Real England

speaking of south coast brutality, just recalled business legernd nicholas van hoogstraten

― Ƹ༑Ʒ (imago), Wednesday, 1 October 2014 09:42 (8 hours ago)

van hoogstraten is an excellent example, a dandified cadaverous psycho with impeccable threat

Why does street photography always have a suggestion (in this DW case a lot more than a suggestion) of the grotesque?

i suspect the answer is connected with my strong sense that we almost never see the middle or upper classes photographed in the style of a wildlife documentary

which is to say that whatever dignity or agency you believe street photographers afford their subjects, there is no real equivalent genre treatment of the non-marginalized

http://i.imgur.com/jOxcECY.jpg

:) i'm open to discovering counter-examples, but i think they're in the minority?

maybe it's something simpler about the way that representation delimits the subjects it uses

Semi serious answer: Paparazzi photography is literally wildlife photography

fair point, and it has got stylistic connections to street photography

unless a subject is posing (or at least pre-consenting) in some fashion, maybe they're always effectively wildlife

http://www.lrb.co.uk/v36/n19/james-meek/in-farageland

^ Haven't read this yet.

we're a farage band we come from farage land

nick you are making brighton sound like an absurdity stranded between cliff-faces and rural or meta-rural hinterlands with only the umbilical link to civilization afforded by the a23 and the railway

Why does street photography always have a suggestion (in this DW case a lot more than a suggestion) of the grotesque?

i suspect the answer is connected with my strong sense that we almost never see the middle or upper classes photographed in the style of a wildlife documentary

― Chimp Arsons, Wednesday, 1 October 2014 16:54 (4 hours ago) Permalink

which is to say that whatever dignity or agency you believe street photographers afford their subjects, there is no real equivalent genre treatment of the non-marginalized

― Chimp Arsons, Wednesday, 1 October 2014 16:56 (4 hours ago) Permalink

http://www.ampelos31.fr/le-blog/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Ray_jones.jpg

Tony Ray-Jones is the go-to for this stuff right? He photographed all types - not just working class folks at Blackpool.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-3XcHU_FRJpA/TiK6G1Nrn1I/AAAAAAAABEw/x97KjKFSIY8/s1600/tony+5.jpg

http://c300221.r21.cf1.rackcdn.com/tony-ray-jones-gentlemen-at-a-wwi-veteran-parade-c-1966-1362348073_org.jpg

Or he was able to foreground something else - that could be the humour generated by the situation he was depicting, or a couple showing affection.

I have a book of his photos and it's pretty clear that at least the ones collected in that volume were supposed to show the English "at play" and class, hedonism or the grotesque had nothing to do with his choice of subjects. Also, the British seaside which makes up maybe 2/3 of the book was not exclusively working class then or now.

I agree that the feeling of the grotesque is not there in Tony Ray-Jones. On the other hand, would a little of it have been there if I was looking at his photos in 1968? When looking at his photos now, a lot of my attention is taken over by the fact they are historical documents, which may overpower other perceptions. Maybe people looking at those Shoreditch photos in fifty or a hundred years will find them to be fascinating on a historical level, and they will be less (or not) interested in whether they are accurate or fair.

But, on the other hand, is it possible that, broadly, people in the west may actually have become a bit more grotesque since 1968 and this is partly the problem? The people in the Ray-Jones photos do generally seem a bit more dignified.

Another factor is technical. A lot of the modern amateur street photography looks very pumped-up with processing. (But, again, maybe in fifty years the 'hard digital/photoshop' look of today will be seen as a historical style with its own charm.)

Finally, maybe people generally look better standing still or at rest than when they are hurrying around or caught suddenly unawares by a photographer in their face.

Also, the British seaside which makes up maybe 2/3 of the book was not exclusively working class then or now.

I found v little of a discernible agenda in those photos (the weakness in that exhibition were the diary entries; there was v little insight to be gained from them, and it felt intrusive). If anything it is that the summer seaside holiday allowed for events to be documented -- could be a fair, or a rock festival (iirc) -- and people were at play in them, they would behaved differently from their stuffy selves.

Brings to mind this bit from the LRB:

In her 1938 novel The Death of the Heart, Elizabeth Bowen describes a train trip from London to the Kent seaside. It’s one of the most extraordinary journeys in English literature. Without stretching the bounds of the real, she takes her young protagonist, Portia, from a 19th-century milieu – a stuffy, oppressive, metropolitan townhouse, gloomy with servants, sexual frustration, snobbery, hypocrisy and heavy furniture – to a bright 20th-century world of freedom, consumerism and erotic risk.

However people behave differently on holiday so I'm not sure whether it is even very historical. It doesn't seem alien to me. Ray-Jones was able to capture certain emotions that feel accurate and fair and strong.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/31/Smith_Dinner.jpg

23 July 1990 Ian Smith makes a point at a dinner organised in his honour by Denis Walker (far left) at Lympne Castle, Kent, July 23, 1990. Smith is flanked by Nicholas and Anne Winterton, both MPs, and Rhodesian flags.

ive posted some shit from that persons wikipedia contributions itt before, its a treasure trove

sometimes you assume every conservative mp is a 42 yr old with an mba from an american university and a six year stint at pricewaterhousecoopers and then you realize revenants like this are still in the house of commons

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ann_Winterton

Lympne Castle is a medieval castle located near the village of Lympne, Kent, above Romney Marsh.

Today, it is used primarily as a venue for corporate events and weddings. It is generally not open to the public. The Estate Manager is Rod Aspinall. Lympne Castle is believed to be haunted, and has attracted mediums and ghost-hunters over the years.

https://www.facebook.com/CongletonPanto

hi im new here

The thread has moved on a bit but Martin Parr did have his "Luxury" project and so on:

http://www.photography-now.com/images/Bilder/gross/24721.jpg
http://thedrawbridge.org.uk/images/article-images/2196_featurepicture2_1.jpg
http://jherrig.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/parrlux2.jpg

Not going to claim that they're good photos but they're there

thread missing Pumpkin Cafe

http://s27.postimg.org/htaiwx277/Greggs_Costa_Duoply.png

the A2(M) is very real but I am not sure it is the realest motorway in England. what, then, is

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4KGxDi-jvk

just about the least real autechre track though

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLbB9S_iwtQ

doves covering king crimson. so unreal it might be real again

http://i.imgur.com/SZ35Ny0.png

Crucial to understanding recent events

http://www.eadt.co.uk/news/dj_waxes_lyrical_about_frinton_gates_1_76906

haha what a dork

loool @ the florist's business name in the prev post

None realer than Frinton. It's an open-air mausoleum

http://i4.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/incoming/article8009954.ece/alternates/s615/JS49533376.jpg

GIS search for "Khantucky Grilled Chicken" in West Hull coming up dry

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a82/bobbysixer/IMG_2551_zps7ccb5e87.jpg

Camden tourists advertising ILE

there are ways to mute the shutter sound you know

love how were having a great Real England then Bob Six wanders in with his morning's pervings. I mean, nothing really against it but it's off-topic y'know

maybe take it to 'too much time on ilx'? more americans there, they'll appreciate your transgressive exposé

it's a little bit importunate to take photographs of people in that sort of setting

Bobble hat fetishists disrupting threads just as genuine dialectical progress being made...Every. Single. Time.

Sigh.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBtd3H3Qdi8&feature=youtu.be

Thanks for putting the thread back on course.

just doing my job sir

This is Mohammed Azam Yaqoob aka "Mr Sparkles" (the name of his modest car wash business in Dewsbury) and a convicted heroin trafficker. I know an Asian guy who grew up with Mohammed and described him as "thick as fuck" and a "disgrace to his great family". I like the guy and tbf it takes some intelligence to become a major drug trafficker and I always root for the maligned odd one out of a successful family. Of his siblings; one brother is an eminent surgeon at St James hospital, the other brother is the governor of Wakefield prison, one sister runs a successful chain of dentists and the other is a barrister.
http://i4.examiner.co.uk/incoming/article7770288.ece/alternates/s615/JS46327222.jpg

that front garden should be finished by the time he comes out