the scottish independence referendum

Why would he be finished? (I mean, I think he's a dead man walking anyway, unless there's a massive shift in the polls, as he can't survive if the Tories fail to get an overall majority again and the odds are still against that - but why would a vote for Scottish independence finish him off sooner?)

this a conservative prime minister who plenty within his own party hate or distrust, surrounded by ambitious people who could try to foment uprising/leadership challenges

so it might well happen but it isn't inevitable

I also haven't read very much on the potential consequences for Northern Ireland, who is good on this subject?

This is a huge unknown, isn't it? What should the name of what's left of the UK even be? 'Great Britain' wouldn't make sense any more, but England, Wales and Northern Ireland is more than a bit unwieldy.

the Remaindered Isles

winner^

Maybe I'm overstating things but I think being Scottish gives you a different relationship to the Union, in that you actually have one, well I do anyway... so apologies for melodrama.

Is there anything to read article-wise on the analysis of implications for Norn Iron?

there are a lot of english people who don't give a shit and outside of the labour party there is ambivalence about it virtually everywhere

as noted shithead, new labour house journalist and iraq war advocate martin kettle says at the end of his column today

English opinion is overwhelmingly in favour of Scots remaining in the UK. Do the English care enough, or know how to get their message across?

the second sentence rather invalidates the former -- evidently not enough english people do care about union, though someone who spends their days talking to blunkett, darling &c would be forgiven for missing that

(xp) if anyone was unsure whether to vote yes, this might persuade you

^ that might swing the vote to yes, right?

eh, in what way?

"If that happened I think an influx of people might move from Scotland to the remaining part of the UK to stay in the union, and their first choice of residence would probably be Northern Ireland," he says.

this is patently ridiculous unless you count less than 100 people out of 5 million as in influx.

I'm assuming that loons with sashes 'n' flutes might persuade a fair few to vote the other way to be rid of them .
Or is tom d saying the Scots should vote no to save norn ireland?

This article says most intending to vote yes do not even identify as nationalists and that the Scots just hate Tories & Nu-Labour. Sectarianism isn't mentioned. Is it playing a part in Scotland? http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/sep/07/poll-scottish-independence-nationalist-yougov

The BT campaign has tried to politely ignore support from the BNP and the Orange Order. They're relying on support from that faction of Scottish society but don't want to say much about it as it puts off as many as it gains.

but the "other side" aren't automatically yes amirite?

Is there much anti-English sentiment driving the yes vote or is it just anti-tory in your opinion?
Would non-scots feel welcome there post-independence? Is there any chance of N Ireland style trouble from loyalist unionists?

there's no anti english sentiment on my facebook feed although i have seen some complain of it on theirs. maybe i just move in the right circles but i imagine non-scots would be welcome and that there will briefly be some trouble which will be hugely magnified in the press.

http://static01.nyt.com/images/2014/09/07/world/europe/08SCOTLAND2/08SCOTLAND2-articleLarge-v2.jpg

based on nothing i feel like yr gonna need yes to have cushion going in election day cause some people will prob chicken out once it starts to seem real

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bw-1Yr5IMAAY31f.jpg:large

hopefully ice or lightning powers

based on nothing i feel like yr gonna need yes to have cushion going in election day cause some people will prob chicken out once it starts to seem real

yeah this tends to be how votes between "more radical" and "less radical" positions go down. momentum is a helluva drug tho.

This article says most intending to vote yes do not even identify as nationalists and that the Scots just hate Tories & Nu-Labour.

the figures cd be right for all i know, but "most just hate Tories" is not the same as "there is no Nationalist component or agenda" - the rest is like, nationalism needn't inevitably lead to anti-sassenach pogroms

What if Scotland becomes a country and you end up with a bunch of samey jackasses in power? In 1995 for Quebec it was extremely close. 19 years later, a few french speaking left wing nationalists are still yearning for a country, but since then the Quebec population keeps electing champions of austerity as provincial Prime Ministers, it's been either that or casual racism/anglophobia disguised as nationalist rhetoric. I mean sure, there was a dream for the scandinavian model republic but as soon as a politician went 'hey guys less taxes' he was elected and re-elected and so on. I don't know how much power Scotland already has, canadian provinces actually have a lot (culture, health, education are mainly provincial affairs) and I feel that if really quebeckers wanted the left wing nation they dreamed of, they would have found a way to become a true left wing province, elected real left wing politicians and we wouldn't have seen the (quite relative) growth in austerity we've seen in the past 15 years.

No pogroms, just Clockwork Orange style re-education centres where people are forced to watch 'Scotch and Wry' and 'The White Heather Club' until the proper Scottish attitudes have been absorbed.

The '95 Quebec referendum seemed far more about banishing the English language from Quebec than installing a left-wing government in tune with their values

http://www.scmp.com/magazines/post-magazine/article/1585089/courting-dragon

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BxBU2P6CIAAqjAB.jpg

This is one of the worst things I have ever read in the Guardian:

http://gu.com/p/4xcj2

i assumed the baby was the first salvo in the black op to undermine independent Scotland by making yr royal family ruinously expensive

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/08/opinion/paul-krugman-scots-what-the-heck.html

I would def vote against it if I were scottish but I guess I am pro-experimental economics since I'm not

Yeah, the North American commentary on this is some of the dumbest shit I've seen.

there's been little to no discussion, as far as i've seen, of the economic impact of scottish independence on the rest of the UK. all the threats and tough talk from the No campaign has utterly ignored any possible consequence to not-scotland and how these consequences wd inform all sorts of negotiations with the newly independent nation

krugman is 100% correct that the plan to stay on the pound is unequivocally very bad and naive

def when compared with this http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/jul/03/independent-scotland-bitcoin-testbed

Speaking through a robot from Sydney at the Financial Times's Camp Alphaville conference in London, Guy Debelle argued that the experience would be similar to Scotland's own period of free banking in the 18th and 19th centuries, when the country's banks were given the power to issue their own currencies.

^ totally thought that was a lagoon joke sentence

its very out there

No-one else finds the 'Oldest Trick In The Book' thing misogynistic?

wee bit

no doubt this has been all over facebook but a glaswegian friend just texted me this one: "i'm leaving you!" "wait.... i'm pregnant!"

ah i see that the Official Worst Article in the World has used this as its lede; i will now slink off to that benighted hole i call my home

there was a suggestion that scotland would run a currency board ala isle of man/channel islands

effectively the same diff as just using the pound no

yes, it's one way of doing it. scottish economy is so interwoven w/ the rest of the uk I wonder how big a problem it wld really be

Taking that as a given, if an independent Scotland were to get into serious financial difficulty, would the rest of Britain end up bailing it out and under what conditions? That turn of events would be politically difficult for almost everyone I'd imagine.

have to babysit the royal babies until its paid off

Not sure if stirmonster posts to ILE - really liked this account of his shift from no to yes:
http://nationalcollective.com/2014/09/05/keith-mcivor-optimo-independence-offers-the-possibility-to-start-again/

wonder what the turn out is going to be like for this

I think maybe 80%

.scot might be made redundant if the Scottish referendum on independence succeeds as Scotland would leave the United Kingdom and get its own two letter country code top-level domain (ccTLD)

.sc/.sd/.sl/.so/.st already taken tho