Buying A House: C or D?

So on the house I saw Thursday that I liked a lot there are some issues. My dad thinks it's the end of the line for this house, but I kind of want to bring out a contractor to look it over anyway. But, basically, anywhere the trim along the roof touches the brick there are small-to-quite large gaps that were shoddily sealed up with foam. Seems like an open invitation for moisture and mold:

http://i.imgur.com/jiglStf.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/cr2md5Y.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/iiWZnz9.jpg

There are a lot more photos, but these three tell the story.

Also, the furnace is resting on a bed of mud in the basement with waterlines on it. Might mean the basement has flooded from a broken pipe once or it might mean the basement floods every time there's a good rain.

http://i.imgur.com/cOO5TGL.jpg

I'll be sad if I have to move on from considering this house, but I may have to. So many questionable points.

yikes man. i have no idea how serious or not any of that is but it certainly doesn't inspire confidence.

^^^ my thoughts exactly

Yeah, I'm really trying to get my mind off this one and move ahead.

Three weeks ago we went to casually check out the house of my wife's colleague who is retiring and moving away, with no intent of actually buying a house right now.

Since then we've had several meetings with the bank, the title agency, had an inspection last week, found a renter (who happens to be the new incoming colleague who is replacing the retiring one) and two days ago they gave us the walkthrough and showed us how everything works before giving us the keys and garage door openers. It's been kind of crazy but holy shit we bought a new house.

!!
so what, you're renting out that one, or your current one?
Don't you need solicitors to draw up contracts etc? My bro-in-law bought a house on 1st day of looking but is hoping solicitors will draw out the process for a few months til he can actually move in (it takes this long anyway)

We're renting our current one out for $50 more per month than our mortgage; houses here sell much better in the spring when the university hiring is all figured out so it's better to wait. Also small, clean houses that have not been destroyed by undergrad renters are a rare commodity here.

As for contracts we just found a fill-in-the-blanks purchase and sales agreement as this was a for sale by owner house. The title company told us they can do everything that you would need a lawyer for and there's really no need for one, bank said the same thing.

My hearsay experience is that the problems always wind up worse than you think, never better. So if it has such visible flaws already, let it go.

xp to joygoat

nice one
I wish there was more of that here. Solicitors don't always add anything or act in your best interests ime. I guess here we have historic nonsense like 'peppercorn rent' and a ton of other arcane stuff.
New house!!

Anybody here ever replaced exterior siding/wood on a house? This one is intriguing to me, but I drove by it after work the other day and there's no question that the whole outside needs to be redone. The inside might just be some cosmetic stuff, though, so I think I'm gonna try to get my agent to show it to me. That's a lot of house for $75k on a street that's really not a bad place to live and those ceilings my god.

http://www.trulia.com/property/3132137758-427-W-Ontario-Ave-SW-Atlanta-GA-30310

could you get a contractor to come with you and quote for what's needed?
$75k for a 4-bed house, jeez

Holy shit that's kind of amazing for $75,000, even if you need new siding. I asked our neighbor about what it cost to get theirs resided and it was like $12,000 but I know that would vary tremendously for any number of factors.

Painting, new floors, trim, stuff like that isn't that big a deal to do but for your first house (or any house, in my case) I'd avoid anything that needs serious structural work unless you really like to do this stuff yourself or have the money to pay for it.

What would a similar-sized move-in-ready house cost in the same vicinity? I'm suspicious.

That size? $139-$199k probably.

Atlanta's Westview/West End area is the next neighborhood that should be turning around. Businesses are already moving in and home prices are going up, but it's not all the way there yet. It got cratered by the financial collapse, though, and the foreclosure/abandonment rate went through the roof. That's why you can still find a few houses like this in established well-kept neighborhoods (instead of in the slums) that are reasonably priced because they need some tlc.

I just don't know how much tlc I'm in the market for.

Oh, that 2nd house is a nice one, looks like every room except the kitchen is completely original, including the bathroom tile work! Although that is maybe in bad shape, can't tell if rotten or just dirty from that pic.

So would you say that if you're considering buying, you get an independent inspection soon in the process, or close to the final decision? Because there's an inspector coming to my building tonight and we thought it was just the owner doing it for the record, but apparently he's coming WITH "the buyer" so now I'm basically incredibly anxious. I think the condition of the building STINKS so maybe a bad inspection will KO it...????

That's not siding, btw--those are shingles, which are going to need repainting/replacing every so many years. You could replace them with easier to maintain vinyl siding, but then you'd be a soulless monster.

That size? $139-$199k probably.

― Johnny Fever, Monday, 23 June 2014 17:23 (Yesterday) Permalink

So it's a half price house. Again, I'd be suspicious. Inspector is a good idea. Buying a 75K house and putting 30-40K work in to get a house worth $150K is awesome. Buying a $75K house and finding out it has foundation problems, or termites, or some kind of major code issues, is not.

The floors look promising throughout--oak downstairs AND upstairs, just need a refinish. And almost all original windows seem intact, although if they don't have storms that place is going to be a bitch to heat, with all those panes. But lovely. The kitchen is hideous and the popcorn ceiling is probably dropped from its original height, so you should get some additional height by tearing it down.

That's not siding, btw--those are shingles

Yeah, up top. The bottom half is more recent siding (but still looks like it probably wasn't cared for very well). If this is an undertaking I plan to go through with, I'd do it as true to the day it was built as possible. Looking at it on Friday if it's still on the market.

One thing I'm really curious about is the staircase, which doesn't appear in any of the photos. If it's some big grand eyepopping thing with a beautiful handrail, I may be helpless against its charms.

I'm definitely not buying anything without an inspection, and I'd probably enter into a contract with a contingency that if it doesn't pass an inspection I'd be free to walk. Bringing out an inspector is $200-300, though, so I don't plan to do it on any property I'm just mildly amused with.

Judging by the style of the rest it's probably a fairly simple square Craftsman newel post with square railings and a simple handrail. You have to love the squareness if you get into a workmanlike Craftsman.

Right. I'm mainly just hoping it's not beat to hell or, heaven forbid, been replaced with something unacceptable for the style of the house.

The asking price for this place is high, about twice as much as it should be in this market. I'm hoping they find so much $$$ worth of work needed that it kills any deal. Update: Oh I see they dropped the price by a quarter mil, that might help. Still though.

xp It doesn't look like a single thing has been mis-done in the house except the 1950s kitchen and the weird boxing in of the back porch so you're probably in the clear.

So would you say that if you're considering buying, you get an independent inspection soon in the process, or close to the final decision? Because there's an inspector coming to my building tonight and we thought it was just the owner doing it for the record, but apparently he's coming WITH "the buyer" so now I'm basically incredibly anxious. I think the condition of the building STINKS so maybe a bad inspection will KO it...????

If I were buying a property to use as an investment, I'd want to know what I was in for before even entering into a contract. You can tell up front that way whether or not its chances of profitability are working in your favor. Since the owner has already come way down on the asking price, though, he's looking to deal. If it's not this buyer, it will be another one.

i said it a few days ago, and having just bought a house in Toronto, i'll say it again. cannot believe how cheap a house in the U.S. is right now... seriously :|

What I'm hoping is that if it needs $250,000 worth of work (one estimate from a contractor friend) that a prospective buyer will demand that much off the asking price and the owner will refuse to deal until the market improves.

cannot believe how cheap a house in the U.S. is right now... seriously :|

Atlanta isn't Chicago or New York or *gulp* San Francisco. It's a large city, but there are large pockets of it where affording housing can be acquired.

I'd bet that in more rural areas, Canada and the U.S. a right in line with each other.

true. not too far out from the city, prices drop off pretty fast. the next closest city, Hamilton, I could have bought two houses with cash to spare for what I paid here.

xp *affordable housing

Just got off the phone with my mortgage person. I make just slightly too much to qualify for the meaningful down payment assistance programs (by too much, I mean like $500/year over the limit..oof!), so the hopes of some entity just handing me $20k for down payment and closing are dead. I still qualify for other things, but the scope is way smaller. Hey, $5k at closing is $5k more than I'd have otherwise.

But it also rules out things like that cottage house where I know I'd immediately have to throw money back into it. I won't have the money to throw unless I get a FHA 203k renovation loan, and the sale price of that house doesn't leave me any ceiling for a renovation component in the loan.

Basically I have to shop for move-in ready or cheap fixer uppers which leave a lot of ceiling in a loan amount.

Shamelessly eavesdropping on the inspector telling all of them that the courtyard drain between the buildings probably needs to be excavated and replumbed/new concrete poured to prevent a build-up of standing water. "It may not be a small matter...."

THAT'S IT THAT'S IT I KNOW YOU CAN DO THIS

This is weird, they're talking about wanting to take out walls and move rooms around, which means they're total idiots, because this is all original plaster and coved ceilings and deeply milled woodwork.

And they think the linen cabinet is a converted...dumbwaiter? Meaning they don't understand that this was never a one-family brownstone.

That's nuts. Preserve, don't pervert!

I think out of all the floors the owners are talking about wanting to live on this one, but they'd gut it first, in their imaginations. This is very ;_______; since we were hoping for a buyer who would keep us as tenants.

booo!

xxxxp - You don't have to replace those shingles with aluminum siding, you could go with Hardi-Board (cement board, I don't know if Hardi is the only game in town, that's all we ever used) - it's fragile and more difficult to install than traditional siding but it will last forever and can't rot/etc. It won't look like shingles but it will look (from a distance) like wood. They might even have a shingle pattern, tbh.

http://www.trulia.com/property/3144533170-608-Orange-St-Arlington-TX-76012

I drive past this every so often but I think they're nuts. It's a large lot but there's no fence, no driveway, no garage and the house needs to be completely redone from the ground up. Pour all that time and effort into it, in that neighborhood, and it might be worth $120k at the end.

I'm perfectly comfortable with a fixer-upper, but everything I find is $75-85k and needs a bunch of work, but the work wouldn't justify its cost down the road at that price. I need to put it out of my mind for a couple more years and just start saving money to pay more for a house in Fort Worth, I think.

The most time I've ever spent in Dallas/FW is a couple hours in the airport, so I have no idea about the cities themselves. Are they any old neighborhoods or is everything post WWII? I just ask because a lot of the comparable houses on that Trulia link look like 50s-60s ranchers—possibly my least favorite of all types of domicile.

Well that's interesting. I don't think that was a repeat visitor and a real hired inspector. I think that was someone new who hasn't been here before and their friend who "knows something" about buildings. I'd expect an actual inspector to check the wiring, run some water, notice that there are water stains on the kitchen ceiling from past leaks--those kinds of things seem important?

This was more like a house tour, and some of the snippets I caught suggest it was their first time here. So many it's not as serious as I feared.

Hooray...for now!

The apartment I got kicked out of in March because the property was sold for muy expensive condos is still standing, though they've harvested every saleable item in it and now it's just a hollow shell (which makes me sad). I wish they'd just hurry up and knock it down so I don't feel the need to drive by it, walk up into my old unit, and just sit there being emo.

Sorry for working out my ish on this thread tonight, but for various reasons we basically CAN'T move, or at least all options will be much, much worse than what we have right now. It's really important to my life functioning that this building doesn't sell/we don't get evicted.

There are older neighborhoods in a Arlington but the houses don't come up that often, the vast majority are '60s ranch houses (and lousy ones at that). That's what makes it hard to shop here and probably why people ask too much for the Craftsman/bungalow/etc. type I like when they do appear.

Fort Worth has a lot of those houses but they're either rapidly gentrifying or in neighborhoods that are legitimately terrible and will be after I'm dead.

I'd rather, if my situation became a two-income partnership, spend twice as much to buy a similar house in FW to what I could theoretically afford now but I doubt I'll ever be able to buy in FW solo.

50s-60s ranchers—possibly my least favorite of all types of domicile

Hilariously my new place is a 1963 ranch house and I'm super stoked about it.

I grew up where almost everyone I know lived in 2 story wood houses built during the late 1800s mining boom - like this one, or this one, or this, all of which are within a few blocks of my parents house.

Ranch houses in general are still really exotic and space-age to me and having all your shit on the same level feels ridiculously extravagant compared to having to climb up dangerously pitched narrow staircases to get to the one bathroom in the house.

In the southeast, at least, most ranch homes are red brick with a black roof and the subdivisions filled with them go on for miles and miles. They are the symbol of midcentury sprawl and it feels overwhelming and endless. They're so anonymous and devoid of any personality that when I finally moved to a city with whole neighborhoods full of early 20th century craftsman and bungalow homes it's what I'd been wanting for as long as I can remember.

I could totally see how if they're not something that's prevalent in your area that they could be desirable. Every place I've lived, though, they're plentiful.

Yeah I totally get that - I love old craftsman houses a lot, and I live in a 1940 bungalow right now which I also really dig. And there are a lot of boring generic ranch houses but I love 50s or 60s ones with lots of veneered wood and formica and frank lloyd wrightish touches.

My sprawl angst is more for the 90s style houses with the double garage as the main focus of the front and a giant foyer and such.

Yeah, those are awful. My parents just built the biggest house they've ever owned now that it's just the two of them and it's exactly what you just described. If that's what they've always wanted, hey...good for them. My mom just called me tonight and said they spent all day cleaning it and they said to each other "why did we need this much house?"

JBR just posted this one on fb, an atomic ranch in LA's San Fernando Valley. Very pricey compared to what's been discussed here lately, but reasonable for LA.

http://www.redfin.com/CA/Van-Nuys/6929-Louise-Ave-91406/home/4552224

Saw that. If I had 600k to blow, I'd have bought it yesterday.

Ooh, there's an open house both days this weekend!