Buying A House: C or D?

we wrote one of those letters (well an email) and really tried to be genuine about it, and the seller sent a counter offer within 20 minutes, so it felt really unnecessary. the sellers in your case sound, frankly, annoying and overly precious.

no one told us to write btw. i think we just read that it was something that people do.

I agree, but am wondering if the sellers really are precious or if it is some trick by the realtor to get us to think the price should be higher. We like the house a lot and it is kinda special, so I don't mind jumping through a few hoops and doing a little show, but I'm still not paying more money!

Haha, meanwhile my wife is totally doing a private-eye job on the sellers and digging up all kinds of online info on them so we can "craft" this letter accordingly. This is more LA-style business, I guess.

Realtors at the ordinary level make their money in volume more than in price increases, so unless it's a pretty expensive house they probably have more interest in moving the house quickly than in bumping your offer. Doing something like that would turn off a lot of buyers and make the house take longer to sell. So I don't think it's realtor trickery, although it might be seller trickery.

Anyone have experience of how to deal with a selling agent? We looked at a place we liked and have been using our own agent but had to meet with a selling agent for this property. She showed us around and kept mentioning other buyers, etc. etc. We just kind of played it cool, but this is the second time she has sold this property and it is probably kind of a cash cow for her. It is priced about 10% higher than it sold for about 5-6 years ago, and all the new owners have done is put a small bathroom (without hot water!) in a small exterior structure. We'll never pay what they are asking and won't enter a bidding war, but we thought about maybe making a bid that isn't a final bid but also isn't insulting...or we wait it out and see if the price comes down. What's a good tactic here? I kind of feel like they are going to wait until they get a higher than value price for it, and we won't pay that, so I'm sort of resigned to not getting it.

― Kornblud (admrl), Sunday, April 6, 2014 11:36 AM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

10% in 5-6 years is not neccessarily outrageous when you consider that the housing market crashed around 6-7 years ago, so prices were very low at that time. Plus figure inflation alone should bump the price 1-2% a year.

As far as dealing with the seller's agent, I don't believe in playing games. If you really like the house, it's better to be honest so the agent doesn't think you're a waste of time. I don't know whether this is actually advisable or not, but when I wanted to make a significantly lower bid than the asking price (and was open to negotiation) I just asked the seller's agent orally -- "I was thinking about offering x. I don't want to insult the seller -- do you think they would at least entertain that?" And the agent said "to be honest I don't think they'll sell for that, but I don't think they'll be insulted either." So we started there and wound up halfway between our offer and the asking price. In our case I knew that the home had been on the market a long time and they had just dropped the asking price after insufficient interest, so I knew I had room to negotiate. If this is brand new to market and has 50 people coming in every day, you might be wasting your time.

Thanks - no it does not have 50 people coming in every day. I think the owners are just not in a hurry to sell and are hoping to get an above-market rate on the house, but it's kind of a tough sell for certain people as there is not a lot of room for a family and some odd bathroom configurations, etc. We might be their best hope of selling any time soon, but maybe not.

honestly just offer what you want to offer. and you can still send a nice note saying how much you like it.

OK scott!

Also - we have only been looking 2-3 weeks but have probably seen around 20 houses. I think we will also keep looking as stuff is bound to go on the market as spring rolls in.

our house was for sale for years cuz the guy grew up in it and didn't need the money and if he didn't like someone he would blow the deal! on purpose! but he kept having to drop the price because of that. which is why we got such a good deal. and we did send word along that we loved the house and really wanted to live there. also, we waived the inspection. WHICH YOU SHOULD NEVER DO. but this guy was prickly and he had blown deals when people had brought in their uncle marty to talk shit about the house or local inspectors that this guy didn't like (he's a lawyer in town and apparently really hard to deal with). we got good info/advice though. we didn't go in blind. we got an inspection after we bought it and everything was fine. he had done a lot of work on the place. we really did get the deal of the century. BUT DON'T EVER DO THAT. even our friend who was our realtor told us to do that because she knew the guy and knew that the house was fine but that he was pathological about home inspectors.

I just imagine home inspectors as these weird creatures that emerge from wet New England basements carrying all kinds of antiquated equipment and dusty manuals.

Adam, if you really like the place and they want to sell quick, you could just make your best offer as a take-it-or-leave-it. Of course, you have to decide in advance what your plan is if they then try to squeeze another 5K or 10K out of you.

I think we got a pretty good deal on our place because it was on the market for so long, and the reason it was on the market for so long was that it looked like absolute shit -- the carpeting was soiled, the walls were gross, the furniture was ugly, there were pet rabbits, nothing looked clean. Yet it had a relatively new kitchen and one of the two bathrooms had been renovated, and the thing was it was in a co-op, so any structural issues or major problems lay with the building not the apartment owners. We felt like we could see the space for what it was in spite of the grossness. It still wasn't like the deal of the century but it was maybe 8% lower than similar units were going for.

Like all we had to do to spruce it up was paint, pull up all the carpeting and resand the floors, and get a good deep cleaning done.

I think the owners are just not in a hurry to sell and are hoping to get an above-market rate on the house

The market price of the house is determined *when the house is sold*! Not before! I had a major lol when the seller of our home wrote a ridiculous e-mail to me saying she would not address the high-ticket repairs (as in, NEEDS NEW ROOF, STAT) because *the house was already priced below market.* Um, sorry, lady, but so far we're the only people who have put a contract on your house, so the market has already sent a message about its market value (i.e., less than you think).

So we sent back a 4 word e-mail: "We withdraw the contract."

We had a phone call within 12 hours to renegotiate the price.

Long story short: the market determines the market price, not the seller. Offer what the house is worth to *you* based on everything you know (the house, the neighborhood, the comps, etc.) and not based on what *anyone else* wants to see. Approaching it this way ensures that you will have neither buyer's remorse nor be butthurt over an illogically rejected offer.

Agree with that post 100%

Also, we wrote a letter once to send along with our asking price bid at the urging of our realtor. It was excellent, but didn't work (19 offers - winner was $125K over and all cash).

That's the one where the backup was also all-cash.

I only wrote the letter because it was a really amazing dream-house situation and we knew there was heavy interest. In any other case I would just make an offer 10% to 15% less than my walk-away price.

I've only bought two houses (both, however, in really shitty buyers markets--insane demand, tiny inventory, multiple-bids-with-escalation-clause situations), so I shouldn't preach, but I stand by this:

Offer what the house is worth to *you* based on everything you know (the house, the neighborhood, the comps, etc.) and not based on what *anyone else* wants to see. Approaching it this way ensures that you will have neither buyer's remorse nor be butthurt over an illogically rejected offer.

Best advice I ever got, which I suspect came from House Buying for Dummies (which I actually bought based on excellent reviews in 2004)

i would not write a letter, just on principle. that you found a house to make an offer on this fast should mean you will find another very soon.

The point of the letter may actually be to give the seller some certainty. It's unlikely they care whether the purchaser "appreciates its special qualities" or w/e -- it's more likely they want to deal with someone they know will follow through because they really like the house. The process is a pain in the ass and it sucks to go part of the way through it only to have a purchaser back out, so they want to minimize the chances of that, is my guess.

Otherwise, quincie OTM -- the best indicator of "market value" is what someone will pay for it.

My impression is that a lot of deals break down when the prospective buyer has delays or other problems with their lender, so if you can tell the seller something good upfront about your loan status, that may sway them more than your appreciation of the property's special qualities.

if the seller has anything resembling brains, a huge earnest money deposit is going to look a lot better than any letter you could possibly write!

We lost the first place we bid on to someone who actually made a lower offer but had much more cash to put down.

my friends rob & liz are moving to dallas :(

so sad! who moves to dallas??? love those guys.

now adam has to buy their house cuz i love their house.

http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/19-Woodleigh-Ave_Greenfield_MA_01301_M30059-87135?row=2&source=web

liz is an amazing avant garde vocalist. rob put out the first stars of the lid record. he just put out an olivia block record. plus, rob sells awesome italian wine for a living. big record collection + wine, really how could i ask any more from a neighbor?

Sad they're moving (and Dallas?!)

It's a beautiful (and pretty big) house, too.

rob's lair on the top floor would make an excellent film-editing studio...

looking at the house i grew up in. my parents bought it for 87,000 in 1977. last sold for 340,000. it looks all foofy and fancy now.

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/167-Whisconier-Rd-Brookfield-CT-06804/57263196_zpid/

my friend rob's house sold. bam! #economicupturn

maybe adam bought it...

Wow, that was fast! It was priced for way less than I thought it would be.

Yeah, I've had 23 saved properties on Redfin in the last few weeks to few months and just last week 17 of them went from available to pending. Like, as soon as April got here, people (who aren't me) went on a buying spree.

That can tend to happen in Spring, especially after this long harsh winter with all the "pent-up demand." But it can never hurt to keep following the "pending" listings or even contact the brokers and just let them know you're interested if the deal falls through. Sales fall through all the time.

I don't even know what we doing anymore

dudes i am
standing in my new houzzzz!!

:D

YAY! Tracer!!!!

Being in Austin again, I decided to peruse the house listing and blehk. Every Sunday I would look up houses for sale, back when I lived here, and have seen the obnoxious rise in prices. It just makes me not want to live here. After living in the country, it feels really claustrophobic here. I know I would always feel that way and needed to get out of the city one or two weekends a month or take a long drive. It's fun being here again but don't know if I want to call it home for long.

We have new neighbors and I'm wondering about the etiquette of asking them whether they're buying or renting the house.

You can probably find out without asking them by checking the county tax assessor records for that property ... here in GA that info is online even for rural counties. Usually those records show a sales history.

This is about to get real for me. I'm going to take a homebuyer education course Saturday morning that's a requirement for all of the downpayment assistance programs in the region. Then? I get pre-approved and start shopping.

Kinda scary, but also exciting.

F buying a house!

where are you looking?

I kind of wish we would have had such a course, though wonder what we would have ended up with had we taken one.

xp I'm looking inside Atlanta. I've already had my fill of the 'burbs in just two months. The thing I'm running into is that most decent condos I come across end up being outside my budget because of HOA fees. On the other hand, single family homes I can afford are in "transitional" parts of the city...it all just depends on the individual street, really.

From what I understand, the course just gives you the basics...keeping a budget, etc...then you get talks from a realtor and a loan officer who go into a little more depth about those steps...then you get individual counseling. This could be good for me because the process seems a bit overwhelming, even though I already know what I can afford, am reasonably certain I can get a loan with no problem, and kind of know already what I'm looking to buy.

Getting a loan is harder than you might think, or at least it was for me. Even if you have a good chunk set aside for your down payment they'll still want to see that you have some collateral after the fact, especially since you likely have no equity.