Rolling European Politics Thread

I think it comes back to the idea the opposition is not unified. The moderate demonstrators backed the amnesty and left most of the government buildings while the hardliners dug in at the tent city in Maidan Nezalezhnosti. It's tough to see anything other than the complete overthrow of the government being acceptable to some of them.

Yeah, that's my impression too.

Got some Russian dupes on this fucking thread. The opposition is unified in opposition to the government, which is a criminal conspiracy.

Other than being against the government, how else do you imagine they're united? That's rather important when looking at short and long term solutions.

first half of this 2004 tony judt article on ukraine, turkey & the EU is quite interesting - http://www.nytimes.com/2004/12/05/opinion/05judt.html

http://media4.s-nbcnews.com/j/msnbc/components/slideshows/_production/ss-140220-ukraine-fighting/ss-140220-ukraine-03.nbcnews-ux-1440-1000.jpg

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2014/2/20/1392898379821/A-demonstrator-stands-on--001.jpg

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2014/2/20/1392898379821/A-demonstrator-stands-on--001.jpg

paramilitary pigs using sniper rifles against unarmed civilians deserve a special kind of hell

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/dam/assets/140220095454-24-ukraine-0220-horizontal-gallery.jpg

Apparently Yanukovich has agreed to going back to the 2004 constitution, a new coalition government and elections in December. No word on whether any of the opposition groups are backing it.

Also George Zimmerman has said he'll never kill again. No word on whether any of those liberals are backing him.

At last, somebody is thinking outside the box: Jean-Marie Le Pen suggests Ebola as solution to global population explosion

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/25/france-national-front-win-european-elections

Gah.

The result in Denmark is really exciting! The polls show that Venstre, the biggest right-wing party, in line to take back the government after the next election, would get three mandates, same as last time. But then the leader, Lars Løkke Rasmussen, got caught in a scandal because the party had spent 152.000 kr on clothes for him during the last election (more than 15.000 pounds) as well as buying planetickets for a vacation for his wife and son afterwards. So people said that if they lost a mandate, it would be his fault. And now the exit-polls are divided, with one showing three and one showing two. The mandate would otherwise go to the Socialist Peoples Party, part of the Green block in the parliament, whom I also voted for. Fingers crossed!

Supporting the interpretation of the European results as a rejection of austerian EU policies rather than a lurch back towards the early-middle twentieth century, Euroskeptic parties of the left did quite well in Italy and Greece. The most likely practical effect in the EU itself will be a displacement of the governing Socialist-led center-left coalition by a center-right coalition. So talk of an “earthquake” in this election will be muffled a bit by the time the aftershocks subside in Brussels. But these are perilous times for the European project.

http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/political-animal-a/2014_05/not_a_real_good_day_for_the_eu050507.php

to what extent do ppl feel like there is a lot of anti-immigration sentiment in these results?

The anti-immigration National Front won in France.

but i feel like everything i've read so far has been about the results being EU-skeptic as opposed to more prosaic domestic concerns?

Well, I think that the EU-sceptic victories far outstrip the polling for the immigration-skeptic parties in most countries. Like, the immigration-sceptic Danish Peoples Party got 26% of the vote in Denmark, and was by far the biggest party. But that result exceeds every poll for parliamental elections, so it's probably not a blanket vote on their political platform.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BogcqQdIYAEJXne.jpg

The National Front is anti-immigration, EU-skeptical, and racist. Mordy, surprised by your blase reaction to their win.

Blase? I speculated on the anti-semitism thread that NF winning would hasten the French-Jewish community's emigration (already at historical peak)

I hadn't read your comments there, just the last few itt

oh, yeah, i'm really just curious about what is driving this rightward swing. obv the economy has a lot to do w/ it (and immigration politics are often caught up in economic concerns) and you can't really separate issues like unemployment from EU-skepticism. it's also kinda surprising to me, particularly wrt to france which i thought was on a much more left wing swing (i guess i thought this bc hollande instead of sarkozy) but obv i was naive/wrong.

Well, Hollande is at the moment one of the most hated presidents ever in France. Also, I think these populist movements are sorta divorced from the general left-right swing in Europe. Denmark changed from a right-wing to a left-wing coalition last election, but the populists keep getting bigger. The main two old right-wing parties are both in crisis. A lot of voters for the populists want a big government with many benefits, just not for the wrong people.

Yeah, what has happened across a lot of countries is that the total of votes for established centre-left and centre-right parties has gone down and the total for populist left and right parties has gone up. People are generally feeling fed up and alienated.

Does Merkel still think her austerity philosophy for Europe is a good idea?

She still thinks it's a good idea for Germany iirc

The objections to austerity play out in different ways (FN in France, Syriza in Greece) but have a common root. There's a growing sense, even from people who are broadly pro-Europe in theory, that the current hegemony isn't working for them. In some ways immigration is only a small part of that. It's seen as much less important an issue when the economy isn't stagnating.

The biggest surprise of the weekend was Renzi demolishing Grillo. Idk, maybe Italy is just a few years ahead and everyone else will revert to the mean again soon.

wow, the FN took 42% of the vote in the 14th arrondissement in Marseille (30% overall for Marseille). & the UMP was 2nd or 1st in almost every arrondissement.

we'll see how things shake out for the UMP with the latest scandal though

sharivari otm these results are a reaction to the reserve status quo from the last elections everywhere not having worked, hence a wider shift towards the political margins

PS nobody really cares about European elections I def wouldn't bet on the results here,for instance, being in any way replicated in a general election tomorrow

Another factor in France is the massive corruption scandal affecting the mainstream centre right UMP party

http://www.france24.com/en/20140527-france-ump-party-conservatives-scandal-bygmalion-crisis-meeting-cope/

yep, that's I mentioned above obliquely

apologies, I must have skimmed over it

Venstre went from 3 to 2 mandates. There are rumours that their leader Lars Løkke Rasmussen had promised to withdraw if that happened, but that he on the night chose to carry on. Now he has called for a meeting next tuesday, and people in the party has openly come forward and said that they are trying to get enough votes to make him resign. This is really exciting. EU elections are rarely this important.

The funny thing is, that Lars Løkke became prime minister when Anders Fogh resigned to become leader of NATO, and then he lost the next election by a very small margin. Almost immediately the polls were showing that he would win the next election, as they still do, but now he might be fired before. So he will perhaps never manage to actually get elected.

Montebourg, 51, fired his first broadside in an interview with Le Monde on Saturday and followed up with a speech to a Socialist party rally the following day. In a veiled reference to President François Hollande, he said that conformism was an enemy and "my enemy is governing". "France is a free country which shouldn't be aligning itself with the obsessions of the German right," he said, urging a "just and sane resistance".

http://www.marianne.net/photo/art/default/985519-1168625.jpg

^^^ kinda disconcerting to see this graphic all over the streets (it's the cover of Marianne this week)

have i missed the thread about the biggest migration crisis modern europe has possibly ever seen?

to sum up, my new username is the distinction david cameron draws between "genuine" emigres from syria (and elsewhere) fleeing physical violence and political persecution, and uh non-genuine migrants, possibly from the very same countries, who are coming to the UK because life is economically untenable where they live

Refugee situation / EU response - rolling news

this started but obv it's not much

Cameron - well, yes, his true colours. The extent of his constituency on this - unknowable as that is, it's big enough - is the real horror i guess

oh gotcha thanks for the link

Don't know whether this is the right thread to draw attention to this fucking disgrace:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-romania-lgbt/romania-moves-closer-to-ruling-out-same-sex-marriage-idUSKCN1LR24R

It's already illegal, you retrograde morons, what more could you possibly want? Way to further widen the gap between Eastern and Western Europe – and this time, we won't have communism to blame.

98% of Romanians are Christian – could that have something to do with it, I wonder? Never mind that in practice, this merely means crossing yourself when you walk/drive in front of a church, saying 'God help us' when you bump into a priest, and making copious use of homophobic/antisemitic slurs at all times.

Thought this thread was bumped because of the pending use of Article 7 against Hungary. But it is sorta related, perhaps? A clash between two parts of Europe.

It seems to me that Hungary's neo-fascism is less religiously-oriented than its Romanian counterpart. For what it's worth, I think the latter is less deleterious at the moment, but that's liable to change, especially if Patriarch Daniel has his way with it.

'Patriarch' is a title that goes without saying in Romania but that is quite… amusing when you look at it from a Western perspective.

Austrian and Italian fascists giggling at your East v. West take on things.

Wonder if the EU will survive the recession we're going into.

We are staring down the first global recession not led by US since World War II. It’s near impossible US doesn’t follow and it’s nearly certain we are making it worse. https://t.co/YWEvsazHtl

— Claudia Sahm (@Claudia_Sahm) September 22, 2022

I wrote for @thenation about the Italian election, how rising energy prices could upset the far right’s agenda in government, and the surprising (partial) recovery or the Five Star Movement https://t.co/bCSAZC1zD5

— David Broder (@broderly) September 22, 2022

Meloni will call the pope a globalist and cut off the church like how Florida taxed Disney… then the pope will make a Netflix deal where he’s interviewed by Michelle Obama who will ask if there will ever be a woman pope and the pope will respond “stranger things have happened”

— Don Hughes (@getfiscal) September 26, 2022

Deutsche Bank is warning of German deindustrialization as a result of the gas crisis. Unlike in the US or UK, there is no world leading financial, service or digital sector to fall back on. The gas question is the question of the future of this economy. pic.twitter.com/AQFOKY92WC

— Isabella M. Weber (@IsabellaMWeber) October 17, 2022

ttps://wapo.st/3UQ292T

gift link should hopefully work- article title--With Europe’s support, North African nations push migrants to the desert

A year-long joint investigation by The Washington Post, Lighthouse Reports and a consortium of international media outlets shows how the European Union and individual European nations are supporting and financing aggressive operations by governments in North Africa to detain tens of thousands of migrants each year and dump them in remote areas, often barren deserts.

European funds have been used to train personnel and buy equipment for units implicated in desert dumps and human rights abuses, records and interviews show. Migrants have been pushed back into the most inhospitable parts of North Africa, exposing them to abandonment with no food or water, kidnapping, extortion, sale as human chattel, torture, sexual violence and, in the worst instances, death.
Spanish security forces in Mauritania photographed and reviewed lists of migrants before they were driven to Mali against their will and left to wander for days in an area where violent Islamist groups operate, according to testimony and documents.
In Mauritania, Morocco and Tunisia, vehicles of the same make and model as those provided by European countries to local security forces rounded up Black migrants from streets or transported them from detention centers to remote regions, according to filmed footage, verified images, migrant testimony and interviews with officials.
European officials held internal discussions on some of the abusive practices since at least 2019, and were flagged to allegations in reports by the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR) and Frontex, the E.U. border agency

BUNDESTAGSWAHL | 18 Uhr Prognose Forschungsgruppe Wahlen/ZDF

Union: 28,5% (+4,4)
AfD: 20,0% (+9,7)
SPD: 16,5% (-9,2)
GRÜNE: 12,0% (-2,8)
LINKE: 9,0% (+4,1)
FDP: 5,0% (-6,5)
BSW: 5,0% (NEU)
Sonstige: 4,0% (-4,7)

Änderungen zum Wahlergebnis von 2021#Bundestagswahl2025 #btw25 pic.twitter.com/L9gDgtCorD

— Deutschland Wählt (@Wahlen_DE) February 23, 2025

Afd etc. But Linke is also doing better.

German public TV just published this poll of first-time voters. A massive lead for socialist Left party on 27%.

Left + SPD + Greens on 54% among first-time-voters. Those voters were also slightly less likely to vote AfD than national average.

So much for the “far-right youth”. pic.twitter.com/Ed67N2EwRC

— Jeremy Cliffe (@JeremyCliffe) February 23, 2025

That’s good

Entire Iberian Peninsula (and bits of southern France) in blackout right now.

Probably fine.

That’s bad