Star Trek: Classic or Dud?

We should do a Best Troi looks poll (making sure to include her as a Romulan).

this always bugged me how much it looked like they just stuck antennae on troi
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/d4/Phantasy_Star_II.jpg

The blu-rays for TOS have the original theme song with the original audio as an option. Although I'm usually a purist about such things, I actually like 90% of the new CGI effects, so I usually turn that option on but switch to the original audio.

Anybody else try playing Star Trek Trexels?

I am unashamed to say that I love Troi's monochromatic aqua blue dress ensemble and hope that becomes standard women's dress before I die.

I love this one too! So Atlantean!

http://media.tumblr.com/223e5184a20a89177bae62572457da0e/tumblr_inline_mozp99lZIh1qz4rgp.jpg

Though I do also like the regular uniform they gave Troi later on. IIRC it was actually a plot point that some high official in Starfleet told Troi she can't just dress however she likes, she has to wear the same uniform as everyone else.

http://images.wikia.com/memoryalpha/en/images/5/54/Negotiations.jpg

In the TNG pilot she actually had a similar uniform, but with a minidress:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-UlXkqJ-q8nI/UDi3Y_h6LzI/AAAAAAAALp8/3ai4PFeblqk/s1600/Tasha-Yar-wearing-skirt-uniform-1024x768.png

I don't think it looks bad, but I'm still glad they got rid of it, because it kinda reeked of TOS era sexism.

yeah the short sleeve/miniskirt look didn't work on TNG at all. i do love both Troi outfits above

Oh yeah, I'd forgotten Tasha Yar had one too in the pilot. Mandatory minidresses and short sleeves on women just feels stupid in the supposedly egalitarian Starfleet. Especially on Yar, who was supposed to be masculine, physical counterpart to Troi's feminine empath.

(xpost)

also lol i forgot it was DICK JONES' fault that Troi got the unisex outfit

i think around that time, or soon after she became a ranking command officer anyway

You forgot that Romulan look!

http://static2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120528001143/memoryalpha/en/images/f/fb/Rakal_%28Major%29.jpg

Though she doesn't look as fetch as I remember.

riker and picard look like future gangsters hanging out at the club w/picard's moll while DJ Yar spins vulcan motorik

I don't know why but the boots are cracking me up

lol DJ Yar

And even though the male characters rarely get a chance to look stylish, I just love the ceremonial dress uniforms Picard and Riker wear when meeting with important guests. So ballin'!

http://i.stack.imgur.com/2Gayk.jpg

http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/184/ceremonial.jpg

http://tng.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/s2/2x19/manhunt001.jpg

Sorry, but those outfits just make Picard and Riker look like carvers in a high-end carvery.

ah but the miniskirt WAS supposed to be egalitarian

http://www.empireonline.com/images/uploaded/star-trek-next-generation-male-mini-skirt.jpg

Sartorially, one of the weirdest TNG episodes is "The Most Toys", which features a rather obviously gay alien collector called Kivas Fajo (he basically wants to keep Data as his boytoy):

http://i966.photobucket.com/albums/ae145/chozzles/322%20-%20The%20Most%20Toys/ScreenShot2011-08-13at112322AM.png

One of the things he demands of Data is that he should wear this ridiculous purple unitard:

http://www.theviewscreen.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/threadalert1-300x229.jpg

Seriously, wtf is that?!

http://subspacecomms.com/sites/default/files/0112-general/kivas.jpg

god the design on TNG is just so abominable

It got better! A lot better.

didn't Kivas also have a girlfriend who was de facto his captive and who helped free Data?

The outfit Q wears in 'Deja Q' is (possibly intentionally) ridiculous.
http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130127002522/memoryalpha/en/images/thumb/0/0e/Q_in_civilian_clothing.jpg/620px-Q_in_civilian_clothing.jpg

I am pretty sure at one point in the80s my mother bought a cocktail dress with the same silhouette as the Picard/Riker dress uniforms

Early TNG design is pretty much what the kids are into now, pretty sure that Riker\Picard formalwear wouldn't look out of place at a Rick Owens runway show if it was monochromatic

just because some kids dress like Dazzler now doesn't mean her look was ever justified

Only the laggards are still into TNG. The hip kids are into DS9 now. Bajoran earrings are making a big comeback, yo.

And even though the male characters rarely get a chance to look stylish, I just love the ceremonial dress uniforms Picard and Riker wear when meeting with important guests. So ballin'!

yeah... as in they were gettin balled by other dudes

respect to nana visitor but michelle forbes rocked the earrings and nose wrinkles first and best

the last line of "the most toys" is the coldest moment in the entire series

The SF Debris review notes that if it were Lore instead of Data, that episode would be about five minutes long.

in non-ST news, canadian-filmed (I think) BBC America science fiction drama Orphan Black is going to have Michelle Forbes *drudge siren*

didn't Kivas also have a girlfriend who was de facto his captive and who helped free Data?

Yeah, but it remains unclear whether she's his "girlfriend", or whether he just enjoys torturing her? Maybe Kivas is bisexual, or omnisexual, or whatever his species calls it. He definitely gives a human gay vibe though.

The SF Debris review notes that if it were Lore instead of Data, that episode would be about five minutes long.

To be fair, one of the first things Kivas asks from Data is whether he is permitted to hurt others; and when Data says no, he uses that to his advantage. Plus he has that force field protecting him... If Data couldn't penetrate it, I don't think Lore could either.

the last line of "the most toys" is the coldest moment in the entire series

I read from somewhere that both the scriptwriter and Brent Spiner felt that Data did indeed fire his phaser intentionally. But apparently some higher authority (Roddenberry?) said Data shouldn't be able to do that, so they made the ending more ambiguous. I like it more like that!

If Data couldn't penetrate it

Quotes taken out of context.

I read from somewhere that both the scriptwriter and Brent Spiner felt that Data did indeed fire his phaser intentionally. But apparently some higher authority (Roddenberry?) said Data shouldn't be able to do that, so they made the ending more ambiguous.

there's nothing really ambiguous about what happens in that scene imo -- data saying 'i cannot allow this to continue' doesn't make any sense if he's not about to fire, otherwise what's he going to do, just keep standing there?

roddenberry was notorious for objecting whenever the characters did something he personally considered 'out of character.' drove the TNG writers crazy, and was partly behind his clash with harlan ellison on 'city.'

data saying 'i cannot allow this to continue' doesn't make any sense if he's not about to fire, otherwise what's he going to do, just keep standing there?

Well yeah, it was obvious Data *wanted* to shoot... But the ambiguous bit was whether he was able to overcome his "do not kill except for self-defense" programming or not.

there's a brief flash before beamout and then the super-shifty "Perhaps SOMETHING occurred during transport" WINK WINK

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_skkBMvlWBw
"Perhaps something occurred during transport, Commander."
The look on Riker's face - he's so not convinced.

oh weird, i swore there was a flash. did they edit that out?

roddenberry was notorious for objecting whenever the characters did something he personally considered 'out of character.' drove the TNG writers crazy, and was partly behind his clash with harlan ellison on 'city.'

"He had Scotty selling drugs!"

There are moments when Gene showed symptoms of Lucas Disease when he would get in the way of his writers' better instincts. By all accounts, dude was the drag behind the early seasons of TNG, but those who took over eventually would drive the ship straight into the rocks themselves.

i sort of love the insane purity with which he explicitly disallowed conflict aboardship in those early seasons. no conflict in the future. drama without conflict. meanwhile the entire mechanism of TOS is the (sometimes vicious!) spock-bones-kirk dialectic; that's like the #1 thing people like about it.

He seems like maybe he was a nice guy and happened to initiate a big franchise but was not a big brain really?
I mean hey gene we'll just have him say something must have happened during transport. No prob, right?

No conflict, or zippers.

everything is unified

I agree that in terms of mechanics, the show worked better outside of roddenberry's "the future is awesome" box, but they basically turned star trek into a non-stop religious war/terrorism opera. (and I guess that's what the producers really had their heart into, because they went on to do the same exact thing with the battlestar reboot and 24)

oh, otm. when i read r.d. moore complaining abt roddenberry i'm always on roddenberry's side even tho he's gone too far. without that silly futurism it's just a tv show.

as opposed to a tv show with silly futurism in it. clearly superior.

non-stop religious war/terrorism opera

I don't recall this really happening with TNG but the last seasons are a blur and I'm sure there's stuff I never bothered to watch...? or are you referring to DS9 and after

DS9 definitely, but the Bajoran/Cardassian thing got started in TNG, and esp. TNG season 7, though I don't remember if it was more than one episode.

it's interesting in the early cardassian episodes on TNG, the action is represented by a few blinking triangles on a computer screen and dramatic music when one of the triangles stops blinking, and knitted brows.

by DS9 it's just full-on battle porn.