2008 Primaries Thread 2: THE QUICKENING

HRC'S GAMEPLAN IS FOOLPROOF.

Actually, it's pretty damn rational. Win most of what's left, close the pledged delegate gap to a small margin, win the "big states," take the shine off Obama, and charge into the convention with a message for the super-delegates about perseverance and loyalty and toughness.

Yeah but there's no way for her to win w/o using superdelegates to undermine a popular vote / delegate count Obama lead. That's a reprehensible 'victory' in my view... and probably the GE voters who, you know, have a deep appreciation for the most basic definition of 'democracy'.

lol i was with you til the last part

haha fair enough. I think the Clinton camp is underestimating the amount of blowback that these backroom deals will generate in the modern media landscape.

Is there anyway to spin that other than Obama voters were cheated?

If she can get a majority of the popular vote it's not that hard to spin.

yeah plus if shes close enough and something happens and obama bombs in some way, shes there to pick up the pieces

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2308/2314168404_b0d9e2cdb9_o.jpg

lol

yeah plus if shes close enough and something happens and obama bombs in some way, shes there to pick up the pieces

I don't think her strategy is to hope for Obama to bomb and then to pick up the pieces. I think her strategy is to bomb Obama to pieces.

Obama doesn't have to have some spectacular crash for Clinton to get the nomination. She has keep beating him, but the margins don't have to be great. If she can front up to the convention saying the momentum is definitively with her, and has been for months, then I don't think Obama's slim lead in pledged delegates will make a difference as to which way the superdelegates swing. I mean, what is even the point of superdelegates if their voting criteria is solely the popular vote?

Margins do have to be great.

I've asked several prominent uncommitted superdelegates if there's any chance they would reverse the will of Democratic voters. They all say no. It would shatter young people and destroy the party.

I wouldn't lol much at the idea that the Democratic party wouldn't want a nominee who wins through superdelegates. As with so much with HRC's campaign, just because Bush got away with it doesn't mean she can too.

but once its popular vote vs. pledged delegates 'the will of the people' is up in the air

another denial about obama's rumored bank of 50 superdelegates:

obama spokesperson Bill Burton: This is just a rumor. There is no secret stash of superdelegates that we are sitting on waiting to roll out.

:(

well it wouldnt be a secret...

hey can we knock it off with this idea that the press is easy on obama? considering the nafta flap was cooked up by canadian right wingers and was initially floated about hillary, but that didn't stick well enough apparently (you can fault obama for not defusing the former well enough, but it was manufactured from the outset.) oh and the farrakhan business, for which we can thank one tim russert -- in the context of giving mccain a complete pass on his nutcase racist pastor.

er some odd syntax due to editing there: "you can fault obama for not defusing IT well enough"

Clinton Camp: Obama Attacks Suggest Campaign is “Unable to Make the Positive Case”

Getty

Senior adviser Ann Lewis scolds Obama on media conference call for stepping up attacks against Clinton after Tuesday’s votes, says instead he should talk about his “positive ideas” on the issues.

“I did not realize that their version of new politics is to recycle some of the same old Republican attacks on Hillary that have failed for years.”

Howard Wolfson says he doesn’t “believe imitating Ken Starr” is a way to run a nomination campaign. Permalink

YOU GOTTA BE KIDDING ME

WHO ARE THE PEOPLE WHO BUY THIS SHIT

something happened in NYC today that will only help McCain in the GE:

http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/03/06/times.square/index.html

hey can we knock it off with this idea that the press is easy on obama?

yea. i think whatever "free pass" or favoritism the press presumably gave obama before no longer stands.

WHO ARE THE PEOPLE WHO BUY THIS SHIT

EVERYWHERE. They are the kind of people who elected GWB twice.

its just such a transparent attempt to reframe an apple as an orange

and thats not even touching on the hypocrisy of it

Again, she's using Rove's strategies -- audaciously blame the other guy for doing what you're doing.

right but calling her campaign shameless is just a cheap media narrative amirite

But they're using Rove's tactics in a way that resembles a star MBA grad trying to get his footing in the real business world.

gff OTM. obama's just doing the same thing maaaaaaaan!

did you guys hear her radio ad that presented itself as a news story about Obama's NAFTA 'lie' - only to say 'paid for by hillary clinton' at the end? Like, it was a fake news radio ad

what "rovian" things is the obama camp supposed to have said?

deej did you hear the jimmy carter radio ad that presented itself as a johnny cash "song"?? what a bait and switch

wtf are you talking about now?

i mean when carter starts using great musicians with personal integrity to further his own political ends it's like, who buys this shit

tracer srsly wtf dude. you are relishing in just being reactionary against people who care. so not you!

are you dumb? xpost

there is a vast strategic and moral difference between presenting your political ad as a news story and presenting it as a song

are you implying that pop songs and false news broadcasts are comparable in information value to the voting public, or you just being a jackass? xpost

dude the faux outrage here over hoary old campaign tactics has reached epic proportions. if you guys are this sensitive now over things like, what, the clinton camp saying that obama is going negative, or a radio ad that pretends to be a news bulletin.. christ, your heads are gonna explode in the g.e.! it's as if no one here has ever followed a campaign before. sure, i'd prefer it if both sides dialed down their OWN faux outrage over every niggling issue but just cause they don't - and won't - doesn't mean we have to follow them down that road.

and no one answered my question - what supposedly rovian accusation did the obama camp make?

(just to have some context for the consensus here that the clinton camp is continuing its shameless jujitsu)

http://www.babble.com/CS/blogs/famecrawler/2007/12/08-15/15_seinfeld_lgl.jpg

What is the DEAL with those politicians?

dude, we get these are sop. we just don't like it in intramural fights, especially when there's good evidence that the losing party is less electable.

and no one answered my question - what supposedly rovian accusation did the obama camp make?

i think they just said she should release her tax returns?

This is an election news update with a major news story reported by the AP. While Senator Obama has crisscrossed Ohio giving speeches attacking NAFTA, his top economic advisor was telling the Canadians that was all just political maneuvering. A newly released document from the Canadian government shows that Obama’s senior economic advisor met with the Canadian Consul General and made clear that Obama’s attack on NAFTA were just, quote, “political maneuvering,” not policy. Political maneuvering, not policy. In fact, the document shows that Obama’s advisor also assured the Canadians that these attacks against NAFTA would not continue. Obama would not want to be, quote, “fundamentally changing the agreement.” As Senator Obama was telling one story to Ohio, his campaign was telling a very different story to Canada. How will Ohioans decide whether they can believe Senator Obama’s words? We’ll find that out on election day. Paid for by Hillary Clinton for President.

can i care about shit and make *your* head explode in the process?

the NYT ran a brief today reporting that the Canadian prime minister denies any such conversation happened.

gabbneb, doesn't that apply to the obama people too?