Yeah but that's an example of government regulation designed to make it harder to use
― 龜, Thursday, 9 January 2014 16:30 (ten years ago) link
anytime you start to get the idea that bitcoin might succeed, it's a good idea to read this:https://twitter.com/shit_rbtc_says
― signed, J.P. Morgan CEO (Hurting 2), Thursday, 9 January 2014 16:35 (ten years ago) link
The government is already regulating it. In the US, if you exchange Bitcoins for real currency, you have to register and perform money-laundering background checks.
Unless you’re Coinbase …
― Allen (etaeoe), Thursday, 9 January 2014 16:40 (ten years ago) link
etaeoe have you attempted to cash in any of yr coins was it a pain
― lag∞n, Thursday, 9 January 2014 16:42 (ten years ago) link
Re: Coinbase and regulation, an e-mail I was forwarded written by 44r0n Gr33n5p4n:
Coinbase is many things, but "compliant" is not one of them. It has =registered with FinCEN=97as a corporation with a Delaware address that =appears to have no real connection with them. But it has not even =applied for a money transmission license in any state thus far, even =though it told FinCEN that it=92s doing business everywhere. This is a =direct violation of those states=92 laws as well as 18 U.S.C. =A7 1960. =Earlier this month, Fred Ehrsam admitted at a panel at Stanford Law =School that Coinbase is being investigated by FinCEN. I have the =recording if you=92d like to hear it; I=92m considering just posting it =on-line regardless. As you may or may not know, my company is suing =Coinbase and many other unlicensed money transmitters =(http://www.plainsite.org/flashlight/case.html?id=3D2434524), but my =involvement doesn=92t make the facts any less true. Secondly, there is not a "lack of regulation" in the U.S. surrounding =Bitcoin as you state. There is certainly a lack of understanding about =the many laws and regulations that exist, and the supposed lack of =regulation is a theme that has been wrongly promulgated in the popular =media. But Bitcoin is actually quite regulated in the United States, and =always has been. The FinCEN guidance issued in March merely clarified =that fact for anyone who claimed it wasn=92t the case. It=92s not even a =gray area. These companies currently require licenses and do not have =them. They are breaking the law, whether one agrees with it or not.
― Allen (etaeoe), Thursday, 9 January 2014 16:43 (ten years ago) link
Not yet. I need to speak to a tax accountant. I’m 100% confident I’ll be audited for having anomalous capital gains (my personal investments are all equity from employment and typical risk-adverse Vanguard retirement stuff). If you’re curious, the liquidity issue isn’t too bad. I’m permitted to sell 50 BTC per day.
― Allen (etaeoe), Thursday, 9 January 2014 16:46 (ten years ago) link
ya the liquidity issues prob more pertain to the people w millions of these things
― lag∞n, Thursday, 9 January 2014 16:48 (ten years ago) link
like i think we already had this chart but almost all the bitcoins are just sitting there
http://static3.businessinsider.com/image/52a74254eab8eacb2266bfa7-828-454/bitcoin%20pie%20ownershp.png
― lag∞n, Thursday, 9 January 2014 16:49 (ten years ago) link
Cash out via swiss bank
Start a shell holding company in the Caymans or BVI
Profit
― 龜, Thursday, 9 January 2014 16:50 (ten years ago) link
fwiw like half the corporations in the US have a "Delaware address" with "no real connection" to them
― signed, J.P. Morgan CEO (Hurting 2), Thursday, 9 January 2014 16:53 (ten years ago) link
Yeah, I didn’t understand that either. He’s been through the incorporation and investment processes so I’m sure he knows that too. I think he was saying, “If they’ve registered, it isn’t under the incorporated entity they conduct business under.” But I have no idea.
― Allen (etaeoe), Thursday, 9 January 2014 16:59 (ten years ago) link
yeah could be
― signed, J.P. Morgan CEO (Hurting 2), Thursday, 9 January 2014 16:59 (ten years ago) link
Shit /r/Bitcoin says @shit_rbtc_says 14h
The owner of Silk Road should be given Obama's Nobel peace prize.
― i like HOOS but this took the cake off my table (BIG HOOS aka the steendriver), Thursday, 9 January 2014 17:58 (ten years ago) link
i have to admit that i would love to see bitcoin be a tremendous success in 2014 and all these seemingly deluded nerds walk away with massive payouts and all the internet intelligentsia forced to admit how wrong and cynical they were "it was a gold rush and we missed it... why couldn't i just BELIEVE"
― this harmless group of nerds and the women that love them (forksclovetofu), Thursday, 9 January 2014 18:00 (ten years ago) link
it would be so fun
visionary stuff right there
― lag∞n, Thursday, 9 January 2014 18:01 (ten years ago) link
and i'll c+p that quote for you to chew on like the bitter tea leaves of your heart when that bright bitcoin day comes
― this harmless group of nerds and the women that love them (forksclovetofu), Thursday, 9 January 2014 18:07 (ten years ago) link
visionary metaphor mixing
― lag∞n, Thursday, 9 January 2014 18:08 (ten years ago) link
that's why i'm on ripplin
― this harmless group of nerds and the women that love them (forksclovetofu), Thursday, 9 January 2014 18:10 (ten years ago) link
Interesting article suggesting that so far we've only scratched the surface of innovations that could be built on top of Bitcoin:
http://theumlaut.com/2014/01/08/bitcoin-internet-of-money/
― o. nate, Thursday, 9 January 2014 21:21 (ten years ago) link
here are some other interesting articles from that author
http://theumlaut.com/2013/01/30/why-americas-fiscal-reality-will-make-euthanasia-inevitable/
http://theumlaut.com/2013/03/13/paul-krugman-is-brilliant-but-is-he-meta-rational
https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/3020148783/8fe0568213d240a2ca1b447493a70bde.jpeg
― iatee, Thursday, 9 January 2014 21:32 (ten years ago) link
interesting guy thinking baout things
― From the Album No Baby for You! (Matt P), Thursday, 9 January 2014 21:56 (ten years ago) link
i didn't know sarge wrote abt bitcoin
― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Thursday, 9 January 2014 22:04 (ten years ago) link
Shit /r/Bitcoin says @shit_rbtc_says 8 JanIf only there would be mass non-compliance against laws in the US. Then we might have some semblance of freedom in the "land of the free."
― panettone for the painfully alone (mayor jingleberries), Thursday, 9 January 2014 22:22 (ten years ago) link
just read this on a jobs board:
Presenter for New Show (Must Have Understanding of Bitcoin)
― TracerHandVEVO (Tracer Hand), Friday, 10 January 2014 09:35 (ten years ago) link
just found out that apparently if any one group can control 51% of all mining power at any time they can do what is known as a "doublespend attack" which essentially could bring down the whole ship, and it looks like one group is getting close, what a shock
― frogbs, Friday, 10 January 2014 14:43 (ten years ago) link
i think charmander has a doublespend attack mirit
― this harmless group of nerds and the women that love them (forksclovetofu), Friday, 10 January 2014 15:16 (ten years ago) link
yeah its surprising someone w a sick ass botnet hasnt just declared that they have all the bitcoins
― lag∞n, Friday, 10 January 2014 15:21 (ten years ago) link
Bitcoin is just a long story of how libertarians discover what financial regulation is for, piece by piece, as lack of it begins to affect them negatively.
― frogbs, Friday, 10 January 2014 15:25 (ten years ago) link
haha
― lag∞n, Friday, 10 January 2014 15:43 (ten years ago) link
!
― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Friday, 10 January 2014 17:52 (ten years ago) link
damn, whose?
― signed, J.P. Morgan CEO (Hurting 2), Friday, 10 January 2014 18:21 (ten years ago) link
http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/jan/20/jamaican-bobsled-team-raises-dogecoin-winter-olympics
― lollercoaster of rove (s.clover), Monday, 20 January 2014 17:37 (ten years ago) link
so chi
― |$̲̅(̲̅ιοο̲̅)̲̅$̲̅| (gr8080), Monday, 20 January 2014 17:38 (ten years ago) link
Marc Andreessen's case for Bitcoin:
http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2014/01/21/why-bitcoin-matters
― o. nate, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 16:15 (ten years ago) link
Editor’s note: Marc Andreessen’s gigantic pointed skull is full of bitcoins
― lag∞n, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 16:21 (ten years ago) link
a tumblr of things that people claimed were the next personal computer/internet
― lag∞n, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 16:23 (ten years ago) link
A random spectator at a televised sports event held up a placard with a QR code and the text “Send me Bitcoin!” He received $25,000 in Bitcoin in the first 24 hours, all from people he had never met.
except that it was all from himself
― lag∞n, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 16:24 (ten years ago) link
No doubt Andreessen's quite biased, but he makes some good points. I don't buy his argument that Bitcoin's first-mover advantage will guarantee dominance in the crypto-currency sphere though. If you can accept and process one form of crypto-currency, it's a negligible additional effort to accept and process a different form, so I don't think the network effects are as strong as he claims. I still think Tyler Cowen nailed this - eventually as crypto-currencies proliferate the value of any particular currency in circulation has to fall to equal the marginal cost of launching a new one.
― o. nate, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 16:26 (ten years ago) link
its funny he touts all these benefits to business and then the benefit to consumers is you wont get hacked which of course is actually a benefit to business, the benefit to consumers is what no fraud/dispute protection
― lag∞n, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 16:29 (ten years ago) link
I've come to think that bitcoin probably is some of the things that its supporters claim, and is not others. E.g. it makes sense to me that it's a very useful way to transfer money or make payments globally without friction/fees. However, I don't think it's going to be a successful tax avoidance strategy, or money laundering device, or drug-purchasing tool forever, and I certainly don't think it's going to become some kind of universal currency that will upend currency and the banking system as we know it.
― signed, J.P. Morgan CEO (Hurting 2), Wednesday, 22 January 2014 16:30 (ten years ago) link
i have yet to see anyone make a good argument why any person would want to use these over a debit/credit card, buying drugs excepted
― lag∞n, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 16:31 (ten years ago) link
the friction/fees are all incurred by the business
― lag∞n, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 16:32 (ten years ago) link
If you're paranoid about ID theft would be one. Or if you don't have a credit card.
The better argument I've heard is that people could use it for international remittances instead of services that charge high fees.
― signed, J.P. Morgan CEO (Hurting 2), Wednesday, 22 January 2014 16:33 (ten years ago) link
not to mention that the security overhead is ridiculous to ask non technical people to handle, someone gets yr wallet infos and all yr bitcoins are gone
― lag∞n, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 16:34 (ten years ago) link
if the US government fails I would think Bitcoin would be pretty useful
― frogbs, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 16:35 (ten years ago) link
xp right -- I mean the fees incurred by the business drive up your cost in the end too, but you're not going to make a decision based on that. However, it's possible there could be smaller merchants who would rather just not take credit cards at all -- etsy-type sellers, who could accept bitcoin.
The bigger problems to me are security and stability in the price. If you're just going to transfer quickly in/out of bitcoin for payment purposes only, the stability is less of a problem, as an article here or in the other thread pointed out.
― signed, J.P. Morgan CEO (Hurting 2), Wednesday, 22 January 2014 16:37 (ten years ago) link
Or if you don't have a credit card.
― signed, J.P. Morgan CEO (Hurting 2), Wednesday, January 22, 2014 11:33 AM (37 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
how are you getting the bitcoins w/o the credit card what are the fees associated with that, what abou the fee when you have to transfer bitcoin back into local currency after remittance, and this is all ignoring the obvious market realities that existing systems like money wiring or w/e can just lower their fees to compete w bitcoin
― lag∞n, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 16:38 (ten years ago) link
― lag∞n, Wednesday, January 22, 2014 11:34 AM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
yeah this is a big barrier, although there might be a tech solution to it. Fingerprint sensor activated wallet or such.
― signed, J.P. Morgan CEO (Hurting 2), Wednesday, 22 January 2014 16:38 (ten years ago) link
If you're just going to transfer quickly in/out of bitcoin for payment purposes only, the stability is less of a problem, as an article here or in the other thread pointed out.
― signed, J.P. Morgan CEO (Hurting 2), Wednesday, January 22, 2014 11:37 AM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
there would be fees for this, bitcoin only becomes feeless if its the default currency which is never gonna happen this is all so stupid
― lag∞n, Wednesday, 22 January 2014 16:39 (ten years ago) link