Has anyone read about the Russian response? I've only seen that Putin said it was 'more a progrom than a revolution', but this is not a good situation for them. The euraisian customs-union is pretty much dead at this point, right?
― Frederik B, Tuesday, 3 December 2013 17:52 (ten years ago) link
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/dec/29/volgograd-train-station-russia-explosion
Thirteen dead in a suicide bombing in Volgograd. Same city as the bus bombing earlier this year. It was assumed at the time that the woman who blew up the bus was on route to Moscow and detonated it early in a panic about security checks but it looks like they are choosing softer targets now.
― Ramnaresh Samhain (ShariVari), Sunday, 29 December 2013 10:59 (ten years ago) link
Yeah. My paper said it was about using the attention because of Sochi.
― Frederik B, Sunday, 29 December 2013 20:59 (ten years ago) link
Jesus, fifteen more dead in a bus explosion in Vologograd today.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/dec/30/russia-second-explosion-volgograd
― Ramnaresh Samhain (ShariVari), Monday, 30 December 2013 07:03 (ten years ago) link
I caught up with some broadly pro-EU, anti-Yanukovich contacts over from Kiev today and they were not particularly positive about how things are going to turn out over the next few weeks. Most of the reporting identifies a clear division between "the government" and "the opposition" but the reality is a lot more complex than that. Euromaidan is not aligned with the formal opposition - it's its own group with its own set of agendas and no clear leadership structure to negotiate with.
Its quite conceivable that a compromise position could be found with the mainstream political opposition but there is absolutely no guarantee that Euromaidan would back it. There's a very strong probability that they would not settle for anything less than the removal of Yanukovich which is highly unlikely to ever be on the table. For all the talk of a negotiated settlement, it's difficult to see a quick end. People are already talking about comparisons with Northern Ireland.
― Ramnaresh Samhain (ShariVari), Monday, 27 January 2014 18:40 (ten years ago) link
is ukraine going to cleave in two along the dnieper eventually
― Pedro Mba Obiang Avomo est un joueur de football hispano-ganéen (nakhchivan), Monday, 27 January 2014 20:28 (ten years ago) link
I don't think that's impossible. Ukraine without the East and Crimea would be substantially poorer, though, and more heavily reliant on agriculture (rather than heavy industry, mining and tourism as well). Culturally and politically it might make a certain amount of sense but economically it would be really tough.
― Ramnaresh Samhain (ShariVari), Monday, 27 January 2014 20:33 (ten years ago) link
How much would EU-money for the agriculture help with that?
― Frederik B, Monday, 27 January 2014 22:28 (ten years ago) link
I don't know, to be honest. It has definitely helped Poland (to the tune of about 4bn Euro a year) but the Ukrainian economy is in such bad shape as it is, i'm not sure it would make that much of a difference.
― Ramnaresh Samhain (ShariVari), Monday, 27 January 2014 22:36 (ten years ago) link
Also, another major problem: Where on earth would 'west-ukraine' get the energy they need? No way would Russia just give them the gas they need.
― Frederik B, Monday, 27 January 2014 22:44 (ten years ago) link
They might do if any division was seen as otherwise favourable.
I don't know. It's so messy. Even in the Russian-dominated cities out East you'd still have a lot of people who'd identify as Ukrainian and who wouldn't necessarily want to change that or move West. Despite all the schisms, i'd like to think it's salvageable but the Ukrainian political class, for a variety of reasons, doesn't seem capable of addressing any of the issues that could pull the country together (fixing the economy, rooting out corruption and special interests, etc, etc).
― Ramnaresh Samhain (ShariVari), Monday, 27 January 2014 22:57 (ten years ago) link
http://www.heraldo.es/uploads/imagenes/bajacalidad/2014/01/30/_ucranaoo_33d9e0dc.jpg
― ogmor, Friday, 31 January 2014 09:11 (ten years ago) link
http://www.latviannews.lv/userfiles/else/b/1390484991_20140123154951.jpg
http://wird.com.ua/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/Zurab_Dzhavakhadze_01_12-1024x682.jpg
― ogmor, Friday, 31 January 2014 09:12 (ten years ago) link
http://25.media.tumblr.com/66440c8769840eae9b1da7fca7860a09/tumblr_mztfa6GGBZ1qz6f9yo1_1280.jpg
http://img.over-blog-kiwi.com/0/82/53/64/20140123/ob_c9759e_tumblr-mztfa6ggbz1qz6f9yo3-1280.jpg
http://wird.com.ua/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/haranych3_reuters_01_12.jpg
― ogmor, Friday, 31 January 2014 09:13 (ten years ago) link
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-cfB0hSD2S6A/UuO11-TMIOI/AAAAAAAARvE/V_3hGPzeHqE/s1600/kiev.jpg
Even after the Orange Revolution, it's surreal to see places in Kyiv i know so well turned into war zones.
This is a notoriously bad Russian tabloid but the graphic is useful:
http://www.kp.ru/daily/26188.4/3076595/
You can see over time which areas have had government buildings seized (pink) and which are under attack (orange).
― Ramnaresh Samhain (ShariVari), Friday, 31 January 2014 12:42 (ten years ago) link
I read about an essay basically blaming this whole mess on the hypocrasy of the EU negotiators. In the deal offered to Ukraine, Moldova, Armenia, etc, it was expected that they would fit pretty much every part of society to an EU-standard, unreasonably fast, but it didn't offer any prospects of future membership of the EU. There is a basic difference between Russia and EU: Russia is playing old-school geo-politics: Grapping as much as possible into it's sphere of influence. EU is only half-heartedly playing the same way, demanding that every one accepts EU rules, but on the other hand pretty isolationist and not in any way willing to for instance open the borders to more eastern europeans. I will try and find this essay, that is probably more useful...
― Frederik B, Monday, 3 February 2014 13:12 (ten years ago) link
what the fuck is switzerland doing
― Pedro Mba Obiang Avomo est un joueur de football hispano-ganéen (nakhchivan), Monday, 10 February 2014 20:11 (ten years ago) link
bump
― sleeve, Thursday, 20 February 2014 01:33 (ten years ago) link
Reports from the last couple of days are really scary, lots of deaths on both sides. There are videos and photos of police using semi-automatic weapons against protesters. The opposition is saying that troops in combat gear were ordered to go to Kyiv.
I don't really know that much about ukrainian internal politics, but it looks like the regional tensions start to show in a big way, with Crimea regional council talking about the possibility of seceding and asking Russia for protection, and Ivano-Frannkivsk council declaring Yanukovytch an illegal president.
― antoni, Thursday, 20 February 2014 14:08 (ten years ago) link
Yes, both sides have used live fire now, though both are saying that the other one started it. There have been at least thirty deaths and another 300 seriously injured.
I'm finding it difficult to get a sense of how widely the violence has spread in Kyiv. During the major unrest last month it was business as usual in 99% of the city but this looks considerably worse.
― Ramnaresh Samhain (ShariVari), Thursday, 20 February 2014 14:16 (ten years ago) link
The company I do business with, which is 20 km or so outside the city to the nw, has closed their office today because it was unsafe for people to come in. The first time since the protests began.
― Jaq, Thursday, 20 February 2014 14:36 (ten years ago) link
Yeah, this is extremely scary. But I must admit this time it seems to me as if the demonstrators started it. So close to an agreement on amnesty, and then it exploded.
― Frederik B, Thursday, 20 February 2014 14:49 (ten years ago) link
I think it comes back to the idea the opposition is not unified. The moderate demonstrators backed the amnesty and left most of the government buildings while the hardliners dug in at the tent city in Maidan Nezalezhnosti. It's tough to see anything other than the complete overthrow of the government being acceptable to some of them.
― Ramnaresh Samhain (ShariVari), Thursday, 20 February 2014 14:57 (ten years ago) link
Yeah, that's my impression too.
― Frederik B, Thursday, 20 February 2014 15:10 (ten years ago) link
Got some Russian dupes on this fucking thread. The opposition is unified in opposition to the government, which is a criminal conspiracy.
― Three Word Username, Thursday, 20 February 2014 15:10 (ten years ago) link
Other than being against the government, how else do you imagine they're united? That's rather important when looking at short and long term solutions.
― Ramnaresh Samhain (ShariVari), Thursday, 20 February 2014 15:14 (ten years ago) link
first half of this 2004 tony judt article on ukraine, turkey & the EU is quite interesting - http://www.nytimes.com/2004/12/05/opinion/05judt.html
― ogmor, Thursday, 20 February 2014 15:16 (ten years ago) link
http://media4.s-nbcnews.com/j/msnbc/components/slideshows/_production/ss-140220-ukraine-fighting/ss-140220-ukraine-03.nbcnews-ux-1440-1000.jpg
― hang son doong (am0n), Thursday, 20 February 2014 16:00 (ten years ago) link
http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2014/2/20/1392898379821/A-demonstrator-stands-on--001.jpg
― What is wrong with songs? Absolutely nothing. Songs are great. (DL), Thursday, 20 February 2014 18:50 (ten years ago) link
― What is wrong with songs? Absolutely nothing. Songs are great. (DL), Thursday, 20 February 2014 18:51 (ten years ago) link
paramilitary pigs using sniper rifles against unarmed civilians deserve a special kind of hell
― Joyeux animaux de la misère (nakhchivan), Thursday, 20 February 2014 19:39 (ten years ago) link
http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/dam/assets/140220095454-24-ukraine-0220-horizontal-gallery.jpg
― christmas candy bar (al leong), Thursday, 20 February 2014 23:42 (ten years ago) link
Apparently Yanukovich has agreed to going back to the 2004 constitution, a new coalition government and elections in December. No word on whether any of the opposition groups are backing it.
― Ramnaresh Samhain (ShariVari), Friday, 21 February 2014 08:43 (ten years ago) link
Also George Zimmerman has said he'll never kill again. No word on whether any of those liberals are backing him.
― Three Word Username, Friday, 21 February 2014 08:47 (ten years ago) link
At last, somebody is thinking outside the box: Jean-Marie Le Pen suggests Ebola as solution to global population explosion
― popchips: the next snapple? (seandalai), Wednesday, 21 May 2014 17:51 (ten years ago) link
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/25/france-national-front-win-european-elections
Gah.
― Yuri Bashment (ShariVari), Sunday, 25 May 2014 18:53 (ten years ago) link
The result in Denmark is really exciting! The polls show that Venstre, the biggest right-wing party, in line to take back the government after the next election, would get three mandates, same as last time. But then the leader, Lars Løkke Rasmussen, got caught in a scandal because the party had spent 152.000 kr on clothes for him during the last election (more than 15.000 pounds) as well as buying planetickets for a vacation for his wife and son afterwards. So people said that if they lost a mandate, it would be his fault. And now the exit-polls are divided, with one showing three and one showing two. The mandate would otherwise go to the Socialist Peoples Party, part of the Green block in the parliament, whom I also voted for. Fingers crossed!
― Frederik B, Sunday, 25 May 2014 19:14 (ten years ago) link
Supporting the interpretation of the European results as a rejection of austerian EU policies rather than a lurch back towards the early-middle twentieth century, Euroskeptic parties of the left did quite well in Italy and Greece. The most likely practical effect in the EU itself will be a displacement of the governing Socialist-led center-left coalition by a center-right coalition. So talk of an “earthquake” in this election will be muffled a bit by the time the aftershocks subside in Brussels. But these are perilous times for the European project.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/political-animal-a/2014_05/not_a_real_good_day_for_the_eu050507.php
― curmudgeon, Tuesday, 27 May 2014 14:39 (ten years ago) link
to what extent do ppl feel like there is a lot of anti-immigration sentiment in these results?
― Mordy, Tuesday, 27 May 2014 14:41 (ten years ago) link
The anti-immigration National Front won in France.
― curmudgeon, Tuesday, 27 May 2014 14:46 (ten years ago) link
but i feel like everything i've read so far has been about the results being EU-skeptic as opposed to more prosaic domestic concerns?
― Mordy, Tuesday, 27 May 2014 14:49 (ten years ago) link
Well, I think that the EU-sceptic victories far outstrip the polling for the immigration-skeptic parties in most countries. Like, the immigration-sceptic Danish Peoples Party got 26% of the vote in Denmark, and was by far the biggest party. But that result exceeds every poll for parliamental elections, so it's probably not a blanket vote on their political platform.
― Frederik B, Tuesday, 27 May 2014 14:54 (ten years ago) link
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BogcqQdIYAEJXne.jpg
― ogmor, Tuesday, 27 May 2014 15:12 (ten years ago) link
The National Front is anti-immigration, EU-skeptical, and racist. Mordy, surprised by your blase reaction to their win.
― curmudgeon, Tuesday, 27 May 2014 15:30 (ten years ago) link
Blase? I speculated on the anti-semitism thread that NF winning would hasten the French-Jewish community's emigration (already at historical peak)
― Mordy, Tuesday, 27 May 2014 15:36 (ten years ago) link
I hadn't read your comments there, just the last few itt
― curmudgeon, Tuesday, 27 May 2014 15:50 (ten years ago) link
yeah everything I know about the valley of the fallen makes it seem like a nightmare
― ogmor, Tuesday, 24 September 2019 10:39 (four years ago) link
i'd prefer desecrated but downsized will do for now i s'pose
― Is it true the star Beetle Juice is going to explode in 2012 (bizarro gazzara), Tuesday, 24 September 2019 10:46 (four years ago) link
Yeah, good day for Supreme Courts. I need to see that doc.
― Le Bateau Ivre, Tuesday, 24 September 2019 11:33 (four years ago) link
https://www.politico.eu/article/jan-jambon-flemish-parties-toughen-migration-stance-in-coalition-agreement/
Flemish parties toughen migration stance in coalition agreementFlemish nationalist Jan Jambon announced the three-party deal Monday.
In the UK there are gammons, in Belgium there is Jambon itself.
― L'assie (Euler), Monday, 30 September 2019 15:51 (four years ago) link
Great that we all learned the right lessons from the last crisis and that the EU is showing skeptics what for by pulling together in solidarity!
https://www.politico.eu/article/virtual-summit-real-acrimony-eu-leaders-clash-over-corona-bonds/?fbclid=IwAR1ewCarJ_y_3h2oiCiE1a0GIooHMbm4wINPxrhQSOXwIM4Si7h80dxPM_g
― Daniel_Rf, Friday, 27 March 2020 14:27 (four years ago) link
This is playing with fire. Can't see the EU surviving this.
― xyzzzz__, Friday, 27 March 2020 14:44 (four years ago) link
It'll survive it, but it's another idiotically selfish move that's bound to decrease its life expectancy in the long run.
― coco vide (pomenitul), Friday, 27 March 2020 14:45 (four years ago) link
Unlike you to be so positive Pom.
But yes it won't collapse overnight, but it gives the anti-EU forces more ammunition. All little steps along the way.
― xyzzzz__, Friday, 27 March 2020 14:49 (four years ago) link
seems that germany is going to be the death of it
― ogmor, Friday, 27 March 2020 14:54 (four years ago) link
Next Bundestag election will be held some time next year. A proper shift to the left is still possible, but I'm not exactly getting my hopes up.
― coco vide (pomenitul), Friday, 27 March 2020 15:00 (four years ago) link
Merkel seemed to be the only thing keeping the fascists at bay, so I'm worried.
I've said before here that I can't imagine Portugal ever going full euroskeptic, despite having been dealt a very rough hand during the last crisis, because the prospects of economic survival outside the EU are just so grim. But if this carries on that just might do it.
― Daniel_Rf, Friday, 27 March 2020 15:07 (four years ago) link
Same in Romania, but we're expendable anyway.
― coco vide (pomenitul), Friday, 27 March 2020 15:16 (four years ago) link
Hungarian parliament has made Orban dictator
Hungarian Parliament passes bill that gives PM Orbán unlimited power & proclaims:- State of emergency w/o time limit- Rule by decree- Parliament suspended- No elections- Spreading fake news + rumors: up to 5 yrs in prison- Leaving quarantine: up to 8 yrs in prison#COVID19 pic.twitter.com/5ScZCbF4yv— Balazs Csekö (@balazscseko) March 30, 2020
― ogmor, Monday, 30 March 2020 18:48 (four years ago) link
We briefly touched on this in the outbreak thread. The EU is afraid of seeming dictatorial and encroaching on the autonomy of its member states, at the risk of condoning a bona fide fascist dictatorship. This is simply not a risk worth taking, even if the usual suspects – starting with Poland – will undoubtedly side with Orbán in order to safeguard their own Blut und Boden bullshit.
― coco vide (pomenitul), Monday, 30 March 2020 18:57 (four years ago) link
The EU seem to be dictatorial when it comes to budgets and issuing bonds though..
― xyzzzz__, Monday, 30 March 2020 19:00 (four years ago) link
As long as Germany continues to call the shots…
― coco vide (pomenitul), Monday, 30 March 2020 19:07 (four years ago) link
European governments who think that a massive shock in the range of 12 to 20% of GDP can be absorbed with a few new loans from the European Stability Mechanism (whose total available capital is a paltry €410bn–just 3.4% of Eurozone GDP) are deluding themselves. https://t.co/i3RnVqAlxe— Nicholas Mulder (@njtmulder) March 30, 2020
― xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 31 March 2020 10:01 (four years ago) link
"The Dutch" is trending on twitter, so you know what that means... I think their stance is appalling, it's entirely inappropriate posturing during the worst crisis imaginable, by both Rutte and Merkel.
This otm basically: https://www.theguardian.com/world/commentisfree/2020/mar/31/solidarity-members-eurozone-coronavirus-dutch-coronabond
― Hey, let me drunkenly animate yr boats in about 25 to 60 days! (Le Bateau Ivre), Tuesday, 31 March 2020 10:25 (four years ago) link
the arguments against this are arguments against the EU
― ogmor, Tuesday, 31 March 2020 10:43 (four years ago) link
It has been argued (in the last crisis) that the half-dozen northern countries opposing fiscal expansion should split as a bloc and I can see that road being mapped out this year.
― xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 31 March 2020 10:57 (four years ago) link
what would france do?
― ogmor, Tuesday, 31 March 2020 10:57 (four years ago) link
An interesting one for Macron, a guy who has very little ideology.
― xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 31 March 2020 11:00 (four years ago) link
what would jupiter do?
― ogmor, Tuesday, 31 March 2020 11:20 (four years ago) link
The EU put out a statement condemning the abuse of emergency powers - that stopped short of explicitly naming Hungary. Hungary has just endorsed it.
It felt so empty without us ... So we joined the statement. #European #values are common to us all. https://t.co/0Wz8rXJduM— Judit Varga (@JuditVarga_EU) April 2, 2020
― ShariVari, Thursday, 2 April 2020 22:17 (four years ago) link
57-year-old Romanian man, one of 40,000 flown in from Eastern Europe to work on farms during the lockdown, dead from Corona he picked up in Germany.https://t.co/hFB2hwlUTS— Greggs Truther (@invisibleste) April 17, 2020
appalling
― calzino, Friday, 17 April 2020 15:59 (four years ago) link
Big surprise in Berlin state elections, where exit polls show the Greens of mayoral candidate Bettina Jarasch outperform predictions to come out top pic.twitter.com/CVSBOUYzQC— Philip Oltermann (@philipoltermann) September 26, 2021
― xyzzzz__, Sunday, 26 September 2021 20:49 (two years ago) link
Initial results indicate that Berlin voted to expropriate and socialize around 11% of the apartments in the city from mega-landlord 😭 https://t.co/IK2f1nRUyE— nathan ma (@nthnashma) September 26, 2021
and Graz just elected a Communist mayor. https://t.co/0jaji2HSYx— jamie k (@jkbloodtreasure) September 26, 2021
― xyzzzz__, Sunday, 26 September 2021 21:17 (two years ago) link
Germany's first openly trans MPs, both Greens 🇩🇪💚🏳️⚧️ https://t.co/IYMYyLzUFy— Ross Greer (@Ross_Greer) September 26, 2021
― xyzzzz__, Sunday, 26 September 2021 21:52 (two years ago) link
The SPD has scored a very modest success in this election, if one can even call it that. And it is NOT some kind of youthful Corbyn-surge but a lurch towards SPD of older ex-Merkel voters. Old voters, bulk of electorate, are decisive in explaining small gains. https://t.co/CNtAKpGmYk— Adam Tooze (@adam_tooze) September 26, 2021
― xyzzzz__, Sunday, 26 September 2021 22:24 (two years ago) link
You are a refugee, desperate, on a stranded boat on the Mediterranean. Do you let yourself and your family drown or starve or die of thirst, or do you try to steer the boat - and face 146 years in prison? https://t.co/I6XXhCbEFc— James B (@piercepenniless) September 29, 2021
― xyzzzz__, Wednesday, 29 September 2021 07:39 (two years ago) link
https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2022/09/22/italian-election-italy-turns-to-the-right-with-fdis-georgia-meloni.html
― xyzzzz__, Thursday, 22 September 2022 10:12 (two years ago) link
Wonder if the EU will survive the recession we're going into.
We are staring down the first global recession not led by US since World War II. It’s near impossible US doesn’t follow and it’s nearly certain we are making it worse. https://t.co/YWEvsazHtl— Claudia Sahm (@Claudia_Sahm) September 22, 2022
― xyzzzz__, Thursday, 22 September 2022 11:41 (two years ago) link
I wrote for @thenation about the Italian election, how rising energy prices could upset the far right’s agenda in government, and the surprising (partial) recovery or the Five Star Movement https://t.co/bCSAZC1zD5— David Broder (@broderly) September 22, 2022
― xyzzzz__, Friday, 23 September 2022 11:59 (one year ago) link
Meloni will call the pope a globalist and cut off the church like how Florida taxed Disney… then the pope will make a Netflix deal where he’s interviewed by Michelle Obama who will ask if there will ever be a woman pope and the pope will respond “stranger things have happened”— Don Hughes (@getfiscal) September 26, 2022
― xyzzzz__, Monday, 26 September 2022 09:05 (one year ago) link
Deutsche Bank is warning of German deindustrialization as a result of the gas crisis. Unlike in the US or UK, there is no world leading financial, service or digital sector to fall back on. The gas question is the question of the future of this economy. pic.twitter.com/AQFOKY92WC— Isabella M. Weber (@IsabellaMWeber) October 17, 2022
― xyzzzz__, Monday, 17 October 2022 12:51 (one year ago) link
ttps://wapo.st/3UQ292T
gift link should hopefully work- article title--With Europe’s support, North African nations push migrants to the desert
A year-long joint investigation by The Washington Post, Lighthouse Reports and a consortium of international media outlets shows how the European Union and individual European nations are supporting and financing aggressive operations by governments in North Africa to detain tens of thousands of migrants each year and dump them in remote areas, often barren deserts.
European funds have been used to train personnel and buy equipment for units implicated in desert dumps and human rights abuses, records and interviews show. Migrants have been pushed back into the most inhospitable parts of North Africa, exposing them to abandonment with no food or water, kidnapping, extortion, sale as human chattel, torture, sexual violence and, in the worst instances, death.Spanish security forces in Mauritania photographed and reviewed lists of migrants before they were driven to Mali against their will and left to wander for days in an area where violent Islamist groups operate, according to testimony and documents.In Mauritania, Morocco and Tunisia, vehicles of the same make and model as those provided by European countries to local security forces rounded up Black migrants from streets or transported them from detention centers to remote regions, according to filmed footage, verified images, migrant testimony and interviews with officials.European officials held internal discussions on some of the abusive practices since at least 2019, and were flagged to allegations in reports by the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR) and Frontex, the E.U. border agency
― curmudgeon, Tuesday, 21 May 2024 23:11 (four months ago) link