American Politics Thread 2013: I'm a cool Rodham grandma in the USA

the more people who can see you in your undies, the less control you have over whether that information is used against you at any point for the rest of your life.

the real threat of collectivization of private property wasn't bread lines or the KGB spying on you - both things that can happen in mismanaged democracies too. the real threat was holodomor and the 3 years of difficult period.

sure glad famine never happened in mismanaged democracies

for my own edification which democracies experienced such cataclysmic famines? i'm not saying you're wrong, but i can't think of anything on that scale.

and both were in such large numbers specifically bc of how the collectivization + political process occurred. neither were natural famines.

do u know where i am from or

well the sample size for cataclysmic famines of that scale is pretty small - there's the Ukraine, China, and probably several African countries but that's about it, right?

xp

zvookster, my xls sheet on you is completely empty except that your handle starts w/ a z and is as many characters as zachlyon.

my point was just that being directly + indirectly responsible for the murder of millions of your citizens through forced starvation + also direct killing is probably a bigger distinction between the US and the USSR than whether the CIA or the KGB spies more.

ireland?

for scale:

Great Chinese Famine: 20-45 million
Holodomor: 2-6 million
Irish Famine: 1 million

ilx

so i thought i'd been posting here long enough that my civil libertarian bona fides were well enough established, but maybe i just wasn't being clear -- i'm obviously against the indiscriminate collection of information on citizens by their governments, but there's a reason for that, and it's not that i want my "privacy". it's that i think that the government/cops should not be allowed to collect information that can be used to build a case against you without showing probable cause and getting approval from a judge. to me that's what the 4th amendment means and i feel strongly about that. and i don't think the government should be collecting this sort of information indiscriminately (ie as the NSA has done) because as j points out, that information is just begging to be used in one way or another. in the particular case of the US govt collecting info on foreign nationals, i just don't understand whose rights are being compromised. if it turns out that we're alerting the spanish government to information we pick up, then that's pretty lame and we probably should not be doing that, but that also sounds like something the spanish people could take care of legislatively if they felt strongly about it

OK fine -- you can still be my secretary of state.

you'll have to keep those undie pics i sent you under wraps or i'll have a tough time getting confirmed

for scale:

Great Chinese Famine: 20-45 million
Holodomor: 2-6 million
Irish Famine: 1 million

― Ayn Rand Akbar (Shakey Mo Collier), 30. oktober 2013 00:49 (35 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

That still means a far larger share of the Irish population died...

Was the irish famine caused by politically motivated redistribution of resources? Seems like with smaller populations natural causes may have proportionally worse impacts. But in the case of china and the ukraine, you had actual govt policies driving the famine.

yo I've got this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Famine_(Ireland)#Causes_and_contributing_factors

From what I've learned the Irish famine had quite a lot to due with being under colonial rule by a country who didn't give a shit. But that's colonialism, and the link between capitalism and colonialism has weakened quite a bit during these last hundred years.

Well, you could say that the Holodomor was an act of imperialism. Also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bengal_famine_of_1943 and (arguably) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bengal_famine_of_1770

Rest easy, NSA's Alexander insists spying on Spanish & German people was done with assistance of their governments to catch terrorists. No data on whom they caught via this method offered or a defense of spying on Merkel's cellphone.

World leader: Do you spy on us?
Obama: I don't know
World leader: Seriously?
Obama: Do you spy on us?
World leader: You can't answer a question with a question.
Obama: I just did.

So you think Obama's cellphone is monitored, and that's ok?

Europe to world: I cant believe he spied on me!
Rest of world to europe: Oh, honey...

thanks to 'citizens united,' the GOP might get destroyed . . . by rich trustfund objectivists? the irony

http://www.vocativ.com/10-2013/gop-scared-conservative-kids/?test

So you think Obama's cellphone is monitored, and that's ok?

Not sure if it's technically possible to monitor his cellphone but if it is then it is likely that the US monitors it. Other countries would absolutely monitor it if possible. Monitoring of all sorts should be expected.

Not really sure if it's okay as much as it's part of the job description.

sebelius apparently just said the word "whatever" in testimony. so, look out for the memes on that one i guess.

Secret Santa gift for Angela

http://covers.powells.com/9780767900416.jpg

Do they even let the president have a person cell phone?

Hmm, he may have a super-secure $3500 Blackberry, but that was a few years back. I wonder what he has now?

http://www.thekidswindow.co.uk/images/CMScontent/Image/469369~Tin-Can-and-String-Telephone-Posters.jpg

Secure! Except for the shouting.

Obama should just have a truckload of single-use disposable cell phones. An aide could carry a couple dozen in a briefcase and always be within X number of feet of him, just like with the 'football'.

He should have a pager, and then when someone wants to get a hold of him they would have to send their number in a code where you jump over the 5-button, and then he would have to go to a payphone a few blocks away and call them. Never the same phone twice a day!

well, he's got a truckload of Obamaphones he gives to poor black people.

http://johngushue.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/09/04/maxwell_smart_with_shoe_phone.jpg

Graham has done his part to placate the most conservative faction of his party, vowing earlier this week to block every Obama administration appointee until survivors of the 2012 attack in Benghazi testify before Congress.

this fuckin guy

Has this guy ever heard of a subpoena?

http://memecrunch.com/meme/KTU9/stop-trying-to-make-benghazi-happen/image.png

curmudgeon OTM this is so annoying:

As each side stakes out differing positions in public, the White House is signaling it may not insist on raising taxes as part of a deal to replace some of the automatic spending cuts under the budget sequester. The Wall Street Journal reported that President Barack Obama is open to accepting a budget deal without new revenues, and instead includes some cuts to entitlement programs he has previously endorsed.

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid said Tuesday that he won’t consider a deal that doesn’t include revenues.

Give'em hell, Harry!

He looks old, tired, and ornery. I'm pleased with what obstructionism has done to him.

Reid is feeling it these days.

yeah idk when reid got cooler

thanks to 'citizens united,' the GOP might get destroyed . . . by rich trustfund objectivists? the irony

http://www.vocativ.com/10-2013/gop-scared-conservative-kids/?test

i like how that one guy is all "i don't believe in a luck" while he and his coterie of 'tantric' Galts are piggybacking off the a dude who inherited millions of dollars.

Yeah, what was the difference between me being born Preston Bates or me being born this indigent, poor child? I don’t know if it was luck or if it was probability.

is there a more WASPish entitled asshole name than "Preston Bates"

Kinda needs a leading initial to cross the asshole event horizon and collapse into assholish singularity. H. Preston Bates or somesuch.

just call him Master Preston

Massah Preston to the rest of us.

Tantric Master Preston

Reiki Master Preston.