American Politics Thread 2013: I'm a cool Rodham grandma in the USA

I doubt default's gonna happen - I'm sure that what's happening right now is just Boehner counting votes to see if he will retain the speakership after putting the Senate bill (or some version of it) to a floor vote without GOP majority support

ive thought all along that there was only a slim possibility of default, but its still extremely dangerous as the results of default are so dire, and if we keep playing this game of chicken over and over eventually that slim possibility will get its day

tear the band-aid off IMO and get it over with now; that way either we will tank the world now and can actually start rebuilding something better/more sustainable or we'll find out that we are an impervious megalith that the world will never hold accountable and we can then start King Konging smaller nations with impunity

ha no plz

this is actually solvable

i have a pet theory that high military spending is a major contributor to a lot of our problems, because it consists of government spending that most people dont see any tangible result for,

It's not even that there is no tangible result, it's that it's effectively throwing your money away. Missiles, bombs, etc. are physical products that cost a lot of money (relative to US median household income) and are BLOWN UP. Literally destroyed.

You could talk about gains in 'protecting our interests abroad' and making the world safer for a free market, but surely all of that is negated by blowback and maintained by a black market that stays strong and current as long as we insist on producing newer and newer weapons.

Apparently, just nudging up against default last time ended up with the US paying an additional $1.3B in higher interest on outstanding loans.

Over a billion dollars, down the toilet.

I think we should leave future generations an interesting challenge to overcome, it will build character

remember a couple years ago when it became OBVIOUS there was a consensus to decrease the Pentagon budget under Obama? I lol'd then.

hey as long as the capital gains tax rate stays low it's all good

It's not even that there is no tangible result, it's that it's effectively throwing your money away. Missiles, bombs, etc. are physical products that cost a lot of money (relative to US median household income) and are BLOWN UP. Literally destroyed.

You could talk about gains in 'protecting our interests abroad' and making the world safer for a free market, but surely all of that is negated by blowback and maintained by a black market that stays strong and current as long as we insist on producing newer and newer weapons.

― Emperor Cos Dashit (Adam Bruneau), Tuesday, October 15, 2013 1:56 PM (9 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah i mean a military is def an extremely valuable and worthwhile thing to have from an economic standpoint, ours is just ten times more expensive than necessary and theres really no return on investment after a while, its prob as you said even counterproductive at some point as we tend to use it to kill poor brown people on the other side of the world just cause we might as well drop all those bombs

remember a couple years ago when it became OBVIOUS there was a consensus to decrease the Pentagon budget under Obama? I lol'd then.

― eclectic husbandry (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, October 15, 2013 1:59 PM (49 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

fwiw it has been cut some

obvs a drop in the bucket but still

a *real* cut? First I've heard of this.

i like chait's rumor ~ the house passes a take-it-or-leave-it draconian CR, then skips town . . . daring obama to pay the hostage-takers or default

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2013/10/boehner-to-decide-whether-to-blow-up-world-now.html

that'll show the kenyan!

well i mean it depends on how you look at it xp

but its progress in the context of 60 years of escalating military spending

overspending on the military is a congressional problem as much or more than an executive one. cf the sad saga of secretary gates trying to kill off the hideously expensive and underperforming f-35 jet.

this "vote then skip town" rumor is scaring me a bit

they are certainly diablolical

Who is spreading this rumor?

i am, i guess

And the prez ses he won't do Fourteenth Amendment magic.

http://plainblogaboutpolitics.blogspot.com/2013/10/the-brilliant-leave-town-option.html

the thing as i think weve discussed is there is no real magic option, trillion dollar coin or whatever, as its mostly about legitimacy market confidence and whatnot

i mean while were talkin crazy 80s SNL-star comedy-style outcomes, if the GOP tries to leave the air traffic controllers could just stop working, its not like theyre getting paid rn

http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2013/10/14/the-default-has-already-begun/

^ sums up my view on things

yeah thats a good piece

who would have thought the dollar would fall apart because of a republican dine-and-dash routine?

default happens thursday, right? and the only chance of avoiding it is if house accepts whatever the senate proposes last minute?

pretty much. that'll teach america to vote for a black guy!

http://www.people-press.org/files/2013/10/10-15-13-01.png

pretty sly and semi-convincing piece of radical writing here:

http://jacobinmag.com/2013/10/tea-party-yankees/

basically, "the tea party is correct in loving the constitution the way they do... and that's why the constitution is bad gree hee hee"

poll shows 10% of americans know how finance actually works

man this shit is gonna SUCK

once we default we'll be greeted as liberators

jack lew should commit ritual suicide on the steps of congress in protest

http://www.moviewavs.com/php/sounds/?id=bst&media=M4RS&type=TV_Shows&movie=Simpsons";e=default.txt&file=default.m4r

where are reinhart & rogoff now? they wrote a book documenting every time a country has ever defaulted on its debt: http://www.bloomberg.com/video/u-s-will-not-default-on-its-debt-rogoff-says-p1fNXwjLSyCzMhipcB8T~Q.html

um, shit?

https://twitter.com/tackettdc/status/390187773841252352
Michael Tackett ‏@tackettdc
BREAKING. Sen. Feinstein says ``it's all fallen apart''

https://twitter.com/SuzyKhimm/status/390189070170992640
Suzy Khimm Verified account ‏@SuzyKhimm
Sen Chris Coons really bleak about the state of negotiations right now. "We're in very dangerous territory."

not sure flopson but think someone upthread posted bruce bartlett's blogpost documenting every major advocate of default in recent decades?

http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/10/14/for-many-hard-liners-debt-default-is-the-goal/?_r=2&

to totally mix metaphors, the republicans can kill two birds with one stone -- repudiate the debt, a looooooongterm goal; and scapegoat a president they've sworn from day one to destroy -- all in one fell swoop! GOP! GOP!

Now, Durbin told reporters, Senate Republican leader Mitch McConnell is in the position of having to wait for some signal on the next steps from Boehner before he takes any further moves.

"McConnell is waiting on Boehner and Boehner is waiting on his caucus," Durbin said

NY Times

and the caucus is waiting on a plane at DCA.

focused like a laser on jobs

CNN's breaking news is that Ted Cruz convened a SECRET MEETiNG in the basement of DC's Tortilla Coast restaurant.

Just walked by there the other night - feel like I'm so close to history

I hate living in these historical times.

quick everyone get to tortilla coast (really?) with pitchforks.

i'm trying to picture tortilla coast.

maybe wear your flair.

http://www.tortillacoast.com/location_capitolhill.htm

wait – weren't they at Tortilla Coast last night too? What must their margarita bill be like?