Irish politics discussion thread

There's room for more than one point though, and to remind FG that being 0.1 % better that FF is not a solid basis for government.

i'd argue the numbers, but i'll grant you the general thrust i spose

No fair enough, but it also works as a warning that the position in question would not be a solid basis for government, so don't go slouching over towards it.

fair warning for any band that take over from despots- don't just do a little better, or we'll slit your throats an all

Ha! I agree about knocking Enda. Too many others ignored this issue.

In Kerry for the night. I have not been asked by a Healy-Rae for a vote. I feel my visit is missing something.

Keeping in the tone of an Irish political thread.

ave that, mrs

fg backbenchers growling over abortion legislation.

Nobody in ireland born after 1963 or so has ever had a say on this matter. That's only about a million women, nbd. Keep grumbling lads, you're doing god's work. For him.

celtic tiger businessman hugh o'regan 'dies unexpectedly' amidst huge debt issues.

idk, y'know?

Are they saying it's suspicious?

I am appalled at the whole Daly Bill thing. Are we to never see legislation?

we will, i think, and it won't be too long coming (i mean 'too long', obv, not 'too long')

ach daly is posturing, too, to an extent. to keep throwing up motions when it's moving as fast as it's going to is just that imo

I think the issue I have with Daly is unfortunately all to do with the company she keeps. It just seems a bit clueless however one cannot choose who one fancies. She is turning into this year's Bacik being almost a "rent-a-speech" but, to be fair, she is a good speaker and, like Bacik, seems very able for the role of leftist agitator.

Of more concern politician-wise is Labour and the whole morphing into the PDs thing. It was to be expected I suppose but it really is surprising how quickly it happened in the end.

I do expect legislation however this anonymous advisory group does worry me. How do we know that there is a proper mix of politics? Does anyone know how they were chosen? I fear that the older, Catholic population would be well-represented with only the token godless lefty in situ.

irish times budget case studyis some serious fuckin trolling, couple combined income 100k, second kid on way 'struggling to get by'

Labour-defending friends on Facebook were saying "Ah god no they couldn't vote against FG, the government might collapse!" and holding up the idea of a FF-FG government as the terrifying bogeyman that might result, as opposed to the long term goal of the Labour party.

idk, yeah i'd love to see the top rate of tax go up 5% and the usc go up double for incomes above 100k and for the property tax to be .3% on all properties worth over 500k and fags to go up by a fiver and spirits by 15%. I just assume that there's reasons they're not doing all this, i can't imagine what they are tho.

ff-fg govt not as good an idea as a ff-fg opposition

there's not too much that appears to affect a couple with combined income of 52k with an 02 skoda renting at 1000 per month, tbh

well they specifically targeted me with the tobacco and wine increases so i hope you're happy

ye cost the health service more iirc, they should subsidise my five a side imo.

im surprised child benefit hasnt been cut

it will be, surely? 10 euro per child.

Ducked out of means testing it tbh

ceann comhairle zing on that cunt mcgrath

i'd be embarrassed to speak in the fuckin jacks of my local the way this one speaks in the dail

lairy moo mcdonald

richard boyd barrett

why can't he talk so good

Adopted as a baby, his natural mother is actress Sinéad Cusack, with whom he was later reunited.[3]

Boyd Barrett is a member of the Trotskyist[10][11] Socialist Workers Party

supported the Rossport Five

In October 2012, Boyd Barrett confirmed that he claimed €12,000 in 2011 expenses for travelling to the Dail from his home in Glenageary, in his Dun Laoghaire constituency -- a distance of just 12km

baby politics, he's playing happily at it

12000 dont even buy hima suit, oooh the rebel

dunno who yerman in between was, but he was ok i think

pringle's a moron an all

Well that was unpleasant. The case studies are a bit odd. To be honest you have to take the firms providing with a huge grain of salt seeing as they have consulting work for state and semi-state bodies in their sights. Don't want to be too pass-remarkable.

It's the sneakiness of some of the cuts that also grates.

I still honestly think the price of fags should be raised properly. I accept that is cruel and totally subjective.

FF-SF for next government. I'm taking the bets now. How has Martin been so adept at rehabilitating FF's image? Has FG really missed the point that they won't/can't last forever? What do all the consultants do?

Of course this whole thing with Ming's jumper is manna from heaven right now for the coalition.

i'd hope that ppl have longer memories than to bring ff back in, i'd hope that ppl are smarter than to srsly consider the basket case that is sf economic policy (which, AFAICT, exists only as the headings written by that cunt editor from the star)

best case scenario is that irish people realise that 3.5bn per annum doesn't come from nowhere, that it did need taking out of the economy regardless of any bailout once revenues had fallen as quickly as they had, and that FG/LAB are going about things methodically and not all that badly (for irish politicians)

o'reilly should have been fucked out on his ear, clearly. labour should have been more honest in their promises/manifesto (when is this never not true). i'm undoubtedly biased but croke park was not a FG/LAB plan and is being renegotiated early to get better terms for the state- really if they bring in a few more supertaxes for superearners and on wealth next year, there's not a lot different a government could feasibly have done, budget wise.

anyone telling you any different would want some seriously convincing backup.

Those pro-life ads popping up targetted at politicians are harsh. It's not often that I would agree with Shatter but there is a real bullying element to it all.

Labour implosion

Or is it Harder, Franker, Furter Gilmour? (Apologies to Scooter)

ah jaysus, there ought to have been a pun tax in the budget

so, look, cmere

Croke Park agreement. What d'ye think of it?

Truthfully? Not altogether sure I understand it. If, as the meeja would have me believe, it's public servants having a laugh and jacking up exorbitant salaries then I am against it. If, on the other hand, it is actually about safeguarding lower paid public servants then I am for it. I don't, however, understand why it can't be revisited or revised.

Yourself?

Sorry "jacking up their already exorbitant salaries..."

it's probably serving both purposes for the term, tbh. On a personal interest level i was against it on day one and voted against it, as i'd not got permanency at the time and it meant my take home pay dropping by about 10% when i didn't feel any responsibility for the causes of the cuts.

As the situation facing the country became more and more entrenched and undeniable, and when i gained the benefit of permanency, i probably view the agreement over the three years as a decent settlement- bear in mind my pay is some way beneath avg industrial wage though- my strongest feelings on the irish tax debate are reserved v much on the lines of income/wealth vs low waged/poor as opposed to public/private.

The agreement is supposed to have seen massive savings on payroll from high earners' early retirement and cutting numbers. Numbers have been cut by numbers not being renewed- ime that's v much concentrated at frontline positions and therefore highly impacts servicd delivery, which seems not to be the public interest methodology. ITO high earners retiring early, eh there's accountancy at work but if you asked me to work out how paying out lump sums and pensions to those at high level who've retired works out as worth having done, i'm at a loss- and i'm p good with numbers tho i say it myself. That others in public service have to take on those duties without pay or recognition is not a desirable outcome imo, even if savings are being delivered on these terms.

There's apparently massive changes have taken place in work practices and efficiency. I must have missed them, but then the need for them have been overstated by at least the same margin- i've worked since 1994 across a rangeof jobs and sectors and there is no loss of efficiency, abilty or dedication to role in my current colleagues that cannot be explained in large part to the different aims and culture necessitated by the nebulous nature of public service where there often exists many different stakeholders (many of whom are emboldened and empowered in a way the never are nor could be in ordinary customer service transactions) and no one simple driving force as galvanising nor glamorous as profit motive.

If the govt claim it's working, and the unions claim it's worth keeping, i can understand very well why the general public would be wary of it. The savings attributed to it are dubious, certainly, and the assurances afforded the public servant under it are rightly the envy of the private sector counterpart. But public services are being maintained in the face of pretty serious cuts, there isn't any question of the types of strikes/unrest that has occurred in other countries (the cynic in me wonders if this wasn't the whole point, bearing in mind my perspective on capital vs labour and the fractured nature of the latter force -split as it is btwn private/public and in other ways imo- in the current climate) and i think that it has delivered some progress in a time of serious instability.

Public sector's got a lot of improving to do- as much as the private, i think at times. I don't think, tbh, that another, more radical, agreement next year would be a bad thing at all. I'd be surprised if it focused on wages the way the media and IBEC would like it to, but overall it's p much done the required over the course and may well serve as a successful template for further necessary reform in the future.

i was so pissed last night btw

You were remarkably lucid for someone who was pissed! Fair play. So essentially the cost-savings appear to be down to people leaving? That's hardly ideal from the aspect of keeping a fully functioning civil service in play. Are any new hires (I'm sure there unofficially must be a number and not just on JobBridge) only on contract?

I have to say that from a private aspect there are very few things I am jealous of in public service. Possibly only the shoe allowance. It's not easy and to be honest it's only the outlisrs who sound like they are doing well.

compared to the outliers in the private sector, they're not, tho. Compare the resources/assets managed and the scope of decision-making responsibility required of a county manager, who gets paid roughly the same as my mate the IT manager of a firm you've never heard of.

Cost savings, in the main, are through nonrenewal of contract staff, and as i said that's lower level and frontline in nature, so yeah it's a direct services impact.

No shoe allowance, but imo non-receipted allowances ought be slashed to next-nothing, the majority of them are a nonsense, and also imo they're both the biggest valid stick to hit public sector with as well as a substitute for genuine wage reform.

New hires are, ime anyway, agency staff working week-to-week for less money with no benefits like sickpay or anything beyond minimum leave allowance. Yay croke park, friend to the working man.

Mr McEntee's brother Gerry spoke at the Mass of anonymous critics of his brother in recent times. "Shame on you people, you faceless cowards who sent him horrible messages on the website and on text. Shame on you. I hope you are not proud of what you achieved . If you are, we are in a worse state than I ever thought we were in," he said.

like idk is this the line to take at a funeral oration tbh, whether or not anyone can ever say what caused his to take his own life

This sounds heartless but I heard that and thought it was pretty sad that it was all being blamed on dose gurriers wit dere interwebs. Tragic that a person killed themselves whatever the reason.

it seems a small-time thing to throw out at a funeral, and i'm fully aware that you maybe oughtn't criticise someone speaking at such a time but we've all been there or thereabouts and you can usually comport yourself as hoped ime

So we're ahead on tax! How long until we are in the black again? I'm quids in for a prediction of the budget after the next election but only if we vote FG back in.

Also I don't understand or condone the existence of Howlin.

there he is, y'know? there's health, which is just a shit job and god help anyone who takes it, and then there's his role, two absolute non-winners. finance, at least if you're decisive and consistent and not always completely fucking wrong (and i have to say, noonan has impressed in the role far beyond what i'd expected) you'll get respect, but howlin's role is just an invite for a fucking.

joke reasons given for turning down right to assisted suicide.

bishops and the usual cranks consulted on abortion legislation.

Steady building pressure on measures to control evil social media

Have i missed anything

http://sphotos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/736524_10152407624245693_544914632_o.jpg