― Gear! (Gear!), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:38 (twenty-two years ago)
You may have to ask someone who thinks that it is his fault.
― deanomgwtf!!!p%3Fmsgid%3D4581997 (deangulberry), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:40 (twenty-two years ago)
― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:41 (twenty-two years ago)
― The Devil's Triad (calstars), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:42 (twenty-two years ago)
― s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:42 (twenty-two years ago)
― s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:43 (twenty-two years ago)
― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:44 (twenty-two years ago)
― s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:44 (twenty-two years ago)
http://slate.msn.com/id/2102723/
― lovebug starski, Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:44 (twenty-two years ago)
― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:45 (twenty-two years ago)
― Gear! (Gear!), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:45 (twenty-two years ago)
― deanomgwtf!!!p%3Fmsgid%3D4581997 (deangulberry), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:45 (twenty-two years ago)
― s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:46 (twenty-two years ago)
― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:47 (twenty-two years ago)
― s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:48 (twenty-two years ago)
― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:49 (twenty-two years ago)
oh no, please don't me bring poor Nanook back into another thread. He's tired.
― hstencil (hstencil), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:49 (twenty-two years ago)
Yours truly, Mister Obvious
― Mr.Obvious (scott seward), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:51 (twenty-two years ago)
― The Devil's Triad (calstars), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:51 (twenty-two years ago)
― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:53 (twenty-two years ago)
― VengaDan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:53 (twenty-two years ago)
― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:55 (twenty-two years ago)
― hstencil (hstencil), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:55 (twenty-two years ago)
― hstencil (hstencil), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 18:56 (twenty-two years ago)
If everyone agreed that Nanook was a documentary, pure and simple, then you're right. You could argue that people shouldn't/can't hold Moore to a different standard. But that view of Nanook isn't universal or even a majority.
hstencil, that was in reference to the "it needs to be objective" arguments. "Objectivity" is a lame bogeyman raised by the right to attack Moore, when objectivity is neither necessary nor preferable (documentary without a POV = boring/pointless).
― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 19:00 (twenty-two years ago)
― J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 19:04 (twenty-two years ago)
― J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 19:05 (twenty-two years ago)
Reference Library: Encyclopedia
Main Page | See live article | Alphabetical index
Documentary filmAn incredibly broad category of cinematic expression, traditionally, the only common characteristic to all documentary films is that they are meant to be non-fiction films. The French used the term to refer to any non-fiction film, including travelogues and instructional videos. The earliest "moving pictures" were by definition documentary. They were single shots, moments captured on film, whether of a train entering a station, a boat docking, or a factory of people getting off work. Early film (pre-1900) was dominated by the novelty of showing an event. These short films were called "actualities." Very little storytelling took place before the turn of the century, due mostly to technological limitations: cameras could hold only very small amounts of film; many of the first films are a minute or less in length.With Robert J. Flaherty's Nanook of the North in 1922, documentary film embraced romanticism; Flaherty went on to film a number of heavily staged romantic films, usually showing how his subjects would have lived 100 years earlier and not how they lived right then (for instance, in Nanook of the North Flaherty does not allow his subjects to shoot a walrus with a nearby shotgun, but has them use a harpoon instead, putting themselves in considerable danger).
Some of Flaherty's staging, such as building a roofless igloo for interior shots, was done to accommodate the filming technology of the time. In later years, attempts to steer the action in this way, without informing the audience, have come to be considered both unethical and contradictory to the nature of documentary film. On the other hand, both the story line and content of any documentary are imposed by the filmmaker.
Amazon.com description:
Editorial ReviewsAmazon.com essential videoRobert J. Flaherty, who wrote, directed, produced, shot, and edited this landmark picture, will forever be remembered as the godfather of documentary filmmaking. While this landmark 1922 production, shot on the northeastern shore of Hudson Bay, isn't a true documentary by contemporary conventions, it remains the first great nonfiction film. With the help of Nanook and his friends and family, Flaherty undertook the mission of re-creating an Eskimo culture that no longer existed in a series of staged scenes. Nanook ice fishes, harpoons a walrus, catches a seal, traps, builds an igloo, and trades pelts at a trading post, all captured by Flaherty's inquisitive camera. Though he presents a "happy" culture bordering on primitive innocence (Nanook and his family were in reality quite westernized), his loving portrait is anything but condescending. Ultimately Flaherty shares his tremendous respect and awe for a culture that has learned to not just survive but thrive in such an inhospitable environment. On a purely visual level the film is a beautiful work of cinema, an understated drama in an austere, unblemished landscape of snow and ice. With unerring simplicity and directness, Flaherty re-creates the details and rhythms of a culture long gone and gives the world a glimpse.
review from Silent Film Sources:
Nanook of the North (1922) R E V I E W 1922. 6 reels. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revillon Freres present NANOOK OF THE NORTH. A story of life and love in the actual arctic. Produced by Robert J. Flaherty F.R.G.S. Pathepicture. Opening title: The mysterious Barren Lands- desolate, boulder-strewn, wind-swept- illimitable spaces which top the world.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Produced for video by David Shepard. Nanook of the North was the first of Robert J. Flaherty's romantic depictions of man's dignified perseverance in combating a malevolent nature. Flaherty is often called "the father of the documentary", and he did make the first theatrical documentary feature with Nanook. But that fact does not do justice to the humanism and the technical brilliance that makes his best works -- Nanook, Man of Aran and Louisiana Story -- beautiful and enduring.
imdb:
Nanook of the North (1922) Directed byRobert J. Flaherty
Writing credits Robert J. Flaherty
Genre: Documentary (more)
Tagline: A story of life and love in the actual Arctic. (more)
Plot Summary: Documents one year in the life of Nanook, an Eskimo (Inuit) and his family. Describes the trading, hunting... (more)
Shall I go on? Googling gets old.
― hstencil (hstencil), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 19:06 (twenty-two years ago)
― The Devil's Triad (calstars), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 19:06 (twenty-two years ago)
x-post
An IMDB entry for it says documentary - OK, IMDB also lists Häxan as a doc. Is Häxan a documentary? An Amazon review, a dictionary reference that includes the line "In later years, attempts to steer the action in this way, without informing the audience, have come to be considered both unethical and contradictory to the nature of documentary film."
None of these show a consensus of opinion on Nanook that lets you use it and its methods as a standard. (Because that consensus does not exist.)
― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 19:10 (twenty-two years ago)
I think your error is in assuming that a documentary is about accounting history. Documentary != history book.
― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 19:14 (twenty-two years ago)
― deanomgwtf!!!p%3Fmsgid%3D4581997 (deangulberry), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 19:17 (twenty-two years ago)
― hstencil (hstencil), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 19:26 (twenty-two years ago)
― The Devil's Triad (calstars), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 19:26 (twenty-two years ago)
― hstencil (hstencil), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 19:27 (twenty-two years ago)
I'm reminded of how effective this whole embedded journalist thing worked during the war's early stages... lame ass FOX reporters felt the espirit de corps and wouldn't report anything negative... they became buddies with the soldiers.
(And my point is....?)
― andy, Tuesday, 22 June 2004 19:30 (twenty-two years ago)
― lauren (laurenp), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 19:40 (twenty-two years ago)
― hstencil (hstencil), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 19:55 (twenty-two years ago)
― lauren (laurenp), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 19:57 (twenty-two years ago)
― J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 20:04 (twenty-two years ago)
― J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 20:10 (twenty-two years ago)
― VengaDan Perry (Dan Perry), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 20:18 (twenty-two years ago)
― morris pavilion (samjeff), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 20:24 (twenty-two years ago)
i am really dreading seeing this movie.
― g--ff (gcannon), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 21:55 (twenty-two years ago)
― J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Tuesday, 22 June 2004 21:57 (twenty-two years ago)
J. Hoberman
a) does he mean Garth out of Wayne's World? b) if so, what's he on about?c) and you know what the worst part is? I never learned to read.
― Enrique (Enrique), Thursday, 24 June 2004 13:56 (twenty-two years ago)
― hstencil (hstencil), Thursday, 24 June 2004 14:56 (twenty-two years ago)
No other reviews "noticed this" because he left off the last part of the reporter's statement - "it must be avenged, or at least punished." (something to that effect)
― miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Friday, 25 June 2004 15:30 (twenty-two years ago)
No Country for Old Men > better than There Will Be Blood, Zodiac
The Coen brothers hauntingly mythologize Americana, while P.T. Anderson and David Fincher make it morbid, sadistic and self-congratulatory.
― and what, Thursday, 17 January 2008 19:43 (eighteen years ago)
o_O
Better Than!
The movies that saved movies from themselvesGoing to the movies last year became one ideological battle after another. It was clear throughout 2025 that movies and media offended our trust under the guise of entertainment content that was often dishonest or dispirited. This year’s Better-Than List opposes that trend and those partisan/seditious lists and critics’ groups that awarded propaganda while pretending to salute art. Film culture reached its nadir immediately after the assassination of Charlie Kirk when, almost by reflex, leftist Hollywood released a particular consensus flick that encouraged racism and political violence. Otherwise, some good, honest art about the human condition awaits your attention.Twinless > One Battle After AnotherJames Sweeney’s bromance asserted gender and romantic differences (not diversity) as the basis of our emotional common ground, from grief to friendship and big-L love — the most profound rom-com since Lubitsch’s That Uncertain Feeling. Paul Thomas Anderson’s shallow political farce was the unpopular — but media-favored — flick that mocked unresolved racism and sexism as the justification for civil war.An Officer and a Spy > It Was Just an AccidentRoman Polanski’s take on the Dreyfus affair finally opened in the U.S. in time to examine rising anti-Jewish bigotry. Jean Dujardin’s commanding performance reveals complex personal integrity without the leaden ironies of Jafar Panahi’s Iranian thriller geared to self-righteous political paranoia.Song Sung Blue > Springsteen: Deliver Me from NowhereCraig Brewer finds the spiritual center of Neil Diamond’s music in the true-life tale of working-class showbiz professionals played by Hugh Jackman and Kate Hudson. It shames the narcissism and phony Americana of Scott Cooper’s biopic about the country’s phoniest rock star.Nouvelle Vague > Jay KellyRichard Linklater redeems his indie banality through sheer inspiration and admiration. The making of Godard’s Breathless gets deeper inside the art of filmmaking than Noah Baumbach’s trite, never-convincing imitation of Fellini’s 8½.The Phoenician Scheme > Sentimental Value and SirâtWes Anderson’s rococo psychological mirth is appropriate for his great-man theory of history — a Wellesian ploy about how the world works that outclasses both Joachim Trier’s art-movie fakery and the overwrought techno display of Oliver Laxe’s globalist nihilism-adventure film.The Empire > WeaponsBruno Dumont counters Star Wars juvenilia with an adult eschatological perspective, a heaven-and-earth contrast that is morally piercing and visually amazing, while Zach Cregger taunts social collapse — sex, drugs, schools, parenting — as an occult game.A Minecraft Movie > SinnersJared Hess makes the best-yet video game adaptation, blooming with childhood’s delight. But Ryan Coogler’s childish approach to black American culture — this time as a vampire rampage — insults authentic blues heritage while delighting only Obama-addled libs.Eat the Night > Marty SupremeCaroline Poggi and Jonathan Vinel capture the excitement and dread of role-playing by tech-addicted siblings, a perfect contrast to the criminal deception that Josh Safdie celebrates in an ugly biography of a ping-pong champion (Timothée Chalamet) who exploits everyone he encounters. Moral hunger versus moral bankruptcy.Marcello Mio and The President’s Wife > HamnetCatherine Deneuve brings iconic grace to two portraits by, respectively, Christophe Honoré and Léa Domenach of real-life women (herself and Bernadette Chirac) as influential public figures. But Chloe Zhao’s silly, occult biopic of Mrs. Shakespeare fakes female agency merely to steal glory from the dead white male bard.Auction > When Fall Is Coming > MisericordiaPascal Bonitzer, François Ozon, and Alain Guiraudie prove it was such a good year for the French (unlike this bad year for Hollywood) that comparing and contrasting three movies about tradition, accountability, and eccentricity measures how a culture understands itself — the essence of filmmaking — on a sliding scale.Eephus > Train DreamsCarson Lund laments a season of sports tradition while Clint Bentley mourns a long, wasted life: an authentic melancholic vision versus a pseudo art-flick exercise. Both show the effect of filmmakers unable to shake the trend toward America’s fading identity.Wild Diamond > If I Had Legs I’d Kick YouAgathe Riedinger’s trenchant portrait of a FOMO-obsessed teen Liane (Malou Khebizi) is more recognizable and universal than Mary Bronstein’s self-pitying almost-comedy about a middle-class American Karen.Demons at Dawn > The Secret AgentJulián Hernández expands the rom-com genre to illustrate that Millennial movies lack romance as a consequence of politicized sexuality that twists and defies natural identity. Kleber Mendonça Filho confuses genre tropes to distort Brazil’s guilt-ridden political past.When Fall Is Coming > EddingtonFrançois Ozon revisits the family secrets of a matriarch (Hélène Vincent) to reveal bonds of love, remorse, and forgiveness. Ari Aster’s parallel horror-flick approach — this time spooking the Covidapocalypse — makes remorse impossible, turning recent political history and panic into a disingenuous mess.Happy Gilmore 2 > One Battle After AnotherKyle Newacheck directed Adam Sandler’s vision of American harmony-among-many — a golf-farce tournament played against the violent conflict of political adversaries. Sandler’s good humor opposed P.T.A.’s unbearable partisan vengeance.Dracula > Frankenstein Radu Jude misses when he targets conservative American politics, but at least his over-amped cultural metaphor recognizes there’s something monstrous afoot in this millennium’s embrace of socialist trauma whereas Guillermo del Toro’s sentimental metaphor for the Munchausen-by-proxy trans movement offers a contradiction in terms. Clever versus Unacceptable.
Going to the movies last year became one ideological battle after another. It was clear throughout 2025 that movies and media offended our trust under the guise of entertainment content that was often dishonest or dispirited. This year’s Better-Than List opposes that trend and those partisan/seditious lists and critics’ groups that awarded propaganda while pretending to salute art. Film culture reached its nadir immediately after the assassination of Charlie Kirk when, almost by reflex, leftist Hollywood released a particular consensus flick that encouraged racism and political violence. Otherwise, some good, honest art about the human condition awaits your attention.
Twinless > One Battle After Another
James Sweeney’s bromance asserted gender and romantic differences (not diversity) as the basis of our emotional common ground, from grief to friendship and big-L love — the most profound rom-com since Lubitsch’s That Uncertain Feeling. Paul Thomas Anderson’s shallow political farce was the unpopular — but media-favored — flick that mocked unresolved racism and sexism as the justification for civil war.
An Officer and a Spy > It Was Just an Accident
Roman Polanski’s take on the Dreyfus affair finally opened in the U.S. in time to examine rising anti-Jewish bigotry. Jean Dujardin’s commanding performance reveals complex personal integrity without the leaden ironies of Jafar Panahi’s Iranian thriller geared to self-righteous political paranoia.
Song Sung Blue > Springsteen: Deliver Me from Nowhere
Craig Brewer finds the spiritual center of Neil Diamond’s music in the true-life tale of working-class showbiz professionals played by Hugh Jackman and Kate Hudson. It shames the narcissism and phony Americana of Scott Cooper’s biopic about the country’s phoniest rock star.
Nouvelle Vague > Jay Kelly
Richard Linklater redeems his indie banality through sheer inspiration and admiration. The making of Godard’s Breathless gets deeper inside the art of filmmaking than Noah Baumbach’s trite, never-convincing imitation of Fellini’s 8½.
The Phoenician Scheme > Sentimental Value and Sirât
Wes Anderson’s rococo psychological mirth is appropriate for his great-man theory of history — a Wellesian ploy about how the world works that outclasses both Joachim Trier’s art-movie fakery and the overwrought techno display of Oliver Laxe’s globalist nihilism-adventure film.
The Empire > Weapons
Bruno Dumont counters Star Wars juvenilia with an adult eschatological perspective, a heaven-and-earth contrast that is morally piercing and visually amazing, while Zach Cregger taunts social collapse — sex, drugs, schools, parenting — as an occult game.
A Minecraft Movie > Sinners
Jared Hess makes the best-yet video game adaptation, blooming with childhood’s delight. But Ryan Coogler’s childish approach to black American culture — this time as a vampire rampage — insults authentic blues heritage while delighting only Obama-addled libs.
Eat the Night > Marty Supreme
Caroline Poggi and Jonathan Vinel capture the excitement and dread of role-playing by tech-addicted siblings, a perfect contrast to the criminal deception that Josh Safdie celebrates in an ugly biography of a ping-pong champion (Timothée Chalamet) who exploits everyone he encounters. Moral hunger versus moral bankruptcy.
Marcello Mio and The President’s Wife > Hamnet
Catherine Deneuve brings iconic grace to two portraits by, respectively, Christophe Honoré and Léa Domenach of real-life women (herself and Bernadette Chirac) as influential public figures. But Chloe Zhao’s silly, occult biopic of Mrs. Shakespeare fakes female agency merely to steal glory from the dead white male bard.
Auction > When Fall Is Coming > Misericordia
Pascal Bonitzer, François Ozon, and Alain Guiraudie prove it was such a good year for the French (unlike this bad year for Hollywood) that comparing and contrasting three movies about tradition, accountability, and eccentricity measures how a culture understands itself — the essence of filmmaking — on a sliding scale.
Eephus > Train Dreams
Carson Lund laments a season of sports tradition while Clint Bentley mourns a long, wasted life: an authentic melancholic vision versus a pseudo art-flick exercise. Both show the effect of filmmakers unable to shake the trend toward America’s fading identity.
Wild Diamond > If I Had Legs I’d Kick You
Agathe Riedinger’s trenchant portrait of a FOMO-obsessed teen Liane (Malou Khebizi) is more recognizable and universal than Mary Bronstein’s self-pitying almost-comedy about a middle-class American Karen.
Demons at Dawn > The Secret Agent
Julián Hernández expands the rom-com genre to illustrate that Millennial movies lack romance as a consequence of politicized sexuality that twists and defies natural identity. Kleber Mendonça Filho confuses genre tropes to distort Brazil’s guilt-ridden political past.
When Fall Is Coming > Eddington
François Ozon revisits the family secrets of a matriarch (Hélène Vincent) to reveal bonds of love, remorse, and forgiveness. Ari Aster’s parallel horror-flick approach — this time spooking the Covidapocalypse — makes remorse impossible, turning recent political history and panic into a disingenuous mess.
Happy Gilmore 2 > One Battle After Another
Kyle Newacheck directed Adam Sandler’s vision of American harmony-among-many — a golf-farce tournament played against the violent conflict of political adversaries. Sandler’s good humor opposed P.T.A.’s unbearable partisan vengeance.
Dracula > Frankenstein
Radu Jude misses when he targets conservative American politics, but at least his over-amped cultural metaphor recognizes there’s something monstrous afoot in this millennium’s embrace of socialist trauma whereas Guillermo del Toro’s sentimental metaphor for the Munchausen-by-proxy trans movement offers a contradiction in terms. Clever versus Unacceptable.
― Lithium Just Madison (C. Grisso/McCain), Saturday, 17 January 2026 00:30 (five months ago)
lol well he’s right that Nouvelle Vague is better than Jay Kelly, but that’s a low bar.
― paper plans (tipsy mothra), Saturday, 17 January 2026 00:34 (five months ago)
Had to remember that he hates the partially Sandler-driven Jay Kelly because Baumbach's Mom was mean to him back in the day.
― Lithium Just Madison (C. Grisso/McCain), Saturday, 17 January 2026 01:00 (five months ago)
“The Munchausen-by-proxy trans movement,” huh?
― cryptosicko, Saturday, 17 January 2026 01:06 (five months ago)
how does a film "distort" Brazil's guilt-ridden past
― The Luda of Suburbia (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, 17 January 2026 01:11 (five months ago)
I liked Jay Kelly, also Sinners, One Battle After Another, Train Dreams, Weapons, Misericordia, and Eddington, and am looking forward to Hamnet, Marty Supreme,The Secret Agent, If I Had Legs, It Was Just An Accident, and Sentimental Value. I'm not that interested in seeing Nouvelle Vague or most of the others, but these takes just seem bad
― Dan S, Saturday, 17 January 2026 01:34 (five months ago)
You liked Jay Kelly?!
― The Luda of Suburbia (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, 17 January 2026 01:39 (five months ago)
partisan against whom, Armond?
― uploading this content requires perseveration (sic), Saturday, 17 January 2026 01:40 (five months ago)
xp
I watched Jay Kelly with a friend who is a George Clooney stan, and he loved it! I'm not a Clooney fan, but we had a great time. It's hard not to like it under those circumstances.
I think it was beautifully photographed, and there were aspects of it that reminded me of Fellini, especially La Dolce Vita and 8 1/2. (I know Fellini films are crossed off the list for most ilxors)
I kind of liked its idea of a solipsistic actor who can't see himself for who he really is, and how other people came to see him more clearly
― Dan S, Saturday, 17 January 2026 01:54 (five months ago)
I find White's gadflyism so corny, that even when I agree with him--thought One Battle wildly overrated--it doesn't feel like any kind of validation (too strong a word; it's not like I need my opinions validated) the way it might with a critic I respected. I know that he'll turn his ire on a film I like next year.
― clemenza, Saturday, 17 January 2026 02:00 (five months ago)
I know Fellini films are crossed off the list for most ilxors
We don't like Fellini?
― cryptosicko, Saturday, 17 January 2026 03:48 (five months ago)
I do like the Bruno Dumont film, it’s wacky.
― paper plans (tipsy mothra), Saturday, 17 January 2026 04:13 (five months ago)
Dumont was the first person I thought of when I saw that Artists Dumbing Down and Better For It thread.
― gjoon1, Saturday, 17 January 2026 10:21 (five months ago)
Was curious as to whether he'd reviewed The Drama and came across this:
https://www.nationalreview.com/2026/04/the-damage-done-by-all-the-presidents-men/
"Hollywood's worst newspaper movie"--haven't read it yet, but I know I'm going to learn a lot.
― clemenza, Tuesday, 5 May 2026 23:26 (one month ago)