Let's talk about Vice Magazine

This shit is so awful it's hardly worth commenting on, except for the glorious punchline at the end:

Follow Clive on Twitter: @thugclive

Oh, Clive...

clive's a lovely guy and one of my colleagues at vice/noisey so quiet yaaaallll

most of that seemed pretty otm to me

and the punchline didn't seem especially glorious

¯\(°_o)/¯

no zombies no credibility

The first point is completely disingenuous - you can't discount the irony of hipster moustaches simply because they come out of the body. Especially when you use a picture of girls wearing fake moustaches to illustrate your point. And suggesting that because there are times and locations in which moustaches are not ironic means that in all times and locations moustaches are not ironic is just idiotic.

The rest of the post is only really discussing that one particular video, so I'm not sure how he can use it to call for a moratorium on all hipster jokes. Essentially he's just telling these people that they're doing it wrong. That doesn't mean everyone is doing it wrong.

Anyway, I used to have a much softer stance on Vice than I do now - I always found it juvenile and crass, but I'd give it a pass because I knew people who wrote for it, and it covered some great bands sometimes, blah blah blah. But it just got too much - increasing Vice-ification of other media and club nights etc etc, it's so fucking depressing to see 'ironic' misogyny literally everywhere. Fuck Vice, and fuck anyone who allows this shit to happen. I don't care if your internship is getting you 'somewhere', you're perpetuating the absolute worst in society and you can go fuck yourself with a rusty chainsaw.

agree with the spirit of this article except imo we should not just be left off the hook; people should make fun of hipsters for being narcissistic aesthetes who don't read books instead of, like, this knowing joke about people who make healthy diet choices and ride bikes

^^^
not sure if this was posted elsewhere but
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[via http://judyxberman.tumblr.com/post/24154819390/vice-writers-music-reviews-rating-x]

afaik this hasn't been revealed to be an aberration, or rescinded with promises of a new improved vice: it's just vice. so yes fuck vice, it's indefensible.

xp

new social conservatism same as old social conservatism, just pretends to be hip and with it

bring back William Buckley, his punchlines were at least funnier

the 60s counterculture/marketing machine, at this point in its self-reflective cycle, had moved on a tiny bit, hadn't it? Thinking About This Kinda Stuff feels like for its adherents it's a terminal cultural practice or something, it literally hasn't budged in a decade

He's supposed to be a cynical indie purist-type, who makes fun of The Barenaked Ladies (the blasphemer!)

that Grass Widow review is, like, somebody we know, right?

"your asses"

ugh have always hated these fucking people

Funny about the fixed bike thing, it's the one thing on that list that would most make a dent in society. Popularizing alternatives to an oil-run economy sounds like a good thing to me, no matter how cliquey it gets. Why hate on it?

Popularizing alternatives to an oil-run economy sounds like a good thing to me, no matter how cliquey it gets.

Bicycles are what you are talking about. For most people, a fixed gear bike is crazy impractical compared to other options.

Yeah its fixies in partic, not bikes in general (though, at least round my way, biking does also get lumped in with the whole "inner city latte sipping biking vegan elitists" sneers from righties)

I have no idea why I defended Vice so vigorously the first time around!

I'm obviously pretty biased, but I still genuinely believe that Vice is a fantastic and useful platform for showcasing new young writers, it does some really fun/interesting travel stuff, the music reviews are always funny/accurate...yeah, it's got its faults (sincerity still being a bad word etc) but on the whole I think it's a positive force. But like I said, I write the odd bit for them/Noisey so y'know.

the music reviews are always funny/accurate...
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m4wsf79rxY1qgnmyzo1_400.png

thomas morton: new young writer.

Who was the "These Clothes" guy in the vest supposed to be?

momus: new young writer

I never really thought of Vice as anything but an assemblage of like good zine writers until one started writing the second most popular TV show on my Twitter feed and now I think I p much wasted my life

rest of your twitter friends still can't let go of mtv cribs?

the second most popular TV show on my Twitter feed

(I'd also like to say add that putting 'Original Pirate Material' out in the US itself qualifies Vice for the Nobel Prize in pop.)
― Momus (Momus), Sunday, October 13, 2002 12:57 PM (9 years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

(I'd also like to say add that putting 'Original Pirate Material' out in the US itself qualifies Vice for the Nobel Prize in pop.)
― Momus (Momus), Sunday, October 13, 2002 12:57 PM (9 years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

― one dis leads to another (ian), Tuesday, 19 June 2012 14:07 (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

.. an annual award?

the second most popular TV show on my Twitter feed

assume we will be seeing this line in the ads

i didn't really have a problem with that Leave Hipsters Alone article except that it exists

is there anything out there that's a good alternative to vice? i think about the only thing you can say in their favor is that there isn't, in the same way there isn't a good alternative to their favorite sponsor, american apparel. in both cases, i do think on balance the world is better off without them existing.

you can say that about everything though

once upon a time, there was Arthur :(

haha you can't say that about fixie bikes. the opposite is true for fixie bikes.
are there good alternatives to fixies? yeah tons! a lot of them are cheaper and better, and you can get them anywhere.
is the world better off without them existing? nope, not really.

a good alternative to vice is your local library.

you don't have to go highbrow all the time but you don't need to read vice either. there are a billion other places for you to read about indie rock bands and look at tits.

andrew wk doesn't arrive in a stagecoach throwing out free energy drinks at my library.

there was so much i found odious about vice (and american apparel, for that matter) in the aughties. (i realize it's been around since the nineties but i associate it with that particular decade for whatever reasons)

howev i always thought the do's and don'ts were pretty great. i even bought the book at one point

Hipster Runoff > Vice

That Grass Widow review is just...really bad.

"there are a billion other places for you to read about indie rock bands and look at tits."
does anyone rep for suicide girls over vice? these things all seem bad. i suspect there's something structurally wrong with the kind of economies that let vice and american apparel thrive, but they seem especially culpable in that they had a hand in creating and shaping those economies. if it were divorced from how shitty they are, i'd find them really inspiring in that they created new channels for themselves when everyone else flopped around dying (vice is apparently taught in business school as a case study of how to succeed in publishing/media), but it seems that being shitty and gross is part of that model, like if you tried to do the same thing they did, but not be shitty and gross, you'd be shut out.

not a Vice fan, but I actually find Hipster Runoff to be even more hateful/mysoginistic and all-around nihilistic in a suburban gamer kind of way, and think the kid usually really means it. he seems to have utter contempt for artists or anyone that actually creates anything too, from what I can tell. xxp

*misogynistic

I think the "really means it" and "utter contempt" are pretty much the joke?

isn't the joke that he doesn't have utter contempt but is actually really enthusiastic? the truth is that he thinks it's all shit.

feel like i don't even know what a "joke" is anymore

I got the impression he didn't necessarily give a shit either way or liked some things and disliked others but wrote about them all the same

i imagine you've gotta be somewhat invested in this stuff to write a prolific blog about it, but is he really celebrating browavecore?

I read Arthur more recently than I've read Vice

I don't think that's the entire truth of it tho. like, he takes this ambiguous/ironic tone that compels people to give him the benefit of the doubt - lest they not be in on the joke... but to tolerate all his n-words and misogyny without any cognitive dissonance people project their own values onto him - maybe too generously... because obv he knows better, he's one of us, right?

but I don't really think that's the place he's coming from. he's more 4chan nihilist/misogynist gamer than urban liberal or hipster or student or whatever, he just blogs about that world because it's become one of the things people joke about

xxxp