Shall we anticpate the AMC series "Breaking Bad"? I think I may.

I rewatched Boxcutter last night and jesus, it's just as tense even when you know exactly what's coming. I'm sure it's already been mentioned, but the sound design in the centrepiece scene is phenomenal. There's this slowly rising drone throughout the whole sequence, underlying Gus' measured footsteps and Walt's desperate babbling.

God, Walter is such an asshole sometimes. Hating him right now.

lol get used to that

Hahahaha. You have yet to see the depths of Walt's assholery.

(I'm just guessing at where you are based on the fact that you aren't saying "FUCK YOU, WALT!" yet.)

God, Walter is such an asshole sometimes. Hating him right now.
― wolf kabob (ENBB),

It's funny how your sympathies change as the series evolves. At first you think Jessie’s just some hapless, stoner asshole and Walt is doing this out of some twisted sense of providing for his family's welfare. But by the middle of season one you realize Walt actually enjoys this shit, because it gives him a sense of power and control, while Jessie is, at heart, a basically decent dude. I get the sense that Walter is really a heartless bastard who would kill you because he did the math and figured you're either expendable or a possible threat. It makes me wonder just how far he'll go.

he's gone pretty far!

Nearing the end of season 2 btw.

Yeah, your feelings towards Walt will deepen and intensify very soon.

My feelings deepened and intensified mainly at that pizza bit

He does display moments of awesomeness, it's true.

If your at the end of season 2, wait till season 3. Walt's asshole quotient goes off the charts.

season 2 is basically the good ol days

Penultimate episode has some pretty dark goings on.

don't knock him
he is the one who knocks

while Jessie is, at heart, a basically decent dude.

no, he is not. it is mystifying to me that people think this.

ha! back that up, yo

he thinks killing people is sort of a shitty thing to do.

ha! back that up, yo

do you remember a character named Gayle? also, the NA meetings thing is some of the most evil shit done by anybody in the show. my theory is that of all the characters on the show, people identify most with Jesse - maybe they're nearest to him demographically? - so they make excuses for his sociopathic crap. the show's whole point imo is that everybody in it is toxic, literally the only blameless party in the whole history of the show is the baby & frankly I don't trust the baby much either

people identify with jesse because he seems vulnerable

plus xbox, plus he's hot, plus he can draw, plus he got his heart broken, plus he's a real human being, none of these things unfortunately are antidotes to being a sociopath but then the contrary is true as well

jesse is a guy who does fucked up things but feels bad about them, which people can relate to even if they're not drug dealing murderers. you can imagine him finding redemption in the right circumstances, whereas walt's just getting more and more coldblooded. it's not that walt's the bad guy and jesse's the good guy, they're both badguys, but walt's the one who's too far gone and jesse's the guy who you can sort of root for to find his humanity again

(i like walt more)

lol

Would Jessie be as far in as he is without Walt? And don't think anyone's going to find redemption.

I don't like Jesse very much anymore - he got the neighbor girlfriend doing meth and now they're doing heroin. Not that I like her at all either but I don't want them to go this route! :(

He is pretty hot though, that's true.

Oh no, they're doing this Trainspotting-esque heroin is so awesome look he's floating thing! They shouldn't have done that.

Oh shit, it's all kicking off!

Oh no, they're doing this Trainspotting-esque heroin is so awesome look he's floating thing! They shouldn't have done that.

― wolf kabob (ENBB), Monday, April 2, 2012 12:30 AM (36 minutes ago)

I remember thinking at the time that was a bit cheap for BB.

I don't like Jesse very much anymore - he got the neighbor girlfriend doing meth and now they're doing heroin.

most junkies I used to know have better ethics than Jesse about not trying to get people into hard shit that they're not actually into yet. which is another thing Walt doesn't do - anybody in his orbit is already involved

it's kinda Jesse's "feeling bad" that makes me hate him more - give me a realist like Walt over some guy who will repeatedly do foul shit and then have minor dark nights of the soul about it & then go right back to doing the same foul shit. OTOH keep a motherfucker like Walt outta my life, too, that guy's realism enables him to e.g. melt down people's fucking bodies if it's necessary. Tracer otm, I think a lot of people's reasons for saying Jesse's somehow higher up on the "decent dude" scale are kinda cosmetic "but he's funny/throws parties" reasons.

The other thing though is Walt initially felt bad about stuff, too, and then he had several experiences that seemed to really harden him (or bring the "real Walt" to the surface depending on how you look at it).

Jesse still has some vague notion of morality. He can't rationalise things as well as Walt.

I wouldn't want any of these guys in my life. Though I'd probably hit up Los Pollos Hermanos for a bucket.

having a vague notion of morality is a grotesque quality in a person imo. Jesse's morality is just enough to allow him to kill you & then feel like his own doubts about what he did are enough to redeem him. fuck Jesse imo

aero otm, y'all Jesse fans are just desperate for any floating piece of junk in Lake Nihilism

jesses felt legit horrible abt at least some of the murders hes been involved with fwiw, he has at various points attempts to harden himself al a walt but hes not really capable

my favorite part of the show is that every majorly horrible thing Walt has done was done with complicated moral justification. And of course each new thing he does is worse than the last.

yeah hes building a lil house for his horrible self to live in

i admire him tho, he has the guts to really change his life

it's kinda Jesse's "feeling bad" that makes me hate him more - give me a realist like Walt over some guy who will repeatedly do foul shit and then have minor dark nights of the soul about it & then go right back to doing the same foul shit.

There's something OTM-ish about this, except that I still kinda root for Jesse despite the odious shit he's been involved with. I sympathize, though, because this is sorta how I felt about Artie Bucco in relation to Tony Soprano. He always wanted to be a big man without getting his hands dirty, so he came off as a major douche and I respected him much less than Tony, who was willing to live with the consequences of his heinous actions.

everybody on this show is an asshole

jesses felt legit horrible abt at least some of the murders hes been involved with fwiw, he has at various points attempts to harden himself al a walt but hes not really capable

feeling horrible about the murders you've been involved in is really just the flavor of one's particular narcissism, not a redeeming quality

i guess? i don't see how it's better that he feel no remorse at all for what he's done (though it seems like they're walking him down that path as much as Walt)

Jane introduced Jesse to heroin though, no?

Yeah, she did. I was a little confused by that post too but thought maybe I'd missed something. She's the one that brought it back to the house after they'd been smoking meth together so I assumed that it's what she was in recovery for.

yeah so what if jesse feels bad about the horrible shit he does? aero otm, this is equivalent to guys cheating on their girlfriends/wives/mothers of their children and then confessing it all in a big jag of sobbing and thinking "hey, at least i was honest and feel bad about it" - no, man up, shut up, and stop fucking up

"hey, at least i was honest and feel bad about it" isn't jesse at all - didnt you see the 'problem dog' episode?

I did but I don't see the connection

To be precise, it's not Jesse who's absolving himself of his crimes with the excuse that at least he feels bad about it (if anything, he hates the fact that he feels bad about it), it's Jesse's apologists/fans

All that said, I love all these characters despite the fact that they spend large amounts of time being colossally horrible people, and that's one of the tremendous achievements of this show, and the acting in it

aero otm, y'all Jesse fans are just desperate for any floating piece of junk in Lake Nihilism

Which is probably why I feel the way I do about Jessie. At least there's a small glimmer of conscience left. Hasn't stopped him from doing horrible shit.

feeling horrible about the murders you've been involved in is really just the flavor of one's particular narcissism, not a redeeming quality

― same old song and placenta (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Monday, April 2, 2012 1:22 AM (9 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

jesse is being sucked down by walt, the posited narcissistic cycle of desire an absolution just isnt really in operation w/him, theres been no particular planning or ambition, hes been manipulated and bullied by walt the whole way, hes bewildered hapless and lost, smalltime, and then when he does something awful he wishes he hadnt, isnt at all psyched abt the suposed rewards, and engages in only the most half hearted rationalization - which doesnt mean you cant pin narcissism or w/e on him, you could w/any character, or really any person in the world, its just somewhat beside the whole plot of the show

the reason i like him personally has really not that much to do w/whether hes a good or a bad guy or w/e but its as ive mentioned before in this v thread he is so true to life, just an amazing character, such a total type of guy of my generation, hes so prevalent irl but so underrepresented in popular art

lol when hes showing jane the comic book characters hes drawn, that guy!

everybody on this show is an asshole

― 1 week to "Charles Dingus" (forksclovetofu), Monday, April 2, 2012 1:08 AM (9 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

in conclusion, to all of you making this point, what an uninteresting observation

tho tbf im sure if you looked upthread you could find me doing the same thing

yes i dont think we really need to prove that we are morally superior to some meth cooks on a tv show.