Chicago: They paved a fetid swamp/and put up a parking lot

I don't want really want to keep talking about RIP threads anymore, but I do want to respond to jvc's post:

But the thing that really bugged me about the Jobs thread specifically, particularly jaymc's comment to me about how if I was grieving so hard I shouldn't be on the internet, is that people seemed to assume that if you were saying anything remotely genuine, you were some slavish, devoted fanboy who was blubbering with tears or something. As if we couldn't just note that it was sad that some guy died young of a horrible disease and left behind some young kids.

I have absolutely no problem with anyone noting the sadness of Jobs's death. I just thought there was room for other reactions and perspectives as well and instinctively resisted the idea that only certain posts were "appropriate." My approach to RIP threads is usually, "Here's a good opportunity to talk about this person's life and legacy, in whatever manner one sees fit" -- but I recognize that others may have different expectations, which in the future I'll try to respect. (Or, at least, find somewhere else on the Internet to read dissenting or contrarian opinions.)

Again, I apologize for the aggressiveness of my posts.

we're going to be here for thanksgiving this year though! excited for that. i've had fun when i've gotten to attend friendsgiving.

You all should try saying no to holiday trips one year.

I'd rather perform LASIK in myself than travel during the holidays again.

I'd rather perform my own appendectomy than travel during the holidays again. And I don't even have an appendix.

I'm really hoping Christmas isn't too bad, since we have to do the 6 hour drive to Bay City this year and driving through a snowstorm with our newborn makes me v v v nervous.

I'm traveling during the holidays and looking forward to it so :P on u

i wish we weren't traveling the holidays but for some weird reason our families are constantly like "weeee want to seeee the baaaaaaaaaaabeeeeeee" ugh, freaks

^^^ this is why travelling this year will be unavoidable

^^^ this is why travelling this year for the next 18+ years will be unavoidable

I dont think I've been back to NC in like... 3 years?

I'm being weirdly protective of your family Nick and I don't know why! I just feel like you guys are always having to incur the expense and hassle of family-related travel and I want you to have a break! Also I want you to stay in Chicago and hang out with us.

Forever.

I will be strapped to my desk for the holidays. Not that I've ever traveled for the holidays anyway.

John, somebody said something either here or on the RIP Jobs thread about remembering him in all his complexity, and I think that's great, even when it includes talking about the suicides in Apple's Chinese factories, and his stinginess, etc., but some people were denying that he ever made any innovations or contributed ANY good to this world (not even that his net contribution was bad, but that he never did anything good!), and even those who weren't being totally unreasonable were just saying how he sucked, which is just inflammatory and rude.

I can play Peggie whilst sitting on the toilet. That's contribution.

Oh, sorry, I missed that you said you didn't want to talk about it! Sorry.

ALL JOKING ASIDE

PEGGLE. Goddamnit. I don't even know Peggie.

it's what happens when you have siblings and one set of parents that's divorced and everyone's living in different places and everybody's sensitive, and it's not really convenient for people to come to chicago because we don't have room for people to stay with us and there aren't any hotels near us. also to be fair a lot of times the families help chip in with travel costs. and it's mainly sarah that travels a lot, i opt out of most of the trips except for the big ones like xmas or going to visit my parents.

Hmmm I'm rethinking my contriteness after accidentally calling you names if you're playing with Peggie on the toilet… xp

some people were denying that he ever made any innovations or contributed ANY good to this world (not even that his net contribution was bad, but that he never did anything good!), and even those who weren't being totally unreasonable were just saying how he sucked, which is just inflammatory and rude.

People say similar things on Beatles and Dylan threads.

i am also really lazy and a homebody so if these family trips didn't happen i would probably never leave chicago. but i would like to plan a trip for just me, sarah, and evie where we go somewhere interesting and out of the midwest and do fun stuff that isn't related to extended family, but that's more of a cost issue than anything else.

Yeah, I always end up burning my vacation time on family stuff, and the we don't get to do any vacation traveling, which is a bummer because visiting family is not exactly relaxing.

Well, my family is fun for like two days but then we have four more days until we go home and those four days are rough.

My family is fun for like 15 seconds. And that's because they have a cool cat.

Otherwise, hell.

Jeff likes blumpkins from puggles.

and everybody's sensitive <-- key info here

we have family everywhere too, but with no babies and no one particularly crying out for our company, it's easy to be like "yo we're here if you want to see us" except for every few years.

i also admit that i am disproportionately resentful of having to travel because someone else wants to see me but doesn't want to see me where i live.

I wish I had a family.

My parents were here last weekend, it was great. I am great friends with R's mom and sibling and his wife and enjoy visiting with them. My sister and her husband and my nephew are traveling to be w/ my family for tgiving and xmas and I'm stoked to go. My grandma had a heart attack recently (she's doing well) and I'm excited to see her and my aunt and cousin. Everyone gets along well and it's fun so the traveling is worth it.

you're very fortunate

I actually really like visiting my wife's family, I love Ann Arbor in general and her dad is always interesting to spend time with. I don't think she is ever as excited about it as I am.

It seems unusual how you - Dan and K8-e and T0m@s - get on so well with your families. I think it's fair to say that the majority of people I've known are at best amicable with their families, and many of them are not even that. I mean, they *love* their families, but you guys look forward to seeing them and you have fun with them like you would with friends.

It would be easier if in visiting our families there wasn't a 2 to 3 hour drive after we get land at the airport.

I don't get the impression that you would love seeing them more often if it weren't for that additional step.

As i indicated, it would be easier. As in logistically and time spent.

Man yeah. Why can't my parents live in Philadelphia?

Why can't both of your parents live across the street from you?

so glad i'm not traveling for thxgiving this year. instead we're going down to see my dad in mid-january.

Why can't both of your parents live across the street from you?

Have you left work yet?

I'm totally leaving work in a half hour or so. The only afternoon plans I have are picking up a growler of some new pale ale Half Acre just released.

Yes Jennifer.

i like visiting my parents for a reasonable amount of time. asheville is really nice and has good places to eat and it's relaxing to be at my parents' house. DC will be cool because i'll get to see my sister and her husband and baby (who is just two months younger than evie), and sarah's sister just bought a house so we'll have somewhere free to stay. i think the thing that irritates me most about visiting family or having family visit is having to adjust my schedule and my list of things i want to do to accommodate someone else's routine or priorities. i'm not very good at this but i think i'm getting better.

Yes, I consider myself lucky to truly enjoy spending time with my parents (and my second set of parents, i.e. Tom@s' parents), my brother and my extended family. In recent years I have put a stop to traveling, every year, to both Omaha, NE and the U.P. over a week in Christmas--because, frankly, it was too much time in a car and not enough time relaxing. Now I do it every other year, which is alright. Once M@tt moves here, I suspect I'll go home even more often, as we'll be able to split driving duty.

In other news, just because we're supposed to have about the same amount of snow as last year, does not mean that traveling will be nigh impossible from November 1-April 1.

And, now, I am leaving work!

Jeff and I got stuck in Philly last Christmas due to the weather so we're using the weather as a good excuse not to travel, not clutching our pearls about the inevitability of weather-related travel mishaps. Just, you know.

anyone go to the great american beer festival last week

I would have liked to but wasn't able, I think Jeff was going?

♪

That was in Denver, right? Yeah I didn't go to it.

I'm going to the Barrel and wood aged beer festival.

^^^that's what I was thinking of