The official thread for Lord Of The Rings - The Return Of The King [LOTR ROTK TROTK ROK] (NOW CONTAINS SPOILERS)

of course it wz terrific, fite-wise especially

they exactly didn't go with my personal reading of gollum's triumph over sauron, but it wasn't ruled out either

(oh yes: when sauron's eye turned north to the gates of mordor, it was actually turning from north-ish to east, unless they moved orodruin)

Maybe by way of Rocketeer and the Blackhawk comics. I'm a sucker for art-deco steampunk, so I'll probably go see it even though I expect it to thoroughly suck.

The next Pitch Black film, Chronicles of Riddick(should I see the first one?)

Ehhhhh... A couple of good scenes, but mostly crap.

he kinda sorta intends to fall into the cracks of doom cz that way no one else gets it - there's a bit in the book, in the gollum vs smeagol dialogues, where one of them says something (i completely forget what at the moment) which wd be of relevance in re: intentionality at that point

Yeah, they were playing around with that more than once! Maybe Barad-dur's secret power lies in the fact it's the biggest and most badass trailerpark home ever.

plus

SPOILERS SPOILERS SPOILERS SPOILERS
SPOILERS SPOILERS SPOILERS SPOILERS

oh, yes haha also: sauron's eye = activity out of a tex avery cartoon once everything goes wrong!

end SPOILERS

I liked the sense of scale and comparitive scale, so when the Rohirrim arrive at Minas Tirith you can see both that they have an enormous army and that they're complete fucked.

The dead are the Ents of this film. Much as they are in the book, in fairness.

I'm looking forward to the DVD, with more Saruman and Bruce Spence as the Voice of Sauron.

The ending was both quite long and much shorter than it could have been. It and the scenes outside Mount Doom do keep the sense of "normal folk don't always come back from war the same".

And it keeps what's probably my favourite last line in any book.

Heckle #1: I liked the look of disgust Theoden gives Aragorn when he left him alone with Arwen. I turned to my friend and whispered "Elf-fucker!". This was only improved by it turning out to be Elrond :)

Heckle #2: After Frodo says goodbye to Sam and turns to Pippin "Which one are you again?"

Yes!!! Actually Mordor = one giant Tex Avery wolf :

gate opening = jaw dropping
orkish hordes = tongue rolling out
the eye popping = well ditto
volcano eruption = grannie mallet action

I absolutely loved the movie; Jackson's still getting (let's say) no less than 70% of everything right (where even getting 50% right would be astonishing); I probably respect even more of the various elision/alteration decisions (even those I disagree with.)

(that said)

Denethor is a completely different fucking character; I guess they wanted to distinguish him more from Saruman and Gandalf (which is to miss the fucking point), but making him a petty pathetic dickhead idiot was just stupid, and I can't see what else it achieved (while sacrificing so much). Connected and similar is the baffling cut of all the palantir stuff. (Given what's left, I can't see why they even bothered.) Holdover criticism from TT: flying Nazgul steeds still seem like they'd be better as vulture-pteradactyl things than dragony things. Witch-king should, alas, be cooler and scarier. Tex Avery eye OTM. Apparent Watchers set-up with no payoff disappointing, all of Cirith Ungol a shade too cursory and not scary enough. The pacing/elastic distances thing is fucked-up (most glaring: for all the time wasted doing nothing or saying goodbye for the 20th time, the Captains of the West sure get to the Black Gate fast--same deal with emptying of Gorgoroth). Personally saddened by elision of Mouth of Sauron. Too much Sam, and almost no 'alpha' end to Frodo's arc (especially a shame at the end). Ultimately I suspect the weakest of the three.

(but still)

Minas Morgul: perfectperfectperfect!!!! Shelob's lair damn good. Cracks of Doom really really nice. Glimpse of Narya lovely. Eowyn, Eomer, Theoden, Merry, whole Rohirrim plot strand = awesome. Paths of the Dead take a little different, indeed a little Pirates of the Caribbean-y, but totally worked, totally great. Minas Tirith, mountains, hell all of Gondor fucking unbelievably gorgeous and OTM. Best movie for Gimli. Legolas 'set piece,' oliphaunts, Hoth tribute supercool. Fall of Witch-king, Barad-dur kick-ass. Pippin = best hobbit in show. Mortenson and esp. Serkis and McKellen terrific. Maybe too much battle-sequence-after-battle-sequence, but they all look and play soso right. Sososo much killer stuff going on in every frame, way more than I could catch the first time through; staggering regardless, FUCK ME for picking nits.

so

Back to the theater!

As I noted, I have not seen the third part of the film yet. I pray that I am yet proven
wrong!

Good Points:
1) Best battle scenes EVAH! ("I see your rock throwing catapults, and we'll raise you a trebuchet that can hurl a Winnebago!")
2) Oliphants and Dragonriders and Shelob, Oh My!
3) Set design is still excellent.
4) Same with costume and prop design.
5) Not as tear-jerkingly hammy as the first movie. It's all 3 1/2 hours of ass-kicking.

Bad Points:
1) No Christopher Lee at all.
2) Maudlin, overlong denouvement.

Let me avow up-front that I share the more recent, upstart belief in universities, democratic accountability, science and human improvability -- one that questions the fated persistence of "eternal" stupidities.

SHOCKAH!!!!!!!!

Also what's the deal with sleeping right on the edge of the cliff?

And I was really impatient with how drawn out the ending was. Some of that stuff should have been saved for the extended version.

Chronicles of Narnia being made into a film, not directed by Jackson, but being worked on by his Weta Workshop.

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!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Guesses as to Extended DVD inclusions:

1. The long slog through Mordor. Surely Sam and Frodo don't just discard that orc armour so quickly. I hope there's a section detailing their unwilling march with a troop of orcs as suspected deserters.

2. After Mordor falls, and the dying/wounded are gathered within the walls of Minas Tirith, I am hoping there will be a lengthy section in which those who require healing bond enough for Faramir and Eowyn to "connect".

3. Which will require a slower build up to Aragorn's coronation. In this theatrical version, his crowning seems almost perfunctory.

But as an overall observation, I don't think I've encountered a film with so many waves of emotional payoff breaking so regularly and so relentlessly during the last (what? 30? 40 minutes?) portion. I missed so much as I was trying to deal with the tear leakage and throat lumpage without looking like a complete dork (I don't do public crying too well). I mean, fuck. I now need to see this again, of course.

Quick summary after first impression.

Good Stuff:

Oliphaunts

Continuing Frodo/Sam/Gollum stuff handled fantastically, even up to Gollum's look as he fell into the lava.

Eowyn, Theoden and Merry vs Witch King.

Shelob was genuinely creepy and frightening.

Shagrat!

Staging of battles felt real, and as Andrew pointed out above, the scale was just right.

Bad Stuff:

The Arwen stuff was terribly integrated with anything else, and was at totally the wrong time to be a handy toilet break.

Minas Tirith's battle wasn't siegey enough. Over too quickly, not enough boiling tension.

Denethor is a nutter from the word go. Shaving off the two minutes or so required for a bit of palantir action to explain his otherwise barmy seeming actions was the second most false economy of the film

Too many endings. Missing out the scouring of the Shire, whilst a good idea in itself resulted in too many natural finishes piling up against each other.

Really, really, WTF, I can't believe you did it like that potentially great bit of cinema screwed up:

Corsair ships coming up from Pelargir. Why no sighting from Minas Tirith 'NOW we're fucked' turning to hurrah hurrah as banner of Gondor unfurled in lead ship?

The little speech from Gandalf to Pippin during the lull in the battle "turn to silvered glass ... a swift sunrise" sounded familiar because it's the description of what happens at the end of Frodo's last voyage over the sea.

Lyra still OTM about Pippin's song/Denethor's meal/Faramir's charge.