oh and colin firth has found his ideal role - sleazy posh guy who sleeps with other people's wives
― When a German communicates, you listen (LocalGarda), Thursday, 22 September 2011 23:35 (twelve years ago) link
firth should play david cameron
only problem with end was that it needed 'stayin alive' playin over it and oldman should have had a pimp cane
― talking heads, quiet smith (darraghmac), Friday, 23 September 2011 00:51 (twelve years ago) link
He is the boss in the next book. Dunno if plans are afoot to make the rest of the trilogy though.
― scotstvo, Friday, 23 September 2011 06:23 (twelve years ago) link
wld be first in line for a sequel to TTSS where toby jones turns up at the circus in full arnim zola clobber:
http://static2.aintitcool.com/images2009/ArnimZola.jpg
― Ward Fowler, Friday, 23 September 2011 07:43 (twelve years ago) link
loved this, bloody fatastic camerawork! the best shot film i've seen for years. amazed at how different Peter is in the film to the tv show. in the series he was almost light relief at times; no recollection of him beating the shit out of Tarr and freaking out, crying etc. Cumberbatch was great mind.
― piscesx, Friday, 23 September 2011 13:02 (twelve years ago) link
thoroughly enjoyed it, tho it has enough flaws on its own terms - the end scene radiates too much quiet triumph, quite out of tone for the rest of the movie, and there's some other silliness/poor writing imo. but as a whole, this was absorbing and coherent and straight pleasurable.
btw i think the wooden gizmo is a wedge for improving the stability of Prideaux' caravan, quite possibly as per the book.
― Dios mio! This kid is FUN to hit! (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 25 September 2011 00:20 (twelve years ago) link
wd've liked it a bit denser and darker tbh
― Dios mio! This kid is FUN to hit! (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 25 September 2011 00:21 (twelve years ago) link
Agree totally about the last montage, can't fathom how wildly out of step with the film it is.
― When a German communicates, you listen (LocalGarda), Sunday, 25 September 2011 01:12 (twelve years ago) link
That scene at Wimpy was hilarious.
Disappointed they didn't cast Ann (guess she sn't described in the book?). Probably prefer the ending of the TV series (Smiley taken down a peg) but didn't mind the montage too much, partly bcz of the spin Mark gives on it.
― xyzzzz__, Sunday, 25 September 2011 18:45 (twelve years ago) link
Mark's spin is fun and made me reconsider but I don't buy it really. Ann was cast, I think the actress is credited, but her anonymity reminded me of Captain Mainwaring's wife in Dad's Army which wasn't ideal.
― Dios mio! This kid is FUN to hit! (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 25 September 2011 19:41 (twelve years ago) link
Yeah exactly, a messageboard lol doesn't really convince me of much.
― When a German communicates, you listen (LocalGarda), Sunday, 25 September 2011 19:42 (twelve years ago) link
i'm trying not to compare film to book cos these things shd stand on their own but there's no sense at the end of the movie of "oh shit we've had a mole in the org for the last umpteen years the Circus is completely fucked"
― Dios mio! This kid is FUN to hit! (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 25 September 2011 19:45 (twelve years ago) link
Yeah and it's like everything is now GREAT and he's happy plus oh look he's back with his wife. It's moronic as an ending.
― When a German communicates, you listen (LocalGarda), Sunday, 25 September 2011 19:54 (twelve years ago) link
i liked the ending but it does make the film a future candidate for..Movies wherein the last scene clearly indicates that the makers had a sequel planned, but no sequel came after it.
― piscesx, Sunday, 25 September 2011 21:12 (twelve years ago) link
I read Smiley's satisfaction at sitting at the head of that table as drenched in irony, given the rest of the film.
― Alba, Sunday, 25 September 2011 23:51 (twelve years ago) link
that whole section at the end (especially Peter's smile) is a bit shameless in it's attempt to please the audience but you know.. it's a 21st century movie not a seven hour 1970s BBC series or whatevs so i think we have to cut em some slack.
― piscesx, Monday, 26 September 2011 02:31 (twelve years ago) link
yeah out here in the 21st century we can't be expecting an audience to deal with a downbeat ending, cinemas wd be getting tore up
― Dios mio! This kid is FUN to hit! (Noodle Vague), Monday, 26 September 2011 06:11 (twelve years ago) link
I read Smiley's satisfaction at sitting at the head of that table as drenched in irony
^ yeah, this. like: it's more a "now i am here and i have no idea if i wanted that" than a "now i am here, hooray!"; likewise ann's return is not actually a triumph for him, & it seems weird to read it thus
(justification in filmic terms - the latter is filmed in deep shadow from the head of the stairs, or something like; and the former ends with a fairly abrupt smash cut to black)
― thomp, Monday, 26 September 2011 14:07 (twelve years ago) link
ha you guys are nuts, the ending is not remotely ironic, it's meant to be smiley totally kicking the door in
― Once Were Moderators (DG), Monday, 26 September 2011 14:09 (twelve years ago) link
the former ends after he's exchanged a knowing smile with Guillam on his triumphal march to the top table, if Oldman's playing ambivalence at the end there then he fluffs it imo
― Dios mio! This kid is FUN to hit! (Noodle Vague), Monday, 26 September 2011 14:10 (twelve years ago) link
i'll give you that "oh she's back" is dealt with a bit more subtly
― Dios mio! This kid is FUN to hit! (Noodle Vague), Monday, 26 September 2011 14:11 (twelve years ago) link
yeah i think the (fluffed?) attempt at formal symmetry with the walk-of-shame at the beginning undercuts the ambivalence (i want to be) there -- still, though. i like it more my way.
― thomp, Monday, 26 September 2011 14:13 (twelve years ago) link
justification of "now i am here and i have no idea if i wanted that" in mise-en-scene terms: given his known tastes in decor and etc (which we know from seeing the tasteful olden-times interiors of his house), he is sat in front of that screamingly 70s orange wallpaper, less swallowed and obscured (his favoured state) than horribly exposed <-- this is totally how alfredson's playing it
can't read how oldman's playing it ftb rubber guinness mask
― mark s, Monday, 26 September 2011 14:14 (twelve years ago) link
"exchanged a knowing smile with Guillam" <-- cutting-edge sexuality alert
― mark s, Monday, 26 September 2011 14:19 (twelve years ago) link
i like the way the film discarded some of le Carre's coyness about homosexuality but considering how underdrawn the suspects all were i'd question the screenwriters' priorities.
― Dios mio! This kid is FUN to hit! (Noodle Vague), Monday, 26 September 2011 14:26 (twelve years ago) link
that screamingly 70s orange wallpaper
haha but er aren't those acoustic baffles? -- if he's in the office we see everyone arguing in throughout. (which itself is kind of a hint -- look at his triumph sitting by himself in a soundproofed room.)
― thomp, Monday, 26 September 2011 14:28 (twelve years ago) link
look at his triumph sitting by himself in a soundproofed REALLY IMPORTANT BIG BOSS MAN room
― Once Were Moderators (DG), Monday, 26 September 2011 14:30 (twelve years ago) link
i wanted the movie to be perfect too but sometimes you have to settle for good but flawed
― Dios mio! This kid is FUN to hit! (Noodle Vague), Monday, 26 September 2011 14:31 (twelve years ago) link
ook at his triumph sitting by himself in a soundproofed REALLY IMPORTANT BIG MOLE MAN room <-- there is no dodging this
haha i think the film is very flawed: since i think its look is one of its -- and alfredson's -- strengths you should read with the grain first: wallpaper before "actors" so-called
― mark s, Monday, 26 September 2011 14:33 (twelve years ago) link
tell you something tho, i am kind of psyched for them to go on and film The Honourable Schoolboy now assuming that a) the look will need to be totally different and b) Stephen Graham as Westerby will be about a million times more fun than Westerby as per the novel.
god except they'll move it from Hong Kong to Gdansk on a wet Tuesday afternoon or something.
― Dios mio! This kid is FUN to hit! (Noodle Vague), Monday, 26 September 2011 14:37 (twelve years ago) link
compromised it may be but that's cos it's the only room worth infiltrating <--- there is no dodging this
― Once Were Moderators (DG), Monday, 26 September 2011 14:38 (twelve years ago) link
they should hire wong kar wai to film it
― mark s, Monday, 26 September 2011 14:39 (twelve years ago) link
actually that is an awesome idea
not trying to talk myself out of how much i enjoyed TTSS btw but yes the art direction had to do an awful lot of the heavy lifting
― Dios mio! This kid is FUN to hit! (Noodle Vague), Monday, 26 September 2011 14:39 (twelve years ago) link
xp
yet it's a fucking awesome idea
yet = yes
― Dios mio! This kid is FUN to hit! (Noodle Vague), Monday, 26 September 2011 14:40 (twelve years ago) link
instead of taking off his guinness rubber-mask, oldman shd have donned a patrick stewart mask over the top
― mark s, Monday, 26 September 2011 14:41 (twelve years ago) link
then get Woody Allen in for Smiley's People
― Dios mio! This kid is FUN to hit! (Noodle Vague), Monday, 26 September 2011 14:41 (twelve years ago) link
otto leipzelig
― mark s, Monday, 26 September 2011 15:42 (twelve years ago) link
I wasn't suggesting Smiley found it a hollow victory - the irony, for me, was on the part of the director, who for the rest of the film hardly gives the impression that the only problem with the whole world they're in is that there's a mole.
― Alba, Monday, 26 September 2011 19:43 (twelve years ago) link
yeah i mean i can see what you mean about the irony thing, but it was still out of step with the rest of the film. the whole feel of that last few mins wasn't really right for me, and if it was irony it was sort of oddly done.
― When a German communicates, you listen (LocalGarda), Monday, 26 September 2011 19:47 (twelve years ago) link
It being a misstep, or a sop to commercial interests, are possibilities too. As is my misreading the rest of the film. But I prefer to have it all make sense my way!
― Alba, Monday, 26 September 2011 19:50 (twelve years ago) link
the other bit in the last 10 mins that was shit was firth's "the west is decadent" or whatever he said. was like "ah let's give him a line to explain why he did it"...fucking scooby doo style.
― When a German communicates, you listen (LocalGarda), Monday, 26 September 2011 19:54 (twelve years ago) link
that's from the book, and i suspect that by cutting back on the earlier presence of haydon as this amazing sardonic glamour-puss superspy that the entire circus adored admired and imitated they left themselves no way to open up the fact this his ideological "explanation" is meant to be seen as lame halting rubbish: the book's device has smiley only half-listening to the spew of cliche and not bothering to set most of it down on the page except as reported speech (viz the book's reading is that the mole likes being an actor with deadly secrets and the world at his fingertips; but the pretext behind it is just cobwebs and self-deluded empty blah: which is a shrewd IRL idea but needed way more work if they wanted it to read ironically, as opposed to just lamely)
― mark s, Monday, 26 September 2011 20:02 (twelve years ago) link
yeah it was honestly not even a rant in the film, was just one single line. have to say i find colin firth pretty lightweight anyway but it wasn't his fault that bit was badly written.
prob sound harsh here but i loved the film, it looked great and the clothes and rooms and stuff were amazing, nice to see something really british too.
― When a German communicates, you listen (LocalGarda), Monday, 26 September 2011 20:07 (twelve years ago) link
yeah like i said, underwritten characters all round imo. Le Carre is pretty good at establishing the suspects as, at least, separate personalities. Esterhase a lot less like Peter Lorre in the book.
― Dios mio! This kid is FUN to hit! (Noodle Vague), Monday, 26 September 2011 20:09 (twelve years ago) link
s/b "a shrewd IRL idea that works in the book but needed way more work if the film wanted...": the book is kinda a detailed psychological exploration of the reality of a scoobydoo villain, and those round him -- which is odd but moving, actually
(not that JLC knows who the fuck scoobydoo is but i think a key to his success is basically treating quite trivial lightweight spy stuff as if it has enormous emotional-philosophical weight, like shakespeare rewriting the wacky races as a tragedy)
― mark s, Monday, 26 September 2011 20:10 (twelve years ago) link
http://youtu.be/m6w0r-ScEG4
― mark s, Monday, 26 September 2011 20:11 (twelve years ago) link
nice to see something really british too.
uh oh
― incredibly middlebrow (Dr Morbius), Monday, 26 September 2011 20:12 (twelve years ago) link