suicide

what's the point in living, emil.y? probably not much, but what's the point in dying? yours is just one small, human life, the things you do pretty insignificant in the grand scheme of things. all those terrible things you talk about having done to people - the worst of the effects of those things on those people last maybe a few years, a few decades in the worst case scenario.

if nothing really matters, than dying doesn't really matter either. you're already here, you might as well hang about. the thing is, ultimately you are responsible for your choices: you are making the choice to treat people the way you (think you) do. if you think you treat them badly, why not try to treat them better? obviously, it's not a straight line from where you are now to somewhere you will feel better, but you are making the choice to not try meds or further therapy, or explore alternatives. the way you look at the world is also a choice.

trying to think up ways to kill yourself that will have the least impact on your loved ones is pretty exhausting - why not put that energy into figuring out a plan to try out some psych meds? things aren't magically getting better for you, and you're still thinking about killing yourself, so i feel like at this point you might as well give the meds a shot or two.

seeing this <3 is just making me think everyone is teabagging emily repeatdely

awww <3

Five years ago today my dad killed himself.

I miss him a lot.

Oh Krakow. All my heart in sympathy.

Thank you. Five years feels both like forever and like no time at all.

sorry to hear Krakow.

i'm very sorry to read that, krakow.

my sympathies as well, man.

Wishing you all the strength for just getting through things today.

sad to hear about this. best wishes for today, A. xxx

<3

you work in a record shop yeah? Hope you find something great today.

You can always talk to ilx, we's here for you.

<3

All the best today, Krakow

<3
fwiw it always makes me happy to see an ilm thread bumped b/c of your photos. They are always colorful and awesome.

krakow <3 <3

Thank you everyone. Your support really does mean a lot to me and was why I felt wholly comfortable posting here. It was never likely to be the best of days, but it wasn't too bad.

I probably should have pushed myself to get out and do something, but I found it impossible to summon the energy or motivation, so ended up pottering at home.

I really thank you all for your good thoughts and your good <3s!

sad to hear that. take care xx

best wishes, krakow! <3

It's good this thread has been quiet so long, but

Recently I've revisited thoughts I thought I'd moved on from. Not so much that I want to die, more about the logistics of doing it. I used to spend so long thinking about it that it didn't occur to me that this wasn't normal. Last time I felt like this I think I sorted it all out, places and notes and warnings &c, but I got away from that. The last few weeks have seen me revisit this, and compare my situation with then, and what's changed, and I don't like it. I'm pretty certain it's not going to happen, but it's a shit mindspace to be in.

tru

why the revisitation

idk really, I ignored whatever depression I'd been suffering for 15-20 years for so long that I was inured to it. Counselling, medication and being in the greatest relationship I've ever known finally helped me stop these thoughts, but we broke up a couple of months ago and I've found myself returning to these vague images of me swinging in a noose or whatever.

That sounds weak written down. It's just a thought process I could really do without.

are you still on board with the meds and counseling?

Meds yes, I've no problem with this. Counselling I stopped a while ago (before it all went to shit) because I figured everything in my life was going well, and I couldn't really afford* to keep going. Part of me thinks it might be worth going back, but it's like this death-feeling seems separate from the depression that's just there.

* I think it makes me feel better putting the money I was spending on this towards clearing outstanding debts

i don't at all doubt that clearing debts is more helpful than counsel(l)ing . . . most of the time.

at certain times like now, however, it may be otherwise.

i'm sure most cousel(l)ors will be all like you need to see me once a week forever, but you needn't accept that judgment. do what you need to do to get by.

give it a shot

when I decided to quit counsel(l)ing, we had an awkward moment where I was like, 'yep, everything's great', and she interpreted it as 'useless chamber loves counsel(l)ing and wants to carry on indefinitely', while I was actually thinking 'I just want to feel this moment of greatness forever, and not spend a night a week blaming my family or whatever for stuff I'd be better off not thinking about'. Perhaps the fact I was already in this level of doublethink is a reason why I always felt disengaged from therapy. idk.

anyway, staying up and talking stuff knowing I've written work off tomorrow helps a lot. Thanks guys.

not spend a night a week blaming my family or whatever for stuff I'd be better off not thinking about

Peace, man, and sympathy for this hard time. This sentence, though, is like...let me put it this way: I know someone irl who stopped going to counseling and his then-wife asked him why he wouldn't make an appt, and he said, "Because she's going to want me to talk about my mother, and I don't WANT to talk about my mother!" NB: his problems are all about his mother.

If therapist was not listening to where you wanted to go with therapy, maybe try a different one? But sometimes the problem is just your mother, so to speak.

Yes. I also feel a bit like I'd led my therapist into a lane where everything was my family's fault, and even if it was a dead-end, on the way out we still had to look through the same windows. And I can see why a lot of the thought processes I go through are a consequence of my upbringing, but the problem I have now is that this situation I'm in is that I can separate it all from this - like I've spent the best part of 30yrs trying to figure out how to be happy with my life, and it's resulted in 6months of awesomeness followed by desolation. It's not like I'm the first person to be in this position, but I'm not the only person to think this is the best solution.

This is a mindset I've been in so long, the background changes all the time. It's only relatively recently I've been remotely comfortable discussing it.

haha my therapy results (including couples therapy, to my ex's chagrin) have always been like 'yeah that makes sense, i can see that' which, while somewhat gratifying, have not been particularly helpful

Anyway, it's been good getting this out. I managed to break a mobile phone for the 1st time in 13 years earlier, and most of my ILXing is done on that these days, so I'm going to go to bed, hopefully get some good sleep and try and sort myself out a bit tomorrow.

<3 you guys.

good night

Reading about something else, saw this passage and thought it might fit here:

Whitaker introduces us to the notion of change. ... I’m talking about the idea that therapy is not about insights. It’s about change. This makes sense. After all, when people come together to form a relationship, whether they realise it or not, they’re trying to change each other. All too often, though, they fall into a situation called homeostasis in which change is impossible. They are stuck in seemingly unchangeable patterns. So what you do?

That’s where the next book comes in. It’s called Uncommon Therapy, and it’s by one of the family therapy pioneers, Jay Haley, but it’s about another therapist named Milton Erickson. Erickson understood that if therapy is about change, not insight, then in some important way you’re not tethered to reality. The therapist is free to create new realities.

This tremendously empowers the therapist, but it also changes our whole sense of what is to be a person. The notion that who I am is this stable entity gets exploded. In fact, and the evidence for this is overwhelming, who I am and who you are is pretty much a plaything of context and assumptions. Change the context, change the assumptions, and you change the self. ... As with Whitaker, this book will give you the sense, wow, I never imagined that therapists could do this. It’s enormously exciting, but for those people who have a traditional view of the self, it’s also deeply challenging.

I've always thought that its bonkers a d dangerous to think of "self" as being static (whether it's yourself or someone else's self). People are processes. We move and change. Makes sense that therapy should make you more comfortable with the idea of change.

Yeah, I'm interested in the idea that you don't go to therapy to "know thyself" better although maybe you can see around some blind spots or w/e but that the goal isn't just to amass knowledge. Because it sometimes seems like it is? And for a person who's reasonably self-aware and contemplative already it's kind of "no duh" to be told things you already know.

But where does it get you if knowing them isn't the POINT? Seems likely to get you somewhere different.

Yeah, that's true. I really like the idea of it. Think it would do my other half good.

the thing about being dead is, i've never heard anyone complain.

it should be as easy to find suicide cults in real life as it is in movies and TV

http://www.xojane.com/family/10-years-later-what-my-fathers-suicide-has-taught-me

the thing about being dead is, i've never heard anyone complain.

― alpha farticles, Sunday, September 23, 2012 10:19 PM (5 minutes ago)

is there ever more annoying a martyr than the non-complainer?

It souinds like you're going through some dark shit right now ––– I am sorry if I am being glib ––––––––––– I don't even know who you are ––––––––––––––––– no suicides, please.

i wonder if anyone who has truly contemplated suicide would call it "the coward's way out"

Honestly I doubt it. This might be TMI but whenever I get down that far what keeps me from doing the deed is thinking about how terrible and sad it would be for my friends and family, the last thing that crosses my mind is "wow this seems cowardly..."

In other words, its more realizing killing myself would result in more misery and suffering, and that flips me out of it. Cowardice is some macho bullshit I don't even care about.

yeah, i think about that too. i'm glad i don't have a wife or kids for this reason, but you can't live for others forever.

is there ever more annoying a martyr than the non-complainer?

― The Most Typical and Popular Girl Rider (Crabbits), Sunday, September 23, 2012 11:25 PM (Yesterday)

yeah the "my pain hurts more than your pain" martyr-asshole

yeah suffering is no competition

sorry though

no need. last i checked you never did anything to me to be sorry about.

jesus is the ultimate superstar of the "my pain hurts more than your pain" schtick though.

closely tied in first place with: God.

and maybe louis armstrong.

i don't know, still not sure how to get past this problem

ultimately, i know deep down that more than anything else, i just want to kill myself. far more than i want to try to live a productive life, anyway, but i suppose medication helps me at least be able to get out of bed to maintain... something

trying to claw my way forward, figure out a place to move, another job, or a school to go to or something, but when sit down to do these things, i feel like vomiting forever, and nothing gets done besides another wasted regretful night. doesn't seem like there's enough anesthesia in the world to overcome this

truth is though i'm just waiting for my family to die off or move on with their own lives

nhex, hugs.