Meanwhile, over in Georgia

so now bush wants to use military aircraft and ships to send aid to the region. is he fucking crazy?

I just saw the statement and this is nothing if not provocative (or maybe just naive). Russia now has ample opportunities to orchestrate 'incidents' in the Eastern Black Sea. Russia gets to do what it wants because the US has no ability to project power and Europe wants to stay warm this winter. I can't see any situation playing out where Russia doesn't 'win' by whatever standards it sets for winning.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/7559252.stm

o shit

yeah, but is this world war III??!!

fucking NUKES people!

Can we for a moment NOT assume that we're about to see Threads all over again, thanks?

They're delivering aid. It's the least they can do. Chill, jeremy.

yeah, but russia isn't gonna stand for this, is it? they're going to see it as an act of aggression.

Five to four says the US told the Russians first before the public announcement.

more reassuring words please, i'm having a coronary, here.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but what exactly were Russian peacekeepers, who had been stationed in S. Ossetia for 15 years, supposed to do when the Georgian military invaded Tskhinval? Their entire purpose was to prevent such an attack from succeeding!

Five to four says the US told the Russians first before the public announcement.

Undoubtedly, but it still throws the Russians another grievance/bargaining chip.

Berlin Airlift, jeremy.

the russians will authorise this before hand you mean?

They will be delivering biscuits and blankets, or whatever it is they deliver in these circumstances, not bombs

I'm just saying we've fed their enemies from military aircraft before and no bombs went off.

More like, they can accuse US of brining in troops/arms whatever, then blockade, the US has to back down, Russia wins.

It's humanitarian aid, people! C'mon.

us doesn't back down, bye bye planet

How much you guys want to bet that actual Ossetians see 0 of this aid

Jeremy, since you are clearly NOT interested in being talked down from your ledge...

i dunno, nobody else feeling anxious?

Nope

the US is not interested in a military confrontation with Russia and has nothing to gain from it. they'll drop their food baskets and that'll be it. Russia may see it as a minor provocation and just use it for more grandstanding.

http://sandradodd.com/game/hangman.gif

WE'RE ALL GONNA DIE JEREMY

OMG OMG OMG

DIE

DURAN DURAN?

STORE AN AN

Yeah how interested is Russia in a military confrontation with the US?

And vice-versa?

like either country is gonna nuke each other over fucking GEORGIA. no way.

sorry, guys. just a little tense. goes back to cold war fears as a kid.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amerika_(TV_miniseries)

I saw most of that TV series, god help me. Talk about a fantasy! (Though I remember how the 'punk' kid was trying to show how edgy he was by wearing a jacket with the Taiwanese flag on it.)

that was a real low moment for Kriss Kristofferson

it was a low moment for everyone

in

AMERIKA

I was really thinking they might go whole hog and get after them pipes but now they haven't and this is all just a wash

it was funny when a georgian emigrant in atlanta decided to host the georgian president's web page in georgia, though, to stave off those dastardly hackers

This doesn't put up a cuban missile crisis or even berlin airlift level of crisis, this just gives Russia the chance to flex it's muscles and strong arm the US at a particularly weak time and I don't doubt it will take the opportunity.

No but it's a crisis all right, with Mr. Saakashvili determined to drag us into this (I was watching this on CNN myself but got irritated when the sophistry and question-dodging became cringe-worthy):

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/14/world/europe/14saakashvili.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

Asked about the cease-fire, Mr. Saakashvili said the Russians “never meant a cease-fire.”

“This is the kind of cease-fire they had in Afghanistan,” he added.

“They even steal toilet seats, I’ve been hearing,” he said.

He made repeated references not only to the Soviet Union’s war in Afghanistan in the 1970s, but also to the invasion Prague in 1968 and even repeated references to the German invasion of Poland before the start of World War II.

As for how he planned to halt the formidable Russian forces if they indeed headed toward Tbilisi, he said, “This will not be only Georgian troops” but an “all-out defense.”

“Freedom is worth fighting for,” he said, adding that his country was doing this “not only for us but for the rest of Europe.”

Asked if the White House was doing enough, he said: “I just spoke to President Bush. Frankly, some of the first statements were seen as a green light for Russia. They were kind of soft.”

He said, “Georgia is the first test case.”

He said the United State should be doing more. “We should realize what is at stake for America; America is losing the whole region,” he said.

“Who else can stand up for liberty in the world?”

As for reports that he was warned not to instigate a conflict by sending troops to South Ossetia, Mr. Saakashvili said angrily: “I’m sickened of this cynical and unfounded allegation. Our troops were always there. It’s our territory. They’re killing our people.”

He dismissed allegations that Georgia started the fighting. “How can we attack Russia?” he asked. “That’s the ludicrous thing.”

Meanwhile the Russian troops are supposedly an hour from Tblisi

Saakasvili is such a douchebag

He wears such ugly ties too, so fat-knotted

He is stuck in the 90s!

As for reports that he was warned not to instigate a conflict by sending troops to South Ossetia, Mr. Saakashvili said angrily: “I’m sickened of this cynical and unfounded allegation. Our troops were always there. It’s our territory. They’re killing our people.”

I don't know... this sort of statement makes me sympathize with Georgia much less.

Considering that mainstream media reported this from "South Ossetia" yesterday...well, yeah. How many times will Saaky lie? Oh maybe until the West is there fighting, or Georgia is in NATO

http://news.yahoo.com/s/csm/ossetia;_ylt=AqK8MMR12BLaNzkpxxPSXgYGw_IE

Why Ossetians want Georgia out

The Ossetians, who claim to have inhabited the same territory for centuries, say their nation was broken in two by Soviet dictator Joseph Stalin, who awarded South Ossetia to the Georgian Soviet republic against the Ossetians' will. (Stalin also took away Abkhazia's independence and made it an autonomous republic within Georgia.) As the USSR was collapsing, Ossetians fought a brutal war of independence against Georgia, which ended in a three-way peacekeeping agreement in 1992. Under that deal, Russian, Georgian, and South Ossetian forces were to jointly guarantee security until a final settlement was reached.

The arrangement collapsed in a hail of artillery fire and bombs last Friday.

"This is an historical problem. My great-grandmother told me that in the 1920s she saw Georgians massacring the South Ossetians," says Gavril Guzitayev, one of many young Ossetian men gathered Monday at Vladikavkaz's main recruiting center. "She said they came in fast on horses and attacked with sabres."

Along with other young men waiting to sign up for the Russian army and fight in South Ossetia, Mr. Guzitayev says "after all this, I don't believe Ossetians and Georgians can live together.... I just want a machine gun, and to ... stand beside my brothers."

Sorry about that link

http://news.yahoo.com/s/csm/ossetia;_ylt=AqK8MMR12BLaNzkpxxPSXgYGw_IE

Aargh. Oh well, I can't even cut and paste

so am i still wrong to be panicing?

Yeah, he's an enormous liar. I'm not saying Russia is 100% in the right, but honestly - if you attack a country, you need to take the consequences for it.

Haven't had much sympathy for Georgia/Saakashvili at any point in all this. And given that Russian soldiers ("peacekeepers") were killed during what amounts to the invasion of a territory they were protecting, the Russian response has been fairly moderate.

And no, the US and Russia won't be fighting each other directly over this.

And it's too bad that John McCain listens to his Georgian lobbyist aid. Because then he can trick the 45% of the country that supports him into denying the facts on the ground.