Bin Laden Dead?

Good point, actually. Kerry is French!

like for example, I fully expect that any Jewish presidential candidate is going to find him/herself painted as viewing the minutiae of American domestic policy through the lens of "what would Israel do?"

well, remember when Droopy Dawg was asked in 2000 whether he'd participate in a national security meeting on the Sabbath?

wait do critics of obama think he asks himself 'what would hawaii do?'

I'm sure a Jewish candidate will have the words "big city" thrown at him a lot.

Really? It's not as if the Israeli cabinet hasn't had emergency mtgs on the Sabbath.

xxpost

wait do critics of obama think he asks himself 'what would hawaii do?'

I was going to amend that to "how can this benefit Israel?"; half the crazies think he is a Muslim socialist who plans to impose sharia law

x-post Lieberman works on the Sabbasth but he has a guy with him to push elevator buttons and put in tokens on the subway.

You know who else had emergency meetings on the Sabbath? Jesus. (lol u thought I was gonna say Hitler)

obama proves the worst of his critics correct by introducing mandatory surfing to the curriculum

but to go back to my original point, anyone using the argument "but they did it to white people too, ergo it's not racist/prejudicial" is not really thinking things through

btw I had to edit that like 3 times to not be unnecessarily inflammatory because that line of argument REALLY angers me, just the blithe inability to see what's happening and the unspoken corollary that it's okay because it happened to white people, too; the actual response should be that it's not okay when it happens to ANYONE

think the argument is that it's not because he's black, dan, i think the argument is that the fact that he's black is just a new stick to beat him with compared to the previous enemy.

I'm not saying that's a fuckin improvement one over the other tho

Those are the exact same argument; the second one is rephrased to make white people feel better about themselves for having conquered racism.

a lot of the stuff that happened to kerry and dukasis felt like just general "needling" in a way. the obama stuff often feels like "know your place" or some al campanis as concern troll type shit.

that's abt two layers deeper than i normally go into stuff tbh, so i'm out.

why do black people always make our most distant and exotic state (what they call "Africa") about race?

lol

i read a "hilarious" facebook comment from a "friend" of a friend on a post she made about repub tactics which was "oh please none of this has to do with racism and besides he was only elected because he was black so who are the real racists here."

the fact that people can say that shit completely seriously will never cease to amaze me

http://thechart.blogs.cnn.com/2011/05/05/sex-in-the-age-of-bin-laden/

x-post OJ Simpson still searching for the "real racists"

You wanna know how Obama got elected, I got two words: Affirmative Action!

Polls counted each Obama vote twice!

documenting the weird demonization of democrats is the howler's entire project so I think he feels pretty strongly that it shouldn't happen. i think you're right djp that race is one of the tools - well, a whole set of tools - that are currently in use against obama. but I also think it's important to see that as a continuation of a long project of dem otherizing, with the blithe compliance or active connivance of the press

Why? How, aside from feeding into a persecution complex and diminish/belittling the scope of the tactics being deployed against the current President despite the tacit acceptance of the fact that his skin color adds a billion more weapons to the arsenal, is this history being used?

Remember also that the context in which you brought all of this up in defense of the statement "race is not a factor in why people are birthers"

(more fairly, "not always")

i think tbqf the tactics republicans use insofar as generally otherizing the dems are also used by the dems against the repubs but it doesn't bother the left because they're "on the right side" (which is of course why it doesn't bother the repubs either.) the repubs are more likely to attract racist loons of course because their party is prone to racist lunacy that seeps in quietly towards the middle from the fringe.

a long project of dem otherizing

this is a drop in the bucket of the long project of white & patriarchal supremacy

Officials interviewed scoffed at the idea that Pakistan could have been unaware of the American operation.

“It’s a no-fly zone,” said a Pakistani intelligence official, referring to the area around bin Laden’s mansion and the nearby military compound. “It is impossible for U.S. helicopters to fly over there without our knowledge and permission.”

A Pakistan Air Force official, speaking on the condition of anonymity, rejected reports that U.S. special forces had jammed Pakistan’s radar system in order to circumvent the no-fly zone.

“This is totally untrue. Neither our radars were jammed nor was any scrambling of any air force plane recorded,” the official said, referring to the practice of launching aircraft in the event that the airspace has been breached. Some observers said the helicopters may have been equipped with stealth technology, but that has not been confirmed.

Residents in the area confirmed that the Pakistan army appeared to have at least some knowledge of the operation well before it began. Several residents said that two hours before the United States launched its attack, Pakistani army personnel ordered them to switch off their lights inside and outside their homes and remain indoors until further notice.

“The army personnel cordoned off the entire area long before we heard the sounds of helicopters hovering over the area,” said Zulfikar Ahmed, who lives in the Abbottabad neighborhood of Bilal Town, where bin Laden’s compound is located. Locals interviewed by the BBC and several other local and international media outlets made similar statements.

Several meetings leading up to the attack, when viewed in sum, also indicate that Pakistan might have known of the operation beforehand.

“Gen. David Petraeus paid an extraordinary visit to Islamabad on April 25,” said a senior military official said. The official said Petraeus held a one-on-one meeting with Gen. Ashfaq Parvez Kayani, Pakistan’s army chief of staff, in which they discussed the details of the operation.

The next day, Pakistan’s top military body — the Joint Chiefs of Staff Committee — held its quarterly session, which was attended by Lt. Gen. Ahmed Shuja Pasha, the country's intelligence chief, who is not a regular member of the body. Pasha had visited the United States to meet with the head of the Central Intelligence Agency, Leon Panetta, on April 11.

Analysts in Pakistan said that the Pakistani government likely wanted to hide its role in the operation to avoid a backlash from the public, which has grown increasingly impatient with the United States and the growing presence of the Central Intelligence Agency inside their country.

But now international pressure is growing on the military to answer not only for its lack of support in the raid but also for not knowing about bin Laden’s hideout, which was located close to the Pakistan Military Academy. Some in the military — which has long been one of the more respected institutions in the country — are looking to correct the record.

U.S. President Barack Obama has sought to diffuse the tension since the raid took place, calling Pakistan an important ally and highlighting the intelligence sharing between the two countries that helped lead the United States to bin Laden’s compound.

In his speech on Sunday announcing bin Laden’s death, Obama recognized Pakistan’s cooperation.

"It’s important to note that our counterterrorism cooperation with Pakistan helped lead us to bin Laden and the compound where he was hiding," the president said.

When contacted by GlobalPost about this latest information, the White House press office said all details about the operation have already been released.

White House spokesman Jay Carney on Wednesday said the United States’ relationship with Pakistan was “complicated,” but that it was important to maintain.

“The fight is not done, and we look forward to cooperating with Pakistan in the future,” he said at a White House press briefing. “As others have said, more terrorists have been killed on Pakistani soil than probably any other country. And the cooperation we’ve received from Pakistan has been very useful in that regard.”

The European Union on Thursday also came to the defense of Pakistan, calling the country an “important partner,” echoing similar statements from officials at NATO that were made on Wednesday.

Experts and analysts here said that the Pakistani government itself, which is concerned about appearing overly friendly with the United States and angering its citizens, is likely encouraging the United States to downplay Pakistan’s involvement in finding bin Laden and the eventual operation against him.

In fact, analysts said, Pakistani authorities have long been trying to compose a storyline that it is actively working against the United States — an effort that is aimed at keeping the country’s population from rising up against the political leadership. Pakistanis have grown tired of U.S. involvement in its affairs in the last decade and ongoing drone attacks in its northern tribal belt that have killed numerous civilians.

http://www.globalpost.com/dispatch/news/regions/asia-pacific/pakistan/110505/pakistan-army-osama-bin-laden-dead

(sorry to go back on topic, I know that there are so very few race and obama/general politics threads on ILE...)

lol*2

to think about it another way, just because dem male presidents get called girly men doesnt make it less observably sexist if R's target a female presidential candidacy for the 'weaknesses' of women, you know?

^^^an example where the sex & race thing can actually be switched & the parallel works imo

A lot of the racism in this country stems not from some deep-seated conviction that race actually makes ppl biologically different in any fundamental way but that different cultures are suspect and a potential challenge to one's own. Birthers and tea-partiers always trot out their black members to show that they're not racists and they're mostly not towards them, because they agree w/them. It's precisely when they're actually forced to defend the rationality behind their assumption of superiority that they're most caustic, hence calling a moderate Democrat a socialist or Nazi, or saying the left hates America because it has the effrontery to make a critique. This where American 'exceptionalism' comes from. This is why when we torture it's justified since we're always the good guys. Most of the malicious lazy barbs about certain races stem from an unwillingness to actually look at the history of this country which might upend some ppl's self-regard.

or more accurately, a rejection of that history ("that was then, this is now", a sentiment which is sometimes warranted but not always; basically, if you catch yourself saying reactionary/mean shit, you should always check yourself)

thanks Steve Shasta!!

sooo, what's the implication there, the pakistani "military" and "intelligence" ppl are non-contiguous? is that how it works, i truly don't know.

The next day, Pakistan’s top military body — the Joint Chiefs of Staff Committee — held its quarterly session, which was attended by Lt. Gen. Ahmed Shuja Pasha, the country's intelligence chief, who is not a regular member of the body. Pasha had visited the United States to meet with the head of the Central Intelligence Agency, Leon Panetta, on April 11.

er no, just looked i up and Lt. Gen. Ahmed Shuja Pasha is head of if the ISI.

(as far as race & birtherism goes, part of me just kind of has to laugh -- if anything obama is exactly the kind of figure they have been trying to paint all democrats as forever. he just IS all of that stuff (professorial, rich, skinny, glib, liberal, not white) and they can barely understand why and how he won. he has scrambled their brains.

they are convinced if they just uncover some more crazy SeCrEts he will fall apart, but this is some kind of suppressed recognition that they wish his totally obvious, surface characteristics weren't enough to bury his career. come on!! the guy's black!! and the name!! what the fuck!!)

guys. GUYS. the SEAL dogs have titanium teeth

http://www.thedaily.com/page/2011/05/05/050511-news-seal-dog-1-5/

lol, times version of that story is WAY cuddlier
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/05/science/05dog.html

Suzanne Belger, president of the American Belgian Malinois Club, said she was hoping the dog was one of her breed “and that it did its job and came home safe.” But Laura Gilbert, corresponding secretary for the German Shepherd Dog Club of America, said she was sure the dog was her breed “because we’re the best!”

So one guy in the ISI squealed on another part of the ISI, right?

they are convinced if they just uncover some more crazy SeCrEts he will fall apart, but this is some kind of suppressed recognition that they wish his totally obvious, surface characteristics weren't enough to bury his career. come on!! the guy's black!! and the name!! what the fuck!!)

― goole, Thursday, May 5, 2011 6:49 PM (11 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

haha

Some dogs are big enough that, when they leap on a suspect, the person tends to drop to the ground, Sergeant Mylott said. Others bite arms or legs. “Different dogs do different things,” she said. “But whatever they do, it’s very difficult for that person to go any further.”

you don't say

Oh and can I just pour cold, chunky SCORN on all the Republicans/fake Independents now complaining that 9/11 and related events ought not be politicized by the President? #itsfinewhenwhiteydoesit

this is a drop in the bucket of the long project of white & patriarchal supremacy

booming post imo

Some dogs are big enough that, when they leap on a suspect, the person tends to drop to the ground, Sergeant Mylott said. Others bite arms or legs. “Different dogs do different things,” she said. “But whatever they do, it’s very difficult for that person to go any further.”

you don't say

― Dreaded Burrito Gang (DJP), Thursday, May 5, 2011 3:02 PM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

this article was killing me last ngiht

"Navy SEALs used dogs in the mission against Bin Laden. What kind of dogs? The military won't say. But here are some facts about dogs. Some dogs are big. Some dogs are small. Some dogs are good at running, and some dogs are good at jumping."

its like, have we already run out of wildly speculative articles about how rugged and hot all the seals are that we have to go do this with DOGS now??

I want to see a military Pomeranian

I hope in the upcoming 'kill bin laden' videogame there's a secret code that lets you play the dog character