Cars: Search & Destroy

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my ride: 2001 honda civic LX, my wife just got one too (new Civic VP - got it for below invoice! they had some crazy sale a few months back but apparently they raised prices shortly afterward to ease tension w/ US automakers)
ideal ride: late 70's/early 80's vintage Toyota Celica, SOOO cool, they're like little wolverines
i don't know of any car movies

tremendoid (tremendoid), Monday, 27 June 2005 20:51 (eighteen years ago) link

Heh--I found out the price and it the price I wanted to pay but was embarassed to ask for bc I thought they would laugh at me. I used Edmunds to try and figure out what they payed, what private party people get payed, and what the dealers get payed--on average. They are still going to laugh at me, I know.

The dealer sold me this lovely sob story about how he bought the same car for his daughter, that's how much he believed in it, in the middle of the story his daughter changed into his niece, before he caught himself and said, I mean, my daughter.

Mary (Mary), Monday, 27 June 2005 20:51 (eighteen years ago) link

Basically, you need to tell them "I love the car and I am going to buy it but you have to make me happy. I am not buying the car unless you make me happy." If they are under a quota crunch (I don't know if late June would qualify as crunch time), they will consider making concessions.

Alternately, lie out of your ass and tell them you're looking at a private sale for a similar car that's 20-30% less, but stress that you really, really love their car. If you moon over it enough and convince them that you're itching to pull the trigger, they will either drop the price for you or start throwing mad free shit at you to get you to sign the papers.

Hahaha also ask him how much he would make his niecedaughter pay. And still lowball the price even if you're willing to pay it.

The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Monday, 27 June 2005 20:53 (eighteen years ago) link

(You may not want to bust him for his fake story but still hahahahaha.)

The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Monday, 27 June 2005 20:55 (eighteen years ago) link

Also, they will try to upsell you on a bunch of BS after you've agreed to the deal - things like some special kind of wax protection etc. These things are all pure profit for the dealer. They may even make you try to sign things like "denied special wax coating protection" which is basically a scam. Just get up and say, "I'm leaving" and they'll chill out.

Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Monday, 27 June 2005 21:02 (eighteen years ago) link

Hahahaha "special wax protection"! You should demand that they shrinkwrap the car for you.

The Ghost of Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Monday, 27 June 2005 21:03 (eighteen years ago) link

yeah with the Honda guy it was theft protection, extended warranty and some other bullshit for at least 10 minutes(admittedly I shouldn't have asked so much for details but I was curious).

tremendoid (tremendoid), Monday, 27 June 2005 21:07 (eighteen years ago) link

When I got an Audi the dealer actually tried to convince me they had some coating that was better than a finish designed by German engineers in Ingolstadt. It was like $300 ("Only $5 a month for piece of mind!"). I think I said something along the lines of "the only way you're going to get that $300 from me is to hold me up at gunpoint!" When I stood up to walk out they relented but still tried to get me to sign something saying I had denied the "extra protection."

Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Monday, 27 June 2005 21:13 (eighteen years ago) link

Was it something like 'permaplate'? 'Cause I bought my car from an Audi/VW dealer, and they tried the same thing on me.

luna (luna.c), Monday, 27 June 2005 21:15 (eighteen years ago) link

That's a great name, but I don't remember the exact one they used.

Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Monday, 27 June 2005 21:19 (eighteen years ago) link

What do I care more about--fly looks or lowest monthly payments?

You're doing a bit of a number on yourself here, since the implication is that anything beyond the bare necessities is a frivolous expense.

Assuming that mileage etc is equal, EX IS THE BETTER VALUE. Not only because it has things will increase your actual enjoyment (e.g., moonroof) and things that make it safer (e.g., ABS, an extra 12hp), but because it doesn't really cost $1000 more - that same stuff that you like retains its value, and will allow you to ask more for the car when you eventually sell it or trade it in, whether that's one year from now or ten.

Depending on the price your dealer's asking, you may also want to look at a new Civic EX. Yes, a NEW CIVIC EX. The Civic is due for replacemant by the end of the year, and Honda's been quietly offering its dealers some pretty nice spiffs to keep the current model moving. In the past year, I've helped two different acquiantances get fully-loaded Civic EX sedans for $16.5K with minimal negotiation.

I'd recommend going to carsdirect.com and checking out how much they sell Civics for in your area. There's no downside, and they offer live prices, which lets you just say, hey Mr. Honda Salesman, I'd like to work with you but I'm not going to pay for the privilege, here's what I can get a new Civic for, is there any point in us talking further?

rogermexico (rogermexico), Monday, 27 June 2005 21:43 (eighteen years ago) link

MY RIDE:
THE BUS AND MY BIKE
IDEAL RIDE:
A GOOD TRAIN SYSTEM

AND FUCK CARS AND CAR MOVIES (2 FAST 2 FURIOUS LOLOLOL)

W4YN3Z0R (trigonalmayhem), Monday, 27 June 2005 21:45 (eighteen years ago) link

i want a '61 mercury comet or a '64 corvair spyder or a '68 dodge dart.

monsanto and yanni (Jody Beth Rosen), Monday, 27 June 2005 21:47 (eighteen years ago) link

Roger's post is one of the most useful ever!

Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Monday, 27 June 2005 22:23 (eighteen years ago) link

*blush*

rogermexico (rogermexico), Monday, 27 June 2005 22:26 (eighteen years ago) link

Hahaha, we just agreeed on a price and are waiting to figure out the financing. They tried to sell me the wax bc the black car really needs it. My mom almost broke but I was like, nah, I don wanna pay any more money. Thanks all, got the sunbeam, moonbeam EX. Wahey!

Mary Honda, Tuesday, 28 June 2005 00:06 (eighteen years ago) link

Mary's got a brand new car
Mary's got a brand new set-a-wheels
Now everyone here is so charged
Man you don't know how good it feels
And we wanna go where she goes
We wanna listen to the radio...

CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!

rogermexico (rogermexico), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 03:13 (eighteen years ago) link

Thanks! And thanks to ILX for walking me through this protracted decision process. The ride home was great. Only one little problem, they told me they were gonna fill the tank for me, but it was near empty. Ordinarily I would think they forgot, but I read before I went to the dealer that there is this one little unfixable design flaw with some of the '04 Civics whereby you fill the tank and every 4th time or so it doesn't register on the needle. I am hoping they just forgot--I guess I will find out tomorrow when I drop the check off. If not, how will I ever know if I am running out of gas or not?

My first point of contact dude was really cool, like I had to ask him if I could do a test-drive, there was no pressure, but after awhile his crazy manager came out to seal the deal. At one point (after I brought in my mom) he was going on about his daughter again, and then he referred to letting the mother take of the warranty, and then he actually said, "Oh, it's my niece." Get one straight story.

After we agreed on the price, they said they were gonna send some in to talk to us about how to take care of our car while they set up the lease processing. I thought, cool, I'll get some tips. That's when the girl started going off about the paint and etc. She said, You don't want to get an alarm for the third most stolen car in America? And I was like, no, that's okay. And my mom was like, they always just go off in parking lots anyway. But I wasn't prepared for those pitches so was happy to read here not to worry about them. She was going to charge a special deal of $595 for the paint sealant/warranty.

I also drove a '02 green Corolla with 50,000 miles that was exactly like the rental car I took to North Carolina which was so so so much cheaper. But the drive was just not as nice at all. My car has only 5,000 miles on it.

Mary (Mary), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 04:15 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh I forgot the funniest part. he asked incredulously, you've never financed a car before? And I was like, no, I've never owned a car before. This was cause my mom was saying that maybe it would be better to use her credit. And he looked me in the eye and said, Financing a car is one of the best things that you can do in life. And without even thinking I said, I seriously doubt that. He was like, what, have you been in Europe for the past 10 years or something? I was like no in New York. he was like ok, but financing a car, buying a home, these are all the important steps that you need to make. And I am sitting there with a Hello Kitty bag in my hand. We decided to co-finance it, so I can take this brave step toward adulthood.

Mary (Mary), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 04:23 (eighteen years ago) link

He's actually kind of right about that. Credit bureaus like to see us take on long-term debt and repay it in a predictable fashion. It really does help with that credit rating thing.

But it is hard to recognize the odd nugget of truth under the pile of BS. Good call on the alarm, btw.

rogermexico (rogermexico), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 04:34 (eighteen years ago) link

Ha ha, yes, I am sure it is one of the better financial things one can for themself, but the way he presented it was if it was the best thing in life that might ever happen to me.

Mary (Mary), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 05:05 (eighteen years ago) link

Yup. Now that you've agreed to finance a car, it's all pretty much one long slow slide...

rogermexico (rogermexico), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 05:21 (eighteen years ago) link

Also, my mom pointed out that this car is made in Canada, not the Land of the Sun :(

Mary (Mary), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 05:32 (eighteen years ago) link

Congratulations!!!

Instead of the alarm, just get a Club (but remember to use it). Also, during cold months, you can still leave the moonroof open (even at night). Just put the heater on your feet. This is one of my favorite things.

Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 06:16 (eighteen years ago) link

A club? As in a baseball bat, or one of those weird wheel-lock contraptions? They look a bit tedious to put on?

I'm so excited. I can't believe I have a car sitting in my driveway.

Mary (Mary), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 06:32 (eighteen years ago) link

Also, during cold months, you can still leave the moonroof open (even at night). Just put the heater on your feet. This is one of my favorite things.

NEEEEEEAAAYAAYAHAAYAAYAYAAAAAAAOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ed (dali), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 06:57 (eighteen years ago) link

My gas gauge is fine; they had just forgotten to put fuel in the tank. I love the way the Honda drives, it's so stiff and slow to accelerate and the engine is so noisy and revvy--it feels a lot like the compact diesel I learned to drive on. Are they all like this? Or did I buy a lemon? I guess I should have sampled some other Hondas.... My only other points of comparison were a couple of Corollas that seemed to drive much looser.

My mom used a charming & bewildering tactic as I was deept into negotiations last night. Out of the blue, she pulled this coupon out of her pocket, and said, this is for a car sale sponsored by the Apple Credit Union next weekend. Do you think we should go to this? As we were haggling over the price of the car that I pretty much intended to buy.

Mary (Mary), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 19:19 (eighteen years ago) link

xpost, Ed, just to calm you down: The compressor is not in use when I do this. It's just heat directly from the engine that would otherwise be vented out of the car.

Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 19:33 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't leave the windows open when I have the AC on (which is very rarely even when it's really hot - although LA heat is very dry which means the AC's cool dry air isn't as important).

Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 19:38 (eighteen years ago) link

Or perhaps you had some other concern? Like you didn't want me to catch cold?

Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 19:39 (eighteen years ago) link

Spencer, have you sat in an onsen? You would love it. Body steaming, head cool.

Mary (Mary), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 19:45 (eighteen years ago) link

NEEEEEEAAAYAAYAHAAYAAYAYAAAAAAAOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 19:49 (eighteen years ago) link

You don't enjoy communing with men in the nude?

Mary (Mary), Tuesday, 28 June 2005 20:01 (eighteen years ago) link

Let's talk accessories. Do you put bumper stickers, other stickers on, or place stuffed animals, or hang things from your dash? Should I place Hyseric Glamour stickers around my car? Their H sort of matches the Honda H.

The most common ones around here are the Bush/Cheney, and the Kerry/Edawards stickers. I made my mom take hers off (K/E) her car, bc I was like, that election is over. But every one keeps them on, so maybe I should have let her keep it. And of course the ubiquitous yellow ribbon stickers. Sometimes even two or three. Gareth and I found that the more Support our Troops stickers a person has on their SUV, the less likely they are to let you merge into their lane.

Mary (Mary), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 23:23 (eighteen years ago) link

You have to keep the campaign stickers on your car so that people know how rude to be in traffic. (Or maybe that's just me.)

If you go with bumper stickers, go all the way and just put it on. People who scotch tape them to the rear window are lame. The bumper sticker isn't going to make your 1994 Chevy Lumina completely worthless, dude.

milozauckerman (miloaukerman), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 23:31 (eighteen years ago) link

yeah GM already saw to that

oops (Oops), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 23:34 (eighteen years ago) link

for those who don't have a club already, skip it and get "Autolock" which locks over the brake or clutch instead of the steering wheel(which can be easily cut, nullifying the club in seconds, the autolock(well, any security measure) can be dealt with but it's much more of a pain in the ass from what I've heard.

tremendoid (tremendoid), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 23:38 (eighteen years ago) link

Ha ha, I never knew anyone scotch-taped bumper stickers to their car! That would be good for me, actually, bc I am always changing my affinities.

Mary (Mary), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 23:40 (eighteen years ago) link

but isn't the Club way more visible than that? and the main point of any security device is to be blatant enough so any would-be thief wouldn't even bother breaking in, even if there are ways of overcoming them.

oops (Oops), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 23:42 (eighteen years ago) link

You don't enjoy communing with men in the nude?

I swear that read as "commuting with men in the nude"

rogermexico (rogermexico), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 23:49 (eighteen years ago) link

xpost but the point is that it's not really as much of a bother to any serious car thief as previously advertised, and they know that. Plus autolock gives you big red stickers(one for EACH side window GOTCHA smartypants) that tell the bad guys in no uncertain terms that you mean business. with extreme prejudice.

tremendoid (tremendoid), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 23:58 (eighteen years ago) link

ah okay, visible stickers.
my point was that it needn't have to be much of a bother to be a deterrent. Locked doors aren't much of a trouble for a serious car thief either, but if he sees a car with unlocked doors he'll no doubt pick that one.

oops (Oops), Thursday, 30 June 2005 00:02 (eighteen years ago) link

Get a "Protected by Smith & Wesson" sticker. Ironic and useful.

milozauckerman (miloaukerman), Thursday, 30 June 2005 00:03 (eighteen years ago) link

Mondale/Ferraro

gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 30 June 2005 00:32 (eighteen years ago) link

I want to put my WFMU car magnet on my truck but I'm afraid it'll get stolen. What to do!

Rock Hardy (Rock Hardy), Thursday, 30 June 2005 00:36 (eighteen years ago) link

four weeks pass...
I am now obsessed with Facel Vegas. Apparently driving one transforms the entire world into an early 60s French film

http://www.jalopnik.com/cars/facelvega.jpg

More to the point, I'm in love with their logo

http://www.cars-a-z.net/f/facel-vega-logo.jpg

Elvis Telecom (Chris Barrus), Friday, 29 July 2005 18:51 (eighteen years ago) link

There is this horrible new woman at work and she drives a BMW Z3. The BMW just has the worst associations for me, character-wise.

Mary (Mary), Saturday, 30 July 2005 05:47 (eighteen years ago) link

The cars are actually perfectly cute; simple and stream-lines. But why do they attract suck agressively social-status happy drivers? MB seems to attract a more staid consumer, rich and boring; while BMW seems to be more rich, sporty, and snotty. I wonder what is it like in Europe?

Mary (Mary), Saturday, 30 July 2005 22:35 (eighteen years ago) link

If I had piles of money, I'd be thinking about a new T-Bird.

Truckdrivin' Buddha (Rock Hardy), Sunday, 31 July 2005 00:24 (eighteen years ago) link


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