DEM not gonna CON dis NATION: Rolling UK politics in the short-lived Cleggeron era

I opposed the Falklands war (I think I even went on a march about it, sooooo many marches back then...) and the Iraq war for much the same reason, both could have been avoided. It wasn't the majority view at the time but definitely a significant minority.

I'm not sure 'this war is unnecessary' was a minority view at any stage of the planned iraq invasion

that fucker was warned by US intelligence that it was going to happen, she did fuck all about it

i've never heard this line tbf, got a ref?

A million people did not march in opposition to the Falklands War. There's one difference.

No, I was talking about the Falklands, xp.

ah sorry ned i thought you were equating the level of opposition, misread your post.

our territory, inhabited by our fellow citizens gets invaded by a bunch of fascists

Note the difference between this from Pashmina and Ken Livingstone's criticism.

That's quite alright, xp.

Kinnock opposed the Falklands war as well iirc.

welsh don't like it up em

Think his argument was along the lines of 'who gives a fuck about a bunch of remote sheep farmers?'

nah that was scots independence surely?

Think his argument was along the lines of 'who gives a fuck about a bunch of remote sheep farmers?'

That was the undertone in some left wing circles - a nice lot, the 80's left

who were the 90's left?

that fucker was warned by US intelligence that it was going to happen, she did fuck all about it

i've never heard this line tbf, got a ref?

― postcards from the (ledge), Tuesday, 29 June 2010 13:29 (11 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

OK, I'm not totally sure, so don't quote me on this, but I think it's in Max Hastings and Simon Jenkins book The Battle for the Falklands. At least Thatcher (and Carrington) had received advice from the UK security services about this.

who were the 90's left?

Me and Noodle Vague. Personally I started off on the right of Labour Party but as the entire country has shifted to the right I've ended up as some sort of wild-eyed left wing revolutionary

I spent the 90s drunk. But what else could you do?

learn to shuffle with the crowd, vital survival skill imo

That was the undertone in some left wing circles - a nice lot, the 80's left

Maybe the SWP but not Kinnock.

I mean Kinnock was nicer than the SWP.

I think Kinnock was too left wing for me!

I can speak for the 80s left and we were all very nice actually. Except the SWP. And the WRP. And Workers Power (splitters).

Kinnock started out on the Left but so did half of the PLP in the 80s. I was only a teenager when the Falklands War was on but there was plenty of implication in leftish circles that the Falklanders were oddballs for choosing to live there and they were all probably Tories so fuck 'em.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/10442823.stm

This is the sort of shit that starts backlashes in unexpected places.

Home Secretary Theresa May told chiefs .... minimum standards and targets would be scrapped immediately.

Nice

Some horrible little thinktank accountancy spod was on Breakfast TV this morning crunching thru those numbers like there wasn't a human being attached to the jobs. He seemed very excited at the prospect of cuts.

It's OK, they're going "more with less" by sharing helicopters, apparently.

xp

yeah, but that's his job, tbf. that's why you have actual people in charge of accountants to blame for their actions.

i mean, kirk had to front for spock for instance

yeah, but that's his job, tbf. that's why you have actual people in charge of accountants to blame for their actions.

I think you're missing the point, he's a thinktank accountant, not one who actually lives + works in the real world with real people

oh yeah, i know some real accountants, they're not the worst.

Yeah I was gonna exclude the A word, but tbh whatever you do if your job is sacking people and you enjoy it then f you imo

there's a professional necessary remove from getting 'the figures' down to efficient perfection and people actually suffering/losing out. once you can fake that, etc etc

Yeah it's the glee with which phrases like "take an axe to public spending" are being thrown around that really galls.

This 'thinktank' fellow wasn't someone from the Taxpayer's Alliance was it, those fuckers are everywhere.

http://www.westburypeople.co.uk/council/Westbury-Councillor-Russell-Hawker-Causes-Uproar/story-5334685-detail/story.html

tbf some cunt inadvertently slurring hilsborough victims isn't rly that important a thing right now

decimated northern (public) economy to be replaced by cotton mills and foundries once wages drop low enough and top-hatted squirearchy reasserts itself

What do you mean, 'once'?

tbf some cunt inadvertently slurring hilsborough victims isn't rly that important a thing right now

Every little helps, but yes, more interesting stuff going on - K Clarke (for the Left) vs. J Straw (for the Right) on prisons.

To which my initial reaction is "Ken Clarke motherfucking otm", although Straw does have a point re: falling crime figures.

Christ, being torn between clarke and straw, what a world!

Think it's more that the Tories have decided that prisons (and police forces) are quite expensive things to be running rather than a significant liberal shift.

I mean, it's welcome after however many years of authoritarianism under both Tories and New Labour, but it's also a very dangerous game for them to be playing having spent several years whipping up Broken Britain hysteria. This way, backlashes lie.

Think it's more that the Tories have decided that prisons (and police forces) are quite expensive things to be running rather than a significant liberal shift.

Yeah- less 'we are dimantling the victorian era machinery of authority', more 'ooh lower public spending, let's have some of that'

A Price Worth Paying. Let's see how the Coalition are as fond of leakers and moles now they're in government.

Should be on the front page of every newspaper in the country but I bet it won't be.

I like how the always impartial Laura Kuenssberg reported it on the BBC News this morning, "We always knew they're would be job losses in the public sector"... uh, this document says there will be more losses in the private sector than the public sector

1.3m lost jobs --- THAT'S how to get the economy moving again! well done everybody

Well, as far as they're concerned, it worked for Thatcher in the 80s

That article doesn't talk about the causes of job losses in the private sector. Is it purely because of more people with less spending money => job losses in the private sector?

They = Vince Cable, Simon Hughes, Shirley Williams etc 9xp)

Is it purely because of more people with less spending money => job losses in the private sector?

Hella lot of private sector jobs directly dependent on the public sector

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2778/4469610650_ba92acfcd9.jpg

xps - if we finally get some decent debate about the merits or otherwise of prison (and sentencing) then I don't care if it's really about costcutting but I'm not hopeful.