abortion classic or dud?

there's got to be a morning after

For what it's worth, from a male perspective, I think that lack of education is an issue across the board. That NPR article referencing that you really need to have a plan to not get pregnant is very true, but neglects to mention that you really need both people in on the same plan or there's another level of risk. Having one partner educated sometimes doesn't work when they're dragged down by another person who's an idiot about contraception.

God I keep forgetting how much money is an issue here in the US. At home, birth control pills are free, I don't have to go to the doctor or pharmacy every month to get them, I can get like a year's supply at a time. Morning after pill is nothing like $40. You can go to a clinic and get free condoms. It's like they actually want to help me not get pregnant if I don't want to.

Here in the US I actually received a card from my healthcare insurance co about the joys of the pregnancy service they provide, pics of smiley babies. I mean wtf.

Well, some people actually want babies.

I wouldn't actually call it classic.
but it's better than having a 10 year old to look after, which is what I'd be doing right now.

I hear "I use condoms"
Erica, my years in the biz have taught me that the most important follow-up question to this statement is "what percentage of the time do you use condoms?" It's never 100% and you can make a much more realistic bc plan with this knowledge.

Insurance companies in the US started doing more promotion of their pregnancy-related services due to the fact getting women to actually go to prenatal care makes it less likely that an unforeseen (and expensive) situation will pop up later. Also, it's part of the whole "don't fuck up your body, women of child-rearing age, because if you do and then get pregnant, we might have to pay out to help your messed-up kid."

OK, maybe it is not as bad as all that, but it sounds like something they'd think.

no it's pretty much as bad as all that

oh yeah, we used condoms, but god know's how it happened.

xps ha, no I know, they send me random stuff from time to time, but it was just the timing of it - as I was moaning about how annoying it was to go get the pill every month and also PAY for it, like are they trying to make me get pregnant? Also my mum dropping hints about how she was my age when she had me. Then smiley baby picture arrives saying HAVING A BABY? ARE YOU ALREADY PREGNANT??

I have no idea if it's a US-centric thing due to our culture of denial about sex (i.e. "I'm not having sex, so I don't need to have condoms") or what, but it seems like there's the unstated idea that if you trust someone enough to have sex with them, you should trust them enough to be reliable about contraception. As cliche as it is, in that Knocked Up movie where there's this miscommunication about whether or not a condom is needed and the reaction is basically, "oh, I thought you said it was cool." This shit happens.

I posted this article over on the contraception thread earlier today. Unless we're talking about condoms, the burden of using--or even thinking about--birth control lies entirely on the ladies.

I'm trying to find a copy of that book I read on the Pro-choice movement(american author, came out in late '05/early '06, had a pink cover), and I remember her mentioning that one of her sources posted the entire book online for free:

http://publishing.cdlib.org/ucpressebooks/view?docId=ft967nb5z5

I think this is the entirety of Leslie Reagan's _When Abortion Was a Crime: Women, Medicine, and Law in the United States, 1867-1973_

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/71011ZN1R6L.gif

ding ding ding, found it.

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/413C3Tt2fhL.jpg

is this rec/d reading then?

I really enjoyed the 2nd book, first one i haven't read.

I remember reading a while ago that one of the reasons teenage girls give for not using contreception is that the planning of sex makes them feel slutty, whereas if they can convince themselves that the sex "just happened" (swept away in the moment, one thing led to another, etc) they don't get that stigma. Don't know if this still holds any water.

That might get you a manslaughter charge instead of a murder charge if that was your defense for killing someone, but mysteriously, you still have the exact same effect when you impregnate someone whether you planned to or not.

that cristina page book is dope btw. case studies and details on the ways in which abortion's been de-legalised outside of roe, like foetal rights laws, conscience laws etc.

"The morning after pill is not free and therefore not accessible to poor women who have trouble coming up with $40."

wtf, it's like 15 euros here.

fifteen socialist euros

"The morning after pill is not free and therefore not accessible to poor women who have trouble coming up with $40."

wtf, it's like 15 euros here.

― Nathalie (stevienixed), Saturday, April 10, 2010 12:38 PM

Well, not everyone has 15 euros, either. BUT, in the states it ranges between $20 and $40. Ya'll also had the pill way before we did as well.

$55 in california

The place I work at has a health clinic two times which gives EC out for free.

Mass does have a law that requires those 18 and under to either get a prescription for EC or buy it from specially trained pharmacists which not every drug store employs.

Which is just to say that not only can it be $$, it can also be difficult for younger women to get a hold of.

so, uh

The primary goal of the "Pain-Capable Unborn Child Protection Act" is to stop late-term abortions, supporters say. The state law makes it a felony for a doctor to abort a fetus at more than 20 weeks.

Nebraska is the first state to ban abortions based on the controversial notion that a fetus can feel pain at 20 weeks.

ahh yes let's go ahead and pass legislation based on questionable grey area opinions. fuck Nebraska, I'd like to sodomize em all with rancid cornhusk

new zealand abortion law is based on fetus viability, i.e. you can't legally terminate a pregnancy later than 20 weeks bc a fetus is considered to be viable outside the womb at that stage.

bahhhhhhhhhhhhh.

On the upside, yay Baltimore and Austin.

lol @ "Like even if the condom split or something wouldn't most people take the morning after pill?"

in a word, no

EC cost me $50 here in NYC, just in case anyone is keeping track. And it pretty much cleaned out my bank account at the time -- at that price, it could very easily be "medicine vs food" for a lot of people, even middle-class-ish and gainfully employed ones.

So... better to just hope that you won't have a baby/expensive abortion? Seems like a lot of blame is being given to the US healthcare system - anyone have a perspective from the UK/Europe?
Really not meaning to sound like a dick, I am genuinely unenlightened about all this. I just realised I didn't notice Kate78's link upthread - off to read it now. And thanks to her and ENBB for sharing their experiences.

I haven't worked in the system, but I'd split the blame between the price of basic healthcare and preventative medical services, and the lack of anything resembling truly useful sex ed. On top of that, add the disadvantages of poverty in both eduction and access, and the problem only compounds for at-risk girls and women.

I wonder how much one worsens the other- if it were easier/cheaper to get contraceptives would poorer girls & women know more about how to get and use them? Obv I have had a v priveleged life but it was drummed into me from an early age that SEX = BABY TIMES unless you do something about it.
Actually I think most it came from reading problem pages in magazines which always took the line that you could become pregnant just from having semen anywhere near you.

Hell, normal middle-class white girls (and boys) can't get and/or don't know how to use contraceptives, so I don't know why anyone expects ANY young people to be on board.

how much does a for eg really early term in+out abortion cost?

also just read a stat that said that by the age of 45 one in three women will have had a abortion, this seems... high?

ok now I'm never going to in-n-out burger again.

I haven't met a pro-choice woman younger than 25 in years. (However, I mostly talk to working class and/or ethnic women, so that is probabally skewing the results.)

hm

i mostly ethnic women

they never me

it what

get @ me, swarthies

mmmm i just got a craving for my favorite type of food: ethnic

also just read a stat that said that by the age of 45 one in three women will have had a abortion, this seems... high?

This seems low/about right to me.

Prices at a clinic I used to work at:

Surgical Abortion
5 – 11 weeks LMP*: $415
12 – 13 weeks LMP*: $510
Oral Pre-medication: included
IV Conscious Sedation: $40
Rhogam (required if you have Rh- blood): $55
Post-surgical abortion follow-up: $40
Second Ultrasound, if needed: $50

Medication Abortion
5 weeks – 9 weeks, 0 days LMP*: $375
Rhogam (required if you have Rh- blood): $55
Post-medication abortion follow-up: included
Second Ultrasound, if needed: $50