Come anticipate David Fincher's "Zodiac"

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i made that same comparison – eazy – between fincher and mann. i think there's a point to be explored by somebody more articulate than myself about their equivalent grasp and appreciation of a, shall we say, poetically elegant urban environment?

-- remy bean, Monday, March 5, 2007 12:46 AM (4 weeks ago)

^^^ yes

i wanna see this again before it gets rushed out of theaters

― and what, Monday, 2 April 2007 13:53 (seventeen years ago) link

Penance?

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Monday, 2 April 2007 13:57 (seventeen years ago) link

yeah i wouldn't mind "rescreening" this myself!

― s1ocki, Monday, 2 April 2007 14:45 (seventeen years ago) link

Saw it for the first time this weekend. Only complaint: not enough Robert Downey Jr. More thoughts as they come to me.

What a fucked up mess this investigation was.

― kenan, Monday, 2 April 2007 14:50 (seventeen years ago) link

really really liked this, especially for the first half i was giddy. it loses steam towards the end (on purpose obviously) so it'll take a future viewing for me to decide how good it really is. totally good/interesting tho.

― ryan, Thursday, 5 April 2007 07:18 (seventeen years ago) link

two weeks pass...

Mostly neatly done (except for the overlength of course). Also about nothing much except the plot, which is why true crime is a who-cares genre for me.

The glam presentation of the first murder: big mistake.

so why fid Avery write Z could've been a "latent homosexual"? This is pretty amusing when Downey is playing him.

― Dr Morbius, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 13:34 (seventeen years ago) link

^why did Avery

― Dr Morbius, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 13:35 (seventeen years ago) link

Zodiac was teh suck. Not until the very end did I say to myself, "Oh, this movie is supposed to be about Gyllenhaal's character." Which, yawn. "Capote" did the "about the story, but really about the story of the story" thing pretty much better.

― crazymonkeyfromjapan, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 15:27 (seventeen years ago) link

Given the opening post, it's funny that the Edwards-Ruffalo scenes are the least strained in the film. Good thing I don't watch contemporary cop shows, or those might've seemed thin too.

Jake as Graysmith was straight-arrow/obsessed-man two-dimensionality.

― Dr Morbius, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 15:34 (seventeen years ago) link

i assume youre referring to the swelling of hurdy gurdy man? i can buy that from an ethical standpoint i guess but not a cinematic one, i thought all the murders were staged really well. god i sound like an amoral cunt.

totally otm about the plot-centricity leading to dullsville though.

― deeznuts, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 15:41 (seventeen years ago) link

the movie's not really about the plot at all, morbius! what's the plot?

― s1ocki, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 15:41 (seventeen years ago) link

lol u enable murdurars liek cho BEARTARP

― Jimmy The Mod Awaits The Return Of His Beloved, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 15:43 (seventeen years ago) link

the plot is WHODUNIT

i assume youre referring to the swelling of hurdy gurdy man?

Not solely, no. That it looked REALLY COOL!

― Dr Morbius, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 16:01 (seventeen years ago) link

the actual murders?? i totally disagree

― deeznuts, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 16:02 (seventeen years ago) link

Mark Ruffalo is lights-out

― Tracer Hand, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 16:10 (seventeen years ago) link

A Matt Zoller Seitz essay on the film -- good debate in the Comments; MZS:

I think showing the murders was probably a mistake, and that if Fincher and Vanderbilt felt they had to show them, they should have done so from a discreet, ugly distance, like we're peeping through a slaughterhouse door at a killing on the other side of the building. "Summer of Sam," a similar film in certain ways, made the same mistake as Fincher. The violence went beyond fascination and into revelry, and the filmmaker saying, "Well, that's true to life -- it's the tabloid mentality" really doesn't cut it.

The movie's so surefooted in every other way that these errors stand out more than they would in a lesser film.

― Dr Morbius, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 21:13 (seventeen years ago) link

like i said i can see that with the first (which i maintain was a great scene), but the one at the beach was absolutely horrific. its been awhile but as i recall the acutal shootings in the first one were done (after the first gunshot) from a static (& distant) angle, and were very far from 'glammed up'

tbh i thought the murders/suspense scene (in the basement) were the highlights of the flick

― deeznuts, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 21:20 (seventeen years ago) link

i liked this a lot. the plot is surely a red herring if there ever was one. i cant decide how im supposed to take the ending, however.

― ryan, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 21:26 (seventeen years ago) link

the attack at Lake Berryessa is totally disturbing and as unglamorous a staging of the event as you could make.

I think the opening murder sequence is amazing, but I can see how its more "sensationalized" elements (the Donovan song, etc.) might be off-putting.

― Shakey Mo Collier, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 21:27 (seventeen years ago) link

I am bummed this failed so badly, as its probably my favorite Fincher film to-date. I am really put off by most of his other films.

― Shakey Mo Collier, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 21:28 (seventeen years ago) link

well in some respects i think it IS supposed to be "sexy"--else why the fascination? it wasnt some hold up gone bad.

― ryan, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 21:28 (seventeen years ago) link

shakey et al the only reason that song is in there is because they actually were listening to the radio at the time it happened, i read up on that afterwards

(for those curious the guy the movie insinuates did it almost certainly did not)

― deeznuts, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 21:33 (seventeen years ago) link

& even if you dont agree it is sceenwise, its completely period appropriate

― deeznuts, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 21:34 (seventeen years ago) link

The contrast between the absolute clarity of the visuals and the absolute mystery of the narrative is Zodiac's very best joke.

totally OTM, great essay - thx Morbs

and deez don't get me wrong I really dug the integration of Hurdy Gurdy Man and thought it worked seamlessly within the scene. But I can understand how another viewer would just see/hear "rock song + murder = exploitation".

― Shakey Mo Collier, Tuesday, 24 April 2007 21:40 (seventeen years ago) link

Hurdy Gurdy Man scene has a "wow, amping up this song will make this a classic" vibe, kinda ugh. I thought the comment on MZS's blog that it shoulda stayed "on the radio" was a good point. I never thought the lakefront murder was glam.

It's a good film, but I prefer Fight Club and Se7en. They're funnier.

― Dr Morbius, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 13:47 (seventeen years ago) link

loved this movie

― and what, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 14:36 (seventeen years ago) link

but Fight Club is so goddamned silly.

― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 15:54 (seventeen years ago) link

no, really. Chuck Palahniuk's other books, those are silly. The Fincher movie only gets silly in the fairly conventional chase stuff in the last reel, but recovers nicely for the Kill Your Inner Iron John ending.

― Dr Morbius, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 15:57 (seventeen years ago) link

haha iron john

― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 15:59 (seventeen years ago) link

fight club is unwatchable

― and what, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 15:59 (seventeen years ago) link

That's nice

― Dr Morbius, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 16:00 (seventeen years ago) link

Fight Club is silly and watchable and makes a decent story out of Chuck Palahniuk's work, which is an impressive feat. Se7en had the extremely-detailed set thing going on, with the killer's apartment being the most impressive.

Fincher's thing always seemed to me that every scene had to build and have some sort of payoff, which makes it more impressive that with Zodiac there are a lot of slow burn segments that don't go anywhere but still succeed. It was also a great exercise in using actors without overplaying their strengths, something he kind of used in every other film (loved Forrest Whittaker in Panic Room, though).

― mh, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 16:22 (seventeen years ago) link

The first act of Fight Club, up until the actual Fight Club gets going, is insanely good. It falls apart after that, but I don't know that I even care.

― kenan, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 16:30 (seventeen years ago) link

Fincher's also drawn to stories with menacing projectionists.

― Dr Morbius, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 16:31 (seventeen years ago) link

the total non-acknowledgement in the film of the premise's inherent homoeroticism (men going literally and figuratively underground to get all sweaty and aggro with each other - gosh what's that about, what would Freud say, etc.) always irritated me... the premise is classic repressed-sexuality-turned-into-violence yawnzville, yet Fincher never seems to acknowledge its basic ridiculousness or have any fun with it. There's a bunch of misdirection about consumer culture and absent father figures (another classic mainstream Hollywood explanation for gayness) and schizophrenia but it all adds up to nothing.

I guess it looks nice though. And I appreciated the pomo porn splice at the end (of a giant cock - gee what's that about) but ugh... so stupid.

― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 16:38 (seventeen years ago) link

I obv disagree completely, but in brief:

classic repressed-sexuality-turned-into-violence yawnzville...Fincher never seems to acknowledge its basic ridiculousness or have any fun with it.

When he first meets "Tyler" Norton is asked "Do I give you the ass or the cock?" Pitt knots EN's tie for him, Norton pulverizes Jared Leto's face cuz "he wants to destroy something beautiful," etc.

It's a ridiculously FUN movie. esp if you think Brad Pitt looks best soaked in sweat and blood. Also, getting 'beat up' is what seems to be going on at many 12-step groups; I think it's more a satire of "self-actualization" as consumerism.

― Dr Morbius, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 16:45 (seventeen years ago) link

^than consumerism^

― Dr Morbius, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 16:45 (seventeen years ago) link

i don't care for fight club too much but one thing you can't really accuse it of is "not having fun with it"!

it's pretty watchable too i find.

― s1ocki, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 16:48 (seventeen years ago) link

When he first meets "Tyler" Norton is asked "Do I give you the ass or the cock?"

haha okay I totally don't remember that

― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 16:48 (seventeen years ago) link

Also he's wrapped The Curious Case of Benjamin Button with Pitt and Cate Blanchett, from the Fitzgerald story about a man who's born old and ages backwards. I can't imagine that'll make money either.

― Dr Morbius, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 17:02 (seventeen years ago) link

I don't either. I may need to drench myself in Pitt-sweat again.

(xpost)

― Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Wednesday, 25 April 2007 17:05 (seventeen years ago) link

four weeks pass...

it's amazing.
-- s1ocki, Thursday, 1 March 2007 04:04 (2 months ago) Link

qft

― That one guy that quit, Wednesday, 23 May 2007 08:44 (seventeen years ago) link

I have a question - when the cops are searching the main suspect's trailer, one of them (Anthony Edwards?) looks at something on floor by the bed. What was it? It looked like a dirty vibrator.

― nate woolls, Wednesday, 23 May 2007 10:00 (seventeen years ago) link

I think it was a container of model cement or glue, that the killer had said he used to disguise his fingerprints.

― ledge, Wednesday, 23 May 2007 10:03 (seventeen years ago) link

two weeks pass...

Loved this film. Loved it. I cannot remember when I have walked out of a cinema so enthused.

― Tim F, Tuesday, 12 June 2007 14:16 (seventeen years ago) link

me too. not many non-americans seem to have made the trip.

― That one guy that quit, Tuesday, 12 June 2007 14:31 (seventeen years ago) link

DVD release in late July

― Shakey Mo Collier, Tuesday, 12 June 2007 15:42 (seventeen years ago) link

this sits really well in my memory. cant wait to watch it again.

― ryan, Tuesday, 12 June 2007 15:45 (seventeen years ago) link

When I was in San Francisco I kept spotting things from the film. Fincher, for his faults, is excellent at creating a believable environment in his films.

― mh, Tuesday, 12 June 2007 15:57 (seventeen years ago) link

still movie of the year.

― s1ocki, Tuesday, 12 June 2007 16:35 (seventeen years ago) link

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