Idiocracy - new Mike Judge movie in superlimited release

I've been to east L.A. And more to the point, I've been to Tijuana.

What I "trotted out" was a soft-pedalled version of the fact that the Hispanic folks I watched it with thought it was actively, distastefully racist. And they're not the type to get too uptight about stuff like that. I, on the other hand, am willing to cut Mike Judge a bit more slack because I like his other work and respect his intentions.

The characters don't all have Hispanic names. But a whole bunch of them do. If you missed the fact that the movie is presenting us with a LOT of Hispanics and Hispanic names in its dumb-as-dirt America-of-the-future, then I dunno how to help you. Watch it again; I think you may be surprised.

What I'm arguing is that the film can be seen as implying a number of things about relationship between race, class, poverty, ignorance, and stupidity. And that some of them might be a little troubling.

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And Elmo:

Touché.

Would I be less offended if the movie were populated exclusively by white people? Well, I wasn't "offended" in the first place. I was left with a few questions and a bad taste in my mouth. But that's beside the point: I honestly don't know how to answer your question. I'd have to see the unmade movie you're talking about to know how I'd feel about it.

For what it's worth, Carlos Mencia isn't any better or any worse than this.

you are fucking insane.

obviously, if you're looking for nuanced analysis of race and class dynamics, you probably shouldn't be looking to mike judge. but if that's your game, you should be prepared to rage at his stereotypical depictions of poor white folks.

I don't think Mencia is dangerous at all. I've never been personally offended by anything he's said. The spirit in which he presents his shitty "comedy" renders it harmless.

And I'll leave it to someone else to rage at MJ's "stereotypical depictions of white folks." That stuff doesn't bug me in the least. See, I'm white. Lived poor for a lot of my childhood. And I imagine that Mike Judge is a product of the poor & middle-class white culture he mocks. Therefore, I think he's got a right to cap on me and mine.

New Sincerity: Perhaps the more obvious point is that the border towns you reference (East L.A. has nothing to do with this, it's preposterous that you mention it at all - there's lovely parts to East L.A. and shitty parts as well, neither of which look anything at all like anything depicted in "Idiocracy") are largely as polluted and fucked up as they are thanks to the big industry and eco-apathy that Judge is obviously targeting with this movie. There is no secret agenda here.

You describe the movie as a film full of outlandishly stereotypical depictions of moronic Hispanics, which is goes beyond hyperbole into the realm of outright lies. You are in some strange whirlwind of uncomfortable projection, and are pulling shit out of thin air to support weak accusations.

I mean, fine, if your hispanic friends thought the movie was offensive, whatever, that sucks. But you citing the secondhand views of a small group of individuals as your racial trump card puts you in the same kind of uncomfortable territory that you are railing against.

Absolutely. I recognize and have no issue with those aspects of the film's critique. I'm bothered by the race/class baggage that got thoughtlessly mixed somewhere along the way. And I regret ever mentioning East LA.

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"You describe the movie as 'a film full of outlandishly stereotypical depictions of moronic Hispanics,' which is goes beyond hyperbole into the realm of outright lies."

I did describe it as such, and while I won't pretend my statement is totally free of hyperbole, I stand by it. Watch it again with the idea of Hispanic identity in mind -- I think you might be surprised by what you see. And if not, then not. Different people see things differently (big surprise).

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"You are in some strange whirlwind of uncomfortable projection, and are pulling shit out of thin air to support weak accusations."

Ummm, I think you're getting a bit carried away yourself, Tiki. Stick to talking about the movie.

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"I mean, fine, if your hispanic friends thought the movie was offensive, whatever, that sucks. But you citing the secondhand views of a small group of individuals as your racial trump card puts you in the same kind of uncomfortable territory that you are railing against."

It's not my "racial trump card." I initially pointed it out (in part) to admit that my interpretation might be distorted by the social context in which I saw the film. When questioned about it, I explained things more fully.

And I hardly think I'm "railing" against anything. I'm just talking about what I saw in this film. It didn't offend me, and I don't think it betrays any malice or hostility on MJ's part, but some of it did seem, well ... odd.

"Don't wanna sound like a dick or nothin' but your chart says you're fucked up, you talk like a fag and your shits all retarded."

Funnily enough, I like to think I did, and that I do watch most things with at least a subconcious consideration of this kind of thing - the Mrs. of 4 years is Mexican-American (she prefers Latina to Hispanic, but that's another thread). In all fairness, when I asked what she remembered about 'Idiocracy,' she recalled falling asleep 15 minutes into the movie, so...

I will rent this film again (it's not out here in the UK until April 23 I see... we caught it back in L.A. before we moved over here). I had planned on it already, but now I am eager to see it with all this in mind.

I think the reason your charges have struck such a nerve is that I have always considered Mike Judge to be one of the few people in comedy to deal with race and class in a totally honest and thoughtful way - at the very least, he's not clearly TERRIFIED of those issues, unlike so many other comedic performers and writers (including many, often with a social bent, who I do admire). And I thought 'Idiocracy,' on my first viewing, was very much in keeping with his track record.

A watchable mess that finally turns into a film the idiocrats could've liked. Pretty splendid first half-hour tho.

I keep thinking about the eugenics/dysgenics philosophy underlying all this, which I've always found cruel, cynical and inaccurate IRL. But that theme was the funny factor for the movie. I just can't help feeling conflicted that it's an argument for such.

A watchable mess that finally turns into a film the idiocrats could've liked. Pretty splendid first half-hour tho.

Agreed. Mike Judge makes first half-hours with the best of them.

Luke Wilson was pretty boring in this... I'm sure they wanted him to play up the unremarkable/ vanilla guy, but what's-his-nuts in Office Space did it so much better.

but yeah, very much agreed on the first half-hour.

The more I think about this movie the less I like it. No mention of a corporate culture that profits from keeping America stupid, no. the problem is that america is increasingly over-run by fuck-crazy trash. I kinda hope Mike Judge is already embarassed by it.

No mention of a corporate culture that profits from keeping America stupid, no.

this was the main thing that bugged me too - the film focused exclusively on the demand side of the equation, and never gave any screentime to the supply side (ie, there has to be someone not-so-stupid around to make the TV shows, keep machines working, profit from everyone else's idiocy, etc.)

I'm worried that for him to go from King Of The Hill to this means some major loss of empathy for the classes he made his mint off of.

I think perhaps the idea is that all the engineers and manufacturers who keep America running are in other countries, while the US has become a subsistence agrarian state exporting little more than violent TV

and feet porn

if they had mentioned that they all moved to Canada, that would have been awesome!

I liked Maya Rudolph on what she 'paints': "People and fruit and shit."

Just watched this. The point about the weird class stuff is well taken. But: I actually think that with all the "particular individual" stuff Judge was trying to portray the stupidity of the future as a hideous hybrid of working-class stupidity (the cussing Carls Jr stuff) with middle-class bureaucratic Office Space style stupidity ("particular individuals") with upper-class corporate stupidity (Brawndo on the crops.) The problem is, the "you talk like a fag and your shit's retarded" stuff is by far the funniest, so that dominates your impression of what the movie's about, and it ends up reading as "fear the dopey masses, they breed."

Some of this film is going to come true well ahead of schedule.