I know this is just Not How Language Works, but I am fine with "fewer" and a percentage based on the root:
- fewer than 50% of Americans have testicles - fewer than 50 (of 100) Americans have testicles
― nabisco, Friday, 2 November 2007 16:26 (sixteen years ago) link
Umm I guess note also that you'd say "50% of individuals have," hence "fewer" -- versus like "50% of the oil is," hence the corresponding "less"
― nabisco, Friday, 2 November 2007 16:30 (sixteen years ago) link
See, I would recommend "less than half" per a half being a discrete thing by itself, but then check out the issue that raises with "support" -- "less than half of all Americans supports the war"? -- so possibly the best workaround is something like
Less than half of the American public supports the war.
― nabisco, Friday, 2 November 2007 16:35 (sixteen years ago) link
If you are doing this in the United States:
501.433.1037
Please stop. The correct form is (501) 433-1037, and I don't have the time nor patience to copyedit such trivial stuff.
― Pleasant Plains, Friday, 2 November 2007 16:35 (sixteen years ago) link
Hmmm, Google seems in two minds:
Results 1 - 10 of about 5,490 for "less than 50 percent of americans". Results 1 - 10 of about 4,540 for "fewer than 50 percent of americans".
― Zelda Zonk, Friday, 2 November 2007 16:36 (sixteen years ago) link
On the other hand, definite victory for "less" with "half":
Results 1 - 10 of about 905 for "fewer than half of americans". Results 1 - 10 of about 21,800 for "less than half of americans".
― Zelda Zonk, Friday, 2 November 2007 16:37 (sixteen years ago) link
Half is a singular thing, you can either have more than it or less than it. "Fewer than half" would require multiple wholes.
― nabisco, Friday, 2 November 2007 16:39 (sixteen years ago) link
And percentage is a fractional thing...
― Zelda Zonk, Friday, 2 November 2007 16:41 (sixteen years ago) link
the figure itself is "less than 50%", so when you're referring to the percentage itself then that's ok- ie the number of people that believe x is less than 50%
that figure then refers to a subset of a group, so when you talk about what that 50% of people believe then you're then talking about a number of individuals- is when it becomes normal (outside US, evidently) to use 'fewer than'.
i think?
― darraghmac, Friday, 2 November 2007 16:43 (sixteen years ago) link
This makes sense to me
― Madchen, Friday, 2 November 2007 16:44 (sixteen years ago) link
Yep, makes sense to me too.
― Zelda Zonk, Friday, 2 November 2007 16:54 (sixteen years ago) link
Is there anything wrong with this sentence?
Weren't they the highest-selling games last week?
It feels like there is, but I think I'm just being paranoid. It is a bit awkward, but...
― Will M., Friday, 2 November 2007 16:55 (sixteen years ago) link
Think I'd leave out the -
― Madchen, Friday, 2 November 2007 16:56 (sixteen years ago) link
Keep the hyphen. It sounds funny cos 'biggest-' or 'best-selling- are more common. 'Highest-grossing' too.
― Eyeball Kicks, Friday, 2 November 2007 17:02 (sixteen years ago) link
A game can sell the best, but can it really sell the highest?
― Tracer Hand, Friday, 2 November 2007 17:21 (sixteen years ago) link
It could at an auction.
― Eyeball Kicks, Friday, 2 November 2007 17:25 (sixteen years ago) link
This question is just for personal edification, not work-involved: apostrophe-s should never mark plurals, even of acronyms or abbreviations, right? E.g. multiple Nintendo Entertainment Systems should be NESes, not NES's, and snotty kids who don't dance to dance music are IDMers, not IDM'ers?
― Leee, Tuesday, 6 November 2007 18:11 (sixteen years ago) link
only exception for apostrophe plurals is single letters. Example: Oakland A's.
― Will M., Tuesday, 6 November 2007 18:13 (sixteen years ago) link
I had three C's on my report card and my dad flipped.
that is my feeling on it, yeses xpost hrm i see the point in that
― rrrobyn, Tuesday, 6 November 2007 18:14 (sixteen years ago) link
I don't think, grammatically, there's ever an excuse to say IDMers OR IDM'ers. I'd say IDM fans. Or IDM nerds. Or something.
― Will M., Tuesday, 6 November 2007 18:16 (sixteen years ago) link
guys i am actually an official copyeditor again one of many not-so-harsh realities dawning on me today
― rrrobyn, Tuesday, 6 November 2007 18:16 (sixteen years ago) link
People who make it are clearly IDMians, though
― nabisco, Tuesday, 6 November 2007 18:18 (sixteen years ago) link
You're telling me that it's "c'ing on her t's," not "cing on her ts"? That feels wrong and dirty.
― Leee, Tuesday, 6 November 2007 18:19 (sixteen years ago) link
ESPECIALLY in that case, Leee, as you are, you know, abbreviating those two words (in that case, c'ing on her t's is short for chomping on her tomatos, so apostrophes are needed)
― Will M., Tuesday, 6 November 2007 18:24 (sixteen years ago) link
the latter sounds more like "sing on her *cymbal sound*"
― Will M., Tuesday, 6 November 2007 18:25 (sixteen years ago) link
E.g. multiple Nintendo Entertainment Systems should be NESes, not NES's
I don't remember if I mentioned this here or not, but I just edited an article on social-networking services a couple weeks ago, and it was agreed that it should be abbreviated "SNSs" -- which I'm not sure how I feel about. SNSs and SNSes are both preferable to SNS's, though. We had some conversation about this upthread, and I think it was generally agreed upon that the apostrophe should only be used in case of confusion -- like when "do's" and "A's" look like different words without the apostrophe.
― jaymc, Tuesday, 6 November 2007 18:27 (sixteen years ago) link
-- rrrobyn, Tuesday, November 6, 2007 12:16 PM (Tuesday, November 6, 2007 12:16 PM) Bookmark Link
Welcome back to the club.
― Pleasant Plains, Tuesday, 6 November 2007 18:55 (sixteen years ago) link
You wouldn't believe how much dead Latin I'm forced to remove.
― Pleasant Plains, Tuesday, 6 November 2007 18:56 (sixteen years ago) link
I just changed "daylight savings time" to "Daylight Saving Time" in a piece of copy.
― jaymc, Tuesday, 6 November 2007 23:45 (sixteen years ago) link
(I found precedent for it in the archives, which isn't too surprising, since we use British spellings for words like "colour" and "centre," too.)
― jaymc, Tuesday, 6 November 2007 23:47 (sixteen years ago) link
SMALLBRAIN WRITER ALERT!
"The series, which ended last month, took on a similar format to last year's Popstar Idol."
took on a format?
was IN a similar format?
was OF a similar format?
It all seems so wrong.
― Zoe Espera, Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:29 (sixteen years ago) link
"...was made/produced/planned/etc in a similar format..." I think you need a verb in there.
― Laurel, Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:32 (sixteen years ago) link
What about "took on a format similar to"?
― jaymc, Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:32 (sixteen years ago) link
jaymc, where are you from again? that it's surprising that you use british precedent?
― Will M., Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:33 (sixteen years ago) link
Or just strike the "on" and say "...took a form similar to that of last year's Popster Idol."
― Laurel, Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:33 (sixteen years ago) link
why not just "took on a similar format similar to last year's Popstar Idol"
― Will M., Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:34 (sixteen years ago) link
oops xpost, i am stupid.
I'm from Chicago. What is British precedent? The reason I changed it like that is that "to" was bothering me -- I was wondering whether it should be "as" -- and then I realized that it would sound OK if it was closer to "similar."
― jaymc, Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:34 (sixteen years ago) link
And actually, Laurel is right: it should be "similar to that of."
― jaymc, Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:35 (sixteen years ago) link
I was just wondering where you were that it was worth mentioning "we use British spellings for words like "colour" and "centre," too." I sort of assumed you were in the UK, so I didn't see why you'd mention that (i assume everyone's British, weirdly).
― Will M., Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:36 (sixteen years ago) link
-- jaymc, Tuesday, November 6, 2007 11:47 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Link
dude he was talking about this xpost
― n/a, Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:37 (sixteen years ago) link
Thanks all! I went for "took on a format similar to that of "
but the addition of a verb would have been good too, I think.
― Zoe Espera, Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:41 (sixteen years ago) link
Oh. Duh. I work for a certain encyclopedia founded in Scotland in 1768. I think we use British spellings for traditional reasons -- although there are some products, like the children's edition, in which they're not used.
― jaymc, Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:42 (sixteen years ago) link
you mean WEE BAIRNS' EDITION
― nabisco, Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:43 (sixteen years ago) link
It's actually changed names so many times, I wouldn't be surprised if that's the next one.
― jaymc, Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:44 (sixteen years ago) link
i'm not sure if it's ironic that i didn't know what encyclopedia you were referring to, so i looked it up on wikipedia.
― Will M., Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:46 (sixteen years ago) link
Haha.
― jaymc, Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:50 (sixteen years ago) link
Simple:
The series, which ended last month, had a similar format to last year's Popstar Idol.
Unless you mean it "took on" a similar format midway through the series.
― Eyeball Kicks, Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:50 (sixteen years ago) link
Urgh I disagree! "a similar format to" strikes me as a grammar wreck. "a format similar to that of" does not.
― nabisco, Wednesday, 7 November 2007 17:52 (sixteen years ago) link