iPhone apps S/D

I think it operates on the principle that if you're moving a lot you're in a more shallow sleep than if you're staying still

I presume yr tossing (fnarr) and turning frequency must be pretty well correlated to sleep state. Sure there's a bit of guesswork thrown in as well but I think it does a decent enough job, If I wake up in the middle of the night sure enough there's an 'awake' peak on the graph the next day. (xp)

yeah, the awake peaks def correspond to trips to the bathroom or w/e.

honestly even if the graph is junky science, the main feature works: by tripping the alarm when you're stirring around before the cut-off time, and doing so gently, i'm way more inclined to get out of bed instead of jamming the snooze bar (and i am a notorious 5x snoozer). like normally if i'm awake ahead of the alarm i'll look over at the clock, see that there's ten minutes to go, and will say 'sweet maybe i can squeeze out another ten minutes of sleep.' sometimes this actually works, and i'm pretty deeply asleep when the alarm (a screecher) goes off, and it's horrible, and i hit snooze. repeat for like 40 minutes.

i'm now beginning to trust this thing and just accept that it is right, and that I AM awake, and that the extra however minutes i would've gotten would have only made my morning worse

but, er, how the FUCK can it make any claim to say what kind of sleep state you're in based on, umm, the accelerometer?

There's fairly robust science behind this: your brain state correlates pretty nicely with how much you move in bed. I've been on a couple of sleep studies where you have to wear a wrist-watch-type device to monitor how much you move, so they can plot your sleep states.

like normally if i'm awake ahead of the alarm
woah, the idea.

i know right

still that's kinda the fundamental premise tho isn't it, that if you've allotted yourself enough time to sleep (like not two hours) then chances are that you'll be awake ~enough~ to be stirred. it just so happens that some days i'm awake enough to squint blearily at the alarm clock and mutter a swear word

There's fairly robust science behind this: your brain state correlates pretty nicely with how much you move in bed

With the greatest respect: "robust"? Away and shite. You want to know what's happening in THE BRANE when you're sleeping, you need to be taking a measure of, er, brain activity! Anything else is lacking in validity, to put it mildly. I'm not saying there's no link at all, obviously, but it seems a little, umm, less than entirely scientific.

THAT SAID: I'm aware this is an app costing 59p, so I'm probably being a little bit of a twat about it :)

Stet: surely the wristwatch-type device you wore would be measuring more than just movement: eg pulse rate or something? Also, out of interest: did they ever take any EEG readings?

i'm now beginning to trust this thing and just accept that it is right, and that I AM awake, and that the extra however minutes i would've gotten would have only made my morning worse

See, I think what this maybe works on is a kind of self-fulfilling-prophecy idea: "Ooh, if this thing says I'm awake, I'm awake! Best get up, then." Which is fine if you're willing to buy into the idea, but not if (like Stet) you're just going to say, fuck it, iPhone, it's early and dark and cold and I'm going back to sleep.

I wake up every morning round about 6ish and think: I really should get up now. I feel wide awake. But because it's 6am and I very rarely have to get up that early, I do exactly what Stet describes, go back to sleep ... and then have to haul myself up a couple of hours later, invariably running late.

Ultimately, I guess what I'm saying is: I don't need an app to tell me I should just get out of my fucking scratcher, *and* I bet that if I did have an app it'd make no sodding difference whatsoever :)

and that the extra however minutes i would've gotten would have only made my morning worse

This is a phrase I'm going to try to repeat to myself at 6am :)

luckily grimly no one is forcing you to use this app!

You want to know what's happening in THE BRANE

what does the fucking brane have to do with it

actually, grimly, i think the science is sound! told my friend about it and he's mega med school nerd (he has kept SLEEP LOGS for the last year or so...he called me on sunday to ask if i knew i any excel secrets, as he was compiling it all in a spreadsheet) and was like oh yeah i've been meaning to buy a wrist accelerometer

anyway: http://bit.ly/51AhDR

Er: the app has a little graph claiming to tell you when you're dreaming? So: fucking quite a fucking lot?

luckily grimly no one is forcing you to use this app!

HAHA. Yes, I know. There's a surprising amount of negative feedback about it on the app store, which kind of surprised me given how positive people were being about it here.

did u kno grimly that sometimes we use data to infer meaning about phenomena we can't observe directly

:)

i mean, w/e, this thing is actually just a more pleasant alarm clock than my horrible yelling thing and it has been much easier to drag myself out of bed on time these last few days than it was last week. even if the results are totally imaginary, it appears to be working, so i'm fine with the 0.99 i spent on it

(That was an xpost to Cutty, natch: sorry, thought I'd C&Pd that.)

actually, grimly, i think the science is sound! ... http://bit.ly/51AhDR ...

Well fuck me: OK, that's very interesting.

That said, there's got to be a world of difference between a wrist activity monitor and your phone under your pillow, no? :) (For a start: if you share a bed, surely it's going to pick up your partner's movements too?)

I dunno. I'm taking it far too seriously, I guess. If I didn't have so many doubts, I'd categorically give it a try ... but I do. And the most important one remains: I really, really don't like the idea of keeping my phone in the bloody bed all night!

Er: the app has a little graph claiming to tell you when you're dreaming? So: fucking quite a fucking lot?

you're an idiot

And you're a cock. Hurrah!

actually you're a bloody idiot

i'm now using this app in conjunction with my wake-up light alarm - I'd better feel great in the AM from now on

xpost

*Sigh*. You're a bloody cock, then :)

btw I was pleased when I saw I could wake up to Satie but when I tried it, immediately on waking I thought "this is wrong". Back to the lolbient.

i think morning mist was the best

haha ledge i thought the exact same thing re: satie

anyway this seems right: (For a start: if you share a bed, surely it's going to pick up your partner's movements too?)

i live alone so it isn't an issue u_u

forest glade man, myself

another vote for morning mist

btw - what is the deal with the calibration during the two first nights?

the FAQ even addresses that it usually doesn't pick up motion from the other side of the bed. your own body blocks it. you can run the test mode if you are so worried about false tosses n turns.

false tosses

*Chortle* ... I need to stop reading Viz.

Fucking hell, though. I'm going to download this now, I can tell. And then I'm going to quite like it, and Stet will give me endless fucking grief for changing my mind about it.

The picture on the app store shows it tucked under the sheet next to the pillow: is that what everyone is doing here? Are some people putting it under the pillow, or what?

Downloaded. I hate ILX sometimes :)

i just put it on the bed. and loop the cable over the headboard in a way that should stop it falling off, not that it ever seems in danger of doing so.

I have been dreaming a looot lately and have been tired for it. sure enough my graphs show lots of actvity and very little deep sleep. I don't know what's wrong with my brayne ;-;

it also suggests you use airplane mode if you're feart of having the phone in your bed. (lol daily mail)

I know. I'm more feart of knacking the phone, but I see they actually say "don't put it under your pillow, you tool", so hey, I won't. That said, I will be putting it on airplane mode, because I don't want to be woken up by drunken texts, eg from you.

I rarely charge my phone overnight: it can't be much of a battery-draining app, can it?

first thing I do in the morning is check zing, so no airplane mode for me

every morning is like Christmas morning when you see which bookmarked threads have been updates

i slip it under the sheet and put it on silent

i use my phone as my alarm so i have it next to me and cant put it on silent, but i have to turn off the specific email sounds because i get a ton of work emails during the night

it's running the accelerometer and screen solidly for 8 hours; it'll kill the battery dead-o

and put it on silent

Call me an idiot if you want (there's a precedent, after all) but: er, why doesn't that mute the sound from this app too? I put mine on silent, nothing makes a noise.

it's running the accelerometer and screen solidly for 8 hours; it'll kill the battery dead-o

Shit.

first thing I do in the morning is check zing

sad

it doesn't run the screen unless you move it; even then it's at lowest brightness

second thing i do is to try to find all the threads where my favorite ilxor poster cutty has posted to

ah that's some fridge door antics, that. xp

either way, GF: it says to plug it in

http://i45.tinypic.com/ndaib5.jpg

wears the titts at?

Oh, can confirm that the sleepytime thing works for double occupant beds too. Me and the missus both running our own copies, and both getting very different graphs. Trouble is, hers keeps going off before mine and waking me up when I'm still in deep sleep, gah.

i guess you'll need to break up :(

my condolences =(

jeez jim sorry to hear about your divorce

i'm surprised how different my daily graphs are so far