Going To Law School

westlaw is better for primary law, fwiw. both are run by huge ass companies but yeah thomson west has its act together much more than lexis

every time i use either one i'm like ugh these are both so 1998, you'd think at least one of them could come up with a better design. i'm not even talking about how it looks, just the whole system is awful and convoluted and inconvenient.

lexis just got a lot clunkier, too. sometimes you can ask your rep for shortcuts to get to databases. i try to always use "search for a database" on West or "find a source" on lexis to get to where i'm going--after awhile you start to ignore all the bells and whistles and bullshit

Fuck an erie doctrine

BarBri offers some kind of deal where you put down a $100 deposit on a review course now and get access to all their first year review materials. They have a bunch of online lectures and some live events in NYC as well. Does anyone have any opinions on whether this is worthwhile? I was considering doing it just for the review materials, which might be worth it even if I don't wind up taking their course.

Hey, any of you guys have a stray Westlaw account I could use? I have a big writing project and they're making us use library shit. ughrhgh

burt you sweet little sock most law students have free westlaw and lexis accounts

I know, but our school doesn't give us access until the second semester. hurghhgh

i don't even know how to use books to look things up really

God knows why they're putting us through this.

could end up lawyering in amish country

Our library and writing center is run by cranky old people; for some reason they always think their musty old way is somehow "superior" to our gadgets and gizmos, and so they think this will impart some kind-of wisdom on us. Nope.

those cranky old people are called librarians, burtie

actually--learning how to use books to research can be very helpful compared to just relying on lexis/westlaw. i'm pleasantly surprised your school does that burt. where did you say you were going again?

Carbozo. Shepardize. SHEPARDIZE

we did learn how to use the indexes and stuff, and i know how to find cases and statutes in books (duh) but they let us use westlaw right away so no one retained anything

xp i would be lost trying to shepardize from a book

learn how to shepardize from a book!

That's what we're doing.

why though?

Cardozo: Preparing Law Students for the 19th Century

if you learn how to keycite via books, it will lead you to cases that won't find via your standard Lexis or Westlaw search. i can think of at least two instances where this happened. keep in mind, i am coming at this from a librarian's perspective, and not a lawyer's. it's one more tool in your arsenal.

ask an older partner at a major law firm if it's a good idea to know how to look up cases in a book

i mean shepardize/keycite, not look up cases

http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNLJ.jsp?id=1202424606121

i will never talk to an older partner in a major law firm but i will take your word for it

this all reminds me of reading rainbow!

Keyciting isn't too hard, actually. I'd just like access to Westlaw to see if I'm really getting everything.

I hang out in the library because the people are nice and the view is good. Knowing the books is mildly key in your junior years

Man, it's getting hard to stay motivated. I think I'm starting to understand the problem of law school, which is that the awful work that takes up so much of your time and energy tends to preclude you from doing the very things that might help you stay motivated to do that work. There have been a bunch of times when there's been an interesting guest on copyright law or something like that and I skip it because my Civ Pro reading requires so much time. But then after a while I don't know why the hell I'm bothering with Civ Pro at all, because I'm not reminding myself about the things in law I actually find interesting.

I hear that. I'm thinking of dropping out, honestly ... my life in NYC feels pretty much over, and I'm not making any new friends here. I can't imagine how hellish life would be stuck working in New York City to pay off debts with no friends, no family, nada. I did it by choice for 2 years and it sucked; to be settled with this debt and thus have no choice of escape, no way.

QUITTER. BURT_STANTON, QUITTER.

I like law, but there is nothing that makes waking up in the morning feel worthwhile ... and to be trapped in one place for decades and have that be every day, doesn't sound so great. The school I'm going to doesn't exactly have the widest reach in employment prospects.

it's hard out here for a sock

I have no idea why people think that. Yeah there's a character I created ... but there is someone pulling the strings. Someone confused about the future : {

ha, aw.

law school sucks, esp. when you're trying to date a law student

(i tried and failed, she was too busy with stupid law school)

I'm not going to start another thread for the countdown this time, but...its about two weeks until I get my results on my fourth and (likely) final run at the California Bar Exam.

The last go around nearly killed my wife and I financially, and maritally. I will not be taking it again if I don't pass.

Luckily, we may have an exit strategy planned. Stay tuned.

Hangin' in there.

Any illawxors have any advice on the OneL summer job search?

not really. i'd say apply to big-name non-private programs - doj, ny law dept, etc. - but focus on class and don't spend too much time on job stuff. you'll find something worthwhile eventually.

This hasn't been as bad as my worst fears so far. I feel like I can see the end of the tunnel of this semester anyway. I haven't missed a class yet and I'm only a little behind where I wanted to be in outlining.

ny law dept. look how well i turned out.

yeah I need to figure this shit out. I'd like to work for the gubment at some point

My uncle is a pretty high up attorney for the NJ government (he's been the litigator for a few multi-state cases in the NYC metro area), and he said the two most important things are 1) grades and 2) writing samples from actual, hands-on work. He said to avoid all the chintzy little competitions and other distractions that pop up in school. Hopefully he's right

Dumb question: How do first year grades operate wrt positions with earlier deadlines? Do they take resumes early but wait on grades for final decisions? Or do they just skip grades?

I volunteered to do a practice appellate oral argument in front of my criminal law class. I'm actually extremely psyched about it. Any tips?

I have to say, I definitely regret going to Cardozo. uhghhrghhh.

I seriously can't take this anymore. Every day feels the absolute same, plus the horrible stress of this bullshit, and then you think ... I'm doing into super fucking debt, and the top students at this school are struggling to find decent work. I mean, is this all worth it? I can't sleep anymore, this is becoming like a fucking nightmare. uhhhhghhhhhh

Welcome to your first year, burt. I mean that in the nicest way possible.

The only way to develop a callus is through repetition. Read, brief, outline, test, repeat.

No regrets so far. 9pm in the library and I'm lovin it! See, they've completely broken me!! AHAHAHAHA!

Seriously, I don't regret it so far. I might regret it if I don't do well enough to keep my scholarship. But I only need to make top 40%.