Doctor Who 2008: Sontarans cometh, RTD Ood 'ave 'im etc.

I tend to agree with those speculating that the hand will allow Tennant to regenerate into Tennant, but would be IMMENSELY impressed if it turned out that the Christmas special that Tennant's been spotted filming with David Morrissey had Tennant's presence as either (1) a total blindside to the press and he's not in it at all or (2) a Two Doctors kind of thing. I said way upthread I would love to see David Morrissey as the next Doctor so am hoping for either. Though obviously conventional Who wisdom says Tennant will regenerate into Tennant and David Morrissey's just a guest star at Christmas and this theory is all a load of wishful thinking bollocks.

Why was Rose so upset at the thought that the Doctor would regenerate? She saw Eccleston (of whom she was very fond) regenerate in Tennant (who she wuvved), so surely she knows that (1) he's not actually dying as such and (2) he might come back as someone even better-looking for her to go all doe-eyed and gooey over.

LONDON

NEW YORK

CARDIFF

the way the larger cast was handled was very frustrating: every time it cut away from one of them you could figure on seeing them again in more or less exactly five and a half minutes

did like the dalek caan mess

really not liking the THE NOUN NOUN thing for random things which exist in dr who continuity - they sound like they were borrowed from badly translated 90s anime

There was an awful lot of wank in that episode. Huge fireball exploding behind a determined, giant-gun toting Rose who doesn't even flinch but just keeps walking towards the camera - please.. And the Doctor + Rose running towards each other - ugh! (Though at least Rose smiled, that was nice to see.) Most of the episode seemed to involved a) references to things that lay outside this series and/or season b) shouting c) running.

I did like the "Ultimate Red Alert" at the U.N.I.T. headquarters.

I mean, the earth getting stolen was cool and the idea that it's forming a cog in a giant celestial engine is also cool. I just hope they remember that part for next episode.

Also slightly disappointed that no reference at all was made to the incredibly thrilling and clif-hanging "BAD WOLF" stuff in the last episode. I guess the Doctor and Donna already figured that out off-screen or something.

thought the phone thing made no sense at all. and seemed like a re-run of the "everyone clap hands and wish for tinkerbell Doctor" thing from last year's finale.

thought the phone thing made no sense at all. and seemed like a re-run of the "everyone clap hands and wish for tinkerbell Doctor" thing from last year's finale.

Exactly.
My favourite thing, as usual, was the bitchy Daleks. "My vision is not impaired" or w/evs. and "MAXIMUM extermination"!
Also Davros moving 1xcentimetre out of the shadows in each cut to him, therefore taking a painful 8 million scenes to be fully revealed.

Martha's acting was particularly bad, too.

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/6407/tobecontinuednc5.gif

Great episode, Rose seems to have grown into Alterna-Universe Space Buffy whilst she's been away, RTD must be wet at the spin off prospects. OK so it was Hokum, but good Hokum. Dalek's growing ever more deranged every time they get revived which is good. Hated that all that Jack needed to get his Time travelling wristamajigger working was two numbers from Martha's backpack. I sincerely hope that they have managed to make this a proper regeneration and hidden the identity of the next Doctor.

No indication as to whether Fishface and Ianto made it out alive, surely Jack can't have taken all of the alien technology mega gun's away with him.

So many plot holes but no matter. Fun stuff.

Least believable thing: that the UN could issue any kind of announcement that quickly after a major earth changing disaster.

They can't kill off two major Torchwood characters in another show, even if it is a related show, can they?

No worries there John 'Mr On TV all the time' Barrowman can play all the characters in Torchwood, no sweat.

New trailer, you guys!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/s4/videos/?episode=S4_12&character=&action=videostream&playlist=/doctorwho/playlists/s4_12/video/s4_12_trl_05.xml

"It's like an outerspace facebook"

:D

Blimey they are building up for a big one next week.

"It's like an outerspace facebook"

i yelled at the tv: YES, WE KNOW WHAT IT IS

lol pop culture reference

damnnn didn't see that coming at all. I hope they do go through with the regen, although that would defeat the purpose of having the 2009 series structure right? cause i thought the whole point of that was to give Tennant time to do his Shakespeare thingy.

Why was Rose so upset at the thought that the Doctor would regenerate?

I thought this was weird too. maybe she was just remembering that it took half a day of regeneration and manic bouncing around before he was in any alien-fighting shape. actually, i thought Rose being there at all was weird all over... aside from wtf @ super-soldier Rose, how does she know about Donna, and all the Torchwood people, but somehow not Martha?

Dawkins!

http://richarddawkins.net/article,2793,Richard-Dawkins-on-Doctor-Who,Richard-Dawkins-Doctor-Who

And Rose was freaked out at David Tennant at first because he wasn't "her" Doctor, now she's attached and doesn't want to lose him either.

how does she know about Donna, and all the Torchwood people, but somehow not Martha?

is this maybe supposed to be because she's only seen what happened in the beetle-on-back parallel universe, where the Doctor died before meeting Martha? (but she could still recognise Donna as important because of the beetle.) Though that doesn't fit with the way that Rose's parallel-universe people must have some overview of the universe she's in now, otherwise they wouldn't be able to blink her from Donna's house to just-far-enough-away-from-the-doctor-for-him-to-get-shot. Also maybe she's going 'no no no' cos it's her fault the doc has to regenerate?

Stupid UK-only clip at the BBC. Is this the same one?

http://youtube.com/watch?v=Wmn9VhvID9w

Yep, that's it.

What was the Doc referring to when he said something about how "someone tried to move the earth before...a LONG time ago"?

Hey, if they got Dawkins to show up, what are the chances that they'll somehow get his wife involved at some point?

*xpost*

The Time Lords did it in Trial of a Time Lord, I think…

*x-post again*

The Daleks tried to do it in Invasion Earth 2150AD, having dug down to the Earth's core and replaced it with a giant motor. Of course this was the film that starred Bernard Cribbins.

2150AD "along time ago"

a) references to things that lay outside this series and/or season b) shouting c) running.
-- Tracer Hand, Sunday, 29 June 2008 11:03 (10 hours ago) Link

I have a really hard time following the plot of any Doctor Who episode that is concerned with the "main" storyline or is not a self-contained episode. I mean, seriously, I just don't understand anything that's going on and this comment really nails it.

One thing I'm sure of, from start to finish, is that the music in nu-Doctor Who has been categorically awful. Does every scene need to be so amped up? Maybe if the music was better, less obtrusive, and more atmospheric, the characters wouldn't need to shout all the time. Imagine all the same scenes but with creepy, minimal synthesizer sounds!

Things that need to happen in order for me to be satisfied:

- Tennant faces off with Davros
- Rose's big gun-toting megareturn pays off in some way far greater than 'omg Doctor at last i has fuond you'
- Donna cheats certain death and/or dies
- Donna somehow gets gramps into the TARDIS and gives him a quick tour of the universe
- A Face of Boe reference is dropped in somewhere
- Bad Wolf is fucking explained properly

I like the idea of Tennant being 10 and 11! Maybe he's tired of playing the character the same way? Maybe we get a petulant, effeminate doctor this time? I agree on the hand; too many nods that direction.

NO! What you end up with is an A Doctor and a B Doctor, like in the EDA books. It works in books when it's only spods like me reading them, but asking the average punter to accept same-Doctor-different-character is too great a reach. Not to mention that changing what's commonly regarded as the best Doctor ever for the sake of a cliffhanger would be clinically dumb.

except it might be a handy way to exchange the shift in the show's tone that will come (inevitably) with the bringing-on of a new helmsman, e.g. moffett

Change of helmsman should be transparent. Of the 10 million Britishers who watch it every week, only about 40,000 know or even care.

But surely having Tennant as 10 AND 11 would be seen as shark-jump?

Donna somehow gets gramps into the TARDIS and gives him a quick tour of the universe

must happen!

Hmm, how about they cgi in peter cushing as 11 take briars to the fountain of youth and hey presto: bbc save money on one of next year's specials.

Doctor Who cannot jump the shark. Or at least it has already jumped it so many times in its past that the concept is meaningless.

Doctor Who Red and Doctor Who Blue!

(Note DAVid Tennant + ROSe = DAVROS)

for those of us not au fait with Who history, it was a little confusing sorting out Red Dalek, Davros, pulsating brain on throne, etc

i also failed to grasp how being one second behind the timeline of the earth made the doctor able to instantly teleport to the earth's new location, or why/how the tardis wound up in "the medusa cascade" to begin with, or why that's interesting

Isn't Red Dalek new, then? The last time Davros popped up, back in the 80s, he was Emperor Dalek himself, with his top half disguised inside a big dome.

granted, when i watched this i was pretty drunk

i thought this was a bit predictably bobbins which is a shame - too many characters, they over-used the harriet jones joke and her inclusion/exit felt lacklustre (tho i suppose she would be the only one who could unite them all), supreme dalek seems pointless so far and the regeneration troublesome because we know DT sticks around so it felt like a contrived obstacle that ultimately won't mean anything (other than a means of him being able to get with Rose, BUT WHO WANTS THAT?) rather than genuinely exciting like The Master turning from Jacobi to Simm. Davro top tho yes.

actually it was a good advert for the Sarah Jane show (not so much for Torchwood). Mr Smith rocks.

I was wondering if Red Robot Supreme Dalek will end up turning on its creator for not being Dalek enough - it was already getting suspicious that Davros was paying too much attention to Dalek Caan.

Pulsating brain is Dalek Caan, who was in the Cult of Skaro (who were fighting the Cyberman at the end of series 2 and buiding the Empire State in series 3). The last time we saw him he was an ordinary dalek, he's been off searching the universe for Davros and has gone all mad and prophetic.

xpost

I was wondering if Red Robot Supreme Dalek will end up turning on its creator for not being Dalek enough - it was already getting suspicious that Davros was paying too much attention to Dalek Caan.

This was my though. There was a lot of tension between the three and noticably no Dalek said 'I Obey'. It could all break down because Davros wants to destroy reality and the supreme Dalek, being a Dalek wants to rule it.

OK so it was Hokum, but good Hokum.

yeah that about sums it up for me, and it's about the best i could expect from russell t.

supreme dalek was a bit rubb, "oh let's just stick a few girders on".

when they finally located earth, why did tardis go on fire and the doctor shout "WE'RE TRAVELLING IN TIME!!!" - um yup? that's what you do?

IN THROUGH

why did tardis go on fire and the doctor shout "WE'RE TRAVELLING IN TIME!!!"

god knows - that's where i realized i truly was lost

And then suddenly they just weren't on fire any more. WHOA FLAMES SCARY MALFUNCTION oh look it's all fine now, no need to mention it. I have no idea about the one second thing at all. Maybe these things aren't there to be thought about (the bits of the plot I could actually follow obviously weren't) but it would be nice not to be scratching my head hoping that they don't turn out to be vital plot points.

This and no reference at all to last week's Bad Wolf ending = are you guys even trying to join these seams up?

I didn't mind the episode but it felt rather thrown together, opportunities missed. As for the cliffhanger, I'd like to have Tennant stick around, but I suspect that if he does then whatever the rewind hinges on will be, y'know, a bit lame. As was his death in the first place. Well, we'll see.