Rangers Have gone into Administration

Gretna 2008 are in the East of Scotland League. If Nu-Rangers did have to start on the bottom rung, I'm not sure where they'd go, South of Scotland League? Not that the powers that be will allow that to happen as Michael Kelly shows.

Shouldn't a government be sending out a strong message that defrauding their country of several million quid by breaking the law won't be tolerated?

Defaulting Clubs
C9.1 If any Club defaults in making payment of any sum or sums due
to the Company and/or to another Club the Board shall be
entitled to apply any sums which, under these Rules, would
otherwise be payable to the defaulting Club by the Company in
discharge of any debt due by such Club in default to the
Company and/or such other Club in such manner as the Board
shall determine.

does this mean Dunfermline et al get their money via the SPL withholding money from Rangers?

fucking michael kelly. what a tadger.

also lol @ five live getting a Kelly to talk about football finance

onimo, that would be my interpretation of it, yes.

if I can jump back a wee bit to accusations of paranoia, I do try to back up my arguments, it's not just baseless ranting, and I'm certainly not unilaterally blinkered, I'm sure I've hardly denied those decisions from which we have benefited. I'm also far from alone in my view of the leanings of the tabloid press.

I believe I've also been quite complimentary toward the twitter output of Rangers' Official Media Partner, btw, to give another example to counteract your flailing whataboutery.

well once you respond to calum and craig we can all be happy :)

I already dismissed equating tax evasion with financial mismanagement, which is where that entire argument falls down. What was the other thing? That some people don't like Celtic? Wow, big news for discussion. Germane to the matter in hand too.

Happy now? Because I'm just about done with this. I was hoping for some useful discussion and insight, but we seem to just be going round in circles pointing out holes in badly-researched/plucked-from-thin-air arguments.

http://www.sportingintelligence.com/2012/02/15/exclusive-rangers-mystery-deepens-over-whyte-links-to-former-jailbird-associate-150201/

and in the Daily Record
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/business-news/2012/02/15/rangers-in-crisis-jailed-embezzler-blows-lid-on-the-deals-he-used-to-help-craig-whyte-beat-the-taxman-86908-23749209/

Kevin Sykes, who served an eight-year jail term for a £3million pension fund fraud, set up companies for Whyte to offload liabilities into.

The companies were used to take on liabilities to the taxman and other creditors before going bust, in deals he refers to as “the old switcheroo”.

Sykes, 51, said he never believed Whyte would pay HMRC a penny of the club’s debt should they lose a £49million tax case with Rangers, which could rise to £75million with penalties.

He said: “Let me tell you this, my money is on that not being paid.

“Hypothetically, there would probably be an old switcheroo and an insolvency.

“I guarantee that there are already some insolvency practitioners lined up, and a big firm of lawyers too.

“Somebody might say the intention was always to leave the revenue behind and that was the attraction.

“You could dump £49million of debt, hive the business up and have a new clean start and everybody is happy.

“You could have the assets out under value and there might be development opportunities around the site.

how did this guy get to buy Rangers? Murray obviously just didn't care who he sold to. Fuck knows what the SFA and SPL did, fit and proper? hah thats a laugh.

Fit and proper criteria "still being investigated" according to the SFA, might be a wee touch too late.

I think he got to buy Rangers because Lloyds were desperate to offload a £50m tax liability and reclaim £18m debt and neither they nor David Murray wanted the attention associated with taking Rangers to the wall.

dunno if this has been asked in the considerable amount of posts... but would celtic fans feel like, empty inside, without rangers?

nice warm glow inside imo

i actually feel a bit sorry for the genuine, non-bigoted , rangers fans. They have been well and truly shafted here. And I just can't believe it was allowed to happen. my cousins husbands who support rangers always said whyte was dodgy. Why on earth didn't the sfa/spl investigate the guy. He had a conviction for fraud ffs.

http://celtic-hub.com/main/

Polls

Do you want Rangers to die?

Yes (92%, 2,446 Votes)
No (8%, 305 Votes)

Total Voters: 2,658

yeah i mean i obv lolled as well, have no love for the gers.

i just mean, in the sense of knowing celtic will now win the league for all eternity basically unchallenged. or is that inaccurate? it must be a bit scary/depressing.

i guess rangers will come back in some form in a few years...

ronan they will be back in SPL in july or whenever the season starts this year in some form im sure of it.

im sure in a few years time, if rangers did cease to exist, some celtic fans will then think actually this isnt so good now. Obv not all though.

i guess it's what form it is though? i mean they could be severely depleted by this right? or not challenging celtic anymore?

We didn't win it all through the 80s when Rangers were mostly shite, before Murray starting punting heavily on Being A Force In Europe. The entire football landscape is completely unrecognisable to that, of course, but I still think there's potential for Hearts, Aberdeen or Dundee United to have something of a revival. Only having to beat one "big" team to win a cup would make a huge difference to how the lesser trophies are divvied up.

The other eventuality of no Rangers, of course, could be pfunk getting his wish and Celtic making a better case for moving to England.

xxp

debt free and possibly with all their top players? i honestly don't know. When Airdrie did it i think they lost everyone but that was no loss.
I just dont know what will happen. I do get the feeling he has this scenario in his plans to cheat the creditors. Whether its to just get rangers starting from scratch or to sell the club on at a big profit later i dont know. If rangers are wound up someone else might buy the club if they put in a better offer than his.

has had this scenario

I can't wait. Fuck them. I'm optimistically hoping for a brave new dawn where smaller clubs have more incentive in the league (European qualification) and the rewards that that brings.

Was anyone wringing their hands about fitness and propriety when Vlad appeared?

i just cant see anything other than being wound up and starting again tbh.

i think there was some, yeah, ailsa. But not that much.

Hearts, Aberdeen or Dundee United to have something of a revival

;_;

<realist>

debt free and possibly with all their
top players? i honestly don't know

This will not happen.

Best case for them I think is to somehow write-off or write-down most of the debt, cut costs (meaning some players and more non-playing staff losing jobs) and emerge from administration weaker but able to come back as they'd still have a huge support compared to everyone else in the league. It might even galvanise the support - I'm hearing Saturday will be a sell-out.

I'm optimistically hoping for a brave new dawn where smaller clubs have more incentive in the league (European qualification) and the rewards that that brings.

they cant do it by buying players so its going to have to take a good youth system and just try and sell players to english clubs to finance it all. Propblem is if you get good players, they get sold, youre back to scratch again. Unless you have a huge support like celtic and rangers do.

but fingers crossed that is what happens

Sorry aldo, I still think you'll avoid the drop but you're a long way from your stupid-haired flamboyance hitting the heady heights of third place again.

Xxxp
Not at all surprising, Darlington tripled their gate when they were facing winding up.

Problem is if you get good players, they get sold, youre back to scratch again

That's how all but the best clubs in Europe operate. There's always a bigger fish. The real problem is when you *don't* get good players to sell on.

do you reckon lack of a competitive old firm derby would deter players from going to celtic? again... just one of the many theories spinning through the "casual discussion at work" vortex

they cant do it by buying players so
its going to have to take a good
youth system and just try and sell
players to english clubs to finance it
all. Propblem is if you get good
players, they get sold, youre back to
scratch again.

Um, I know? We've been over this since time immemorial. Don't be excluding Celtic from this model, it's how we operate too.

there's only so many good players in scotland. The money wont be there to go to other countries to sign players like they do now (unless you're celtic)

If only All leagues had to start from scratch really. Maybe that will happen one day. Madrid and Barcelona must be in all kinds of shit if the banks ever call in the debt.

god knows how many english clubs will go under too. They must be next

do you reckon lack of a competitive old firm derby would deter players from going to celtic?

I think for many supporters those games would be a big loss, though I can't say I enjoy them.

Playing in some form of European competition every season (with shop-window/stepping-stone to England opportunities) is a much bigger carrot than playing against Rangers.

there's only so many good players in scotland

There are as many good players in Scotland as there would be with no Rangers.

I can't work out how *any* of what you're saying is mitigated by Rangers existing. This is just a general gripe about the state of Scottish football. A state it wasn't in before people started trying to spend big to compete with two teams with more spending power who were spending too much to attempt to compete in arenas beyond their abilities.

If only All leagues had to start from scratch really. Maybe that will happen one day. Madrid and Barcelona must be in all kinds of shit if the banks ever call in the debt.

― pfunkboy (Algerian Goalkeeper)

that's a few references to debt that seem to show you don't understand it at all. madrid and barcelona have a turnover that would make your eyes bleed, like any other business they operate with a debt, a debt that it is eminently easy for them to service, and always will be, since they rake in so much cash.

a debt that it is eminently easy for them to service

Didn't Real have a huge chunk, like hundreds of millions wiped out by the city council or the state? Some of Real's property bought by them for stupid prices or something?

there's only so many good players in scotland

There are as many good players in Scotland as there would be with no Rangers.

I can't work out how *any* of what you're saying is mitigated by Rangers existing. This is just a general gripe about the state of Scottish football. A state it wasn't in before people started trying to spend big to compete with two teams with more spending power who were spending too much to attempt to compete in arenas beyond their abilities.

I never said this had anything to do with Rangers, I'm just saying that most clubs do not run a purely home grown youth system for the first team. If every club does this as a result of change, there is only so many good players here. There's not enough to go round all clubs. And i think the money wont be there to pay for top class scouting in other countries or to pay wages of these players.

Where did i say scotland needs rangers for that?

aye maybe, but i mean like now, they're both sitting pretty, though with a lot of debt.

The city had previously rezoned the training grounds for development, a move which in turn increased their value, and then bought the site. The EU-commission started an investigation into whether the city overpaid for the property, to be considered a form of state subsidy.

The sale of the training ground for office buildings cleared Real Madrid's debts of €270m and enabled the club to embark upon an unprecedented spending spree

there is only so many good players here. There's not enough to go round all clubs

More children are born every day. Developing talent is a rolling strategy. You don't turn round one day and go "oh shit we've run out!"

Where did i say scotland needs rangers for that?

Ok, you didn't. You just posted it slap bang in the middle of a discussion about the future of Scottish football without Rangers in a thread about Rangers going into administration. No idea why.

I can't work out how *any* of what you're saying is mitigated by Rangers existing.

or try reading what i say rather than trying to manoeuvre it into what you want me to say so you can have a go.

in other words onimo you read what you wanted to read