Drag City

Destroy: Silver Jews, 'Dongs of Sevotion' by Smog, Neil Hamburger, most of their Red Krayola releases (apart from the wonderful title track on 'Corky's Debt to His Father'), the Stephen Prina alb.

Still the best 'alt rock' label in the world.

please search David Grubbs.

Search:

Royal Trux (skulls)
Smog Forgotten Foundation
Pavement Westing...
V/A Hey Drag City
Smog Julius Caesar
Royal Trux Cats and Dogs
Palace Bros. There Is no-One...
Smog Burning Kingdom
Palace Bros. Days in the Wake
Palace Songs Hope
King Kong Me Hungry
Flying Saucer Attack Further
Cynthia Dall Untitled
Smog Kicking A Couple Around
Palace Arise Therefore
Smog The Doctor Came At Dawn
Neil Hamburger America's Funnyman
Ghost Lama Rabi Rabi
Flying Saucer Attack New Lands
Smog Dongs of Sevotion
Flying Saucer Attack Mirror
Masaki Batoh Kikaokubeshi (although this was never really a DC release)
Edith Frost S/T
King Kong Movie Star 7" (A DC reissue)
Palace Gulf Shores 7"
Royal Trux Thank You (vinyl version)
Shellac The Bird...
The Sundowners The Girl With the Thing in Her Hair

agreed! outside of the palace stuff (and maybe if i was in a more charitable mood flying saucer attack), urgh. if i can say nothing else for drag city, they've disguised their essential tedium from me for quite a long time.

INDIE GUILT PART TWO

Ned wrote:
I like the idea that millions of indie kids laid down their money for Silver Jews records

you say some silly things, but this one is maybe the silliest! I just got into American Water after playing a few times with a guy who played on that record... it's a nicely recorded album with some great songs. Highly recommended for people who think the Silver Jews sold millions of records.

Drag City roster as a continuation of the weirdo Americana elements documented in Harry Smith's anthologies? That new Plush album that Drag City passed on is very Drag City 2002... better than the latest Jim O'Rourke album they did not pass on.

i think the album is MUCH better than pavement's album of the same year (the DULL Brighten The Corners), I think people who find Malkmus' playing interesting and are curious his ability as a sideman would enjoy this. He was really ON during the recording of this album, very smooth/fluid playing/arrangements...

keep : some ghost albums esp. "lama rabi rabi", the royal trux singles box

"cover by hipgnosis", ha ha it was funny 'cause it was true.

Search : Flying Saucer Attack, Smog, Palace, Silver Jews, Royal Trux,Scott Walker, Silver Jews,Ghost, Red Crayola reissues, Edith Frost

Destroy: New Red Crayola, Suntanama, Wierd War,Champs

There's much more music on this label than many others that I don't mind hearing once in a while but I wouldn't buy/ copy it

yeah well spotted, anyone who knows me knows i never owned any records by smog or palace or scott walker in the 1st place.

fuck hipgnosis & roger dean yeah!

hoorah to drag city for getting my pre-ordered vinyl copy of the excellent new bill callahan album to me a week before the scheduled release date

boo to drag city for not providing digital downloads with vinyl purchases. i don't understand why labels wouldn't do this as standard these days

you make me wish i'd pre-ordered. i'm seeing him in a week or two in a record store and thought about buying it to get signed. i don't do that or anything, just, how else will i have stories for my grandchildren involving someone so laconic?

lp is slow burningly lovely anyway. i think all thoughts are prey to some beast is good enough to sit in the distance/the well/truth serum spot each record seems to have.

oh they also sent me a nice poster promoting the album, though i don't really know what to do with it

i think they do supply digital copies for those purchasing vinyl in some cases. i believe they call it "ultraload" or something.

i decided a minute ago that i like drag city, not just because of all the music but because they actually have a mystique.

I don't know if they still do it, but they used to have really neat alternate artwork on their promo cd's. I contemplated collecting it at one point...

There was an early comp they (or maybe Ajax?) was going to put out called "Hey Dan K." which after a quick googling shows had Cannanes and M0unt@1n G0@ts songs on it.

http://www.amazon.com/Hey-Dan-Koretzky-Various-Artists/dp/B000005NGW/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1268195446&sr=1-1

Like the random ESP Summer biography that appears below it.

I don't know if they still do it, but they used to have really neat alternate artwork on their promo cd's.

The posters too -- Smog's Knock Knock:

http://i9.ebayimg.com/08/i/001/3c/89/1242_12.JPG

ha, never seen that before but that's Dan Osborn of DC in the Dr's uni

boo to drag city for not providing digital downloads with vinyl purchases. i don't understand why labels wouldn't do this as standard these days

They still don't do this, which seems insane to me. Is it some kind of principle thing with them?

yeah, it does seem kind of stubborn. i'd be more likely to buy a record w/ mp3 downloads.

i don't thnik it's principle since they sell mp3s.
love going over to the drag city site to see what they're up to: right now a portuguese guitar player and pete shelley electronic records. such a cool label.

and a new collection of alan lomax scottish field recordings!

the carlos parreda thing is pretty great, wasn't familiar w/ that dude before.

aren't those scottish recordings kinda 'lomax-esque'? i thought they were new, collected by ali roberts, sorta following in the footsteps. may be wrong

nah, they're actually Lomax recordings, complied by Alasdair Roberts, I believe.

*compiled*

aw okay, that's neat, i misunderstood. really had roberts down for the roam around scotland recording strangers type.

He (Ali Roberts) asked me if I knew of any good swimming holes when he was in town playing a show.
Charming guy. I really should pick up one of his records. Recommendations? I had the first Appendix Out ages ago.

Amber Gatherers might be the best intro? Really wonderful record.

Thanks! I spotted some of his records at a shop in the newly acquired used bins.
My list is getting long again.

http://www.dragcity.com/news/499

why are drag city calling things gay, is it bc they are a label for the ironic youth

bc of the rainbow colored ribbon iirc

lol @ them apologizing for having an artist performing at lincoln center: "No this thing is actually cool, really, let me explain it to you in vaguely grad-studentesque terms so you'll see why."

I thought about buying tickets to that show but it sold out. My first thought when I saw it was "I guess we're getting old."

it is v poor you are meant to just do the thing you do without making the world a tiny amount shittier, why ironically say gay or make a (i guess innocuous but guess what they forefit critical restraint) hiv joke in yr copy

the bill callahan letter is great though

Do you think that Dan & Dan were lucky or talented to identify their core roster talent like Neil, Jennifer, Malkmus, Callahan, Berman, Oldham, Jim O, etc. fairly early in their infancy and (for the most part) these artists are still kicking strong 20-25 years later?

it's always a bit of both isn't it

i think the fact that the drag city folks have pretty unerring taste has something to do with it

almost unerring, i should say

back in the mid 1990s i would have had no idea this label would last so long and put out so much great stuff, both new music and reissues

has a lot to do with their ethos too, they just seem really respectful of their artists and they are competent and even-keeled. i'm speaking a little out of ignorance but anytime i read an interview with one of their musicians they all seem pretty happy to have DC as their label. i mean bill callahan sings "DC 450" at the end of apocalypse and if he hated the label i doubt he'd do that.

i think they have really varied and solid taste, and choose artists who have room to grow -- beyond that, keeping their scope pretty small and not doing anything financially stupid/risky has led to long-term success.
i <3 drag city!

they are so reliable. but also never boring.

I forget way too easily that a large number of my favorite albums released since the inception of Drag City were released by Drag City. Like probably half of my top 20 from the past 25 years.

There should be a gallery show of their albums and ephemera.

At the risk of sounding a little crass, it has built among the strongest "brands" of any indie label, and I think that's because they're really clear-eyed about both their taste and their purpose. You never get the sense that they're thinking "We're releasing this because we took the cultural temperature and the kids will like it"

Yeah. Them and like Merge

Merge a little less so obv.

merge is a great label, but i'd say they rely a little more on bands that have proven themselves on even smaller labels (i read a lot more "x signs to merge" than "x signs to drag city" stories), and the breadth of their signings is a little less diverse than drag city.

Drag city bitch, drag drag city bitch

The Drag City Supersession album doesn't get nearly enough props. "Nothing Rises To Meet Me" is one of Callahan's best.

good Hagerty tracks on that also

There's a great 20-minute early Royal Trux track buried in the middle of the "Drag City Hour" CD

Do you think that Dan & Dan were lucky or talented to identify their core roster talent like Neil, Jennifer, Malkmus, Callahan, Berman, Oldham, Jim O, etc. fairly early in their infancy and (for the most part) these artists are still kicking strong 20-25 years later?

― Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Tuesday, November 18, 2014 8:15 PM (2 days ago)

it's always a bit of both isn't it

― call all destroyer, Tuesday, November 18, 2014 8:50 PM (2 days ago)

"I'll be the first one to admit luck has played a huge role in the Drag City story..."
Dan Koretsky, 1993 (!!!!)

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=VuuGvMBRrYAC&lpg=PA101&dq=%22drag%20city%22&pg=PA101#v=onepage&q=%22drag%20city%22&f=false

what do people think of the arch tone of rian murphy's drag city newsletters?

i have to say, the last one made me want to hurl something at the camera. it was just too much.

er, i mean computer monitor, not camera

post please

it's long

THE DRAG CITY NEWSLETTER! JANUARY 2015
posted January 27th, 2015

Good - another new year! We follow the old Roman calendar, just like you, just like the good children of imperialists that we are. It matters to us that when you turn the page into 2015, you find a whole world that's good. Lest you doubt our intentions – don't worry, they are FAR from altruistic – we hope you find a whole world that's good BECAUSE of (and filled with) Drag City records of all kinds! If we're not in the mix, fuck it, let it burn. We're adult enough to recognize that the world won't do it on its own – no, people are too fucking stupid to buy our records on simple merit. We need to do something to help! That special something we have determined to be "planning in advance," and as alien and unwelcome a suggestion as it’s been around the Great Ivory Bunker, we've managed to carve out a schedule of releases through the year that give the dedicated listener everything it (it’s 2015 people, we’ve moved beyond gender - trans(inc)endental) ed.) wants and needs – ups, downs, technique, drama, variety, humors, action and of course guitars, basses, drums, flutes, saxes and synths, beats, and yeah, even a harp! We've called out the coast guard to bring as much of our vaunted talent back from wherever they were (the original “square groupers”), back in the woodshed or on their walkabout of discovery...don't care, we have a need to FEED the world the only way we know how! With LPs, CDs, cassettes, DVDs, DLs, books, posters... and now YOU KNOW how we feel about a t-shirt (we love it - trans(parent) ed.)! The whole bit! Plus live shows! In 2015, we're working to bring it ALL to you. Except a download code with vinyl purchase. That shit's sooo pre-2012 anyway. There are limits, folks! We're not Superman. But we are Drag City and - oh, fuck it. Just read the rest of the newsletter, assface.

ALL DIS PRAISE ASIDE

Kicking off the year for us in grand auld style is a self-titled record from one of our favorite artists, Alasdair Roberts. With his three Appendix Out records and eight subsequent solo records over the past decadeish, Alasdair has topped his own damn self continuously, growing as a writer, singer and artist with each album. On 2013’s A Wonder Working Stone, the enormous song-world of Alasdair Roberts and Friends projected sheer pleasure, as Alasdair built his syncretic songwriting approach (debuted on 2009’s Spoils) into a vehicle for traditional music in our contemporary populist idiom. Which means in short, FUN! More than the mere words on this screen though, that record, for the less fortunate of you who haven’t listened, is a modern folk-rock masterpiece, linking hands across the ocean from Scotland to America in ways that those Dumford Sons o' bees won’t EVER get round to considering (they’ve got other fish to fry – minnows! – angling ed.). And yet — our Alasdair's new self-titled record shows a tremendous maturity in his craft (would that the newsletter author take a similar tact! - high road ed.), executed this time with austere arrangements that give his songs and vocals ample room to shine alongside his ever-exquisite guitar picking. It’s the first Alasdair Roberts record of short, almost pop songs since 2007’s The Amber Gatherers, but this new album and that former one are worlds apart, speaking strictly approach-wise. Alasdair’s continued artistic growth has absorbed traditional folk influences so much more completely than previously, and they now operate as impulses within his own 21st-century songwriting style in ways that weren’t evident in them thar earlier days. Meanwhile, Ali’s never really given us a set of songs that radiate such a personal air; beyond the codes of his syntax and the soul with which he infuses all his work shows a bit of something else – forgive us if we call it “heart.” Alasdair Roberts comes out on January 27th; we hope that many more in North America will check this record out than ever before, mainly because we care about the future of the country; and this country, in the end, after the revolution – fuck the politicians and their corporate overlords! – will still be about people, and people who need to know themselves better. This is a record that can only but help.

THERE’S A PRATT IN OUR HOUSE!

Sitting alongside Alasdair Roberts in the driver's seat for early 2015 is Jessica Pratt. Her album’s called On Your Own Love Again, and people seem to be DEEPLY ready to hear it. That’s good – this is a record that’ll stand up to the anticipation, with a delicately woven set of pop-folk songs written through a deep love and observation of songs and singers and the whole rock thing. Jessica’s taken it in but what comes back out again is put forth so innately, from whatever it is that we perceive as Jessica's "personality," that there’s a new sense of the tradition, something expressed in a way that hasn’t already been covered in the generations of blues players and the country guys and all the rest, working from the same template and coming up with their own personal twists on things. Something that is HERS. Beyond the songwriting, Jessica’s also got a tremendous sense of HOW her records are supposed to sound, which is amazing, because not only is this the first one for which she's actually had her hands on the dials, but also, the balance she's going for is such a delicate one, comprised of fine lines and haze in a constantly shifting equilibrium. Plus there's the other thing in the mix that's not always so easy to get in there, a little thing you might heard of called vibrations? Like the time, the vibes in On Your Own Love Again just feel right. The light from the moon is falling in the right place. The fog starts lifting at the same moment every time we flip the record. Yeah, it’s exciting – tunes and a mood and a bunch of people who seem interested in hearing 'em. Doesn’t always happen that way. We might just have a Pratt infestation on our hands – but don't fret, the reverse exterminators are on their way. On Your Own Love Again comes out January 27th.

SPEAKING IN EVEN MORE TONGUES

Also out on January 27th is the third single from last fall's classic, career highlight album from Bonnie ‘Prince’ Billy, Singer's Grave a Sea of Tongues. We didn’t talk too much about it at the time because that might have prevented you from having your own pure reaction to it (this is incredibly generous – genuinely-impressed ed.), but basically, the same source material that had been gathered to build 2011's Wolfroy Goes To Town was used, in a different time and under different circumstances, allowing the songs to impact in new ways upon the singers and the players – making a different record in the process. It’s a wild and kind of unprecedented thing to do, and the way that the material turned out so great the second time, just...wow. Since the SGASOT record hit, there's been a couple of singles taken from the album, each with their own custom-built B-side that seems to relate to the song on the other side of their little record in a deeply uncanny manner. Nowhere is this more apparent than on the new, third-in-a-series single, “Mindlessness” b/w “Blindnessness," which smacks you right off the bat and right in the title too! The songs themselves share a lyrical theme of general disorientation in life, as well as in the very weird present day – but where “Mindlessness” is a full-tilt group strut, “Blindnessness” is disquietly alone, just Bonny and his dog. Spicing the heady brewness of this whole enterprise, the production of "Blindlessness" reflects back to sounds from a couple of different B’P’B eras in an almost effortless way, like, by osmosis, or just because of a shared vessel; that of body and mind. The word was said above – and down here at the end of the paragraph again, is still ‘uncanny.’ Hear it to believe it – and then your long road through lives together has begun…

TANGIER-INE DREAM

You like records? Yeah, us too. You know what’s good? Rock records. That’s where the love was when we started out, back when we were children. Whoop – we meant, mere children. But then you grow up. Suddenly you’re twenty, and there’s like, so many more records in the store. So weird, right? Somewhere down the line of choices, you find that a type of record that’s fun to listen to ALSO is a record of a guy playing solo guitar – blues, classical, jazz, country, it’s all good. There are a lot of these records around, probably even a lot more than there were only a few years ago, because the funny thing about technology is how tends to create a lot of opposition to the technology, maybe even more than your typical decrying of the latter-day, anti-computer, anti-digital types who prefer to get back to basics and, instead of being smothered in delicious-and-convenient-but-ultimately-thin digi-layers, bathe in the encompassing warmth and singular sound of an acoustic guitar. It’s a nice thing, whether you’re living in reactionary-ville (what the fuck is that supposed to mean?! - population-one ed.) or you’ve always gotten off on the sound regardless of the culture wars – and really, in this day and age, there’s nobody we’d rather hear a guitar recital from than Sir Richard Bishop. This has made the last seven years a really maddening time for us – for after making four solo guitar albums between 1998 and 2007, Rick’s been a little quiet on that particular front. In fact, Tangier Sessions is his first solo record since the record he cut for us back in 2007, Polytheistic Fragments. Of course, since then, there was The Freak of Araby as well, but that was an electric-guitar-with-band album, completely different! What broke the solo silence for Sir Rick? A new guitar – that’s all. Shit, if we knew it was that easy, we might’ve sent him a bouquet of guitars every month! Geez. Of course, it was an awfully special little ol' guitar, one in particular that he wasn’t even looking for – but after encountering it in Geneva, Switzerland, he spent many restless nights trying to get it off his mind. It didn’t work, and we’re glad. Instead, the guitar was purchased at great personal sacrifice (he didn't eat for a month, okay! Not a drop of hash was vaped for an entire month - poor olde Sir Rick!), then traveled with him to Tangier, where he’d been brought to play a show in the old city. While there, he used taping equipment he’d brought to capture a series of improvisations while sitting up late in his apartment. Now, if you can unhear what you’ve just been told (just pretend we’ve just been talking about Roth IRAs! — no-head-for-numbers ed.), go listen to the record, and you won’t think about a record being recorded while on the road. The sound is sweet and pristine, and everything works out incredibly well – and that's all down to Bish and guitar coming to a very sweet understanding. Not only that, on Tangier Sessions, they work it out together, song by song, so that by the album’s end, there’s this story of Sir Richard Bishop and this guitar having met and gone on the road and started playing together finding out everything that can be done, playing-wise, with that. The beauty of it is, the music becomes simpler as it goes along. Tone is the be-all, end-all, and after the expected fiery string-play early on, Sir Rick settles into a deep spiritual groove with the guitar, tripping on the sound, at one with his instrument. It’s a special trip, and one that keeps stimulating fresh listens. Tangier Sessions comes out on February 17th.

HEXADICS OF OUR LIFE

2015 – as we said above, this is the year we REALLY get our shit together! If it weren’t for bad habits, we might not have any habits at all (except for still running this record label, which honestly, may serve as a testament to the triumph of the will(fully ignorant)). We’ve been our own worst enema for too long now! But how to, as Alice Cooper once did, “flush the fashion?” We look in the mirror and know that it didn’t work for him – so how will it work for us? Fortunately, we’ve got talent on the label to do the thinking for us! Specifically, Six Organs of Admittance’s Ben Chasny. No, kids, he’s not just another guitar-playing pretty face. In fact, a pretty face isn’t EVER what we look to Ben for – but with his new album, he’s come up not only with a new volume of challenging guitar-as-song-driver music, but also an answer to our perpetual creative stagnation (tell please! – me-run-out-of-wordzes ed.)! The system that helped revitalize Ben’s approach to the guitar, and to decision-making in general, is called Hexadic. The system is simple enough: it involves a deck of playing cards and a set of instructions. By arranging a set of tones affixed to card identities, one allows the cards as played to imply a direction for one to follow. If that sounds oversimplified, don’t worry, you are. Good news is, there’s a book coming out that’ll explain the whole process through the lens of the guitar, in terms of playing and composing. It’s a new approach to creativity and decision-making, but one that’s part of a long, maybe even ancient tradition that Ben’s been studying for a quite a while. That’s a big part of the reason we’ve been waiting so long for this record – after the bro-rock ass(c)ault of Ascent back in 2012, we thought perhaps Ben might keep on with the guitar-god poses at an increased rate. Instead, it’s almost three years later – and while the volume of Hexadic is plainly consistent with heavy-rock royalty, the Hexadic compositions featured throughout the record are songs of a god not often heard in the rock-guitar field. By following his own system to the letter, Ben’s created challenging music, which, when showcased with volume and a rhythm section, in the “heavy rock” idiom, proves to be powerful and powerfully insane at the same time! This is because the System generates relationships outside of our (pitiful! — First-World-shaming ed.) western understanding of harmony and tonal relationships. And really, any time a musician starts proposing new relationships in these areas – Schoenberg, Cage, Stockhausen, Coleman, Ayler, Ginn – it may take a minute, but the time spent washing our ears and brains in these sounds is well spent, and the world becomes bigger, wider, more colorful and filled with opportunity. Hexadic comes out on February 17, with the book and a specially-designed Hexadic card deck coming a little later. And loads of tour dates, to demonstrate the fruits and pure musical expression of this method to people all over – and maybe some lecture and workshop type things down the line. Stay with us on this! The Hexadic System may be the best thing you hear about all year – or it may be Six Organs of Admittance's Hexadic album. Hopefully both – for your ears and your own sake.

FROM FRIENDS TO OTHERS

Why do people like parties? It’s something we’ve never been able to figure out. It has something to do with liking people, we’re surmising – because when we don’t like people, parties are pretty fuckin’ DIRE, you know? Either that, or really freakin’ AWESOME – which is another story we probably never need repeat again. But when we’re in the mood, people are great. Society’s worth fighting for, and we look toward a future filled with faces that we hope to be able to put the names to in short order when the time comes. It’s good to have friends! Especially from a business perspective. Like, looking over the titles we put out last year, some of our favorite releases were titles that we P&D’d for other labels – like Sun Araw’s Belomancie on Sun Ark, Belfi, Grubbs and Pilia’s Dust and Mirrors on Blue Chopsticks, and Wand’s Ganglion Reef on GOD?. Great music that we and others might not have heard if we hadn’t been hyped to it by the CEOs of those respective concerns. These relationships are a fruitful way of us knowing what the FUNK is going on out there (it’s usually a long shot otherwise), ever since the good old days of Dexter’s Cigar, which was a great way to learn about the kind of music made by Merzbow, Circle X, Rafael Toral, Arnold Dreyblatt and other amazing and weird sounds and music that helped our ears hear more than we ever expected to when we got out of/were asked to leave school. So it’s just more sweet, not-from-concentrate, cold-pressed juice for us to tell you that our first quarter releases (oooh, fancy Drag City man in the charcoal gray suit! Run the first quarter numbers for me, would you, mister fat cat? While you do it, try not to blow the smoke in my face from the cigar that you lit with the cash we so unfairly trade to you for basic records, okay? You owe us!) got some TOP-NOTCH “shit” from our affiliated labels Streamline (albums from Plastic Palace People, Christoph Heemann and Jim O’Rourke’s lab of sound-treatment, samples, and aural good humor, stretched to an ex-dream state of stasis electricity; and OORUTAICHI, the Japanese sonic tsunami/outré-pop veteran’s Drifting My Folklore, appearing for the first time on vinyl); GOD? (Axis: Sova’s Early Surf, a guitar-and-tweaks masterwerk of under-headphones-fi heavy jurm) and Ethereal Sequence (Nedelle Torrisi’s Advice From Paradise, silk-sweet synth pop from Cryptacize lead singer and producer Kenny Gilmore (Haunted Graffiti)). WILL we actually get rich from this stuff? If we didn’t constantly wish for such a ridiculous (you mean REAL — PMA ed.) outcome, there might only be a few other (equally compelling) reasons to come to work every day, but another way to answer the question is to say that despite our generously appointed fantasy world, we are ultimately realists. But it’s nice to have friends! And other kinds of people too.

WHITE/RIOT

Europe! We feel your burning pain. We have seen the headlines throughout January – and they’re not unlike the headers we’ve seen here. With the paper folded (yes, we like to page through the local edition at breakfast, no matter where we're at in the world – sure, we’ll peruse a pad if we have to, but sampling the local custom is best done with one’s fingertips! So yeah, I guess an iPad works too, feh. The newspaper, she is dead!), riot seems to be the lead in a Nation/World section full of unfortunate Christian-Muslim misunderstandings and meta-understandings as the flames of debate are fanned into local unrest, with only the constabulary able to quell passions (but for how long?). Well, damn that! Instead, we simply fold the page (or, yes, scroll down)and read about White Fence walking across the the water to play their intensely enjoyable, oddballin' pop music yer old-world villa this week. Score! In fact, GOOOAAAAALLLLL! Through early February, the long-awaited For the Recently Found Innocent European tour is in effect, rolling all the way out to Greece, where we know those psych-loving thugs are gonna dig it. But White Fence aren’t the only groop getting into the EU act; Dope Body’ll be over there for almost all of February, touring behind their LIFER album of later last year, and Purling Hiss’ll be there for all of March, promoting Weirdon after months of Euro-ticipation. Jessica Pratt will be debuting her On Your Own Love Again material over there in March and April. Why, even the locals are getting into it – Alasdair Roberts will be coming down from Scotland into the still-solvent UK for a nice, three-week tour in support of his excellent self-titled album in March as well. It’s weird; it’s not as though the weather over there is exceptionally better than in America. But whatever. We’ve got Elisa Ambrogio playing a bunch of dates over here in the North American critical mass for her The Immoralist album of last fall. Six Organs of Admittance dates for Hexadic coming up. And some Jessica Pratt dates coming down fast on the West coast. Keeping it live, with riots of sound. Shit, if you wanna revolution, do it – but just don’t miss the show!

THAT $INGLING FEELING

Gadzooks, all of last year’s talk of Ty Segall growing up, taking his time and making a REAL record for a change – and then he goes and drops the $ingle$ 2 compilation just a couple months after Manipulator, on super-short notice, a hot-and-dirty set of tracks that make everything sound like it was 2012 all over again! You can take the kid out of the country, I suppose…but look, we’re not going to pretend we’re unhappy. We don’t sell talk, we sell records! And since both $ingle$ 2 and Manipulator are full-bore rock records with great songs and sounds of a completely different variety, and since we don’t discriminate (in public!), we got no problem and we’re looking forward to seeing Ty at Burgerama in March. That’s the only thing he’s really got on the schedule for awhile – but if we know the lad, it’s actually not. ‘Cause he’s out surfing! Well, he's doing that, yeah – it helps to get his head together – but he’s mostly making music, that’s really what turns Ty Segall on. So more music – don’t know where, don’t know when. And you know that can’t be bad. In the meantime, cassettes for $ingle$ 2, Hair and Manipulator are back in stock! Manipulator is the first Drag City cassette to go gold in our long run, so if you want a little piece of history (or a kick-ass tape), now's the time!

MORE-CH!

And just like that, time marches on! March doesn’t share its name with a stately martial parade step for nothing – month-wise, it's kinda like that track 3 of an album moment, the month where the year we think we’re in (because what is time etc. — ugggghh ed.) really KICKS IN. So March settles it – that’s where we tell you where we’re really at. If you didn’t figure it out already with the trad-folk musical displays of Alasdair Roberts and the folk-pop offerings of Jessica Pratt, and the heavy guitar wizardry of Six Organs of Admittance and the acoustic guitar wizardry of Sir Richard Bishop, then March might just be for you, dummy! Wait – we take it back. You GENIUS! You figured us out! March brings it all together – acoustic, electric, and a-WHAT?-tric, all rolled up in three releases! Masaki Batoh of the late and lamented Ghost (they were Ghost before they were late, that’s just the way it goes't) returns to rock band polity with The Silence, which features his most aggressively forward style of everything ever! Frederick Michael St. Jude reaches into his archives for the second time to pull out another classic – Gang War, a dystopian concept album from 1982 – an album so prophetic and so intense that it’s never been released until now! And Dead Rider, who are so effin’ freaky that all they have to do is put out a two-song single like the forthcoming “New End” b/w “Uncomfy” 7” record, and then they’ll be able to take the next year putting together their follow-up to Chills On Glass because that’s how, like, totally stunned we’ll be. And we’ll just go back, listening again and getting deeper into everything. Or sometimes farther away. Then closer again. Then farther. Closer. Farther. Colder! Faster!

Musical record releases. It’s the only way to fly.

Rian Murphy

Drag City Inc.

January 2015

lordy

Hardy fuckin' har - make fun of the fact you don't give download codes ... really frustrating, and I as much as I love Sir Richard Bishop and Six Organs, I'm tempted just to make Use(net) for those releases. Most Drag City artists don't need these pedantic descriptions to 'move their product.'

Yea, Rian's emails and copy for the website are generally awful. I can't even decipher what he's going on about half the time. I wouldn't mind if it was entertaining, but then you get stuff like this:

"but basically, the same source material that had been gathered to build 2011's Wolfroy Goes To Town was used, in a different time and under different circumstances, allowing the songs to impact in new ways upon the singers and the players – making a different record in the process. It’s a wild and kind of unprecedented thing to do, and the way that the material turned out so great the second time, just...wow"

Which is just the most redundant crap.

he does seem in love with the sound of his own voice

above all though i kind of feel like rian is having a joke at the reader's expense, which doesn't exactly make me want to run about and blow a few hundred books on his product

jesus christ i can't write

run OUT and blow a few hundred BUCKS on his product

that newsletter was awful

(and sorry for making you post it amateurist, i realized after that it is available here http://www.dragcity.com/news/2015-01-27-the-drag-city-newsletter-january-2015

i do often wish there was a straightforward way to preview drag city releases, i'd buy a few more of them if i could easily preview. you can always find youtubes and soundclouds of bits and pieces but it can be a pain

Yeah, it drives me crazy when the preview track cuts off before the intro is over. Just give us 2 streaming tracks a record, please!

Just read the rest of the newsletter, assface.

Gee, thanks. I can't wait to give you more of my $$$

that newsletter is unreadable, yeah. but it's not like you really need track previews. a howling teakettle + any random third-rate 70s psych album will do the trick.

which album are you talking about?

o come on, you know the one, it's kind of square and roundish inside, yeah, that one

i do often wish there was a straightforward way to preview drag city releases, i'd buy a few more of them if i could easily preview. you can always find youtubes and soundclouds of bits and pieces but it can be a pain

― marcos, Wednesday, February 4, 2015 11:05 AM (3 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

^^^

though I don't even see many Drag City albums at record stores, either

what is a "record store"?

follow the beards (works for either of the last 2)

the owner of my favorite record store has a pretty cool beard

i do wish drag city was on spotify, but i understand, old school slow listening unheard music risk taking is the wave. i just want to listen to a bunch of smog and palace records, i feel like i'm ready for that shit right now but i'm not at all interested in just buying whatever their supposed "masterpiece" is, i mean come on.

yeah, I would just like the ability to listen to the albums on Spotify that I already bought on vinyl

the owner of the record store around the corner is beardless. he's also sketchy like a used-car salesman, and i avoid him like the plague.

coincidence?

Lone voice of dissent / devil's advocacy here, but I find that I actually listen to Drag City releases because I have to make an effort to play them, rather than, oh, I don't know, having something playing while I'm typing this, not knowing the song title or where it's sequenced or how it relates to the rest of the album, etc. I got stoned and just sat and listened to the new Jessica Pratt the other night and it was a great experience. There are probably a few 2015 releases I like better, but I haven't 'communed' with any of them in quite the same way. I agree it's frustrating to not have a copy to listen to on my iPod or in the car, but I have tens of thousands of other things to listen to in that context, and you do, too. Now, don't misunderstand me, I'm not saying "thanks, Drag City, for making us all better, more appreciative listeners!" but I also definitely don't view their decision to not offer downloads with their LPs as some sort of "dick move."

yeah honestly i don't care about samples. i got by for a long while without samples of albums! (unless, of course, it was in the form of a single released to radio!) i respect drag city's interest in doing things their way. i just wish the prose in their newsletters wasn't so fucking arch and condescending.

information rules!! screw the authenticity bullshit, there are more than enough great groups writing/performing classic american songs than can fit on a single compact disc (walks a million miles away from the source of his inspiration)

Lone voice of dissent / devil's advocacy here, but I find that I actually listen to Drag City releases because I have to make an effort to play them, rather than, oh, I don't know, having something playing while I'm typing this, not knowing the song title or where it's sequenced or how it relates to the rest of the album, etc. I got stoned and just sat and listened to the new Jessica Pratt the other night and it was a great experience. There are probably a few 2015 releases I like better, but I haven't 'communed' with any of them in quite the same way. I agree it's frustrating to not have a copy to listen to on my iPod or in the car, but I have tens of thousands of other things to listen to in that context, and you do, too. Now, don't misunderstand me, I'm not saying "thanks, Drag City, for making us all better, more appreciative listeners!" but I also definitely don't view their decision to not offer downloads with their LPs as some sort of "dick move."

It's not like you couldn't have a digital copy of their albums if you really wanted to.

youtube is the only suitable alternative. I like to imagine the artists cringing at the sound quality as I listen to their masterpiece on youtube.

i don't know i feel like there are 10 drag city artists i am very curious about but i just haven't gotten around to hunting down samples to explore them. and the drag city artists i know and love (e.g. bishop, callahan, oldham) i own like everything they put out

I like to imagine the artists cringing at the sound quality as I listen to their masterpiece on youtube.

― It's strange to me too. But we're talking about praxis, man. (Sufjan Grafton), Thursday, February 5, 2015 2:48 AM (7 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yea, way to stick it to 'em

purchasing unheard physical media is the only thrill i have left available so thank u drag city for keeping that frontier spirit alive

xp I also set myself on fire to make my listening distracted

as an ignorant dude who shuns Spotify, I say 'right on' Drag City, fuck that shit.

I wonder if this bit at the end of the February newsletter has anything to do with this thread...!

"Yes, sometimes we hate you. Sometimes you hate us. It’s all in the game. We can’t make it without you and we love how we love how you love us – and by "us" we mean, all the artists on Drag City and their various and sundry contortions in the name of entertainment without limits. Thanks always for listening, and a long life to everyone. We’re the greatest -"

they kind of are the greatest. who else kept the vinyl faith back in the day? the dans, corey r, bettina r, gerard c, not many more

http://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2014/07/vinyl-records-savior-of-the-music-industry/374291/

Thousands of electronic/ dance labels.

I also definitely don't view their decision to not offer downloads with their LPs as some sort of "dick move."

It's not like you couldn't have a digital copy of their albums if you really wanted to.

I do think it's a dick move, or at least a snooty one. I ride buses for like four hours a day for work. I'd love to listen to some of those albums on those rides. As for the latter sentiment, I don't download stuff illegally, so it makes their policy feel extra frustrating.

They didn't give out free cassette tapes for your walkman along with your records in the 80s.

my mp3 player didn't work so great back then either

a better comparison would be if most labels did give out cassettes for free with records in the 80s

a persons expectations for your product depend on your competition

I'm sure there's some overhead involved, but it must not be too much if Kranky can have a system running for this long.

I do think it's a dick move, or at least a snooty one. I ride buses for like four hours a day for work. I'd love to listen to some of those albums on those rides. As for the latter sentiment, I don't download stuff illegally, so it makes their policy feel extra frustrating.

― Your Ribs are My Ladder, Thursday, February 19, 2015 3:16 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

what an entitled thing to say.

it may come from a sense of entitlement, but it's not unreasonable

i think it's unreasonable to expect a label to offer downloads if that's not part of their business model. much more reasonable for a person to buy a copy and make the mp3s themselves if that's what they want.

yeah, I guess I don't really understand how much offering downloads with vinyl would change a label's business model. I haven't noticed a strong difference in price between records that do and do not have download codes.

but it costs something. I'm sure even the little inserts with the download codes are significant.

you can buy The Natural Bridge on amazon, and it comes with 'autorip'. so I guess Drag City does give you downloads now anyway. you just have to buy the record through amazon. That's actually a pretty sensible way to do it.

the trick is to not buy the vinyl

maybe they could sell CDs in the vinyl sleeves

and include an insert for a free McFlurry

some labels do slip a CD into the vinyl

the music industry is so weird these days, i don't blame labels for just about anything

As for the latter sentiment, I don't download stuff illegally, so it makes their policy feel extra frustrating.

I guess your best bet then is to ask for a kind ILX soul to share their digital copy.

I don't expect labels to offer me a download code with my vinyl purchase. I'm happy when they do and a bit disappointed when they don't. Drag City doesn't sell its records cheap. A new LP from DC will likely cost more than one from Sub Pop, Matador, Thrill Jockey, Castle Face, Goner or Jagjaguwar (in some cases, quite a bit more). Albums from the latter labels typically come with download codes. Merge sells records for about the same price as DC and include a download code. It's not that they owe me anything, but rather that they kind of stand alone, both in terms of what they charge and what they offer in return.

It's not like you couldn't have a digital copy of their albums if you really wanted to.

As for the latter sentiment, I don't download stuff illegally, so it makes their policy feel extra frustrating.

You could just rip it yourself, like I've been doing for last 15 years.

but it costs something. I'm sure even the little inserts with the download codes are significant.

as someone who does this - it doesn't cost anything. really.

ripping MP3s from vinyl is so annoying

I suspect it's not about costs as much as it is about discouraging piracy. I don't torrent stuff so I dunno about that end of it, but I've had no luck finding free MP3s of Drag City albums that I've purchased on vinyl, which I would think is at least partially due to them not having a bunch of MP3s from download codes floating around out there.

given how easy it is to rip a CD, they must be actively discouraging privacy as well

ha *piracy

I have no doubt that Drag City is aggro about downloading sites/blogs etc.

it is a slightly cranky approach, sure, but i get the feeling they just think: "hey you want to listen to a record, buy the record. you want to listen to a CD, buy the CD. you want to listen to mp3s, buy the mp3s."

yeah, and then they can just do some 'yeah, we are giving you less than the other guys. but that's because music is worth MORE. what have we become, etc.' or 'we are just simple music people with simple music options. have some artisanal mp3s.' marketing around it

I always throw out the download vouchers (like, if I wanted to download the album I would have done that lol) but feel a bit weird abt it bcz maybe it will affect resale price sometime in the future or just seem like a fun nostalgic part of the package is missing (lulz they had mp3s back then!)

I just give someone else the code if I think they'd like it and I already had downloaded it or whatever.

DON'T TELL THE COPS

worst episode of "dragnet" ever

what an entitled thing to say.

― hammer smashed nagls (mattresslessness), Friday, 20 February 2015 00:51 (3 days ago) Permalink

No, that's fair enough - I genuinely feel entitled to it! Contenderizer spells it out there, feeling a bit more sanguine about it. Many of those other labels listed make their loyal customers feel like they're getting maximum value when they shell out for a record, which is nice, and which is why I buy tons of Castle Face LPs, and vinyl via Bandcamp that I can also listen to on my commute, and don't really buy equally or more expensive Drag City stuff, where I feel like the people running the shop aren't that bothered about that stuff. Which is totally their right, obviously.

from their recent newsletter - beware the house style, but interesting in regards to this thread's recent discussions.

G'OD MORNING
The sun rises an acidic blood-orange over the blanket of snow and frozen poo(p) surrounding our independently-owned-and-operated ivory bunker/fantasy factory/time-and-love-and-music machine. It's the same sun dawning over the rest of the world, one little combat zone at a time, and sometimes we think it's the only thing we truly share with the deeply distressed rest of the planet. But you know what? FUCK the damn planet - it's too late for tears, and we're outta minutes to argue with naysayers and the rest of those who'd sooner end times than admit that they and their industrial patrons have brought on the close to the era of men (apes, please stand by!). We don't care about the government - a corrupt creature elite who so evidently care NOTHING for us, either. We're the chaff that runs their still, dripping a 'shine for them and the others of their selfish kind to imbibe. They are not our people; not only won't they get (or buy) our records, they certainly won't stay the force in their charge in order to benefit the greater good; this is clear. But OUR people - this society of music-lovers that we chose to live among and contribute to so many years ago - are we just another herd of zombified cattle to be shifted by their invisible hand? For ANYONE in music to argue that the days of the record label as we knew it are over, that the dinosaur mega-rollers have passed, leaving only the true and the good to determine their own fate on our One Free Internet, is drollery at the very least; it seems more like utter foolishness in the face of the very real and looming threat of the count-them-on-one-hand (yes, even yer apes' hands!) corporate collective that abso-fucking-lutely controls the One "Free" Internet to expel independent music makers for not signing potential profits into its iron fists. As well, it must be known at this point - well-known and REVILED, people - that these "services" exist ENTIRELY for a profit that will only be had, in the estimation of the "suits" (at least that's what we called them in the 90s; pressed-jeans-and-white-sneakers-and-pastel-polo-shirts-and-thrift-store-blazers by any other name would smell as cheap), by paying only a pittance to the very people whose content draws the moths (listeners, aka unique email addresses) to the flame (corporate marketing departments!)! !(!) So the controlling corporate scum are gone from our industry, eh? It seems they're retreated only as far as the internet's edge - where they merged, bought each other out, and consolidated power. Because that's what good corporations do, and we are delusional fools to expect anything more - like, to live in a world free of their damnable influence. So, when word comes to our tablets and pads from on low that we move our release date from Tuesday to Friday to save and serve the record industry...whose industry, again? Not yours and mine, actually, but the holding of the very few. Once again, the fat cats are sitting on our face - hoping for a quick suck of their udderly-adaptable/hermaphro bits (which is in no way an expression meant to bring shame upon the noble hermaphrodite, please understand!)! Don't let 'em tell you that we're living in a new free world where we can determine our own fate through the manipulation of technologies IN OUR HANDS - because once again, the power source for our tech is in the hands of the very few, for mostly THEIR gain and HARDLY ours. Yet there is still some power left to the individual! Your own unique email address is worth $2-$4 to marketing companies! We have value(s) after all! And if all else fails, remember that even apes are upfront about that whole "not killing ape" thing.

Wake up! It's still tomorrow.

That's so many words.

Really makes me not want to buy anything on the label.

Shooting to catch Sir Richard Bishop this evening. Assuming it's just going to be him and his new guitar, but we'll see!

there's a blanket of frozen poo(p) surrounding their building?

guess that'd make me hate my customers, too

Genuinely couldn't make it past the first few lines, that style is so embarrassing

don't understand how the friday release date is bad for indies

my eyes just slide off of that

like frozen poop

They're going for a US Maple promotional syntax instead of sounding like publicists.

A visual representation of rian's newsletters: http://files.dragcity.com/video/rockinrian.mov

tried to give drag city as a gift but they don't offer any sort of gift options
sorry you don't want my $ DC!

weird. but man they are unbelievable this year - bishop, six organs, batoh, baird, o'rourke! it's all golden.

i know!! i wanted to give my brother in law the chance to choose his own drag city gift and instead i had to give him something else

Drag City is def top 3 as far as labels are concerned

as far as newsletters are concerned?

Drag City kinda sucks wrt digital stuff. Like they make it has hard as possible for you to check out releases on their label, no bandcamp, one song on youtube or soundcloud. And no download cards. UP YOURS DRAG CITY, THE DRAG IS YOU

Not on Spotify either, good work dudes

I'm sure the business side of it is problematic, but at this point it's gotta be a huge drawback promotion-wise to not be on Spotify - in the long run the exposure their artists would gain on Spotify must be pretty valuable

That's what I'm saying. I mean, I want to hear the new Axis: Sova LP they did, but I'm not dropping $27 without hearing it first, so I may wind up illegally downloading it.

I support this label and their way of doing biz. I like the fact that they don't (have to) give a shit. Sure, it bums me out that I have to illegally download albums I bought on vinyl (though I do so without guilt), but lord knows there are plenty of other things to listen to on Spotify, Youtube, etc. I don't know if they are 'taking a stand' (Spotify rips off artists, etc) or just not bothering to expand the empire or whatever, but either way I'm in full support.

I understand why they do things this way, but it's definitely a tradeoff and as a result I just wind up thinking about Drag City a lot less often because they don't come up in the main channels I use for checking out music.

xp: hey... great. I don't really get what there is to support there and it doesn't seem so much a badass attitude as blindness to the modern era, but cool!

i get how this is annoying but it's hard to argue against it without sounding entitled and annoying. waah waah why isn't all your music free

https://soundcloud.com/drag-city btw

it's annoying but whatever. they are a good label

i just want bill callahan to release new music though

I don't really get what there is to support

maybe that's the problem?

If you're illegally downloading their albums are you supporting them? You should really be paying for the LP and download, that's their model.

And if you have to blind-buy albums at $25+ each to find out they're mediocre, too bad, I guess, you gotta support the label?

You should really be paying for the LP and download, that's their model

This is not their model. I've never gotten an LP w a download from them.

They are a great label that puts out good stuff. I support what they do.

in the long run the exposure their artists would gain on Spotify must be pretty valuable

Not really.

"and also the download, if you want a digital version"

(just to clarify)

Anyway I'm glad they're still a label, sure, I just think they're being dumb about the way they deal with digital stuff. If disagreeing with that means I'm not supporting them that's fine. I'll buy stuff they put out that I like, I'll try to check out the stuff I don't know, I think it's stupid to drive your customers to illegally download albums to have digital copies but I'll do that if I have to.

i get how this is annoying but it's hard to argue against it without sounding entitled and annoying. waah waah why isn't all your music free

― na (NA), Wednesday, January 4, 2017 9:20 AM (fourteen hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah i can't really hate on them for that, but the fact of the matter is that it means i don't hear stuff on drag city. i just posted on another thread that i didn't even realize there was a new high llamas album. didn't bother with the new papa m album or the last couple of laetitia sadier records, despite liking their stuff in the past. hardly know anything about bitchin' bajas despite suspecting i might like them. etc. i did pay for downloads of the latest jim o'rourke and joanna newsom albums, which i guess is what they're banking on.

really not fucking hard to find audio samples of drag city albums you might be interested in
jfc spotify is fucking garbage and has made you simpletons

yup v helpful thx

^^entitled shitbag

Not really.

― Οὖτις, Thursday, January 5, 2017 5:09 AM (four hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

there is no questioning ur logicz

velko, are you DC street team or something?

still, pretty sad if Spotify is your first and last stop for all new musical discoveries. Congratulations: you are my uncool cousins

sorry hawkz, obv uncalled for ott response from me *makes drinky-drinky motion*
this argument is tedious in 2017 tho
in fact, you might even call it a......drag

I guess it's a tedious argument but it's also kinda...I mean dc's position is rather an affectation here. it's like refusing to release yr movie to netflix or w/e because IT SHOULD BE SEEN IN THE THEATER

it's an affectation to not want to give away your product for free now?

DC shunning streaming services is cool w/ me -- there are a million ways to check out an artist's stuff if you need a sample. not including mp3s w/ vinyl purchases seems like they're just being curmudgeonly.

it's an affectation to not want to give away your product for free now?

this seems like an intentionally misleading reposing of the question, but sure, I'll bite. whoever you are, your music is presently available for free. not doing d/l codes with vinyl is tight-fisted and an affectation that inconveniences the people supporting you by buying the vinyl, and hosting the d/l code files for download isn't costly enough to justify being a shithead about it.

not putting your artists' music on streaming services -- a separate question -- deprives them of the small quarterly checks they might otherwise get, because plenty of people are just going to grab the motherfuckers by searching the band name + .rar instead, but the q is moot because I'm certain this is specified in any contract you sign w/dc so it's on you if you don't want yr (paltry! don't get me wrong! you do not get paid well for letting people have 24-hour-a-day access to your music on Spotify!) payment from the streaming bros.

where was that quote about how a majority of download codes are never used?

pretty sad if Spotify is your first and last stop for all new musical discoveries.

This is silly.

drag city bandcamp would be good

agreed, and then they could only stream one song per album if they wanted, or none.

we had a very similar chat on the bitchin bajas thread a while back.

and look - not a single bb track on their soundcloud.

tbh, i have given up caring now.

I bought the bitchin bajas/BPB collab vinyl unheard and was not disappointed

yeah i know that got a lot of love,
but i am more interested in the non-collab material.
but as i said, i am over it now.

where was that quote about how a majority of download codes are never used?

I think it was in Numero Group's announcement that they'd no longer be doing download codes - they reckoned only 5% were redeemed. I wonder if that's 5% of codes in all inventory purchased, or 5% of all the codes issued for a release?

I know that Fat Cat have stopped including codes (as of the recent C Duncan album).

I see both sides of the argument here. I don't mind that DC releases aren't on Spotify, etc, in full, but it is useful to be able to check out a track or two. The lack of download codes is more of an issue for me - it's nice to have the convenience of a digital version. If I know upfront there won't be a code I generally just go for the CD - Drag City or anyone else.

not putting your artists' music on streaming services...deprives them of the small quarterly checks they might otherwise get

yeah, you're right, Purling Hiss could probably really use that check to almost afford an oil change for their van

xp ordered some things last month from numero and they sent along a code to download mp3s immediately. is it a 2017 thing? or did they just mean they wouldn't include a piece of paper with a download code with vinyl. i definitely like ordering a physical album and being able to hear the music right away ...

(it's been said before, but) the biggest impediment for me in keeping up with DC are those unreadable email updates. just no excuse.

xp If you order direct you get a download, I think.

Re: Numero - Yep, direct orders get an instant download but they'll no longer include the bit of paper with the vinyl.

yeah, you're right, Purling Hiss could probably really use that check to almost afford an oil change for their van

I can't speak for Purling Hiss, but if you offer me the following proposition: "people get your music for free and you get nothing, or people still get your music for free and you get five bucks," I'm not so steely in my principles that I'm gonna say "KEEP YOUR FILTHY LUCRE, DON'T YOU SEE THERE ARE DEEPER THINGS IN PLAY HERE"

still think a method of unlocking albums on streaming platforms would be cooler than download codes. Don't want to manage any local digital content.

doesn't bandcamp kinda offer that via their app?

What... since when did Numero ever do download codes? I thought they were one of the labels that never did that...

at least a coupla years -- you order from their website and they send you an email w/ info about DL-ing mp3s.

Oh, but there was never any paper slip in the vinyl as was implied above?

i don't remember -- i think i've just gotten an email about having "downloads waiting" or something ...

Guess I was always out of luck getting their LPs from brick and mortar.

got no use for a DL code that doesn't offer FLAC files, I'll just rip the damn vinyl myself instead of dealing with MP3s (let's not derail this thread, they sound like shit to my ears and I am not interested in yr arguments to the contrary). Numero is a big offender in this regard. I just bought a $45 Unwound box set, give me the fucking FLACs.

this is one reason why I like Bandcamp

drag city puts out some great fucking records -- looking forward to the new Alasdair Roberts LP! And Six Organs!

Bitchin Bajas are one of my favorite acts on there, they're highly recommended. Some of their (non Drag City) stuff is even on Spotify! Wow!

did you check this out? pretty neat! http://sweetblahg.tumblr.com/post/154773932543/bitchin-bajas-in-c-2016

the 2016 Rangda album on DC is also excellent fwiw

yeah i think i underrated that one at first, but i was playing it a bit last month and it is awesome.

I like it much more than album #2

these posts are pretty good. just wish they could be read to me on spotify.

by wimmel's uncool cousins

ILM would be much better if it was just a Pandora station tbh.

Howling Hex's Denver record from 2016 is very solid too -- might be my fave from his current phase, a little more varied, anyway. I just saw the Hex playing a weird afternoon residency (i think global did too!) last month. at a wine bar kinda place!

bill callahan + will oldham alone probably make DC one of my favorite labels tbh. other stuff is great too

ooh thx for the link to In C!!

ha yea listening now too, thanks

rangda
ali roberts
6 organs
bbs

these are some of my favorite people making records today, so i am glad to support them
bandcamp is (imo) DC's best bet for satisfying longterm reliable customers (like me) and allowing weenie freeloaders (spotify cousins) to hear in order to form an opinion
beyond that, it's not really my decision to make and i have been buying DC records for what seems like forever

xxxp I listen to bill's kath bloom cover on spotify all of the time to help me cope

annual In C performance is always a good time, hope they keep it up!

I think Spotify Cousins are signed to Jagjaguwar, not Drag City

maybe Sacred Bones

i should really give rangda a listen, those SRB albums are some of my favorite guitar records ever, i love those early six organs albums a lot too

Wimmels' cousins could be Link Wray

Only Wimmels knows the degree to which we're burnt

Congratulations: you are my uncool cousins, Bjork and Roy Orbison

xp new 6O has Chris Corsano on it too, he is awesome (and part of what I love about Rangda)

i probably said this on the BBs thread, but part of the reason i think Drag City not being on streaming is good is that it miiiiiiight make "uncool cousins" realize that there is a world of music out there that isn't just spotifiable. and that might generate a little interest in the world outside of the computer. or it might just generate more insufferable snobs like us, probably.

it is not difficult to make music that is unspotifiable. I don't understand how this is a good or impressive thing.

it's the coolest!

(i don't know, i'm not really making sense)

insufferable snob generator is the name of my new band

well, better get your stuff on Spotify or no one will know it exists

that name's not as good though

the thing that's annoying about the "if your music isn't on Spotify no one will know it exists! Think of the exposure!" argument is that it neatly elides the fact that there are bajillions of bands on Spotify that no one knows about. It is not a promotional tool, unless you pay Spotify to promote you/expend resources working it as a PR tool, which will quickly eat up the miniscule revenue generated by Spotify.

Well, but I think it can be argued that it can be an auxiliary promotional tool if you are getting promotion in other ways and people can then check you out on Spotify.

people do ask "are you on Spotify?" when they e.g. work with you in some personal capacity (kids' teachers etc) and if you say yes, they go listen, and then a week later they say "I looked you up! say, I enjoyed the song I knew from the tv show!" - I guess outis's objection here would be "that translates into maybe one album sale for you, not really a huge promotional gain" but I'm gonna get three bucks of that sale and I can use three bucks so it counts for me. not as great a promotional tool as radio, ever, let's be honest, just because somebody still has to go "I'm going to listen to this": the passivity of radio engagement had huge promotional value. but Spotify as a promotional adjunct, it's got its uses ime.

As opposed to just typing your bandname into a search engine and being taken to band's page w soundcloud or bandcamp or other music links

yeah I mean -- you're a lifelong music fiend posting on a music board. that's obvious to both you and me. I can't imagine it's surprising to you that there's a gigantic segment of the population for whom a few very comfortable uses of technology are the go-tos. I utterly guarantee you that there are many many people (like, millions) who'll go as far as "I'm using spotify, I'll type in that band's name" who aren't about to google a band, pick a link, and pursue it that far

That's true. How many of those ppl are likely to dig Drag City bands? I would wager not a lot.

As opposed to the music nerds here complaining that DC's catalog is not on spotify - which is essentially entitled whining.

what I am reporting to you as a working musician is that the positive effect of availability on Spotify is real, measurable, and valuable. the same people who dig what I do -- the appeal of which is inherently self-limiting -- would be as likely to dig Bill Callahan for sure.

They've also been the label never to advertise (Chunklet excepted), never to license their songs to Starbucks/Chipotle, and so not being on streaming services feels like a natural continuation of that. And their artists know what they're getting into with that.

still doing it the right way, they are

i haven't been following this revive closely but i will say that i've liked a lot of dc acts over the years but given my limited time for new listening these days i'm gonna pick the new record that's on spotify over the new record that's on dc which i won't be able to play without 5 minutes of effort on my part.

like, it's a great label but i don't think they have a strong enough brand to override other forces at work.

otm. Though I did buy insignificance the other month because I loved it in high school and hadn't heard it in years. I don't think I love it anymore, so good work, DC.

"I kinda wish their stuff was on Spotify"="entitled whining"

Jesus.

I guess it kind of fits that most of DC's roster now is indie-grandpa music and y'all are yelling at clouds.

I just wish they kept selling t-shirts. Have a Viva Last Blues one I'd pray to fit into to.

Also: don't think Oldham, Callahan, Berman besides being old man indie have problems with a label that's given them notoriety and which they've never left. Give me a list of Drag City refugees... I can't think of any.

i probably said this on the BBs thread, but part of the reason i think Drag City not being on streaming is good is that it miiiiiiight make "uncool cousins" realize that there is a world of music out there that isn't just spotifiable. and that might generate a little interest in the world outside of the computer. or it might just generate more insufferable snobs like us, probably.

hehe I like this post

what's up with bitchin bajas, what a weird name for a band, listening to a song called "bueu" on youtube rn and it's awesome, is that the album to get? if so I'm buying the shit out of that cd, won't even bother to look it up on spotify

bought 'Dream River' for a friend last year and he did seem to have like a eureka moment when he realized this awesome music was not on spotify

They've also been the label never to advertise (Chunklet excepted), never to license their songs to Starbucks/Chipotle, and so not being on streaming services feels like a natural continuation of that. And their artists know what they're getting into with that.

yeah this is OTM for the most part. of course their stuff is avail on iTunes, whose royalty rate is set by Apple and non-negotiable, which you'd think would be a sticking point for the purer-than-pure but hey, a sale's a sale

I know O'Rourke doesn't want his music on Spotify because of sound quality issues rather than royalty rate issues, wonder if other DC artists feel the same way

I just wind up thinking about Drag City a lot less often because they don't come up in the main channels I use for checking out music.

This is such a strange viewpoint IMO. I mean, what were you doing five years ago when Spotify wasn't available?

http://i.imgur.com/zSb64B1.png

It’s interesting how Drag City doesn’t have any of their stuff on Spotify. I work in a restaurant, and I’m always trying and failing to play Trux or your solo music.

Neil Hagerty: There actually is one streaming service they license to, but it’s very specific to a hotel chain, or a hotel lobby, or some restaurants that are a part of its network. But that’s a different, smaller service. Personally, I’m for having the music in every venue where people can hear it, but I defer to Drag City for those things. I don’t make those decisions, they do. Personally, I would let it go out in any format that would give more people the opportunity to hear it, you know? But that’s a separation of our interests. They’ll feel another way, and I’ll defer to them on those issues.
http://bombmagazine.org/article/6931428/neil-michael-hagerty

This is such a strange viewpoint IMO. I mean, what were you doing five years ago when Spotify wasn't available?

― donut, Friday, January 6, 2017 7:56 AM (one hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I believe man alive was analyzing why DC is unintentionally not at the top of mind these days, based on how music consumption habits have changed. That's how I read it.

xp i don't have a problem w/ DC not being on streaming services but the weird thing to me is not deferring to the artist's preference here.

(assuming there are a number of other DC artists like hagerty that would otherwise be fine w/ streaming services)

I could be wrong here, but I thought Spotify was an "all in all out" sort of situation wrt labels. Can anyone confirm or deny this?

which would mean if a handful of (relative) cash cows rejected the idea of their music being available on Spotify, everyone else would have to follow suit

There have definitely been cases of big artists pulling just *their* catalog, but maybe they have their own dedicated publisher or something?

Like Taylor Swift isn't there but other Big Machine albums are

I'm pretty sure this is all about the bottom line w/The Drag City folks and making sure their artists get a fair shake, which I find admirable. But, the other side of the coin is that DC vinyl is rather expensive, usually $20.00 or more for a single LP. That's a tall order.

the main issue i have remains the same and has nothing to do with spotify -- if i buy the LP, i want to be able to listen elsewhere and a downloadable option costs extra which means i pay like $30 for an album

and i am happy to give money to my favorite artists i just feel like it's inhumane to their loyal longterm customers to squeeze that hard
i go to shows too
will probably just focus on buying vinyl at shows i guess

From Will Oldham's AMA on Reddit last year: (https://www.reddit.com/r/indieheads/comments/51n7bz/ask_me_anything_will_oldham/) on subject of Drag City policy:

giraffeking
Hey Will, do you agree with Drag City's philosophy of not allowing their music on streaming services? And with their stance, do you worry about not reaching an audience that would want to listen to an album first before buying it?

bonafide138 (Will Oldham)
I don't know. we don't eat a meal before deciding if we'll pay for it. we don't wear clothes before buying them. we don't see a movie before buying the ticket. streaming is pretty bogus, it feeds the entitlement mentality. there are more vital audiences that I worry about reaching, besides/in addition to those who are dependent on a computer/smartphone and a wireless signal to listen to music

firetruckfiretruck
I get your point and agree to an extent, but we most definitely do try on clothes before buying them. Changing rooms?

bonafide138
Drag City puts up a streaming song prior to the release of almost every Drag City record. This might parallel the experience of trying on an item of clothing in a 3x3 flourescent-lit box, with price tags and security devices still attached to the garment.

Dr_Pickle_Fingers
Drag City is my favourite label and has been so for about 15 years. Times have changed, though, and it is sadly less convenient for me to listen to my many Drag City albums. I have to pull out all my old cables and such.
My point is this: I would totally pay a monthly subscription to Drag City for a Drag City streaming/download service. You, Joanna Newsom, Bill Callahan, Silver Jews, Faun Fables, Baby Dee. Hell, it'd be a better library than Spotify.

bonafide138
this is good news.

blacktoast
Will I love your music and I've been a listener for many years, but your viewpoint on this is deeply out of touch. I found your music through peer-to-peer sharing, as I've found most of the artists that I listen to and enjoy. Most people that are excited about hearing new music today are doing so using an internet connection, and that's not an "entitlement mentality" that's just the media climate that we're in. To expect people to continue to buy CDs in lieu of finding music on the internet is naive.

FearStalksTheLand
Just so you know I was a huge fan, and I have bought a lot of your music. The times have changed and I don't carry a iPod I can put my music one anymore. I have not heard any music from you in 6 years or so. In my mind you fit in the entitled audience of Neil Young of people who think they can dictate people listen to music.

bonafide138
Where Neil Young has created a new form of file and would like listeners to buy new gear, I say please keep your record player, your tape player, your CD player. Don't spend money following corporate evolution unless you feel you have to. And you can find almost all of my music on YouTube. So I don't get your point.

xpost (coincidentally!)

Oldham's talked a lot in interviews about how the 200/300-person club is the ideal size for performing, and how he wouldn't want the norm to be larger than that. I'm assume there are other DC artists who similarly want that level of success/fame, versus a label that will take them to the next level. And similarly not just with music placement but with their lives in general. There's certainly a level then of "how do they afford to live?" but if that's taken out of the equation, ideally the artists are working at the level they want to be working at.

Been interesting to see Adult Swim take DC's ethos to television.

Oldham's talked a lot in interviews about how the 200/300-person club is the ideal size for performing

totally agree w this, personally.

I'm an old that doesn't stream but I do use Youtube if I need to.

Drag City will endure all these streaming services imho... Spotify lost a tremendous amount of money last year, purportedly one quarter of one billion dollars, lol.

i stream & pay for spotify premium but would never begrudge an artist or label who decides it's not for him

Drag City will endure all these streaming services imho

idk how they do it but this is v likely to be true

Don't spend money following corporate evolution unless you feel you have to

so simple yet so otm

yup

http://pitchfork.com/news/70724-Drag-City-announces-closure-job-losses

fuck you for that (but also lol)

ha

Rock, in contrast, is the most popular genre in general, with 29 percent of consumption, but accounts for only 20 percent of the streaming market.

Part of streaming’s increased success, Nielsen finds, is that it’s the preferred platform for hip-hop and R&B fans. The genres make up 22 percent of all audio consumption, but 28 percent of on-demand streams.

So hip-hop and rnb fans are tight-arses?

good insight dude

or just more concerned w convenience/cheaper/poorer - take yr pick

also possibly less interested in "albums" as discrete artifacts idk

or smart

i prefer boxedjoy's interpretation of radio wont play it

so they have to stream it

that makes sense too

the Dans know all

what

the guys who run DC

Issues of compensation and business model aside, how mindblowing a piece of software is Spotify? Instant access to every song in the worlds biggest record collection!

I could not have imagined something like this as a kid.

Remember when Napster came out, the thrill of music being available per request! Up until then I could only hear what came on the radio, what was on mtv, on sampler cds with music magazines, and of course what I could afford and what I could borrow from friends or at the library...

Remember vividly a day at the school library, I must have been 12 or 13, I was on the computer and some girls from a class above mine were doing group work. I was on iMesh and so I asked them: Hey, is there a song you'd like to hear? They were hesitant to answer, maybe cause they didn't see the point of the question, probably also because it amounted to a kind of flirting and they were my seniors and all. But anyway, after a short while one of the girls was like, "I think he'll be able to get the song on the computer" and they asked for Lady Marmalade (the Xtina, Lil Kim, Mya, Pink version).

I searched for it and 20 minutes later I'd downloaded it and was able to play it back through the sound blasters. Felt like magic. The girls were impressed, but I think I was even more impressed. Never forgot that day.

so not gonna happen

lol

Issues of compensation and business model aside
Issues of compensation and business model aside
Issues of compensation and business model aside
Issues of compensation and business model aside
Issues of compensation and business model aside
Issues of compensation and business model aside
Issues of compensation and business model aside

Napster wasn't great for musicians either - but for the listeners? Amazing

I think it's fine if musicians can make a living from single/album sales (if they can buy a private jet I think it's silly) but I'm not sure it's necessary for there to be great music? lots of people make music for fun, ambitious stuff too

You don't hear expensive string arrangements on a lot of records these days, production value on a lot of new releases is probably lower than in the 90s - but there's tons of great stuff, right?

anyway, did not mean to further derail this dc thread, there are separate threads for this

you're right, why do we need the modern equivalent of Pet Sounds, Rumours, or Houses Of The Holy Road when we have Car Seat Headrest

Houses of the Holy, that is

everything's better now

sorry to be snarky. This is a sensitive topic for me

lots of people make music for fun, ambitious stuff too

don't you think that these 'lots of people' often reflect a very specific demographic of people privileged enough to have the free time to do this without having to worry about working a full time job? And don't you suspect this imbalance might be silencing voices that would otherwise be making great music?

no, I don't think so - especially not in an American context where jazz, blues, r'n'b, hip hop were at least partially rooted in "under-privileged" demographics

you're right, why do we need the modern equivalent of Pet Sounds, Rumours, or Houses Of The Holy when we have Car Seat Headrest

lots of things "might be silencing voices that would otherwise be making great music" but I'm not sure economics of album sales is... prominent

come to think of it - how are voices silenced? makes me think abtthe metal scene in Iran suffering oppression, but that's a case of censorship - is censorship more silencing than material concerns? (if the two are separable)

Silenced or confronted with barriers to entry? Different and both relevant but not in the thread for Drag City, of all things

xp the part about your post that triggered me was the thing about 'expensive string arrangements,' because I happened to be lamenting this very thing just yesterday. I was in a friend's car and she was listening to Aja, and all I could think about was how a record like that, under current conditions, could never get made now. Aside from the mechanics and logistics (flying session players across an ocean, recording at multiple studios), there's the matter of the cameraderie that "evil major label money" afforded bands like this. My concerns are just as much aesthetic as they are political (but that too)

it's interesting you bring up jazz because I doubt the average millennial Spotify junkie could name five working jazz artists that aren't in some way connected to Flying Lotus. Even if they could, they're not exactly 'supporting' them just by merely knowing who they are, and that may be even worse. Without benefactors, this is a music that will more or less cease to exist in any commercial capacity (and before you say anything, I would argue that as long as Downbeat still somehow exists it still does, despite the odds, exist in something resembling a commercial capacity)

La Lechera otm, sorry for the major derail, lord knows there are already dozens of threads about this (one more excruciating than the next)

just to clarify:

in an American context where jazz, blues, r'n'b, hip hop were at least partially rooted in "under-privileged" demographics

and funded by millions and millions of dollars of major label money

Napster wasn't great for musicians either
Napster wasn't great for musicians either
Napster wasn't great for musicians either
Napster wasn't great for musicians either
Napster wasn't great for musicians either
Napster wasn't great for musicians either
Napster wasn't great for musicians either
Napster wasn't great for musicians either
Napster wasn't great for musicians either

Niels absolutely killin' it ITT

just to clarify:

in an American context where jazz, blues, r'n'b, hip hop were at least partially rooted in "under-privileged" demographics

and funded by millions and millions of dollars of major label money

The situation was complex, at least with blues and jazz, but, yeah, I was puzzling over how to respond to that one too.

so much to say about the issues Wimmels raises I hardly know where to start, and can't in fact settle on a place to start. big question, the relative virtues of the old label system and its deep recording/studio budgets.

Stop Thinking of Yourself as a Good Person: The Ethics and Economics of Music Streaming

Related discussion

I'm trying to get this; Steely Dan's "camaraderie" was based on them getting paid a lot by the labels? They couldn't record Aja now because they can't fly studio musicians in to do dozens of takes?

Seems to me the home studio and digital recording, not to mention being able to fly tracks in from remote musicians, would allow the studio rat immense opportunities to make "perfect"-ish albums.

Lol no

Okay. Why?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Random_Access_Memories#Conception

Gott Punch it's a question of process. I know a dude, massive studio badass, played on Nick of Time -- he's available as a session guy and is widely known to be a total fucking gunslinger. If you send him your track, you WILL get something awesome back. And you'll be happy with it, or you'll ask for a slight tweak, and that'll be that. What you won't get -- and this, I want to be clear, is a very mixed thing, neither good nor bad, it has its ups and its downs -- is Nick of Time. You won't the control you would have gotten if you had this guy in a chair at Village Recorders for 8 hours and you were behind the glass stroking your chin and listening to playback in the moment, fully immersed, focused to a pretty unhealthy point of focus on what was directly in front of you. There's much more to blame/credit about this, and much of it is for the good. But the reason you can't get another Aja or Pet Sounds or w/e is that the culture of the whole process has changed. It's much less dehumanizing now, and more comfortable for everybody concerned, even though the budgets are smaller. But every touring musician I know, knows that if you play 30 dates in a row, you will be on fucking fire by the end of that run. You'll be crazy and depressed and unable to communicate with normal people, probably, but you'll be producing music at a pretty high level. Same concept w/the old studio model imo. It afforded the people making the music the luxury of very long hours in perfectly equipped studios with world-class engineers on hand 24 hours a day. The "send the amazing player a track" process keeps the most important element -- the player -- but the rest of these elements, again just imo, contributed to a deeply unhealthy hothouse environment whose virtue was that it produced a bunch of the rock/pop records that came be thought of as classics.

tl;dr it's not about money but it is partially about money.

also, most home studios don't run 2" analog tape (again $ related)

addendum, I do actually think there are people still worrying the studio model in the same insanely luxurious fashion. most of them are in rap - Kanye, Black Hippy guys. Justin Vernon built himself a massive studio in the woods and takes his time getting the record to sound exactly like he wants. But that studio rat model, I believe strongly that the aspect of all the working musicians being together and under the direction of the guys whose vision guides the project, that's actually kind of important to the project. Remote tracking isn't new and has produced plenty of great tracks, and many great albums were recorded at multiple studios, but the process is so different when the presence of the musician is no longer required. IMO only I could be wrong but this is how it seems to me.

xp I happen to agree w/sleeve but that's a controversial position.

really tickled that major label practices that were long excoriated by the likes of Drag City et al in the 1990s are being defended on this thread. Like i hardly am deeply familiar withe the label's doings in the past 15 years, but i never knew those guys or their artists to advocate for maximilist studio fantasias.

JCLC thanks for that explanation, I can see that.

Joan otm upthread and said many of the things I wanted to say but more eloquently, even if we disagree slightly

really tickled that major label practices that were long excoriated by the likes of Drag City et al in the 1990s are being defended on this thread. Like i hardly am deeply familiar withe the label's doings in the past 15 years, but i never knew those guys or their artists to advocate for maximilist studio fantasias

I don't think anyone here is speaking for Drag City, and I'm certainly in no way associated with the label, but I wonder if many of the "indie" veterans are now thinking twice about bemoaning the existence of evil major label gatekeepers now that very few of them are able to carve out even a modest living putting out a record and touring 100 days a year (which, make no mistake, was absolutely possible a few short years ago)

Like i hardly am deeply familiar withe the label's doings in the past 15 years, but i never knew those guys or their artists to advocate for maximilist studio fantasias.

― veronica moser, Saturday, January 7, 2017 12:35 PM (fifty-two minutes ago)

They actually parted ways with label stalwart Liam Hayes for doing such a thing:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fed_(album)

Great album btw.

sorta kinda in my case. the downside of the major label system was considerable: you seldom got final say over how stuff sounded. contracts were shiiiiiiitttty. in the present day environment, artists at most levels have a lot more control than they used to, but they also can't avail themselves of the resources I've mentioned -- though they could make records just as lush, only as I mentioned wanting to make those sorts of records at all was somewhat a function of that decried system. only the major players had control/final cut in the auteur system. now it's kind of inverted. the Joan Crawford Band, who makes a good living making music we love, would have been laughed out of the door at every major label with the possible exceptions of Reprise & A&M. that's true of a lot of good bands, and Drag City bands are some of them. who in the old system would have taken a chance on Will Oldham? Bill Callahan? David Berman? Maybe maybe Lenny Waronker. Maybe maybe Clive Davis. But probably nobody.

Even something recorded with a very modest budget of a few grand, like say 3-4 days in a studio with someone like Steve Albini (or home recorded) with mastering for vinyl etc. is going to cost probably at least $5000 (or more). With the costs for pressing vinyl etc, you are going to have to move probably at least 1000 units to even come close to breaking even. If you look at it that way, first press you might be looking a single LP with a base cost of at least $8-12 a unit. CDs would obviously be quite a bit less and getting digital files up for sale fairly negligible after the digital mastering. But you are still going to have to probably do $8-9 grand worth of sales on a title before you are square.

I'd figure guys like Will Oldham that have a long history, this is probably no problem up front, but for others, it might be a dice roll. Does Drag City move that many LPs on each of their title? I don't know, quite a few touring bands you see do LP print runs quite a bit lower than 1000.

I'm not sure if we're taking this to the Stop Thinking of Yourself as a Good Person: The Ethics and Economics of Music Streaming thread or not, but I think there've been lots of great posts itt (great stuff by JCLC)

anyway,

it's interesting you bring up jazz because I doubt the average millennial Spotify junkie could name five working jazz artists that aren't in some way connected to Flying Lotus. Even if they could, they're not exactly 'supporting' them just by merely knowing who they are, and that may be even worse. Without benefactors, this is a music that will more or less cease to exist in any commercial capacity

I also think jazz is a very interesting scene for thinking about these questions. I happen to know a few "professional" jazz players and they are broke - was talking to a drummer the other day, and he was like "I don't even know why I keep doing it - it's so irrational. My pay is terrible, I've no retirement fund etc. etc."

For all the injustice, the main takeaway for me is that musicians (unlike label owners) produce music regardless of the cost. And this is why, ironically, talking about unfair Spotify recompensation can end in a defense of major label Aja-like productions - cause these are perhaps the phenomenon most endangered! Certainly the hardcore diy scene could give a fuck about Napster.

I'm not too acquainted with the conditions for "indie" musicians, but I gather from the latest Okkervil River release that Will Sheff is not very happy abt the state of things...

A final note: as much as I love Aja and Pet Sounds, I'm not sure I'd root for a revivalist aesthetic, and I think RAM was a good indication that replication 70s top shelf production value does not necessarily = good music. That being said, the success of Kaputt enabled Dan Bejar to do some great string arrangements for last years Destroyer record, and that was awesome.

Certainly the hardcore diy scene could give a fuck about Napster

I would have thought this too, but I know a few punk / hc bands on small labels and I can tell you the consequences of Spotify et al have definitely trickled down. The so-called democratization of music that became possible after the toppling of the old system (ie cheap software, digital self-distribution models, etc) has also created a situation where supply now far outweighs demand while the pie continues getting smaller and smaller. More bands / artists than ever = fewer and fewer tenaciously dedicated fans on the sidelines. It affects everything at every level imo

that's surprising to me... I stand corrected!

tbf, I bet a grind / crust / whatever band on a stacked 8-band bill playing a basement / squat on a Tuesday night might not notice any difference, but I'd say that's maybe one possible exception; maybe some of the less ambitious noise bands, too. But I still think those artists are fighting for the attention of a smaller and smaller group of listeners, whether they realize it or not

a few punk / hc bands on small labels and I can tell you the consequences of Spotify et al have definitely trickled down.

I think about this sometimes - how in the mid-nineties, a whole lot of pretty love-it-or-hate-it HC bands could release 7"s and sell at least 500, which is usually the minimum pressing at a plant (1000 was the going minimum actually but you could swing a deal to press 2 records in runs of 500 at once to meet the minimum), and is a number which, if you sell through at even two bucks a copy, lets you recoup & maybe buy a new snare drum. those 50-page-long MRR reviews sections -- nobody was getting rich, but a fair number of bands almost nobody remembers were breaking even or coming close. now? your two songs on Bandcamp will get you a dollar if people hear about it. I don't know, because I'm not current with that scene at all, but I'd imagine the economics of making hardcore are pretty punishing in the wake of Spotify/downloading.

drag citys an alltime great label really respect them just doin their own thing f the system, crazy thing abt spotify et al is not only are musicians not making any more but neither are the streaming services who are doomed to be swallowed by bigger entities who can use them as loss leaders and eventually discontinue them when they lose interest wattba

At the very least, I'm glad we are discussing this like adults (albeit on the wrong thread), because I usually run into a lot of quasi-Darwinist "boo fucking hoo, times are changing, fuck you" derision when I bring up the issue of musicians' vanishing livelihoods

streaming feels the least like following corporate evolution bc you don't need to buy into a medium or format that will be replaced in 5 years. It is the best idea, and I hope we can find a way to make it work well for the artists.

That ship has sailed. We're reverting to previous musical culture regimes (folk music by/for plebes, elite of well-paid pet musicians paid by wealthy benefactors)

and future islands

What you get without streaming is the idea of the pilgrimage - to the record store, or having to wait to get it in the mail, and so on. Given the 70s self-released grails they're reissued (Red Hash, etc.), it's consistent with their ethos that they like having something be exciting to discover instead of available everywhere. Similar to having to roadtrip to Guerneville or Gainesville to see a Will Oldham show, instead of waiting for an annual pass through the Mercury Lounge. (Nothing wrong with that - it's just not them!)

really tickled that major label practices that were long excoriated by the likes of Drag City et al in the 1990s are being defended on this thread. Like i hardly am deeply familiar withe the label's doings in the past 15 years, but i never knew those guys or their artists to advocate for maximilist studio fantasias.

― veronica moser, Saturday, January 7, 2017 8:35 PM (two days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Joanna Newsom got to record her second record with an orchestra and hire Van Dyke Parks, Jim O'Rourke and Steve Albini [though I take it his rates are reasonable as part of his whole deal] on Drag City's dime AFAIK, for which she has repeatedly praised them. I hope it worked out as well for them as it did for us and JN.

Eazy those are really good thoughts - that framework of pilgrimage is something I hadn't really thought about

Full catalog is now on Bandcamp: https://dragcity.bandcamp.com/

"....BANDcamp, that is! Yes, the viral digital world is not a place easily trusted - not when you're a label like ours, with precious cargo that must never be handled frivolously! (Yes, including Final Flesh.) For those who have been urging us to throw all our bands into the deep end of all this mess, we'll meet you mid "stream": the whole fookin' Drag City catalog is now available digitally via Bandcamp! So for all the neophytes out there (you're the ones reading our newsletter, right?), enjoy the complimentary musical wares we've provided - then take advantage of Bandcamp's artist-friendly build to explore the world of ALL Drag City artists (and even some (dis)honorary ones) - and make your downloading decisions with both care and financial abandon. We sure dig this Bandcamp thing - and if it turns out to be worth a penny, then we'll have to consider the further implications of the non-pornographic-side of the internet. Help us help you help us make that decision! Make an extended trip to Drag City on Bandcamp."

whoa

hey, nice

this is rad

oh snap

Finally! Thank you Drag City

only one track to stream per album though so people will still complain about this

that's fine. it's nice to be able to explore all DC artists - so many that i've heard about but never looked into - in one place that is easily browsable and accessible. i know it's all on youtube anyway and i can deal w/ that but this is cool

also i really like the artist thumbnails. i want to chill in meg baird's living room and listen to recorsd

https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2015/06/08/meg-baird_wide-4c215cf31a3b6462bf428b21cbb9115d781a604d.jpg

nice

bandcamp is thriving btw https://daily.bandcamp.com/2017/01/24/everything-is-terrific-the-bandcamp-2016-year-in-review/

only one track to stream per album though so people will still complain about this

― na (NA), Friday, January 27, 2017 10:23 AM (thirty-seven minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

seems like the perfect arrangement

lol those albums in that pic are so meticulously chosen <3

and yeah one track per album and $9 for FLAC is fine with me

weird that the Half Japanese reissues aren't there

great news!

bandcamp is thriving btw https://daily.bandcamp.com/2017/01/24/everything-is-terrific-the-bandcamp-2016-year-in-review/

― lag∞n, Friday, January 27, 2017 4:01 PM (eighteen minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

just want to note that the second comment underneath this was left by someone from the band Primitive Radio Gods

that is the standard press pic for meg baird afaik
i've seen it a bunch of times

Full catalog is now on Bandcamp: https://dragcity.bandcamp.com/

OMG

only one track to stream per album though

oh

Re: Half Japanese reissues—I'm guessing they aren't on there due to the recent reissues on Fire.

Re: Half Japanese reissues—I'm guessing they aren't on there due to the recent reissues on Fire.

(Inadvertent double post, obvs.)

oh hmm I did not realize that Fire had reissued the 1981-85 material! thanks.

Hey, it's a start, welcome to the 21st century Drag City

Meanwhile

1994! A great year for Drag City releases is now is available at your fingertips on @AppleMusic ! pic.twitter.com/veJV5mnVFl

— Drag City (@dragcityrecords) June 23, 2017

The Royal Trux and Palace stuff doesn't seem to be available (for me anyway)

seems like most of their catalog is up on spotify. notable exceptions from a brief search include jim o'rourke, joanna newsom, will oldham, red apple falls

Disappointed to hear that one of the last holdouts finally gave in. Streaming music is for lames

otm

I don't see any

April Fools(?)

Had to go through the This is: Drag City playlist

oh man, this is fantastic

Btw – DC will always be stone classic, but this label and I sure have grown apart over the past decade or so.

(I also met Rian M. in person, which kinda shattered the illusion; but that’s no one’s fault...)

I can finally listen to Silver Jews again!

You know their records and CDs have been available all along, right?

I don't own a record or CD player and all the ones I've bought off iTunes are on an external hardrive in the back of a closet somewhere.

You can even buy them used. That way the artist gets nothing!

Especially if they're promo cds, because you can actually <i>take</i> the artist's money that way.

I've actually been buying records of artists that I listen to a lot after I started streaming music, just so they get some money and because 10 years of buying mp3s was unsatisfying in a way. So I should probably spring for record equipment because Im starting to amass a collection but it would cost a lot to get good gear and I would have to carve out space to set it up. But I did buy all the SJ albums during the iTunes years, although to my understanding artists werent getting paid well from that arrangement either

lol Jim O still holding out

I don't see Newsome or Callahan but jamming some Silver Jews now - yesssssss!!

The game may be rigged and all streaming services should be overthrown but until we get there I'm happy that these great artists will have a better chance at exposure and that I can easily put friends onto their music

smog/callahan

aw man, so good - thanks!

Listening to Papa M's Live from a Shark Cage right now -- yay!

So this is what those cryptic, passive-aggressive Instagram posts were about...

weird. I can see the page for smog/callahan from the links above but it doesn't show up in searches. can't see silver jews, papa M, etc

https://open.spotify.com/artist/4ePunOqQbOYoQwd1298g3Z?si=7KMKvouVS0KP4KpR-but2g

seems the indexing isn't up to speed

NP: The High Llamas - Talahomi Way

A mini modern masterpiece. :)

Listening to Papa M's Live from a Shark Cage right now -- yay!

― jaymc, Sunday, April 1, 2018 11:54 PM (thirteen hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I actually got excited chills realizing this is available now. And I actually still have my CD of it, so I don't know why I don't just listen to it on CD, but I never listen to CDs.

Perhaps now is a good time for a renewed S/D for this label. I listened to tons of this stuff in the 90s (Palace, Gastr del Sol, Aerial/Papa M, and others from that period). In the last 15 years or so I've probably only listened to some of the bigger artists. As I scan through the artists on the label now, there's a bunch I don't know.

the whole chicago circuit is worth looking into- ryley walker/bill mackkay, bitchin bajas, circuit des yeux, they all kinda run in the same circles

Dope Body is sick

natural information society/ka and meg baird also

global otm -- it is very tight crew + natural info society is sooooooo goooooood
if alasdair roberts is in there, i recommend him a lot

imo it would be characteristically drag city to give this to spotify people for only a short period of time -- maybe 6 month contract -- and then not renew their contract.

definitely search the six organs / rangda / richard bishop universe

oh yeah
dang i forgot about them
RANGDA

people are going to be like omg why did i not...oh yeah

I am going to check the hell out of this Helena Espvall & Masaki Batoh album!

^^ both of those are great

Is Matt Sweeney + Bonnie Prince Billy - Superwolf up? (not seeing it via search) That used to be a big favourite of mine.

yeah that one might be my favorite oldham

supposedly some of his palace (music) stuff is up but i couldn't find any

the palace bros 7"s are up which if you ever wanted to hear what "Trudy Dies" would sound like with mellotron and a left-field "out" guitar solo, well... here's your chance!

The very first Palace Brothers album is there, but that's the only full-length.

the palace bros 7"s are up which if you ever wanted to hear what "Trudy Dies" would sound like with mellotron and a left-field "out" guitar solo, well... here's your chance!

― Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Monday, April 2, 2018 10:50 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

the original vers tbf, think that was the first thing i ever bought by them

They got in right before the IPO!

So, uh, I'm guessing these guys are about to give up on the CD format completely. It's been tapering as an option on their releases for the past couple years, but now it seems like a CD release is the exception rather than the rule. The New Bums album is vinyl only and the just announced Peacers album is vinyl and cassette only. Not surprised, I guess, just bummed. Weird that cassettes must be hitting higher sales numbers for them though.

yeah that’s a drag (hahah). Kinda surprised they’ve held out this long. I still think CDs might be cool again in 20 years or something if we still have an energy grid and stuff.

I mean, I think it depends on the genre and labels, really. Seems like a lot of jazz and prog stuff is still getting heavily released in the CD format and it still seems to be strong for the deluxe reissue world, but who knows. I don't think it'll ever go away completely, just become more of a niche thing. I mean, I know Numero Group gave up on them (which makes me extra sad knowing that Husker Du may now never see a decent, proper release on that format).

It bums me out... don’t people listen to albums in the car (and want better sound than an streaming over Bluetooth)?

I do! I mean, I still buy CDs all the time. I have some vinyl, but it's expensive as shit for a lot of titles compared to CDs, a lot of labels stopped giving download codes, pressing issues, pressing delays meaning the vinyl can sometimes come months later, I spend a lot of time away from a record player, etc. I like vinyl, but CD is still the most functional for me.

I'm really curious about the economics regarding cassettes these days though, is there really that much of a market that labels would pick that over CD as lower quantity second physical media option?

And, lol, at the risk of this becoming my own personal physical format blog, I would be curious to know if it would ever be possible/economically feasible to expand that Bandcamp vinyl pressing on demand thing to CDs as well.

cassette sales doubled in 2020 fwiw:

https://www.bbc.com/news/newsbeat-55476419

Amazing that Drag City avoided streaming for so long only to abandon CDs shortly after embracing streaming.

Thanks sleeve, wonder how the US figures compare. I know cassettes keep a pretty decent following for metal, experimental and noise bands, but it just seems so weird for cassettes to be where manufacturing dollars are spent at this point in time. But, I guess that's why I don't run a label.

Is there a corresponding jump in sales of tape-decks?

Amazing that Drag City avoided streaming for so long only to abandon CDs shortly after embracing streaming.

Haha. Yes! I have a huge number of Drag City CDs precisely because they were shunning streaming. It was an effective strategy. No more Drag City CDs would mean 100.00% streaming their new releases here. I'm not about to become an olde worlde analogue format fetishist.

It bums me out... don’t people listen to albums in the car (and want better sound than an streaming over Bluetooth)?

― one of the only artist who is genuine (morrisp), Thursday, January 21, 2021 3:39 PM (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

finding a new car these days with a CD player factory installed is turning non-existent. cars are turning to that point where you need a discman to hook into the AUX to get that satisfaction, a sorta pre-CD players in cars era.

That’s interesting, it’s been standard in our last few leased vehicles (most recent is a 2019).

my 2018 subaru doesn't have a cd player, i only even thought to look a couple weeks ago!

It would skip like crazy careening over all those rugged trails and dry stream beds!

https://i.imgur.com/fkwePBI.jpg

Those sun visors were great... if you wanted to scratch the shit out of your CDs.

What is God? Records about – curated by someone in particular? (I tried searching for info, but just found some similarly-named labels.)

Ty Segall I think?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ty_Segall#GOD?_Records

Don't seem to have a thread on them so I'll toss it in here, but the new Wand live album is fantastic. In a more just world, they'd have at least half of that rabid King Gizz fanbase.