Will Oldham/Palace/Bonnie Prince Billie: S&D

favourite song title, rather. the album from which it's taken, arise, therefor, is very dull though, imo. i'm not an expert on the man, though my brother was very enthousiastic about the palace brothers' there is no-one that will take care of you.

your appreciation of oldham probably rises and falls with three things: a. your appreciation of his basic shtick (rich indie kid from louisville, ex-child actor playing faux-ozarks ballads), b. the rather...cracked quality of his voice, c. the quality of the songwriting itself (which i think is actually quite high if not exactly immediately memorable...cf. my above comment about not realizing i owned almost all his records.)

it's too early in the morning to do a full on s&d but for right now search:

"there is no one what will take care of you" - the first palace brothers albun, released in its first edition anonymously, not unlike john fahey's first lp. obviously his songwriting and voice are at their earliest but not necesarily weakest: when he stretches out he sounds like a particularly enervated neil young.

"days in the wake" - the most stripped down release in the oldham catalogue, right down to the jandek referencing cover art. mostly just will and guitar, quite a few emotional bombs/great lines dropped, an LP a shade over 27 minutes.

"i see a darkness" - probably his all around best record, 38 minutes, short and sweet. dig the celtic/islands vibe on "madeline mary" and the fuzzed out sub-dub bass of "death to everyone." also, the last track may be the prettiest thing he's ever written.

"ease down the road" - tom favorably compared these to the fat & happy & bearded dylan of the (mid?) 70s. he's right; a contented oldham is not necessarily a happy oldham, but he's certainly janutier than normally.

also SEARCH: the johnny cash cover of "i see a darkness" on american iii: solitary man. a mediation on a vision of death by a man who at the time was staring it directly in the face.

The only album I rarely listen to anymore is Arise Therefore, the rest are in constant rotation.

Search the Almost Heaven EP too, with Rian Murphy.

Personally though I amn't listening to that kind of music now, I think Will Oldham is a great man. I see a darkness is probably one of my favourite songs ever, I forget if it made my perfect 15 or not.

His cover of AC/DC Big Balls is pretty good too. I don't have all his stuff but I wish I did. I think what makes him interesting is his voice which can convey desperation and sadness better than almost anyone else I've ever heard.

Search Also:Every Mothers Son, and most of I see a darkness album.

I don't know if I would destroy the likes of Arise, Therefore, Joya, and his inumerable EPs and "versions," but they generally don't do much for me. He definitely hit a slack patch there for a while around A,T.

When he first started out, he appeared to be the epitome of something I really hate--the po-faced roots-music dilettante. But there was something so idiosyncratic and cracked about the first single and album that I was hooked anyway. Then I saw him live for the first time: no acoustic guitars, no wood-smoke croon--he was leading a rock band and wearing leather pants that laced up the sides. Confounded again. Then he put out Days in the Wake: solo acoustic, with tons more of those great what-the-hell-is-that-all-about songs. After that I paid close attention just in case I might miss something.

Now I take him at his word that he's feeling his way forward, trying to write about emotional states that aren't always rational, or that he has trouble articulating rationally. And while even the best albums he's done since have their weak songs--or even moments when it sounds like he's just a musical slummer whacking off with both hands-- like as not he comes up with a few tunes that describe or tap into something I've felt but couldn't have described either. And then there's his singing, which is almost always worth a listen, even though it annoys me to distraction when he chews gum while singing live.

As a side note, I also like the way he casually drops the erotic and vulgar into his lyrics. I mean, some of his lyrics are bizarrely, explicitly sex-obsessed, but that stuff is never there to shock or serve as a punchline (well, except maybe that bit about fucking a mountain). In his songs wrong-headed trysts, cum stains, blowjobs, and cunnilingus are just as much a part of life as not knowing how you feel. Seems pretty sound to me.

here's a pic of Will

• lost blues and other songs (singles/rarities comp) - search "lost blues", "marriage", "west palm beach"
• side 2 of viva last blues
• "one with the birds", "patience/take however long you want", "little boy blue", "trudy dies" (the 7" version) singles

definitely some melody there for you. check out the peel session of "you have cum in your hair..." which I like better than the original.

i find him interesting because he has a great voice (narrative- wise, but also vocally) uh... is it indie-pride week yet?

I got Arise, Therefore today. PERFECT for my mood.

Colin, you're not alone, I am also a big fan of Arise, Therefore. I think it's one of his most consistent works. I am very much looking forward to his upcoming greatest hits record, which I heard will be re-recordings.

It's hard to explain the mystique, I'm aware of the pretense of it all, but somehow, I find him very talented despite the obviously forced illusions. I think he'd be great to have a beer with. I don't own all of his records but the ones I do have I would not trade. Fair enough?

When I saw him, he didn't so much change as flesh out some of the earlier, sparser melodies. A lot of the really meandering/weird stuff from Days In The Wake, for example, was given a nice full band treatment. He also played with solo electric guitar for about 1/3 of the set, the band coming out to rejoin him for the end.

Further comments... there's a six minute long, full-band version of "No More Workhorse Blues" on this bootleg from Austria I found. Crazy. Parts of it sound spanish, then when the song climax the drums really start to come in. Unrecognizable initially!

There's also a wonderfully twisted piece written by will in today's guardian.

(p.s. THANKS NA!!!!!!)

A question, though: how can I find out who played on/produced the songs, without tracking down the original singles? The big Oldham websites don't seem to have that info. I'd like to know which song(s) were produced by Kramer, Adam & Eve, etc...

there's always been a protean quality to his music, which often goes overlooked largely because of the superhuman insularity of his misterioso hillbilly shtick. people tend to link him with these old balladeer types, which a certain prominent vein of his music does encourage. but i hear--sublimated and reconstituted beautifully in the last 3 records--a whole bunch of less-austere influences (sorry mark) there, like a thousand singer-songwriters and alterindie bands.

I don't know why I never really responded to the other Palace albums (though I like some of the songs on "Days in the Wake"). These early singles are just another breed - not just the songs themselves, but the production, the playing, the atmosphere...

"just to see my holly home" is a very funny song. it's about, i guess, the dark side of the whole "nuclear family" thing--the family has a remarkable closeness, but it comes from denigrating and attacking all others and ultimately locking them and the world out forever. oldham cheerfully places mysogynystic musings next to a kind of idealization of his partner/family. anyway this is a boring exegesis but what makes it work is how oldham finds a peculiar balance b/t silliness and earnestness. the balance wouldn't hold if the song had such an insinuating sound.

xpost

i'm not kidding.

What should I buy next?

a) Ease On Down The Road
b) The Lost Blues comp
c) Arise, Therefore
d) Not these ones you nut
d) Bugger it, get them all

BTW, I no longer have the indie guilt referred to up thread. I drowned it in the bath tub last week, most satisfying.

PLUS the "one with the birds"/"take however long you want" single.

piers are you looking for a oldham cd to buy next? i'd recommend "i see a darkness" and then probably one of the two "lost blues" comps and then "days in the wake". "master and everyone" is better than "ease down the road," i think, though both are good. i actually find latterday oldham more interesting than earlier oldham even if the records haven't been perfect.

Arise, Therefore is good so far, but only first listen. Based on what you said I think I'd go with the two lost blues comps and maybe days in the wake. Jess also posted a pretty good S&D way upthread including the first Palace album. He has a fun, if bewildering, back catalog to explore eh?

i have this theory in which i see a darkness is real late at night and ease on down the road is the morning after.

well, that makes me feel like a boring old professor, thanks ("yes, mr. amateurist, we've this one already").

that's not a very evolved theory.

I'm having trouble with BPB sings Greatest Palace Muscic.

I am finding this completely frustrating, since I am obsessed with his "Brokedown Palace" cover, and the other songs are similarly blowing my mind.

Does anyone have an actual copy of this e.p.? Is it available anywhere? Goddamn it, it's amazing.

The Oldham/Tweaker song from that single is surprisingly good (Happy Child). Otherwise, I think Viva Last Blues is probably his strongest release. I also like most of the stuff on the Palace Music disc and the cover of "In My Mind"

xpost. The first album is great!

He's playing a secret show here near SF in a week and a half.

So does anyone have the Brightblack split? I am desperate for those tracks.

Although (and big surprise) - AC/DC is such the clear winner here:

http://users.bart.nl/~ljmeijer/oldham/lyrics/balls.htm

"and my balls are always bouncing
my ballroom always full
and everybody cums and cums again"

vs Oldham's

"we could be eating pudding
but we'd rather place our balls
in their mouths when they are eating"

As mentioned, he's a very unique personality that somehow defies the rich boy charlatan role he could've easily fallen into. As a lyricist he's particularly interesting, simultaneously arcane, profane, and abstractly eloquent. Musically, he rarely repeats himself, making him confounding and exciting in equal measure. If his new single Cursed Sleep is any indication, expect his new album to be heavily orchestrated (swelling strings) with r&b/soul-inspired vocals (see his live cover R. Kelly's Ignition for reference).

His discography is intimidating, so I'll give a rundown of what you might want to start out with.

1) I See a Darkness - easily Oldham's most accessible and some would say best. Bleak yet very listenable.

2) Lost Blues and Other Songs - the perfect introduction to Palace era Oldham, contains nearly all of his classic singles. Essential.

3) Ease Down the Road - a great companion piece to I See a Darkness. A bit bouncier, the lyrical bent favors sex over death this time around.

Here's a little rundown of the rest of his more prominent releases, in roughly chronological order.

1) 'There is no-one, What will take care of you' - his first LP, very ramshackle and primitive (in a charming way of course).

2) 'Days in the Wake' - sparse and lo-fi, sounds like it was recorded on a boom box. Just Oldham and a guitar for the most part.

3) 'Viva Last Blues' - probably the best Palace LP. Rocking in a woozy, drunken kinda way. Solid Albini production.

4) 'Arise, Therefore' - Dirge-like, methodical, repetitive. Some use of the drum machine. A few songs remind me of Smog honestly. As evidenced by the thread, it's a fairly divisive album.

5) 'Joya' - No real explicitly defining characteristics. Sounds like an Oldham record. It's a solid release, nonetheless.

6) Guarapero: Lost Blues 2 - A collection of rarities. Very hit or miss, as would be expected.

---- entering Bonnie Prince Billy era ----

I've already mentioned I See a Darkness and Ease Down the Road, so i'll give them a pass.

1) Master & Everyone - very gentle, front porch, hushed-whisper acoustic album. It's all very pretty, lead off track 'The Way' is particularly stunning.

2) Sings Greatest Palace Music - Incredibly divisive album. Sees Oldham revisiting some classic Palace songs with glossy Nashville production. Very bizarre to say the least.

3) Superwolf - Skeletal and guitar driven. 'Spindly' seems like an appropriate adjective. Matt Sweeney provides a great backdrop for Oldham's vocals.

4) Summer in the Southeast - A fairly rocking live collection. Oldham reworks a lot of older songs to interesting effect.

5) The Brave and the Bold - Oldham teams up with Tortoise for a covers album. This didn't work for me at all, two great tastes that do not taste great together. His covers of Elton John's 'Daniel' and Springsteen's 'Thunder Road' are the only memorable cuts.

-----

Well, that about covers the big ones. Jump in.

I, personally, love it so much that it no longer bothers me when it comes on after I've forgotten it's in there. Even my wife, who so rarely likes anything I do, just accepts it as beautiful wallpaper. It's so damn tasty in so many ways.

I've been enjoying Joya a lot lately - Oldham's last couple of releases have been a bit saccharine for my taste, and I stopped listening to him for a while, so it's nice to remember what the Oldham I was originally taken in by sounded like.

Search: Ask Forgiveness EP (Nov 20th)

1. I Came Here to Hear the Music (Mickey Newbury cover)
2. I’ve Seen It All (Björk cover)
3. Am I Demon (Danzig cover)
4. My Life (Phil Ochs cover)
5. I’m Loving the Street (Will Oldham original)
6. The Way I Am (Mekons / Merle Haggard / Sonny Throckmorton cover)
7. Cycles (Frank Sinatra cover, written by Gayle Caldwell)
8. The World’s Greatest (R. Kelly cover)

oh woah the mickey newbury record that song is from is TOTAL lost classic, great tune.

summer in the southeast is a great crazy horse record too! rowdy!

I hope this is better than the tortoise collaboration, that shit was dire

u dire

hi dire

Everything's covered pretty extensively upthread - i'd just like to add that I Called You Back from the wonderful "The Letting Go" might just be one of the single most gut-wrenching tracks he's released.

oh man, "West Palm Beach"

Which version? Think I probably prefer the original EP version, but at times it's a toss up. Haven't really enjoyed anything he's done since Ease Down the Road (haven't heard those covers tho), but back in the day, he cd kill me with pretty much everything he'd done.

West Palm Beach/Gulf Shores is one of the best singles of the 90's.

Gulf Shores has its own thread, with some recent discussion of how great both Gulf Shores and West Palm Beach are.

^^^^ agree with all this west palm beach love <3

Difficult to choose between the two IMO.

Agree, is this 7" one that was released at the same time as The Mountain EP? Cos that had And End To Travelling as well, they all seemed to fit together so well. That 'tally ho' bit at the end of that song - so mournful.

"West Palm Beach" is maybe tied with "Let's Start a Family" as my favourite Will Oldham song.

It's the backing vocals on "Gulf Shores" that bring it to true greatness.

something is up

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cR20Fel4vIg

Interesting. Also, tasteless.

I can't believe there wasn't any talk on ILX about the Bonnie / Cairo Gang LP that came out on Drag City this year. Wow. Maybe everyone (by which, I mean his fans .. don't waste yr time haters) is just tired of the guy. He is nothing if not prolific. But this album is super great. And the live show, with a full band, makes the songs take off ten times more. Incredible.

I was a die hard Oldham fan from the first 7" up through I See a Darkness. I had EVERYTHING. I don't know what happened but after I See a Darkness (which I thought was his best!), he just fell off my radar. I don't know why I had such a drastic switch-up. I also stopped listening to all the old stuff and even now I only have a few of the records still. Lately I've felt like I need to re-buy all of it, and delve into the post-Darkness material.

I did get Lie Down in the Light recently. I like it. It's totally solid from beginning to end, though nothing knocks me off my feet the way, say, "Gulf Shores" or "Riding" or "Ohio River Boat Song" or the whole Hope EP or "New Partner" or a whole bunch of other songs do.

Scott, I've done the same exact thing with various artists before myself. i.e. become superfan, get everything, at a certain point -- start to completely ignore.

actually, now that I think about it that is kinda what I did w/ Oldham ... altho I was never "superfan". but I did generally keep up a little with his work, but around the early part of the decade I kinda dropped off, it was too much. Bought Beware when it came out last year, on a whim .. "let's see where he's at" .. really enjoyed it!

bought this new Cairo Gang thing and have been completely blown away. Up there w/ Rangda for album of the year for me. but the live show is even better

The live show where he sings a capella with no amplification and just Emmett Kelly on guitar to a room of like 200 people kind of sold the album for me.

I'm beginning to suspect I never really liked this guy.

For nostalgic reasons, I just put on Viva Lost Blues, and holy christ, is the guitar player on this awful! I mean, it sorta does add to the overall feel of the album (which Ive just decided is probably his best, most consistent full length, though like many of you I stopped paying attention many years ago), but shit, sounds like Jandek in places. So many 'bad' notes! I know the book on this album is that everyone was under rehearsed, but I guess I never realized to what degree. A headphone listen reveals that some of these musicians were probably sorta just making it up as they went along. Again, not a judgment on the album - if anything, it holds up very well.

Side 2 of that record is a fucking beast btw.

lot of the old Palace stuff is sloppy, unrehearsed and sorta improvised by buddies and whomever was around. that was kind of their thing.

Saw him in October in a tiny bar with Emmett Kelley and the rest. Reminded me of Bill Withers live, in the elongated storytelling. He only sang. No country nods.

When I talked to David Pajo for my Slint book he talked about playing with Oldham and said that for a lot of the songs the first time he heard them or played them was when Oldham had hit the record button for the record. He would literally be figuring out how the song went as the tape was rolling.

I was a die hard Oldham fan from the first 7" up through I See a Darkness. I had EVERYTHING. I don't know what happened but after I See a Darkness (which I thought was his best!), he just fell off my radar. I don't know why I had such a drastic switch-up. I also stopped listening to all the old stuff and even now I only have a few of the records still. Lately I've felt like I need to re-buy all of it, and delve into the post-Darkness material.

― scott pgwp (pgwp), Saturday, October 2, 2010 9:42 PM (1 month ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

haa mee too exactly

arise therefor is by far his best tho fuiud

Viva Lost Blues has some wonderful moments on it. More Brother Rides is one of his best ever. I must be technically naive, because I think the band on this album sound perfect. I see a darkness was good but he didn't fuck any more mountains in the noughties.

It is sorta funny how everyone has a similar story - "Followed him rabidly from the beginning, then got his BEST ALBUM EVA I See A Darkness, and haven't paid attention since." Why is this? Seems like a weirdly common fan trajectory. Can anyone suggest any theories on this phenomenon?

feel like his style of music maybe just went out of style

indie fans be fickle, phony

Both correct, I reckon.

i like lots of his post darkness stuff the best

i went to see him in concert at an art museum theater and it was pack tho, he still has lots of fans i think

He regularly draws big crowds over here in the UK too.

I'm the same as posters upthread in preferring pre-Darkness material. Something about the quality of his voice changed after that record, I think- it lost, the cracked, slightly keening edge which IMO made him so interesting as a singer. All the rough edges have been smoothed off these days.

i like lots of his post darkness stuff the best

me too, just don't have much to say about him.

yeah, i'm the same. maybe i'm just bad at talking about music qua music, but the narrative of 'guy who quietly and consistently releases very good albums' isn't something i feel the need to be particularly expressive about. that said, i do think lots of the arrangements in the recent albums have been lovely.

I've loved him pretty straight through and enjoy the early Palace stuff as much as the glossy "...Sings Greatest Palace Music" disc. Some stick with me more than others, but I've really liked the last few major releases (and the Bonny Billy and the Picket Line live thing as well).

"Lie Down in the Light" is a really great, low-key album

i still jam to ease down the road

that was actually the last one i vibed to

Ease Down The Road is definitely my favorite. He took some singing lessons after Darkness, so maybe the haters/boreders caught on to that.

Listened to 'The Letting Go' yesterday whilst driving through a very misty part of East Anglia, maybe my favourite post Darkness record.

The live albums Summer in the Southeast and Is It The Sea? are arguably the greatest things he's released IMO. However, nothing will ever touch Viva Last Blues for that early ramshackle vibe. I find him, by far, the best and most consistent English songwriter of the modern era that I can think of. It's plainly outrageous that hasn't been anointed the contemporary Dylan/Young/pick-your-favorite, that failure of a critical consensus more than a lot of others reveals the bankruptcy of modern mainstream music criticism IMO.

arise therefor is by far his best tho fuiud

― ice cr?m, Sunday, November 28, 2010 10:53 AM (2 days ago) Bookmark

Co-sign on that. Sad to hear so many people here care less about Superwolf, Lie Down In The Light and The Letting Go, all my favourite WO

I just checked out a Bonnie Prince Billy album from the library yesterday. I donht know which one it is, but it's blue. I think I avoided checking him out for over a decade because of the name - what kind of renfest shit is this anyway? Wanna join my medieval militia?

But I'll listen to it tomorrow morning and report back.

I've picked up a bunch of his releases over the years, but I think I could live with just Lost Blues and Other Songs, Superwolf and Ease Down the Road.

by far, the best and most consistent English songwriter of the modern era

This is preposterous. I like the guy fine, he's made some nice records, but come on - dude says absolutely nothing. With Dylan, you need an annotated bibliography. Scholars can hold annual symposiums on single verses. Oldham, on the other hand, exists and seems quite comfortable beneath a veil of willful obscurity. He's cultivated his own 'impossible to know' myth from the jump, so his persona, by his own design, signifies exactly nothing. Everything he does comes off like some sort of ironic, unfunny in-joke. His music is mostly pleasant but, to me, his act gets incredibly tiresome.

well songs arent just lyrics so...?

True, but take away the vocals on a Bonnie Billy album and you have...?

lol i guess (some ppl think) good songs

not me

Everything he does comes off like some sort of ironic, unfunny in-joke.

I couldn't feel more opposed to a single opinion. He has written (not just the words, but the singing, the choices of instrumentation, intonation, the choice of players, etc.) some of the most beautiful, open and honest accounts of varied human experience I have ever heard. I hear very little irony in his lyrics, and when it is there it seems very intentional. Obviously no two people will have the same listening experience, but I've never encountered this particularly opinion about Oldham's work. Different strokes.

See also: everyone on Drag City

" I hear very little irony in his lyrics,"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mPn21H3PC4

i thnink i'm gonna sell all my oldham records except for days in the wake, which i still return to occasionally.

lol there's loads of irony in a lot of his stuff but I think he swings the other way into super-serious confessionalism just as often (I don't think there are a lot of jokes on I See A Darkness, for example, altho there are a couple). this ambiguity is part of his appeal.

Saw him in October in a tiny bar with Emmett Kelley and the rest.

i went to see him in concert at an art museum theater and it was pack tho, he still has lots of fans i think

― there was usic in the cafes at night (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Sunday, November 28, 2010 12:32 PM (3 days ago) Bookmark

The live albums Summer in the Southeast and Is It The Sea? are arguably the greatest things he's released IMO. However, nothing will ever touch Viva Last Blues for that early ramshackle vibe. I find him, by far, the best and most consistent English songwriter of the modern era that I can think of. It's plainly outrageous that hasn't been anointed the contemporary Dylan/Young/pick-your-favorite, that failure of a critical consensus more than a lot of others reveals the bankruptcy of modern mainstream music criticism IMO.

― Badmotorfinger Debate Club (MFB), Monday, November 29, 2010 11:05 PM (2 days ago) Bookmark

otm re: summer in the southeast. is 'is it the sea?' that live thing he did in scotland? cuz that rules. i dunno, i stan for oldham pretty hard, and in lol college would've made the claim that he was one of the best living songwriters in america, but i'm not as willing to go that far lately. like, i love the dude, and he has written some v v good songs, but he's not the best (our very own aero is better imo).

i mostly tapered off after Master And Everyone (live albums aside), and have struggled a bit to love his newest stuff as much as, say, Darkness or viva last blues. that being said, i think i'm gonna listen to oldham for the rest of the night now, thx guys

lol there's loads of irony in a lot of his stuff but I think he swings the other way into super-serious confessionalism just as often (I don't think there are a lot of jokes on I See A Darkness, for example, altho there are a couple). this ambiguity is part of his appeal.

― a big influence on me in a non-stabbing non-killing way (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, December 1, 2010 5:54 PM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark

see, i've always read his confessionalism as being firmly tongue in cheek, should you decide its getting too creepy. it's almost goth, you know? yes, we're being serious, yes this is weird, but there's an understanding that there's a safeword or something and if you want to be amused by the darkness, you can, no one's gonna call you out for ruining the creepy vibe or w/e. if that makes sense?

I don't know why I mostly got off the bus after I See a Darkness - that album's great, I love a lot of what went before and what I've heard from after was not bad by any means. I think in some ways it got to feel like a chore to keep up with him, and I felt like I've kinda already gotten as much out of his schtick as I could, sorta like Beck. Like, his boundaries are pretty well defined now, I'm not sure what he could possibly do that would surprise/engage me again.

xp

i never really got off the bus at any point, i just can't keep up with all his releases. reading this makes me want to get those live LPs, though.

cf bill callahan, who ~kinda~ mines a similar vein of quirky macabre american gothic. i'm not nearly as familiar with smog, but what i have heard, and liked, is oldham but with a much smoother voice and a firmer handle on concrete imagery

xp beck comparison is a good one, actually---i abandoned that dude for the same reasons you did. also, lol, in high school i would've called HIM america's best living songwriter. ~suicides~

dude, omar, summer in the southeast is a fucking JAM.

also, if you want recordings of the show mississippi and i saw at the walker, lemme know and i can REDACTED

i would love to get a [mod edit] of that show if you can [mod edit] it my way via ilmessage

~standby~

-_-

one of the things i like about his later work is how much better of a singer he is now, people don't really talk about that but he must've put some work into voice lessons or something along the line.

man gbx

i was just thinking about his cover of "the world's greatest" by r.kelly at that show and how awesome it was.

dude he went from being kinda terrible to being legitimately v v good.

that was teh second set! i only made the first :-/

also omar check your whatever

i liken his early singing talent's roughness is akin to something like Libba Cotton's, not sure how blasphemous that is or if I can get away with comparing 2 such talents to each other, but hey, no worries brah.

(ie, not terrible unless you listen exclusively to broadway musicals and autotuned paedo-pop)

i will not be lumped in with musical theater enthusiasts and poptimists, thank u v much

gonna DL these as soon as i get home, thx homes

more comin

ok mississippi, i just listened to the world's greatest again and it's awesome

With Dylan, you need an annotated bibliography. Scholars can hold annual symposiums on single verses.

cool thx dad

if anybody wd be cool enough to slip me an ILXmessage too I would dance with glee? but no worries if it's a chore

I was an die hard Oldham fan from the first 7" up through I See a Darkness. I had EVERYTHING SEVERAL THINGS. I don't know what happened but after I See a Darkness (which I thought was his best!), he just fell off my radar.

― scott pgwp (pgwp), Saturday, October 2, 2010 9:42 PM (1 month ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

adjusted

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SCen9gOTmD4

aslo he sings on this, which is rad and of instructional value regarding bears (dangers of)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kG2PL2zO034

I still think Superwolf is amazing, I feel like I listen to it far more than I See a Darkness.

I can't listen to I See a Darkness much nowadays, I know the layer of joeks is there but it's too close to home plus a bit dirgy imo, wd far rather play Ease On from that era.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmDbO4zgzvE

attn NV

thx :D

i really liked lie down in the light

superwolf might be my overall fav thing he's done

superwolf def has some of my all time favorite tracks on it, for sure

thx for sending those tunes over, gbx. no worries on the rest of it *`~unless you have a moment to spare someday~*

first palace bros singles/rarities comp (lost blues) works for me as his most solid work.

beck comparison is a good one

I think these two guys were at about the same point musically circa '93 and Beck may have even bit Oldham a bit.

also, have always admired how willing and able he is to continuously reformat and reimagine his old stuff. i've only seen him live twice (Walker last year, Boston...seven years ago?), but those shows and the live albums are seriously impressive imo. like, when i saw him in boston (@middle east), it was on the heels of Master And Everyone, so i went in expecting a pretty hushed affair. instead, he came out in eyeliner, and blazed thru the whole album, in order, front to back, wild and electric. lyrics and basic tunes aside, it was a complete transformation, and completely awesome. then he played old shit by request, all of it different from the 'originals.'

i honestly can't think of many other contemporary artists (instrumentalists aside) that play it so fast and loose with their stuff.

cf the lol strokes concert i went to a few months later which was mechanically faithful to the album. it was like someone hit shuffle on itunes.

and n/p omar, i'll see about getting the second set up later today.

gbx hook me up?

i honestly can't think of many other contemporary artists (instrumentalists aside) that play it so fast and loose with their stuff.

― BIG MUFFIN (gbx), Thursday, December 2, 2010 12:03 PM (20 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

dylan is the only one i can think of

yeah, that's who i was thinking of, too. was trying, and failing, to think of anyone else.

Prince (live at least)

really? prince did pretty standard version, like a little more jammed out but still basically the song, the 2 times i saw him

i mean, last time i saw dylan it took me 2 verses to figure out he was doing "tangled up in blue" fer chrissakes

Neil Young, maybe?

actually the correct answer is prob any number of jazz artists

instrumentalists aside

I haven't seen Prince in 10 years but afaict usually he is really flippant/goofy with his old material, shoving everything into a medley, dropping verses/choruses, instrumentation is usually totally different, etc. - I guess yeah they are just more jammy. which is kinda required by the fact that most of his stuff was not recorded live with a band to begin with.

I bring him up because the end result doesn't really bear TOO much resemblance to the recorded versions, even tho they are still identifiable

i honestly can't think of many other contemporary artists (instrumentalists aside) that play it so fast and loose with their stuff.

like it or not, ever jam band ever (the Dead being the most obvious example)

if anybody wd be cool enough to slip me an ILXmessage too I would dance with glee? but no worries if it's a chore
me too!

got u tylerw

like it or not, ever jam band ever (the Dead being the most obvious example)

― If Assholes Could Fly This Place Would Be An Airport, Thursday, December 2, 2010 1:30 PM (14 minutes ago) Bookmark

jamming doesn't count imo. stretching out and elaborating is one thing, but oldham takes whisper-soft strummy beardo songs and overhauls them into shreddy electro rave-ups. like, they are occasionally unrecognizable. also, at least from what i've heard, the Dead/whoever still hang all their improv on a basic song structure, like the head of a jazz tune, you know? each iteration of a tune might be completely different, and you may not recognize it if you walk in in the middle, but eventually they'll circle back.

i mean, Greatest Palace Music is sort of a singular artifact, as far as i can tell.

Boy, there's a caveat for everyone else, huh? Oh, right, except, umm, Bob Dylan.

w/e

and yeah, except for bob dylan, because he does the same thing. jam bands ~don't~. jazz dudes DO, but they're playing jazz, and that's sorta the point sometimes. but in the realm of rock and roll or w/e, i can't think of anyone that reinvents their back catalogue as frequently and as often as oldham.

i think with jam bands like the dead, it's about extending songs, exploring them in a more expansive manner, not necessarily really changing the actual skeleton of the song. with someone like dylan, he often really reimagines the songs. there was a version of girl from north country few years back that, to my ears, had a completely different chord structure than the original (sounded like friend of the devil, actually). don't know if oldham falls into this camp -- i'm not an obsessive fan, but it is pretty rare.

if the song is entirely re-structured, including chords, what makes it the same song? that the dude remembered to repeat a refrain every so often?

I mean, P-funk does that in their own peculiar jam-bandy way when they play live. They hit a groove and then George recites as many choruses from various songs as he can think of, for ex.

whether or not the song is a "version" of Tear the Roof Off, Get Off Your Ass and Jam, Mothership Connection, Sentimental Journey, etc. is kinda a moot point

if the song is entirely re-structured, including chords, what makes it the same song? that the dude remembered to repeat a refrain every so often?
yeah, i mean, sometimes it sorta seems like Dylan is just awkwardly fitting old words into a new song, but it works on occasion -- like an visual artist painting the same landscape from a different angle, you kinda get a new vibe from the rearrangements.

yeah that makes sense, esp given the v nature of a lot of parliament songs in general (~groovy~).

in the case of oldham, it's the "same song" because it's got the same lyrics, and that's about it. phrasing, chord structure (i ~think~), delivery, instrumentation, etc. are all different sometimes.

xps

I am going to leave it to GG to express my absolute antipathy towards Dylan, she does it more eloquently than even the biggest lektual on here could or indeed a working class spaz like me could. I personally despise him and consider him one of the most contrived and overrated bags of shite from 20th century music. Will Oldham certainly isn't perfect but he is worth a thousand Dylans.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2008/jun/30/popandrock.poetry

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/red/blue_pics/2008/09/12/germaine_greer.jpg

Dylan-haters are the equivalent of James Brown-haters imho

like if you hate him I kinda think you don't actually like/understand popular music in the latter half of the 20th century

gauntlet THROWN

oh shit.
i don't even get what that article is saying -- she doesn't think dylan's lyrics work as poetry? fair enough. do they work as lyrics? YES.
also, "not fit to tie woody guthrie's shoes?" was this written in 1962?

woody guthrie had SHOES?? what a sellout

germaine greer has some weird opinions + she loves telling everyone abt them

if the song is entirely re-structured, including chords, what makes it the same song? that the dude remembered to repeat a refrain every so often?

I mean, P-funk does that in their own peculiar jam-bandy way when they play live. They hit a groove and then George recites as many choruses from various songs as he can think of, for ex.

― goat, camel, horse, and water buffalo (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, December 2, 2010 2:10 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

it's different than that though....

here's a pretty good example: tonight i'll be staying here with you original vs. the rolling thunder tour...one's jaunty pop country one is a raging 70s rocker but it's still fundamentally the same song, even if the arrangements and some of the chord voicings have been changed

like if you hate him I kinda think you don't actually like/understand popular music in the latter half of the 20th century

^^^^

i honestly can't think of many other contemporary artists (instrumentalists aside) that play it so fast and loose with their stuff.

Dan Bejar / Destroyer kinda does this but not to the same extent

I saw him on the tour for Your Blues and it was raggedy crazy electric versions of those songs (w/ Frog Eyes as the backing band)

Yep, Bejar definitely fits that category, and, FWIW, he's a far, far better songwriter than Bonnie at his best

there are recorded versions of those Your Blues reworks on the Notorious Lightning EP, fwiw.

I don't even have to make the Dylan comparisons or fuel the controversy anymore! My work here is done.

xpost - yep I almost mentioned that it became an EP. I think he used to do this kind of thing a lot more (friend who saw him at SXSW circa Streethawk/This Night barely recognized the songs until the choruses came in) and it was a little maddening b/c he didn't play out very much. nowadays he's kind of toned it down I think.

"like if you hate him I kinda think you don't actually like/understand popular music in the latter half of the 20th century"

[Disparaging Voice]Yes mate you are totally correct, the essence of 20th century popular music has simply passed me by because I dont like one strand off its entire fabric.

I hear more about the human condition in one simple song by luminaries such as Skip James or Lightning Hopkins than in Dylans entire back catalogue (and I have tried many of his albums).

Admittedly they arguably were making music in the early half of the 20th century, but quite close to his era.

Your response is just the archetypal Dylanapologist arrogance I would expect from folk who cant just settle for him being merely their own particular favoured strand of 20th century popular music. You have this pathological need to elevate him above everyone else in the world, sort of like inverted adult teenyboppers with yer Bobbie Williams. Are you suggesting he is the motherlode of all 20th century greatness? Very shortsighted, deluded and plain wrong.

Obviously because a lot of folk with pallid dungeon-tans and wavering eyes spend a lot of time disserting his greatness, he is obviously not a mere strand but a godlike enigma etc zzzzzzzzzzz. He isn't Mozart, do you realise this?

u mad

#Mozartapologist

first palace bros singles/rarities comp (lost blues) works for me as his most solid work.

― i love you but i have chosen snarkness (Steve Shasta), Thursday, December 2, 2010 1:00 PM Bookmark

^^^

Mozartapologist

Quack Quack Chortle!

the sound of a man choking on a message board post

Not really ballbag, just laughing at Mozartapologist.

u mad

Will Oldham certainly isn't perfect but he is worth a thousand Dylans.

like if you hate him I kinda think you don't actually like/understand popular music in the latter half of the 20th century

^ equally ridiculous

OTM

Your response is just the archetypal Dylanapologist arrogance I would expect from folk who cant just settle for him being merely their own particular favoured strand of 20th century popular music. You have this pathological need to elevate him above everyone else in the world, sort of like inverted adult teenyboppers with yer Bobbie Williams

huge lols at 'dylanapologist'

1) why make it one word? there's no trailing 'a' in dylan!
2) that a well-respected musician can even have 'apologists' is a fucking hilarious idea, and one that can only be held by someone who is taking shit way, way, waaaaaaaaaaay too seriously. apologists are for people that are actively making the world a worse place.
3) you might be right about dylan getting too much love, i dunno, i never got into him that much (tho you have prompted me to put on john wesley harding), but actively hating dylan and his place in the pantheon is webelos grade challoping, try harder.
4) u mad, doggy

Will Oldham certainly isn't perfect but he is worth a thousand Dylans.

like if you hate him I kinda think you don't actually like/understand popular music in the latter half of the 20th century

^ equally ridiculous

You might be right but that is my humble opinion and I am not going to tell you that you know nothing about 20th century music because you beg to differ. Its different with Zimmerman though, isn't it?

"zimmerman!"

*audible sneer*

dude is so phony he doesn't even use his real name

will oldham interviews r kelly - http://www.interviewmagazine.com/music/r-kelly/

ILM needs a revived Will Oldham thread like it needs a hole in its head, but fuck it. Arise Therefore is a weird, weird record, even more so than I remember.

this self-cover has been killing me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-xSxWX7_-4

love it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtX1RSKW4gI&feature=related

Can anyone ID the band in this, especially the singer to his right?

those outfits are the fucking best

The female singer is Angel Olsen. The backing band is the same as Wolfroy.

Angel Olsen

this self-cover has been killing me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-xSxWX7_-4&feature=player_embedded

― j., Sunday, July 15, 2012 7:48 PM (2 months ago) Bookmark

man what the hell did i just watch

been diggin' that all summer. initially because I was all "HEY IT IS ASHTON LANE AND BYRES ROAD IN GLASGOW" but then the song just took over.

yeah i love that video

this new everly brothers tribute CD is about half great, half meh. "kentucky" is gorgeous.

Weird question: does Will work in the food/bev industry now?

thought he was in the fragrance industry - http://sanaeintoxicants.bigcartel.com/product/bonnie-billy
y'all should check this song out, which features oldham on the chorus
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wU_jF6okvQ
whole album is great

Ha, but back to my question, I know he did a (weird) ad for Dogfish Head last year but I've kind of pieced together that he's been quietly collaborating with select cult/niche nanobreweries on special beer releases (in Maryland, Delaware, Louisville and... Santa Cruz)?

Just wondering if someone knows a little more.

He has his own coffee brand now, I think.

I have been playing "Whipped" a lot lately

New album 'Singers Grave a Sea of Tongues' out 22/23 Sept!

on drag city?

Yes, it's a full label release this time: http://www.stereogum.com/1701981/new-bonnie-prince-billy-album-singers-grave-a-sea-of-tongues-out-next-month/news/

I tuned out a few albums ago but that recent self-released thing was so good it brought me back. Will buy this

what self-released thing? i lost track of his releases a few years ago. it's easy to lose track.

i missed that one too. guess he's talking about this: http://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/18650-bonnie-prince-billy-bonnie-prince-billy/

huh. was that some crazy limited edition?

If it's self-released, it's definitely limited edition.

been listening to a lot of palace stuff lately, it's so good.

also i have a question: what is "hosing" and why does the fact that death to everyone is gonna come make hosing more fun? serious question lol

btw i have a hard time feeling passionate about anything post i see a darkness. even if some of it is good it doesn't quite match up.

that was the cutoff point for me too, not sure why

I have really been enjoying this Greatest Palace Music album tho

xxp I always just took it as meaning "using a hose", like I imagine a guy watering his garden with a huge smile on his face, thinking about death coming to everyone.

lol

never heard greatest palace music, need to check it out. for me lately it's been lots of viva last blues and arise therefore. joya is good too

The new one is very good although a bit weird. It's mostly re-recordings of songs from 2011's Wolfroy Goes To Town. There is an EP of cover songs that comes with the first run of vinyl versions that is really fun. This is the tracklist:

C1 That's My Kind Of Night (Luke Bryan)
C2 Better Than I Used To Be (Tim McGraw)
C3 Let Me Love You (Ne-Yo)
C4 There Are Worse Things I Could Do (from "Grease")
D1 Loving You Is Fun (Easton Corbin)
D2 Die Young (Ke$ha)
D3 Take Care (Drake)
D4 I'm On My Way Home Again (The Everly Brothers)

so i feel like his voice changed a lot starting with the albums after ISAD, it lost that sense of frailty that was so intriguing in the early palace records. something bland about a lot of the later records. i haven't heard much from "ease down the road" so i don't know if that's a transitional album but there is a stark difference between ISAD and master & everyone, dude smoothed out a LOT and becomes less interesting as result

Didn't he get voice lessons around that time?

He learned how to sing ;)

There's a lot of good stuff post-Ease, with 'The Letting Go' probably the pick of the bunch.

I'm really enjoying the new album, think it's his best for ages. Has a nice live feel to it, and the Wolfroy songs are different enough to be worthwhile, for me at least.

I feel like his father's passing provides a certain partition to his career:

1993 - 1997: Palace
1998 - 2004: Bonnie Prince Billy 1.0
2005 - : Bonnie Prince Billy 2.0

Would anyone recommend the Alan Licht book? I've only scanned it a few times.

Prolly the best story we have about a cameo is Will Oldham. He and his father were big fans and one of the ways they bonded was by watching Jackass. It kinda blew our minds because we didn’t realize someone that smart liked our stuff. Anyway, unfortunately his father passed away a couple of years ago and one of the ways will thought he could pay homage to him was by being in jackass 3D. So he reached out to one of our cameramen, Lance Bangs, and asked to get in touch with us. Lance said sure but he had to write a song about Lance's life first... and he did. A really wonderful touching song and so Lance put Will in touch with us. We are big Will Oldham fans and were thrilled to have him in the film.

Johnny Knoxville on casting Will Oldham as a lion tamer in Jackass 3D.

whoops, gorilla tamer.

The book is fantastic, a must-read even if you're a casual an. I'm a devotee but I have recommended it to non-fans who are very taken with its description of the creative process.

So Johnny Knoxville doesn't think I'm smart?????

A new interview, touching on religious discourse and the Nashville scene, sort of in line with the Alan Licht book: http://www.aquariumdrunkard.com/2014/10/09/bonnie-prince-billy-the-aquarium-drunkard-interview/

(Also, it's unsurprising that Oldham's interest in Dylan trails off after the gospel albums....)

he did do a cover of brownsville girl though!

his criterion top ten was a fun read

Has this cover ever been discussed on ILM?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7LdJGhf2XI

damn lost blues and other songs is 100% all killer no filler

bites scharpling and wuster pretty hard:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUDLmRifMUk#t=266

xpost: don't think that's a cover, I think Oldham wrote it specifically for Staton's album. The version on Little Lost Blues is a demo.

Ah I didn't know that, what a stunning track at any rate.

I was at this show, good one from the archives ("Ohio Riverboat Song"/"I Am A Cinematographer"), age 24:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NYI8q2NZRM

damn "west palm beach" / "gulf shores" duo is killing it for me recently. just love those two songs so much. i am in SC right now and it has been warm and beautiful and the air smells like the ocean and there are palm trees everywhere and i have been rocking these two songs like crazy

SC btw is south carolina not southern california

Easily his greatest 7". Nothing else in his discography sounds quite like it.

yea! i'm just astonished too at how good all the palace stuff is. took a while for me to finally pick up the first two and "lost blues" and the quality is all very high amidst such a diversity in styles and approaches from the first palace record up through i see a darkness imo

Yeah, Days in the Wake, Lost Blues, Viva Last Blues, I See a Darkness, and Lie Down in the Light are the highlights for me. I like a good deal of his BPB work, but once he finds a more comfortable mode of singing and writing (pretty much following I See a Darkness) his work seems less often to have a certain exploratory quality.

Although Get on Jolly and The Wonder Show of the World have plenty of loose threads, to be sure....

haven't heard either of those! man this guy has so many albums. the post-ISAD BPB records i have are master & everyone, lie down in the light (which yea is very very good), beware (which i didn't like at first but is growing on me, esp. the second half). oh i think i have superwolf but i need to dig out from somewhere, haven't listened to it in a long while.

Get on Jolly (basically droney guitar noodling, but really gorgeous Dirty Three-ish noodling by Mick Turner, over verse adapted from Tagore's Gitanjali) is notable for having some of Oldham's most open song structures, I think; it's much looser than Moon Pix (on which Turner also played), but it's interesting to listen to those albums together.

oh rad, yea i have moon pix, need to get some more dirty three albums too, i love those guys.

Yeah, Dirty Three are great, although I came to like them more when I accepted that their albums basically worked minor variations on their established (but compelling) sound. But that's the case with so many bands....

this helped me get in to get on jolly

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_FafCJbyWE

really adore get the fuck on jolly live too

In that Licht book he talks about West Palm Beach/Gulf Shores being his Jimmy Buffett single. Ever since I read The Long Secret I associate it with WPB.

Easily his greatest 7". Nothing else in his discography sounds quite like it.

― one way street, Thursday, November 6, 2014 5:34 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah don't think he'll ever top that 7". some days i think that's all he really needed to release, ever.

I've had a hard time getting really into anything he's done since Master and Everyone. Most of the output up to that point I like.

Master and Everyone itself I like, although at times it feels almost uncomfortably intimate and tender, in a similar (but very Oldhamian) way to Blue.

I'M LONG SINCE DEAD AND I LIVE IN HELL
SHE'S THE ONLY ONE THAT I LOVE WELL
WE WERE RAISED TOGETHER AND TOGETHER WE FELL
GOD IS WHAT I MAKE OF HIM

I do not believe he has written anything that troubling and compelling in the last 10 years, but would be happy to be corrected

^^^ especially when you imagine it being sung from the perspective of Bart Simpson

If you like the "open/exploratory" Palace stuff and you haven't heard Superwolf that's the best place to start getting into the BPB stuff. It has that same startling vibe where songs unfurl in unexpected ways. After that, I suggest exploring the trilogy of live albums - Summer in the Southeast, Is It The Sea? and Wilding in the West. That cracked, fragile swell of his early material still remains in his live stuff.

superwolf is great, kinda zeppelin
i really like lie down in the light and the letting go

goat and ram is such a great song!!!

Goat and Ram is so awesome that the next few songs seem underwhelming in comparison, but they're actually really good.

i don't even remember what they are
all is goat and ram

i really have a soft spot for summer in the southeast

Yeah actually I like Superwolf. On the whole I just feel like he's gone down this Dylan-esque "I am a confounding artist who will keep doing unpredictable things" path. But I should probably give the more recent stuff more of a chance - I heard a song off Lie Down In The Light recently that I liked a lot.

Oldham is one of those artists I always like when I hear, but rarely enjoy for long when I put it on myself. At this point the catalog is so windy and unwieldy there's really no easy point of entry, save "I See a Darkness," which I still think is all anyone really needs, even if you like the rest of the catalog. Though I guess I am aware that some folks find the guy unbearably moving and deep, which means they get more from him than I do. Obviously it's not fair to compare the guy - or anyone - to Dylan, but Oldham's balance of emotional honesty and humor has always struck me as much more confusing/confounding. I could equally imagine him penning a beautiful song about taking a dump and a stupid song about his mother dying.

i think there are a few records of his that work more or less equally well as a starting point: i see a darkness, sure, but also the letting go, and the lost blues comp.

Lost Blues > I See A Darkness

Lie Down in the Light is a really approachable, more comforting record, it's like his American Beauty

Similarly found it difficult to go beyond Ease Down the Road - like marcos I've come to the conclusion it's the singing as much as anything else, something platitudinous about it, though I think there's been a lyrical drop-off as well. NV's stanning for I Don't Belong to Anyone off Beware did something to win me over to that record and the Black Cab session version of Black Captain is wonderful. Would also second ows's praise of Get on Jolly - 25 off that is probably top 15 Oldham material for me.

The recent album seems terrifically boring - I haven't managed to make it all the way through.

I remember really liking the Trembling Bells collab record but have not listened in a while

Lie Down in the Light is a really approachable, more comforting record, it's like his American Beauty

ha yea it does have a very dead vibe to it, esp that first track which is probably the best on the album imo

the oral sex song starts off very strong but the climax of it is very bad imo

jeez, how many songs about oral sex does this guy have?

I love this song:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IgTBFlUSeg

glad to see folks referencing the licht book. it is very good, not a while lot of musician "biographies" like it. made total sense to have a friend do the book, i always think of oldham as surrounded by friends and collaborators throughout his whole career who he really values and draws from. i could never see him agreeing to such a book with an unrelated journalist or something, and the fact that licht is a friend allows oldham to get much deeper into the questions than i've ever seen in any published interview.

not a while lot of musician "biographies" like it.

not sure where the "while" came from. anyways

This is my kids favorite dessert in the world: http://arthurmag.com/2009/04/02/will-oldham-on-his-double-chocolate-chess-pie-as-told-to-gabe-soria/

haha

When you take a bite of it, it’s like… how you know… it helps you recognize how omnipotent and indescribable God is. Because this food, you know, goes beyond, and obviously God, you know, God would go beyond anything a Pope could tell you, or an imam could say about, or rabbis, you know? They can pretend that they can tell you about God, but it’s way fucking beyond their comprehension, no matter how many books they read or how much they whip their back or do whatever they do. It’s the same thing with the pies when you realize that the way things work is way beyond anything you could comprehend. We can put [the ingredients] together, but we can’t explain why, when you put them together, why they do what they do.

did you like the cake?
ah some of it was nice
I have made a cake like that
in my own home once or twice
it was just as fine as that one
which we had some of today
none of it was wonderful
much more of it okay

A+++

btw i found this very wonderful picture on the internet

http://www.rockdelux.com/files/article/82/smog_1.jpg

is that bill callahan?

yes!

woah!

"What a bummer that my hair is thinning. Maybe I should grow a beard? Hmmm ... "

Shhh, It's Actually About Oral Sex

the new record from Bonnie Prince Billy

tbrr i cherish the memory of the time i sneezed at a show (bert jansch!) and someone behind me put a hand on my shoulder and said "bless you" i turned around to say thanks and it was will oldham

Surpised he didn't say https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Efk9p00mEJA

which borrows heavily from Billy Bragg's "I dreamed I Saw Phil Ochs Last Night" and samples Julee Cruise's "Falling" in reverse.

We can put [the ingredients] together, but we can’t explain why, when you put them together, why they do what they do.

will, say hello to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_science

bonus reading: http://www.npr.org/blogs/thesalt/2014/03/19/291406696/why-a-sweet-tooth-may-have-been-an-evolutionary-advantage-for-kids

sorry i just hate that "only god could make something so perfect" stuff. love you, will.

As a food science denier, I say tis God that makes it taste good.

i mean save your "only god..." for stuff that science truly doesn't understand well. a chocolate cake is easy.

But who invented chocolate? God, that's who. Advantage: Bonnie Prince Billy.

A friend of mine saw an early Oldham show in NYC at some small place and was impressed when Oldham went around the room and handed everyone a photocopy of a typed lyric sheet for all the songs he was going to play

tbrr i cherish the memory of the time i sneezed at a show (bert jansch!) and someone behind me put a hand on my shoulder and said "bless you" i turned around to say thanks and it was will oldham

― cross over the mushroom circle (La Lechera), Tuesday, November 11, 2014 3:49 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

whaaat that is so awesome

yeah it was pretty awesome
i wish i were like 10% as confident as will oldham
dude is a weirdo but he seems to have it figured out

for himself at least
he also doesn't seem like a prescriptive person

however i do worry a little when he veers too far in the self-baconing direction

yes you are very right about all of this

huge regret I never saw him dancing with mark e smith at ATP because I was too busy vomiting, but friends I was there with did.

marcos
Posted: November 12, 2014 at 10:29:10 AM
tbrr i cherish the memory of the time i sneezed at a show (bert jansch!) and someone behind me put a hand on my shoulder and said "bless you" i turned around to say thanks and it was will oldham

― cross over the mushroom circle (La Lechera), Tuesday, November 11, 2014 3:49 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

whaaat that is so awesome

lol

new vid released today:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tIWWsreneG8

good song

but lol does he have tusks in that video

He transforms into a werewalrus.

it does not take much to make a noticeable slip into parody
that's the problem

"come in" from lost blues is just destroying me. it's so brutal. i can't quite pin down exactly what the scenario is he's singing about but it is just so powerful.

always figured the subject of that song was a still-pined-over ex that'd come back to town out of some necessity and had nowhere else to stay but is only in town for the night, and all the possibilities therein.

ooh la la
is that the emo stuff men write songs about?!

idk it fits the weird obtuse lyrics of that song!

or it's as literal an interpretation as ever made sense to me for a song about cooking a final time for someone leaving for "Egypt" while implying a bunch of long lost intimacy.

yea that's a fine interpretation!

it's about oral sex song iirc

definitely had that feeling for me xp

lol xp

tbrr i cherish the memory of the time i sneezed at a show (bert jansch!) and someone behind me put a hand on my shoulder and said "bless you" i turned around to say thanks and it was will oldham

so Oldham is obviously the indie rock Bill Murray right

i went to a fair in a small and quaint english town once & all the villagers were wearing costumes & among them walked bonnie prince billy

i have a picture somewhere

it was nice because there was a moment when we pointed across the harbour while we were eating at a man with a big beard wearing all denim, & said that he looked like bonnie prince billy, this amusing because bonnie prince billy's look is that of the strange man of the village, probably at least approximately replicated in most small and quaint villages

but it was bonnie prince billy

o hey

http://i.imgur.com/LfATSmo.png

I'm pretty sure I saw him on the street in Chicago with a large Jamba Juice. At the time I thought can't be but of course it could have been.

Oh, and I'd forgotten but I did meet him at a Blowfly show. He recommended a taco place down the street, a shack that was thick with pot smoke and good tacos, forever after known to me as the "Will Oldham Taco Place."

Meanwhile, a new interview:
http://bombmagazine.org/article/2000011/will-oldham

fiddle does wail in that new black rich vid.. striking lead, 2 minutes in

I've seen him in Louisville bars, but never felt like disturbing him. I thought of posting that Bomb interview: given how often writing about BPB lingers on his eccentricities, the most interesting part of the interview for me was his stress on decentering the performer's emotions for the sake of the song (shades of the way Bresson used actors):

At that point, your body has learned to do this thing, the releasing of the song out into the world, which is not about what the performer feels, but what the listener feels. The performer at some point will feel that they failed to make a point because they are not doing their best to communicate the power of the song, but it might be best when all of the emotional baggage is out of the way and the performer just plays the song. In the same way, a director might make an actor do a scene thirty, forty, or fifty times, if they want them to get the technique out of the way and have it all be second nature.

that's probably an allusion to bresson (ozu also did that btw)--oldham's a major cinephile.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palace_Music_%28horse%29

That's interesting; I think Oldham's said that his project was named after the Palace Flophouse in Steinbeck's Cannery Row, but it seems possible that he could have also been aware of the racehorse.

Bob Nastanovich moved in to a house across from the Downs in 1992 and Will was a one time roommate of his.

can't help repeating myself but I love "Whipped". as funny as it is affecting, like much of w.o.'s best stuff

the new LP versh is great but I still prefer the bombast of this one
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vSvyxlUdb8

"it's valentine's day / and i'm catatonic" is such a great line

i really like the album he did w/tortoise too

https://soundcloud.com/temporary-residence-ltd-1/bonnie-stillwatter-the-devil-is-people

Will backed by Britt Walford on drums and Zac from Grails on guitar.

and here is the b-side remix by Bundy K. Brown:
https://w.soundcloud.com/player/?url=https%3A//api.soundcloud.com/tracks/202066152%3Fsecret_token%3Ds-ruIxW&auto_play=false&hide_related=false&show_comments=true&show_user=true&show_reposts=false&visual=true

*imagining a 'conceptual collaboration' between Will Oldham, Stephen Stills, & these guys
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/5d/Sweetwater_sm.jpg*

finally picked up ease down the road, it is pretty good

i like it way better than master & everyone

i could imagine it being a letdown after darkness but 15 years later when it is just another title among oldham's 20-odd albums it is very good

kind of reminds me of "joya", mid-period oldham that is somewhat minor but still interesting and pleasant

wasn't joya the first lp under the will oldham name? it felt momentous to me (at 16) for that reason and so looms large in my personal palace cosmology. really good record still i think. i need to revisit ease down the road.

I like both Joya and EDTR. They're records that could only have been made by a guy in his thirties. Anyway, that's how I like to think of them.

The s/t album from 2013 is, I think, his strongest work in years.

I went back to Master & Everyone a few weeks back and found it really dull. I always confuse that one with Beware (which iirc is pretty good)

oldham sounds so good on this new joan shelley song: https://soundcloud.com/noquarterrex/stay-on-my-shore-by-joan-shelley

He did a low-key show in Louisville the other night, would have been great to be there.

Ease Down The Road is my favorite. And perfect one to listen to this time of year. Pajo's Allman-y solo on "May It Always Be" followed by the line "And in the morning we'll wrestle and ruin our stomachs with coffee."

The only blight on that record is "Just To See My Holly Home." I always skip that one.

nah. that's one of the better songs on that album imo.

ent back to Master & Everyone a few weeks back and found it really dull. I always confuse that one with Beware (which iirc is pretty good)

― Wimmels, Tuesday, June 30, 2015 11:08 AM (30 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i confuse them too. i have never been able to get into master & everyone, it definitely seems super dull and boring, i don't know maybe it will click for me one day

i love holly home!

M&E is like a balm/relief for a troubled psyche, it's soft, tenuous, warm. there are nice subtleties to mark nevers' production.. he also recorded is a woman by Lambchop, which is remarkably lush and spare.

definitely a lot of beautiful and subtle touches poured onto M&E, but the songs (outside of The Way, which is gorgeous and crushing) never really stuck with me.

been many years since i've listened though. should really revisit.

"maundering" resonates, w/its lyrics, and a lean, ranch fence-styled guitar lead.. a minor highlight of the album. weed helped to synchronize with the general wavelength/vibe of the album.

caught them live, maybe a year or so after master and everyone was released. the songs def had more weight and power, spruced up and rocked out somewhat. it helped to be already familiar with the material as well.. they played at one of the better venues (the zephyr) in salt lake city, before it closed down. I believe ZWAN had also played in town that day, as some of the members were in the audience.

http://www.dominorecordco.com/pondscum/

Saw him last night at the Vic in Chicago. He's got an astoundingly gifted band with him right now. The last song -- a medley of "Jolly One (2/15)" and "New Partner" that included harmonies from Maiden Radio (including Joan Shelley and Cheyenne Mize) -- was just gorgeous.

Having heard him in the early days then sort of checking out for good twelve or fifteen years, I'm blown away at the artist he's turned into. The thing that kind of blows my mind is that he still has a long career ahead of him. Really curious where he'll be creatively in another ten years.

Nice, he's been doing that as a set closer for a while:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_FafCJbyWE

So majestic when he's hood flies off at the end of the song. Surely staged.

Will Oldham can control the weather. Next steps in career: mainstream country success, own line of eyeliner, meteorokinesis.

I've been aware of Oldham since his earliest output, which didn't do much for me back then, and in the ensuing years I've dipped in and out of his vast discography. Some albums are good, some not as good, but for some reason I'm one of those guys for whom "I See a Darkness" is the only Oldham I'll ever play. The guy is certainly gifted, but I sometimes feel like there is a secret language I'm just not understanding, or other people are pretending to understand. Is it me, or is it him?

A sentence I have not heard anyone utter in at least twenty years: "There's a song on the new Bonnie Prince Billy album you've just got to hear." Talented chap but has been coasting / resting on his laurels for a long time.

It was a while ago but I think Superwolf has some must-hears.

I really want that album he did with Bitchin Bajas with the fortune cookie lyrics

josh - i think, at least to me, the 'secret' language you allude to is rather just the 'world' of palace/bonnie itself. will's skew-whiff delivery aside, the appeal for me is how he fluidly embodies his work... the way he just seems to breathe and live everything thats inside him. it can seem cryptic on the surface. really i think its just existential. i feel the same way about jandek, who's existential throughout his catalogue, too. while jandek's a tough listen, sometimes, i can sit and read jandek's lyrics for hours on end. digressing a bit, but... i suppose that's as succinct as i can try to be about will. maybe it sounds like im talking out my arse... im just trying to articulate what you picked up on a bit.

I think the best record he did was the one with Nashville session guys, Sings Greatest Palace Music. I didn't mind Singer's Grave a Sea of Tongues, but whatever. I've always found him just a bit...ahh, ehh. He's got good taste in stuff, for sure.

Ease Down The Road is my pick. Also, his book-long conversation with Alan Licht is pretty good at articulating the choices of persona, arrangements, etc.

fave thing he ever did was that version of Hot Chip's I Feel Better, "I Feel Bonnie"

How does this thread have no mention of the gorgeous, moving, lyrical The Letting Go? Dawn McCarthy brings ellipsoid, inverted harmonies from another dimension, Valgeir Sigurðsson's production and orchestration is sympathetic and minimal, and the songs are understated and absolutely devastating.
Oldham's greatest work bypasses form and makes an unusually direct emotional connection. If you don't feel it, you don't, but I do.
Seek: Days in the Wake, Hope EP, Viva Last Blues, Arise, Therefore, Black/Rich Music, Lost Blues, I See a Darkness, Little Lost Blues, The Letting Go
Destroy Sings Greatest Palace Music (sorry, I know many like it) - apart from TLG he kind of lost me after that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FsddBLr6pFc

yeah there are tons of great songs in his stuff from the last decade... he just releases a lot of stuff, which i think minimizes the market/word-of-mouth impact of any one album or song.

I was completely obsessed during my college years. Yeah, as beautifully articulated above, it's less catchy jams and more about a lilting, dark/light mystic world that he conjures and inhabits. I think he's a brilliant lyricist and persona.

This is his most underappreciated song in recent years that I've heard.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIv-pD6R7VI

I love this all-time classic post (well okay, actually two posts)

i went to a fair in a small and quaint english town once & all the villagers were wearing costumes & among them walked bonnie prince billy

― schlump, Saturday, 15 November 2014 06:51 (1 year ago) Permalink

i have a picture somewhere

it was nice because there was a moment when we pointed across the harbour while we were eating at a man with a big beard wearing all denim, & said that he looked like bonnie prince billy, this amusing because bonnie prince billy's look is that of the strange man of the village, probably at least approximately replicated in most small and quaint villages

but it was bonnie prince billy

― schlump, Saturday, 15 November 2014 06:53 (1 year ago) Permalink

I'm far from a BPB completist, but I feel comfortable saying that the best thing he's done in recent years = helping to launch Angel Olsen's career. The Now Here's My Plan EP of reworked old material is also a highlight... I seem to recall the 2013 s/t LP being nice though I haven't listened to it since it first came out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSO2SqwI-cI <<< this is hawt

A like a lot, or at least some, of what many of you have mentioned - I want to say I've enjoyed The Letting Go and more recently Beware and Lie Down Into the Light, though not Plays Greatest - but like I said, "Darkness" is the only one I honestly ever go back to. It could be that at least from my perspective, even if his other stuff is good, that album is just better? I dunno. Like I mentioned, I've been at least casually following him since, I dunno, 1993 or so? That's when I moved to Chicago, and that's when a lot of friends of mine were really into Palace. But Palace never did it for me then, and every several years I try again and it has yet to click. I don't find it objectively "bad," I just can't put my finger on what's pushing me away. (I'm also not a fan of Slint, so who knows.)

I think the persona thing may be what keeps me a few arms lengths away. I mean, Dylan has a persona, too, but I've never had much of an emotional connection to his music, even the stuff I like best, yet that's never been a problem; I find him best at his funniest, not his most heartbreaking. But BPB, I've had people say "you have to listen to such and such song/album, it will just reduce you to tears!" Yet while I can hear, academically, what he's after, perhaps it's the persona stuff that keeps me from embracing it, or getting out of it what he wants me to.

That said, like Dylan, I think Oldham can be really funny, too, but maybe it's just funny in all the wrong places and that throws me off.

i like this guy most on side-projects it seems. that Bitchin Bajas thing (weiiird meditative noodling) and Superwolf are highly recommended!

lie down in the light & beware are both great

His most recent 'proper' album, Singer's Grave - A Sea of Tongues, is really very good.

i adore all the palace stuff, ISAD, joya, all BPB up to ease down the road, after that i find him really boring and spotty but there is a lot i haven't listened to. master and everyone, beware, etc are snoozefests, though lie down in the light has a few songs i really enjoy. i still ahven't heard greatest palace music! i bet i would like it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1V0NbUYb9BY

My friend Caroline Peyton sings on Singer's Grave, she'd worked w/ Mark Nevers previously and Will thought her voice would be perfect for "Quail and DUMPLINGS!."

Interesting early band history c/o Drag City:

http://www.dragcity.com/news/2018-04-01-stream-palace-1993

STREAM PALACE 1993
posted April 1st, 2018

OHIO RIVER BOAT SONG

It was the summer of 1992 and Todd Brashear invited his friend Will Oldham to come live with him in Bloomington, Indiana where Brashear was in the Audio Engineering program at IU. Oldham moved into a house with Brashear and his schoolmate Grant Barger, and soon they began working on music all together. They set up a weekend session at the house with Barger at the controls, using his 8-track cassette recording machine (not to be confused with the crappy 8-track tape format popularized in the 1970s). They invited David Pajo to come up from Louisville to play on the session. There were three songs to tackle: “For the Mekons et al”, “Two More Days”, and “Drinking Woman”. Brashear played drums and lap steel and sang harmonies, Barger played bass and Pajo played lead guitars (both acoustic and electric). Oldham sang and played acoustic guitar. The house was an older house with high ceilings and wood floors, and Barger’s engineering was impeccable so that everything sounded good and felt in line with an aesthetic that felt like a true realization of what was in Oldham’s mind.

Around the same time, Brashear and Oldham scheduled a session in the IU studios, with Brashear as engineer. Britt Walford and Brian McMahan came up from Louisville and, there in the fancy studio using 16-track 2” magnetic tape, the group recorded “Ohio River Boat Song” and “Riding”, with McMahan playing drums, Brashear playing bass and Walford playing electric guitar. This sound was big and clean and the songs had a polish to them that differed significantly from the house recording with Barger. Beautiful, though maybe not quite the kind of recordings Oldham was beginning to want to be a part of. The Barger session was all about assembling people and getting the takes right together as an ensemble, while the Brashear session was more about studio craft. One could listen to “Drinking Woman” and hear the musicians clearly, almost imagine one is in the room as the song happens. “Ohio River Boat Song” has more of an out-of-time-and-place vibe happening. Brashear and Barger were both great engineers, and the methods and technology used for the two sessions differed significantly.

Oldham sent cassettes to a few record labels featuring a proposed 7” single: “For the Mekons, et al” backed with “Drinking Woman”. A perfect single! Of the four labels Oldham sent tapes to (including Matador, Homestead, and Interscope), only Drag City responded enthusiastically. He’d sent Drag City the tape because he had a copy of the Silver Jews“Dime Map of the Reef” EP and sensed a value-system in play that might accept some of what was being dished out. Drag City said they were intrigued but needed to hear more. Oldham sent them “Ohio River Boat Song” and Drag City was sold; they liked the solid power of that recording. They asked if they could match this latter song with a song from the earlier cassette for release as a single. “Drinking Woman” was a born B-side. The Mekons ode would have to wait for a more opportune moment.

The cover of the single was designed by Paul Greenlaw, a great visual and musical artist from Rhode Island. Greenlaw used an archival aerial photograph of some unnamed coastline over which he superimposed lettering fashioned from a photograph Oldham had taken of Mekons violinist Susie Honeyman (when Greenlaw started the design, the idea was still for “For the Mekons et al” to be the A-side). The lettering spelled out “palace songs”. In the lower-right corner of the front cover was a sad yellow bird that Greenlaw had drawn. The back cover featured a Greenlaw elephant, a “Palace Brothers” banner, a fleur-de-lis (symbol of Louisville, KY) and a photo from the “Drinking Woman” session of Oldham, Brashear and Pajo. There’s an alphabetical listing of contributors to the existence of the record, as Oldham was still figuring things out and didn’t know how best to attribute the existence of any fraction of the whole. Only black and yellow inks were used on the sleeve in order to keep costs down. The label design was a throwback to old-school labels: royal blue with metallic silver ink. Dan Osborn is the Drag City graphics admiral and he executed the label design beautifully.

Oldham shot a video for “Ohio River Boat Song” on 16mm black-and-white film using a wind-up Russian camera. The footage centered around the early morning horse exercises at Churchill Downs in the spring. Osborn and Oldham edited the footage at Osborn’s office in the HARPO compound.

“For the Mekons et al” came out later on the compilation Hey Drag City. “Two More Days” came out on a compilation called Love Is My Only Crime, released in Europe. “Riding” was re-arranged and re-recorded for the record There is No-One What Will Take Care of You. The recording of “Riding” from the Bloomington session was included on Lost Blues and Other Songs.

The "Ohio River Boat Song" single is streaming everywhere now.

THERE IS NO-ONE WHAT WILL TAKE CARE OF YOU

Once the “Ohio River Boat Song” single went into production, Drag City asked the Palace Brothers for a full-length record. Over the summer in Bloomington, Oldham had been writing songs and was thrilled to find that these songs might have a welcome place in the world, at least when it came to there being a label willing to release them. At the end of summer, Oldham moved back to Providence, Rhode Island, where he was ambivalently pursing a college degree in semiotics. He went to ethnomusicology professor Jeff Titon and suggested an independent study class, supervised by Titon, in which Oldham would work on a set of songs derived in many ways from a variety of historical styles, forms and sources. Oldham worked on many of the songs with musicians Matt Fanuele, Paul Greenlaw, John Davis, Mark Cummins, and Colin Gagon. Davis introduced Oldham to the records of the Royal Trux, and at one point during the fall the Trux came through Providence on tour. The band stayed over at the house Oldham shared with writer Bob Arellano. For Oldham, it was the first in-person encounter with the inner world of Drag City; not just Jennifer Herrema and Neil Hagerty, but also drummer Rian Murphy, the third leg of the power tripod (with Dan Osborn and Dan Koretzky) that has defined the character and mission of Drag City over the years.

Oldham and Brashear scheduled the recording session for December of 1992 in Kentucky. Grant Barger would engineer, using his 8-track cassette rig. There were two recording locations: a house on Ohio Street (which street has since lost its name to the larger Frankfort Avenue, of which it is effectively an extension) owned by Steve Driesler (who has, in more recent years, re-entered the Drag City galaxy through his work on the White Glove Test book of Louisville music fliers and his involvement with the Endtables reissue record) and a cabin outside of Brandenburg, KY, called “Merciful”. Brian McMahan and Britt Walford would play on the record, along with Barger, Brashear, Oldham and Paul Greenlaw. Brashear, Barger, McMahan and Walford traded off instruments (inspired, in part, by the Bad Seeds records of the 1980s), while Oldham stuck to singing and playing the guitar and Greenlaw played the banjo. Greenlaw was a deeply inspired and unique banjoist; it was the sound of Greenlaw, as opposed to the sound of a banjo, that made Greenlaw’s presence crucial.

The record was mixed by Brashear, Barger, and Oldham at Brashear’s parents house in east Louisville.

There were fifteen songs considered for the recording. A cover of the Rolling Stones “Hand of Fate” was dropped at the last minute. The full-length record ended up with twelve songs. The outtakes were “Don’t I Look Good Today”, which came out on a double 7” comp called Louisville Sluggers 3, released on Mike Bacayu’s Self Destruct label; and “Valentine’s Day”, which came out eventually on the Palace Music comp Lost Blues and Other Songs. The rest of the songs were new originals Oldham began during the previous summer in Bloomington, except “Riding”, which was begun a year or two earlier, and a cover of Washington Phillips’ “I Had a Good Mother and Father”.

Auspiciously, David Berman and Bob Nastanovitch of the Silver Jews passed through Louisville and stopped by the session at Driesler’s house. It had been the Silver Jews 7” Ep that had inspired Oldham to send the first Palace Brothers recordings to Drag City.

Greenlaw painted and/or the covers for There Is No-One What Will Take Care Of You. Oldham had asked him to render the fable of the mouse and the lion and requested that Greenlaw use bright pink and yellow. Greenlaw worked on the cover intensely, ultimately coming up with four powerful variations. Ultimately, all four were utilized, each for a different format or pressing. The back cover is a black and white photograph of a road in northern Scotland taken by Oldham during a hitch-hiking trip.

The record was licensed, via a connection made by Nastanovitch, to the British label Big Cat. The relationship with Big Cat lasted only for the one release, after which all Palace and Bonnie Prince Billy records were licensed through Domino.

There Is No-One What Will Take Care of You is streaming everywhere now.

COME IN

It was 1993 and the musical ideas were flowing. Oldham wrote two songs for a 7”, “Trudy Dies” and “Come In”. There was a live-to-DAT session done in Louisville and/or Chicago that was deemed unsuccessful. Meanwhile, Neil Hagerty and Jennifer Herrema of Royal Trux were establishing themselves as freelance record producers under the noms-de-guerre Adam & Eve, and it was decided that they should guide the recording of these two songs. The studio was King Size, in Chicago, run by Dave Trumfio. Mike Fellows tracked the drums but Hagerty erased those drum tracks and replayed the kit himself. Liam Hayes played the Mellotron. Adam & Eve expressed a desire to bring out the inner Springsteen in Oldham’s songs. The front cover of the record sleeve featured a drawing by Jeff Mueller of a bird embryo. The back cover held a photograph by Oldham of land outside of Madison, Virginia. Lyrics to “Trudy Dies” were included on an insert with drawings by Dianne Bellino. There was a video made for “Come In” featuring animation by Bellino and 16mm footage of music rehearsals in the basement of David Pajo’s parents’ house.

The "Come In" single is streaming everywhere now.

Artists in this story: Palace Music

The letting go remains my favourite to this day

i am not reading that whole thing but THERE IS NO-ONE WHAT WILL TAKE CARE OF YOU is one of my favorite titles of anything ever

SALVATION IS FREE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IR93lB1_h0w

Unlike the rest of Drag City catalog, he is slowly adding his catalog to Spotify week by week. Everything (including singles) up to Viva Last Blues is now available.

Aye - just noticed Days in the Wake and Viva Last Blues, too.

Hope and the Mountain ep and a few early singles too, if you search the various Palace pseudonyms.

His recent Merle Haggard homage, Best Troubador has been getting quite a lot of replays. Odd how i find it far more rewarding to hear Billy than i do the original material.

Arise Therefore, Joya and I See A Darkness have all appeared on Spotify, sometime in the last couple of weeks.

favorite album: Viva Last Blues (More Brother Rides, New Partner)

favorite song: "For the Mekons et al” from the Hey Drag City comp.

...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eJf2iY2Kbx0

https://ih0.redbubble.net/image.416230857.5464/flat,550x550,075,f.u1.jpg

wat

Gotta say - whatever its "deal" may be, this song grabs me more than his stuff usually does (I've played it 3 or 4 times now).

heh

https://i.imgur.com/7WfC0br.png

https://www.stereogum.com/2006096/bonnie-prince-billy-blueberry-jam-video/video/
"Per a press release, the song came about after Oldham and his wife ate THC-laced chocolate-covered blueberries soon after the false missile alert that was sent in Hawaii at the beginning of the year. Oldham wrote the song during that experience, and then repurposed it a few weeks later to help out his friend that was opening a weed shop in California."

lmao this is GOLD. thanks bill, you are the light of my life.

Nice

It’s prime time to pick blueberries n sell them at the local farmers market tbh

I smell a hit.

It’s his “Margaritaville,” not in a bad way.

I think it is terrific… I am not a scholar, but I can't think of a song of his that's even remotely uptempo, other than "work hard Play hard." Incidentally, the only thing that recommends the new right wing american character that Sasha Baron Cohen debuted on the new show (somehow he can't do an american accent for shit) is that its eerily reminiscent of Will.

song of the summer

i love this and indeed blueberries

I'm fantasising over this coming out 20 years ago and Chris Evans hammering it on the breakfast show, turning him into a one-hit wonder

i know it's Oldham and I'd forgive him pretty much anything but this has got my 'shit whimsy' Geiger clicking like mad.

oldham is one of favorite artists but i ignore probably 70% of the shit he's created

(Side note: hadn't noticed that Superwolf has made it onto Spotify.)

He's been adding a year's worth of output to Spotify every Monday.

I see a darkness is all time

this new song would be cornily endearing if BPB was a dad, but I'm pretty sure he isn't a dad

"Whipped" has climbed into my BPBPOV

He seems like a person who is v. much enjoying life these days.

The chorus of this song reminds me of the beginning of "Katamari On The Rocks"

#noizeboardnostalgia

He seems like a person who is v. much enjoying life these days.

The pics in the 2nd post were in a big NYT feature, so you could relax re: your stalker paranoia!

i never tire of looking at photos of artists' homes

i never want to look at photos of artists' homes! it feels so invasive and gross to me. every time i have looked i wish i hadn't.

https://i.imgur.com/kPPdDYM.jpg

TFW your very first show is opening for Big Star's big reunion in STL and you hire the best backing band you know.

Who are those guys?

https://grantland.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/slint-1-hp.gif?w=2048

IT US

Haha, didn't recognize them with dry hair

i barely recognized Oldham with hair

I thought he was Beck at first glance.

good grief that guy really did get all the breaks didn't he?!
does anyone know/care to share how it happened that he was opening for big star as his first show? i am curious

No Pajo, I think that's Grant Barger on banjo.

https://i.imgur.com/94g42Uv.png

i love seeing photos of young bill! what a gem.

thank you for the response! From what I can tell, the answer is "there was somehow an offer"? i am not satisfied! from whom? why?

It was at University of Missouri... maybe some of the guys had connections to the student bookers? (I'm totally just guessing)

Maybe. There is definitely something more factual behind "there was somehow an offer". Still curious.

I remembered that my wife works with a guy who was one of the two college DJs who organized that Big Star reunion show... I asked her to pick his brain and see if he knows/recalls anything about the Palace booking.

hey that's awesome! i just want to know how something like that actually happens, not how it is reflected in the lore or whatever. it probably does boil down to "friends"

I'm interested too!

Got an amazingly great anecdote / reminiscence back from the guy. Don't think I can post it verbatim (and won't use his name), so figuring out how to whittle it down...

Wish I had DM capability and/or your trust!

(a Louisville friend "well-actually"'d me and said that Will, Todd & Grant performed at a cafe "a couple of times" before the Big Star gig.)

(which morrisp's link goes into much better detail, haha, sorry for posting before clicking all links)

The core of it is that this guy (the college DJ and Big Star fan) was friends with Bob Nastanovich, and Bob "knew Will from Louisville and suggested we put him on the bill." He continues: "I didn’t really know what we were getting. But I knew Will from the movie Matewan. I think maybe we gave him $500. We definitely didn’t have 5g. If it was his first show, I didn’t know that at the time (or until now)."

He included a few other personal recollections which are v cool but I probably can't share here.

xp: (though I can confirm that is Grant on banjo in the pic which the meticulously detailed website is uncertain of w/r/t early lineup)

Bob "knew Will from Louisville and suggested we put him on the bill."

They were roommates at the time iirc.

What a great revive, this!

The new arrangements with Eighth Blackbird are gorgeous. It really shows where he is as a singer to hold his own with this ensemble.

Here’s a live one of “One with the Birds”:
https://vimeo.com/179383778

The new arrangements with Eighth Blackbird are gorgeous. It really shows where he is as a singer to hold his own with this ensemble.

Here’s a live one of “One with the Birds”:
https://vimeo.com/179383778

<3 that

same! going to get the album on the back of it

new single off new album, sounds like 8th Blackbird is still involved:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LhMz9pvRNCQ

'Superwolves' came out a couple of weeks ago. I'm on track 3. Great stuff so far.

https://www.dragcity.com/products/superwolves

Reading posts from a year ago discussing the show at the university of Missouri. My good friend, Jeff Breeze, was the student who called Alex and pitched the idea of a Big Star reunion gig on campus. This was a few years before I went to school there and became friends with him, though.
He sadly passed away very suddenly last November. I know he was working on writing up the whole experience and shopping it around for publication, but he wasn't getting much traction.

I am not at all certain about any of the details surrounding the event. It had already become the stuff of college radio legend by the time I got there.

Gonna be a luddite and hold out for my physical copy of Superwolves. I've been waiting years for a follow-up, so a few more months ain't gonna kill me. I know pressing plants and schedules are still out of whack, but I'm surprised by how far behind Drag City's physical releases are lagging.

Having now listened to Superwolves fully a few times I am delighted to report that it is magnificent. A worthy successor to Superwolf.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xzjahqr9wGs

https://www.theguardian.com/culture/2023/aug/24/bonnie-prince-billy-i-cant-regret-working-with-r-kelly-it-made-me-better-able-to-judge-my-behaviour-and-that-of-others

Didn't know about the Birdman thing.

Thanks for that, the "Birdman" thing is nuts.

His new album is terrific, one of my favorites of his in recent years.

I didn't know he took that Slint cover photo.

feel like the title 'Good Morning, Popocatépetl' is some sort of infringement

new record is great imo

absolutely, def top tier Oldham.

Bonnie "Prince" Billy is headlining Supersonic festival in Birmingham this August/September... I'm hoping this means there will be some other UK dates around that time.

he’s playing QMU in aug. presale is open

Thanks, obviously I'd totally missed that! When was it announced? I blame wretched social media algorithms.

He also has a small role in the upcoming movie The Bikeriders

Every now and then I become convinced “Troublesome Houses” is one of the greatest songs ever written.

H.P otm

also this news today: https://www.instagram.com/p/C3-jBRyunnM/
"ryan daly made this film. i witnessed and nudged. @criterionchannel is now streaming it. the idea was to give audiences a time and space to listen to an intentional grouping of songs, in this case the Bonnie Prince Billy record KEEPING SECRETS WILL DESTROY YOU. it was shown in movie theaters across the western world. i am a card-carrying Criterion subscriber and have found it a tremendous resource for uplift, edification and, at times, escape. we are honored and grateful to have our work on the channel. @dragcityrecords @dominorecordco"

why the fuck is there a british band called Palace

"Their debut album on Fiction records, So Long Forever (2016), trawled the wreckage of Wyndham’s shattered psyche following the death of a family member and the break-up of both his parents’ and his own relationships, and chimed with the times"

no thank you

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IpSCDm9HJmc

I felt the last record a bit of letdown after the excellent I Made A Place, but man oh man The Purple Bird is sounding amazing so far (only played side A)

does anyone know why it's on No Quarter and not Drag City

Not sure, but they also released an album he did last year with Nathan Salsburg and Tyler Trotter.

that one is amazing, two side-long lungfish covers.

Yeah, it's great! Looking forward to the new one, supposed to get here tomorrow. But I actually that the last one was really good too!

does anyone know why it's on No Quarter and not Drag City

― Murgatroid, Thursday, January 30, 2025 6:12 AM (three hours ago)

check the latest Kreative Kontrol podcast interview with Will, he talks about it a little bit, nothing definitive but just that there may be some behind the scenes drama.

https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/ep-944-bonnie-prince-billy/id652522142?i=1000686107011

Bandcamp listening party in about 30 mins (2 p.m. Eastern 1/30):

https://t.co/zyR1md2CPM

today at the two o'clock hour of the eastern United States. 14 o'clock.

— Boniface Billy (@signifyingwolf) January 30, 2025

xp i've listened to this episode like twice now (good thing the interview is short) and I don't hear anything like what you're describing

yeah I also couldn't find that bit?

Mrs Ippei may be a subscriber -- Vish of Kreative Kontrol has switched to podcasting full-time, so we who don't pay only get excerpted interviews

ah

yes, 53 minute of patreon version

Will on Drag City on Kreative Konrtol:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxZvJsRPLnE

Yikes…?

I think a simple "no comment" might have been better. The cagey lack of specificity here will almost surely lead to some wild speculations

...

it's so vague that there's nothing to speculate with

Yeah, it's hard to speculate, but seems like he was hinting at an issue with maybe just Dan Koretzky? Since he went on to say how much he still likes the other folks at the label.

Anyway no offence to the I’m sure fine folks at No Quarter, I hope Will patches things up with DC in time for his next record, BPB was my entry point into the DC catalog and the first artist I think of when I think of that label, I’m sure this is true for many others

Yeah, I still dig a lot of what Drag City puts out, I just wish they hadn't nearly abandoned the CD option for most of their releases.

I gotta wonder if its something political (like so many other falling-outs over the last couple years)

Some interesting songs (until 2000) like Smog (until 2000 too!)

"I gotta wonder if its something political (like so many other falling-outs over the last couple years)

― waste of compute (One Eye Open)"

I can assure you that this is not the case

A lot of Drag City's resources are being held for the next Joanna Newsom record and Will likes to move fast.

I'm sad that this thread is all about vague label gossip, instead of how good the new album is

Mine just finally got delivered last night! Hoping to give my first spin later today.

A lot of Drag City's resources are being held for the next Joanna Newsom record and Will likes to move fast.

Had that same thought.

Also did the Bandcamp listening party last week for the album--love it so far. Obliterates any Gen X idea of "you don't want to get caught sounding polished" (though BPB did that a long time ago once before with Nashville cats).

i didnt mean to imply anything untoward, he just sounds so intense & personal in that clip, but also yeah, idgaf. the new record is really good, i've listened to it a bunch, its been kind of just what i need to get through the last week or so of political terror

boise idaho is so good

I was the biggest Will Oldham fan in my 20s (like I travelled to see him 3 nights in a row in Vancouver, etc.) and I still am a fan (though you can guess I admittedly haven't kept up with him as much in recent years) but I'm not as fond of this new one as much as you guys are

idk maybe I prefer him a bit more brooding?

There are great songs on this one, in their way, but at the risk of "the older stuff was better!" banality, there has been something comfortable, domestic, unthreatening in his music, at least in the last 10 years or so. Nothing wrong with that, perhaps, and I know his personal circumstances have changed. But I always thought the point of the various monikers, 'Bonnie Prince Billy' included, was to ward off too close a connection between the songs and the life.

Maybe I just want a bit more abstraction, some archaic diction, a bit more left to the imagination?

I love the new album but he’s a prick. This is from the Stereogum interview. It’s annoying.

How did you first encounter her and her music?

OLDHAM: It was 2002 maybe. We did a tour of the West Coast that was spurred on by a band called Rainywood, which morphed into Brightblack Morning Light. And we did three annual tours together. The first one was the West Coast. And in putting my band together, I think I was talking to Kyle Field of Little Wings and I think we figured out we were gonna rehearse in Portland, Oregon, and I asked if he knew of a keyboard player. And he referred me to his friend Rob Kieswetter, who records under the name Bobby Birdman. And he’s from Nevada City, Grass Valley area.

And so we finished the tour. Last show was in Solana Beach, California, close to San Diego. And all the musicians dispersed except for me, Colin Gagon, and Rob Kieswetter, and we had to return all the gear to Isaac Brock from Modest Mouse. We borrowed a bunch of gear from him. And on the way, Rob was like, “Why don’t we stop in Nevada City and play a show? There’s a movie theater there. I can just set something up.” So we went, and I remember seeing this young woman walking around, and she definitely had an interesting air about her, but I didn’t meet her.

In the van the next day, Rob said, “Oh, my friend Joanna gave me her CD-R, and she wanted you to hear it. I think it’s pretty good if you want to listen to it.” And yeah, I thought it was incredibly novel and compelling and interesting. And for the next tour with Rainywood — I can’t remember if they were Brightblack yet or not; we basically just moved one set of states over for the next summer — I asked her if she would open four or five shows. So we began just south of Solana Beach in San Diego the next year and then went into Arizona, New Mexico, Utah. And she played a handful of those shows, as did Dawn McCarthy.

I would often talk to Drag City about artists that I thought they might be interested in releasing, some of which they would not, and so that’s when I created a, you know, a sub-label Palace Records imprint to put things out like Alasdair Roberts’ Appendix Out project or Dave Pajo’s M. It was first called M before it was Papa M or Aerial M. But Drag City, for some reason, they liked the Joanna Newsom. And now we’re in the quandary we’re in today with her.

What’s the quandary?

OLDHAM: I’m kind of joking, but I’ve also just always been like — well, I don’t know. Is she making music? I don’t know.

Oh, that quandary.

OLDHAM: Yeah, I mean, part of it is I appreciate artists who have a respectful relationship with their audience, and I’m not sure that’s evident there. But her husband makes a lot of money, so she doesn’t have to worry about it. Maybe if my wife made a lot of money, I would disappear and have children.

jesus!
that's rude

Yeah, that's gross. Is he hinting that he needs more credit for bringing her to Drag City's attention? Jealousy? Regardless, not a good look.

A few off-the-cuff remarks about how she married rich seem tame considering that Bluebeard song but w/e

I always had very complicated feelings about the Bluebeard song, not because I swear any allegiance to dudes, but because there was something awfully traditional about it - I think you can write about men who leave destruction in their wake, men who take advantage of their position as men to be emotionally careless at best and deceitful and exploitative at worst, without asking, "Who is going to bear your beautiful children? Who will take care of you when you're old and dying?" It sort of tries to paint patriarchal domesticity, the family and a woman's place in it, as feminist. I don't particularly like that, nor tbh the orientalist imagery.

I still do like the song a lot because there's something that rings true about it; I'm just not sure I trust Joanna to articulate it properly, or to have the imagination needed to envision something beyond it. I say this as someone who loves MEM and Ys a lot, and that they are better than anything Will has ever done.

That being said, I thought the song was directed more at Callahan than Oldham, despite the "Master and Everyone" reference. I have absolutely no confidence that either were not dickheads/stereotypical men in their day (or tbh even now).

Re: Will's quote about Joanna, I can't defend any of that if I take his words at face value. But after reading the entire interview, if I try to be generous and essentially put words in his mouth, I can see how someone whose life is so embedded in music-making - whose sense of community cannot be divorced from the practice of playing music with others - would be disappointed or even bitter to see a peer remove herself and marry into celebrity and money.

I'm sure she sees it very differently. I have no doubt that as a woman she was pushed away from that sense of belonging as much as she removed herself from it. But I'm also not too enthusiastic about the life she chose for herself. I'm a total nobody - and I'd never have this choice in the first place - but you wouldn't catch me dead attempting to enter that world either. I've loved her music a lot in the past, but I'm not sure I'm particularly interested in hearing more of her from the place she inhabits now.

I think I'm misunderstanding what the issue with her and Drag City is and how it relates to Will.

The issue is the limited time, money, and resources a smallish label like Drag City has for the pressing and promotion of a record. Joanna Newsome is the biggest seller of any Drag City release. She’s been currently recording new music, but doesn’t have a deadline or anything. But when that record is finished it will take up a lot of Drag Citys workload and they have to set all that aside for a record without a set release date. Instead of waiting for all that to get figured out Will just released his finished, and kinda most commercial in years record on a different label. And he seems mildly salty about it.

Guys

Just to be clear, Will’s move away from DC has nothing to do with either DC proper or Joanna Newsom, it was an other thing that is so boring that all this speculation seems idk ~~Ozymandian~~ in comparison

Also thanks rairun for that generous post

#dragcitydrama

Brother JT thinks Black Bananas are too macho

Drag City is releasing the soundtrack to Amanda Milius’ Trump documentary. Alternatively, Drag City isn’t releasing the soundtrack to Amanda Milius’ Trump documentary

'

Back to The Purple Bird though, this really is excellent! I can see why some might not like this, but it's hitting me really well today.

“keeping secrets will destroy you” might be one of his best genuinely

Both Purple Bird and Keeping Secrets have hit my ears as returns to form, as different as they are. I'm a big John Prine fan and Purple Bird seems to bear his influence heavily, in a way that threatens to contaminate what makes Oldham special, but he manages to pull it off. The cleverness of Oldham's lyrics has always been a trademark but he has typically deployed it more for elegance than whimsy (not that Prine can't do both too, but his legacy here - and often - lies more on the whimsical side). Keeping Secrets is more what I think of as classic BPB, delicate sweetness with an undercurrent of darkness and tension that is usually there if it catches the light right. All that said, with a guy like Oldham, he works so much that I can never tell whether my digging new stuff has more to do with me, cycling back around to him and taking an interest in his latest, than it does with the quality of a particular new project. Either way, I'm enjoying listening to him again these days!