the band that best addrsses 'Irishness' and the subject of Ireland

* ducks *

x-post, i got beat to it

I'm spent.

Christy Moore or something.

That guy.

NEUTRAL milk hotel! *winks*

Bah, humbug.

(Possible answer: JA music seems to be on a tip of continuously re-telling / mythologising the present day...).

oh for the days of coffin ships and potato famines.

ps kilian, thank you, you lovely man, you.

Roy Keane to thread!

There's plenty of romantic sentimentalisation of Africa in Jamaican music though DS, yes? So it's really the Irishness which you find cloying?

Ummmm, did The Pogues actually reflect the genuine experience of Irishness and being Irish or did they (and similarly The Men They Couldn't Hang) not in actual fact reflect the (inevitably somewhat distorted and romanticised) impression of Irishness and being Irish that you'd get from growing up (as most of them did) as 2nd generation Irish immigrants listening to their ex-pat. parents sentimental reminiscences about their home land?

Please note I'm not trying to detract from the Pogues in any way, merely to identify them as what they were - a bunch of London punks with Irish parents.

Stiff Little Fingers and Saw Doctors OTM.

How about The Chieftains, The Dubliners, Christy Moore?

... this is kind of my point: that's been one of the key experiences of 'Irishness' for a long time, hasn't it?

Dave, I was trying to make conversation because I'm interested in this subject: I wasn't trying to shut you up.

Christy Moore is a good nomination, for this thread. Probably the best I can think of.

I dunno about "Irishness" - it seems to be a basic element of human nature that people of all nationalities become increasingly anxious to develop and cling to an increasingly romantic and idealised version of their homeland the longer they're away from the dreary realities of it, yes.

I imagine that if I were forced to spend the rest of my days on some horrible Caribbean island right now, within a couple of years I'd probably start singing mournful songs about how much I miss the joys of driving 'round the M25; the efficiency of South West Trains; the exemplary levels of cleanliness, service and excellent cuisine at the Moto services on the M4; and the wonderfully refreshing rain that occasionally interrupts the glorious sunshine than glints enticingly off the abandoned shopping trolleys that have been dumped in the Kennet canal.

There again....

This makes it sound like Ireland needs a Manic Street Preachers.

I'm saying we don't need a house band at all. My thesis is that we no longer have any stories worth singing about.

Actually, there's a native comedy troupe who occasionally appear (Mighty Wind-style) as fake-folkie balladeers, satirising the whiny, recriminatory self-pity that pervades so much of Ireland's "trad" songbook.
They're called The Hairy Bowsies*, and their songs tackle Perfidious Albion (Ye Dirty English Bastards) and sacred cows such as the 1916 Rising (The Craic We Had The Day We Died For Ireland) and the Potato Famine (Jaysus, The Spuds Aren't Lookin' The Best).

(*"Bowsie" is a Dublin slangword connoting a man of low breeding and unpleasant personal habits.)

philomena begley

I always wondered if "the ambulance . . . took little Jim away" in the Undertones' song because he committed suicide or because a bomb got him.

What, no-one's mentioned The Cranberries yet :-)

No Foster and Allen? It's a disgrace, so it is.

Re: The supposed Irishness of the Pogues. The line-up in their mid-80's heyday was as follows:

Shane McGowan who was born in Tunbridge Wells
James Fearnley who was born in Manchester
Spider Stacey who was born in Eastbourne
Jem Finer who was born in Stoke
Andrew Ranken who was born in London
Cait O'Riordan who was born in Nigeria (before moving to London)
Darrell Hunt who was born in Hampshire

but(although he didn't join till Rum, Sodomy etc)....
Phil Chevron was born in Dublin YAAAAAY!

A lot of 19th century National Romantic composers, painters and authors preferred to live outside their home countries.

Their "home country" is England.

Bap Kennedy has a few songs that help this Yank relate to living in difficult times in Ireland.

The Divine Comedy - Sunrise

I was born in Londonderry
I was born in Derry City too
Oh what a special child
To see such things and still to smile
I know that there was something wrong
But I kept my head down and carried on

I grew up in Enniskillen
I grew up in Inis Ceathlain too
Oh what a clever boy
To watch your hometown be destroyed
I know that I could not stay long
So I kept my head down and carried on

Who cares where national borders lie
Who cares whose laws you're governed by
Who cares what name you call a town
Who'll care when you're six feet beneath the ground

From the corner of my eye
A hint of blue in the black sky
A ray of hope, a beam of light
An end to thirty years of night
The church-bells ring, the children sing
What is this strange and beautiful thing
It's the sunrise
Can you see the sunrise?
I can see the sunrise

the band that best addrsses 'Irishness' and the subject of Ireland ...inna reggae song?

Christy Moore was still the best answer on this thread, but it asked for a band, so it would probably have to be Planxty whose first three albums (at least) were pretty much peerless.

planxty was such a good band, and pre-MOR paul brady was even better than christy moore imho (lol i just remembered luka bloom, christy's brother - is he still "around")

Mary Coughlan: "My Land Is Too Green" (abt sentimental self-mythologising alcoholics ect)

No mention of Clannad or Enya?

the Virgin Prunes, see especially the song "Down The Memory Lane" or most of Heresie for example.

Actually, there's a native comedy troupe who occasionally appear (Mighty Wind-style) as fake-folkie balladeers, satirising the whiny, recriminatory self-pity that pervades so much of Ireland's "trad" songbook.
They're called The Hairy Bowsies*, and their songs tackle Perfidious Albion (Ye Dirty English Bastards) and sacred cows such as the 1916 Rising (The Craic We Had The Day We Died For Ireland) and the Potato Famine (Jaysus, The Spuds Aren't Lookin' The Best).

must look these guys up, those titles are pretty sharp.

There's always the Horslips.

I vote for Primordial. Easily the greatest Irish band of the last 20 years.

The Craic We Had The Day We Died For Ireland

lol

so beautiful...

There's clearly a gap in the market for a band of young(ish) men full of righteous anger spewing venom about falling house prices, the income levy, and the loss of Ranelagh's Michelin star restaurant.

There's clearly a gap in the market for a band of young(ish) men full of righteous anger spewing venom about falling house prices, the income levy, and the loss of Ranelagh's Michelin star restaurant.

or career rebirth for the Thrills, to give vent to the anger of their class....

I used to play football (soccer) with the lead singer of Primordial when I was a kid. He's one of my best friend's cousins.

my best mate was introduced to his GF by one of the thrills at a wedding, and subsequently given the use of his posh room to consummate said meeting.

that pic from the youtube primordial is five mins from me.

i got nothin else.

that was actually my dad

seriously tho, first sentence, are you saying your mate slept with guy from primordial's gf? or the dude from the thrills? i saw the thrills in aladdin's on brick lane last thurs. the circle is complete.

introduced to his own future gf, not a gf of any of the thrills. that i am aware of.

ah okay, now i understand. the dublin indie scene is pretty small. a lot of bands/artists i thought were irredeemably shite turn out to be v nice and good fun and into techno.

their music still shite tho...imo

certainly.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7NV52UApGY
Women from the UK/Ireland area have the most soothing songs/voices. This girl, Enya, Leona Lewis, Dolores O'Riordan from the cranberries to name a few.
Just something about celtic women singing that calms the soul.
Jarsia 1 year ago 34

has never heard Dolores O honk like a sealion on "Zombie" i take it

the band ronan was looking for singing about young posh middleclass upwardly mobile ireland (but well aware of cultural nationalism's importance to edge in the celt angle) are probably bell x1 tbh, cf reacharound

but i mean the chieftains were suckin diesel last night on jools holland and if we can go back to the dubliners, those are good answers too.

just think of all those douce celtic sirens like sinead o'connor, jessie j and the melifluous cerys from catatonia

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQcnepLAu0k

NPR says they deliver “a brilliant co-mingling of electronic music and anthemic pop rock”.[4] The band is named after the Bell X-1, the first supersonic aircraft in history.

co-mingling

The Clancy Brothers with Tommy Makem

They're called The Hairy Bowsies*, and their songs tackle Perfidious Albion (Ye Dirty English Bastards) and sacred cows such as the 1916 Rising (The Craic We Had The Day We Died For Ireland) and the Potato Famine (Jaysus, The Spuds Aren't Lookin' The Best).

I thought this was Ding Dong Denny O'Reilly, one of whose tunes is reputed to feature the lovely lyric "Flow river flow / fuck off to the sea".

I understand that the same person was also behind Tony St. James and the Joshua Trio.

an old website: http://indigo.ie/~lwp/dingdong/

I know everyone will tell me to fuck off but what about those Fontaines DC lads

i was hoping this revive was going to be about Fontaines DC

I’ve never heard of them! Will check them out.

I also just saw The Blizzards have a new album out, dubious because I feel they are really best remembered at the time I experienced them (plus my favourite of theirs is a bside I got on mytunes circa 2006 that didn’t make it onto the album ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ )

Crying at this Genius annotation in Boys in the Better Land

Carrolls is an Irish brand of cigarettes which had its headquarters in Dundalk Ireland. The traditional Irish ownership and production location so close to the border with Northern Ireland makes it a popular cigarette with Irish Republican smokers – the type of person that might spit out “Brits Out”

riiiiight

I started off smoking Carrolls!

Yeah I mean Carrolls is, what, a pretty normal brand? Are Major more authentocrat?!

Nah Major is an aul fella brand surely

Major are like Carrolls' harder older stockier brother

Do these brands exist anymore?

They do!

https://shop.supervalu.ie/shopping/newsagent-tobacco-cigarettes-major-25-s-1-piece-/p-1544159000

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/fd/Sweetafton.jpg

^^^ discounted 2011, proper aul fella fags

Absolutely stunned that there is no mention whatsoever of Cathal Coughlan on this thread. For shame . . .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRe0Jses5hw

Absolutely stunned that there is no mention whatsoever of Cathal Coughlan on this thread. For shame . . .

Microdisney and The Fatima Mansions quite obviously own this thread.

― noodle vague (noodle vague), Tuesday, 18 May 2004 10:10 (fifteen years ago) bookmarkflaglink

Ah, I did a word search for his surname.

No mention of Flogging Molly though

no mention of the Rubberbandits as far as i can see

for shame...

xp had this been 2011 I would have been happy to write about how much I loved Serious About Men! Always rated them

I really love the Fontaines DC album but it’s the kind of experience where I could imagine being talked out of it.

I know what you mean. someone on my FB feed dismissed it as 'Lamacq-core' but you know, if every UK indie rock band is gonna get called that while the likes of Ought and Parquet Courts are allowed then it's not fair. Also, compared to Idles who I find fun but super-cringy, there's no comparison

ahem

both Dad Punk tbf

Theres nothing blindingly original about them (and why does that have to be the be all and end all) by any means but I love them. "Boys in the better land" is a banger

And yes the lyrics do address what it's like to live in late '10s Dublin

listening to them for the first time coincidentally. keep reminding me of the hold steady.

I definitely think Republic of Loose were responding to some idea of ''Irishness" in a more complex and nuanced way than Bono would have you believe:

"The Celtic twilight turned into Celtic soul with Van Morrison. Republic of Loose grabbed the Celtic tiger by the tail, swung it around their heads and threw it out the window into the cosmos. They're sophisticated soul bootboys."

Cruelty Man

Once there was the cruelty man
The whip of the state in his hands
Creeping round the halting site to steal their infancy
If they held out in the ditches well then come the morn
They had to move on again
Brush that history down the shore, disinfect the corridors
Mother she is fallen & the father is unknown
Superior vile she burnt the files, left a generation in tatters

They’re rising, they’re rising, their chances of surviving
What’s really after happening in the fields?

A young one that was raped so young
Took decades to discover her tongue
Touch me daughter sergeant & I’ll break your fucking knees
You’re the bastion of misogyny
Protected by the baton of ignorance

They’re rising, they’re rising, their chances of surviving
What’s really after happening in the fields?

The parish is rising, the parish is rising
In the diocese & the villages that were poisoned
The parish is rising, the parish is rising
To find out what has happened in the fields

What kind of mind debased & rank
Buries babies in a septic tank

If there’s a heaven father then you’re going to fuckin hell
You may not have signed off the heinous crimes
But pulled down the blinds when they came for the answers

They’re rising, they’re their chances of surviving
What’s really after happening in the fields?

They’re rising, they’re rising but no-one’s televising
What’s really after happening in the fields?

I'm posting this here because this is one of the few threads that's ever mentioned Christy Moore. I did a bit of a rabbit-hole dive on him recently — I was aware of him and love "Ride On," but hadn't really listened to much. In the course of that, the song that really leapt out at me was "Bright Blue Rose," which (like "Ride On") is a Jimmy MacCarthy song. Apparently kind of a modern standard in Ireland? Anyway, it's a beautiful tune and just wanted to call attention to it. I guess it somewhat fits this thread because its soaked in a sort of mystical literary Catholicism that feels very Irish to me. This is Christy and Jimmy singing it together.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=glGdAwGBt8s

Anyone listening to Kneecap from Ireland

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/16/arts/music/kneecap-irish-rap-celtic-revival.html

Yeah I like them

ctrl-F "Planxty"
HWAT/?