Marilyn Haggerty's amazing Olive Garden review and the subsequent viral shitstorm

I watched it all unfold, undoubtledly like many of us. In my case it was a Facebook link to a newspaper in North Dakota. A reviewer reviewed The Olive Garden, with all the ernest enthusiasm and wide-eyed amazement of a kid in a corporate candystore.

As a New Yorker, I have my moments where I get that stereotypical superiority complex, and reading the review was one of them. It was funny to me that in some places, an Olive Garden opening would be big news or that a review of the place would also warrant some column inches in the local daily.

When the review went viral, the reactions seem to be, Haha, look at the rubes who think that fancy dining is an Olive Garden. And then, the backlash towards them, asking what is it to you, city boy?

You can see all of it encapsulated thanks to Kevin Hoffman at the Minneapolis City Pages whose interview with a nonplussed Haggerty oozes with smarmy condescension. However in the interview, Haggerty doesn't take the bait, doesn't come off like Barney Fife as much as she does Sherrif Andy. And the comments vilify the author so much he was forced to add an addendum that says he didn't mean to be mean-spirited (about as convincing as your average Rush Limbaugh apology, but still.)

[A note to Hoffman: Everything is relative. I can find laughable charm in your "big" city just like any other jaded New Yorker could and please note that the banner ad on the page I linked - at least when I was on it last - was a link not to some new pasta purveyor, but a fucking Buca di Beppo.]

I lived in smaller places myself, places like Columbus, Ohio where chain establishments filled the year-end best-of lists without fail. This doesn't make for bad people. It makes for people with less choices, that's all. And you can note the differences - and even laugh about them - without being an elitist.

As a former writer, I always tried to write to my audience. Marilyn Haggerty has done that superbly, so well that it helped stir up the rural-wasteland-vs.-urban-elitism themes because her words were not just read by her audience, thanks to the power of the internet. If she didn't know her audience so well - if she didn't do her job so well - none of this would have ever happened.

But if we can recognice our differences with humor and respect instead of insecure posturing and defensive anger, we are a lot better off. And I think that lesson can apply not just to restaurant reviews-turned-internet memes, but for nearly every avenue of life.

Pass the breadsticks...

was pretty surprised to see this take off as much as it did.
she seems pretty cool

I just wanted to call to tell you how much I enjoyed your Olive Garden review.

Oh, I'm sure you did.

Kevin Hoffman does come off pretty dickish

Her best interview is here.

We were talking about it over here:

shit that looks like an onion article but isn't

<3 guilelessness, <3 Marilyn

― Carlos Pollomar (WmC), Friday, March 9, 2012 2:53 PM (51 seconds ago)

Kevin Hoffman does come off pretty dickish

Why is that it's always people from the midwest who seem most intent on making fun of rubes? It's like, dude, you're in Minneapolis.

haha you went there

" A reviewer reviewed The Olive Garden, with all the ernest enthusiasm and wide-eyed amazement of a kid in a corporate candystore."

This is really gross and unfair. People who write for community newspapers have to fill space, and she was nowhere near as enthusiastic as he makes her out to be.

cause they grew up being bullied by rubes? and they are still surounded by them and so are easily annoyed by them?

My booth was near the kitchen, and I watched the waiters in white shirts, ties, black trousers and aprons adorned with gold-colored towels. They were busy at midday, punching in orders and carrying out bread and pasta.

wait is that first post from somewhere or just a post

people thinking this review is somehow unique or remarkable is way more embarassing than the review itself.
i'm from a place way larger than grand forks where there is a full-time food reviewer on staff of the paper and his reviews don't really go beyond marilyn's work.

the only part that i thought was o_O in a bad way was at the end where she clearly just c/p'd olive garden PR copy but that's on her editors

haha that kind of thing happens all the time at community papers

anyway, where does this rank in terms of viral stars/memes of 2012

"The Drunken Noodle" doesn't sound like the kind of restaurant that you'd normally be at. Was it pretty wild there? Was there a lot of drinking?

So is it that the Minnesota food writer never heard of this dish, or is he just certain that the North Dakota food writer hasn't and he can have some fun at her expense?

I admit that I found this article funny when I read it but I really want this whole thing to end now. Every single additional thing written about it is just making it worse, especially the bloggers *coming to her defense* with even more heaped-on condescension and overanalysis.

yeah i agree

the internet gets so startled when it realizes someone is actually a real person

kevin hoffman pwnd - hoffman might as well have spanked him over her lap

real people can handle being internet memes they can even handle the occasional concern troll iirc xp

she needs to monetize her 5 minutes of fame, maybe she could work out a deal w/ olive garden

This all reminds me of that scene in Nurse Betty just before Aaron Eckhart gets scalped by Chris Rock and Aaron is trying to explain why his small town is so shit so he tells the story of how everyone queued up to go to the Burger King that opened up and Morgan Freeman tells him that's not stupidity, it's just ignorance.

Maybe she can get a reality show with that homeless radio announcer guy.

and that yo yo guy

and that cigar box guy

and winnebago man

Grand Forks is a college town. Big ass hockey arena and some awesome mid-century neon signage there.

I feel like there is a good forksclovestofu pun to be made in here somewhere but it's not coming

You can see all of it encapsulated thanks to Kevin Hoffman at the Minneapolis City Pages whose interview with a nonplussed Haggerty oozes with smarmy condescension.

just no

I'm amused by the article, not because I'm someone who enjoys pointing the finger of mockery at people from anywhere that's not Manhattan, but because I used to edit two weekly local papers in suburban NJ (yes, simultaneously) and we ran shit like this all the time. "Local event of no interest to anyone not from this town" was front page news every single week. We ran pictures of people's Christmas light displays. Articles about the installation of a new streetlight - not a streetlight at an intersection that had previously not had one, but the replacement of an older model streetlight with a newer model. And yeah, food reviews were of new chain restaurants. So for me it was a (semi-)fond memory of a past job.

I think the onion-esque picture of her is prob what made this big as much as the actual content

haha, you are describing my job exactly. If you were in Union or Essex county it might have even been the same chain of weeklies. xpost

...with all the ernest enthusiasm and wide-eyed amazement of a kid in a corporate candystore.

also, i see a fair amount of poker-faced "well, it's a job" -style uncynical awareness in her review

In fact there was an old lady there who I remember wrote a glowing review of the very ordinary chinese carryout place across the street from the office. But the thing is I had to write complete bullshit all the time, b/c there just wasn't enough going on in the tiny town I covered to fill a paper. I wrote story after story on exactly how many downtown businesses were vacant, whether a sign ordinance would help, the (non) progress of the development and construction of a relatively small mixed use property, a "controversy" over a "historic" flagpole that the town wanted to remove, etc.

My big scoop was that a local beauty salon owner might have *embezzled* a few thousand dollars from a charity haircutting event that she held.

I just wanted to call to tell you how much I enjoyed your Olive Garden review.

Oh, I'm sure you did.

― mizzell, Friday, March 9, 2012 3:44 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

she pretty much pwns him out of the gate with this

haha, you are describing my job exactly. If you were in Union or Essex county it might have even been the same chain of weeklies. xpost

I live in Union County, so yeah, I bet you work for W0rr@ll. I quit one week after I stumbled across the ad section of one of my papers and saw a quarter-page ad from some church, asking its parishioners to come in that Sunday and "pray for an end to the plague of homosexuality."

I think it's totally weird this blew up, but OTOH I grew up reading and eventually working at rural papers, too.

Also a new Olive Garden is huge in a town that hasn't had one in the area. One opened up in Las Cruces right before I moved and there were lines out the door for weeks. No joke. My parents were very proud our hometown finally got an Olive Garden; they made a point of driving near it to point it out (they did the same with the new Carl's Jr., we ate at neither bcz both too expensive for my family).

haha, you are describing my job exactly. If you were in Union or Essex county it might have even been the same chain of weeklies. xpost

I live in Union County, so yeah, I bet you work for W0rr@ll. I quit one week after I stumbled across the ad section of one of my papers and saw a quarter-page ad from some church, asking its parishioners to come in that Sunday and "pray for an end to the plague of homosexuality."

― 誤訳侮辱, Friday, March 9, 2012 5:41 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

That is exactly who I worked for, but it was a number of years ago.

At the county weekly I worked for, the first article I wrote was about how someone had driven on the post office lawn. Between that and the photo, it took up half a tabloid-size page. The paper owner had dibs on writing restaurant reviews because those were easy/fun writing compared to reports of a cow blocking traffic or the Rotary Club meeting or the stuff I usually wrote about.

Ah, OK - I misread your post and assumed you were current.

I think the weirdest stories we ran were local coverage (in rural Idaho) of Sept. 11 news like "friend of cousin thought about going to NYC last week; did not die in plane."

haha, the old "local angle on a national story" bit -- the editors were always pushing that

"kids shove plastic Solo cups in school chainlink fence to spell out NEVER FORGET"

There was a little french casual cafe in the town I covered, like an order-at-the-counter place with crepes and quiche and stuff like that, and I was there right when the Iraq war was ramping up, and there started to be a minor phenomenon of assholes driving buy and yelling shit out the window at the place -- "Go back to France" etc. Ironically the owner was a woman from Vietnam who was married to a Vietnam vet. She wouldn't let me write about it though, I guess out of discomfort or slight fear. The one that got away.

kevin hoffman isn't from minnesota btw:

Kevin Hoffman will be the new editor-in-chief of Minneapolis/St. Paul City Pages, Village Voice Media announced today.

Hoffman, presently the managing editor of VVM's Cleveland Scene, will take over from departing City Pages editor Steve Perry early next month. Perry announced yesterday that he is leaving the paper to pursue other opportunities.

A 1998 graduate of Washington College in Chestertown, Maryland, Hoffman worked for the Associated Press and the daily Wilkes-Barre Times Leader before receiving his master's degree from the Columbia University Graduate School of Journalism in May 2001. He briefly worked at the weekly Cleveland Free Times before being hired as a staff writer at Scene in January 2002. He was promoted to the managing editor position at Scene three years later.

During Hoffman's tenure at Scene, the paper took first-place in general excellence in the Missouri Lifestyle Journalism Awards and was named the best weekly in Ohio in numerous state contests. Hoffman himself has won numerous awards for his writing, and his story "Soul of the Brute" was included in Penguin Books' Notes from the Underground; The Most Outrageous Stories from the Alternative Press, published in 2005.

Hoffman, 30, will be in Minneapolis next week to meet City Pages staff. He is married to Erin Hoffman, an attorney specializing in constitutional law.

Kevin Hoffman: yet another thing about Village Voice Media that sucks.

oh my god he sounds like the worst

bleatreader 8 hours ago

Is the city pages that is making fun of this person the same city pages that published a review of a new My Burger, a fast food burger joint, when it opened in calhoun-isles a couple of months ago?

Flag Like ReplyReply Joel 7 hours ago in reply to bleatreader

You mean the review with the stunning insight of: "The chicken sandwich was very well-seasoned; not overloaded with mayo like most chicken sandwiches you find. Even the French fries tasted fresh. Our only complaint was with the onion rings, which didn't really taste very oniony."

oh at first I thought he wrote that review. that would have been much better.

he's now trying to say they were "celebrating her wit" on twitter and not making fun of her

http://bluntcard.com/images/1243460812og.gif

When your badges are "Cleveland Scene" and "Missouri Lifestyle," there isn't much ground to stand on with the OG lady.

Photos I shot in Grand Forks last August:

http://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/198765_10150254678891596_681036595_8157387_113781_n.jpg

http://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/285496_10150254660526596_681036595_8157258_206086_n.jpg

http://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/184022_10150254654821596_681036595_8157181_2440973_n.jpg

the great thign about the original article is how coolly matter-of-fact it is.

something about it was kind of hypnotic.

like you are literally being hypnotized by her

"You watch the waiters in white shirts, ties, black trousers and aprons adorned with gold-colored towels. They are busy at midday, punching in orders and carrying out bread and pasta...."

*goes into trance*

i like her writing!

damn el roco and the bronze boot look way fucking cooler than most bars here in mpls

the great thign about the original article is how coolly matter-of-fact it is.

― A Little Princess btw (s1ocki), Friday, March 9, 2012 11:25 PM (11 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

for real, i kept thinking "this isn't lolzy, this is some hemingway shit"

fuck the condescension, matter of fact small town old lady wins

They are busy at midday

^^this is the part of the line that really sells it for some reason, i can't quite put it in words

wkiw marilyn

sure but i still wish this was Neil Michael Haggerty's amazing Olive Garden review and the subsequent viral shitstorm

Antony Hegarty's Olive Garden Review
Julie Hagerty's etc.

it felt more proust than hemingway to me

i like her writing!

― art dealin' thru the west coast (tpp), Friday, March 9, 2012 3:29 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

the great thign about the original article is how coolly matter-of-fact it is.

― A Little Princess btw (s1ocki), Friday, March 9, 2012 3:25 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

for real, i kept thinking "this isn't lolzy, this is some hemingway shit"

― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Friday, March 9, 2012 3:41 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

this this this all this. she's a better writer than he is!

the great thign about the original article is how coolly matter-of-fact it is.

yeah, i'm missing the part where she's oohing and aahing about how great the olive garden is; she just basically says "yup, there's a new olive garden, the waiters wear uniforms, soup warms you up when it's cold."

"and yes - several black olives"

The chicken Alfredo ($10.95) was warm and comforting on a cold day. The portion was generous. My server was ready with Parmesan cheese.

As I ate, I noticed the vases and planters with permanent flower displays on the ledges. There are several dining areas with arched doorways.

she writes in a really self-aware and intentional version of that semi-autistic yelper's style we all made fun of on the yelp thread

Like Robbe-Grillet, but with more of an emotional payoff.

Here's the thing about that: When you write steadily for 40-plus years, you get good at it.

Clowning on the style/content of writing like this: totally cool
Clowning on this particular review with friends/on a message board: fine
Clowning on the review in a professional-level forum: douchey as fuck

It's just one of those core comedy rules: if you're picking on someone who's perceived as having less power than yourself, chances are good that it's gonna come off to a lot of people as bullying.

Possibly because it's bullying.

It is, but the fact that this shit is being published/posted indicates that some people aren't perceiving it as such or just don't care if they are.

Shee-it. I read that review. It seemed perfectly competant and suitable for the town where it took place and the audience it was aimed at. If you don't know anything about middling-small towns, then all that means is you've stumbled across your own ignorance, not that this review was anything odd or weird.

ppl being entertained by the most mundane things, even off the "all time" comedy films thread

I think the horse is dead, Morbs, you can put the stick down.

saw it move

Ta-da:

http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/03/13/for-a-professional-midwest-palate-a-first-taste-of-a-dirty-water-dog/?src=tp

She was flummoxed, though, by a bilingual sign on the cart in Arabic and English that said “Halal food.”

“I don’t know what that is,” she said.

The concept was explained.

“I’m Lutheran,” she said, “so that wouldn’t apply to me.”

Ms. Hagerty promised to revisit Mr. Abdelbaky’s cart on her next trip to New York. And she said she was looking forward to dinner at the Times Square location of the Olive Garden on Thursday.

“It will be, shall I say, interesting to see if it’s any different,” she said. “It’s pleasant to dine at the Olive Garden.”

Ok this woman has an awesome sense of humor.

Hell yes.

So now what, a book deal? A food network show? How does this shake out?

I would pay money to have her roast Guy Fieri et al over a slow fire. In her understated way.

i don't get why this is a thing but that kevin hoffman dude is a dick and i am gonna follow this story vaguely in the hope that he gets his comeuppance

yeah he kind of needs to be fired

It made the WSJ.

The highest honor:

http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/HC-GQ603_Hagert_BV_20120312172702.jpg

i don't get why this is a thing but that kevin hoffman dude is a dick and i am gonna follow this story vaguely in the hope that he gets his comeuppance

I completely agree, he was so obnoxious and condescending.

His condescension strikes me a as narcissism of small differences kinda thing, tbh.

What I like about Marilyn: She appears to have managed to sustain a successful career in journalism without either being laid off or getting burned out, something which I gather is really at the heart of alt press's contempt. She also seems like she would be a lot of fun to eat with, provided the food doesn't get in the way.

What I don't like about her: The sense that a meal with her could turn out to be a live reenactment of this. In an article about the News Room (in Mpls.), she referred to some of the clientele as "swishy." Just like everyone else, I only tolerate homophobia in my own grandparents and no one else from their generation.

What I don't like about this thread: "Why is that it's always people from the midwest who seem most intent on making fun of rubes? It's like, dude, you're in Minneapolis." (Oh hey, check out the dateline on that Onion article!)

Also, playing attack dog on all other local media is sort of KH's beat.

(Not defending at all. Just explaining.)

he also seems like she would be a lot of fun to eat with, provided the dining room has a fireplace.

She appears to have managed to sustain a successful career in journalism without either being laid off or getting burned out, something which I gather is really at the heart of alt press's contempt.

??? huh ???

ya when i read that article and contemplated her long, persistent career, it just made me so fucking mad

Here's the thing about that: When you write steadily for 40-plus years, you get good at it.

there's a local writer around here who definitely proves that isn't true. i've read some pretty terrible 40+ year writers

places like Columbus, Ohio where chain establishments filled the year-end best-of lists without fail.

Just FYI, I've lived in Columbus for most of my life, and I don't think that this has ever been true. Maybe it doesn't matter, but it's not accurate.

alt press = little job security and rarely paid well

Marilyn = I get to write about Taco Bell and keep this job for my whole life

(But that may admittedly be projecting my own bad faith from my limited experience with the local alt.)

Xxp http://www.columbusalive.com/content/topic/best-of-columbus/2011.html

ime (worked at an alt-weekly for a long time) there's almost TOO MUCH job security there... people get kind of old in those jobs all of the sudden

lol @ being jealous of someone who reviews the olive garden for a newspaper in north dakota

I'm insanely jealous of people of all shapes, sizes, ages and levels of stupidity.

TROOF

i don't think this is so much about jealousy.

i was talking about eric, or what eric posted, if that's a c/p, i couldn't totally tell

yes i am agreeing with you.

has anyone here eaten at an Olive Garden recently

I thought this was funny when Best Music Writing tweeted the link and said that every year they had to read a lot of music reviews with that kind of flat, affectless prose, but the idea of it becoming a viral and something that some snarky prick would phone up and patronise her about just makes me feel bad about being amused in the first place. Yet again, I find myself hating the internet.

I like the idea of Ernest Hemingway, restaurant critic though.

this conversation covers the response AND the quality of olive garden food pretty well

http://www.theawl.com/2012/03/our-week-with-marilyn

The Venetian Apricot Chicken is just a fascinating idea. It sounds like a name for a high-risk sexual practice more than a viable entrée idea

Macaroni Grill > Maggianos > Chef Boyardee > Olive Garden

this is otm:

To me, the fact that the food is not good—and it's a fact, and that's fine as far as it goes—is less jarring than the actual experience of being at one of these tablecloth-grade macro restaurants. The whole thing is just enough like being in an actual restaurant that the ways in which it deviates from that stand out as especially baffling. The weirdly formalized weirdnesses that we're supposed to take as normal. The rituals that make regulars feel at home—oh good, I was hoping you'd ask if I needed more breadsticks—but that just make outsiders feel weird.

David: Also, once you get past the LOL Old Lady thing, the review reveals itself as a miniature masterpiece of Upper Midwest Minimalist Underminining.

i don't think i've ever been to one of these "restaurant grade" chains like olive garden, chilis, houlihan's, etc.

but lord knows i've seen a lot of their ads.

Ruby Tuesday's?

Underminining?

For me it's almost one of those situations that's inevitable, unless you want to get peevish about where to go to eat when going out with coworkers or relatives. xp

i'm surprised Olive Garden is getting so much shit. i mean, they're okay, I like the salad a lot, not sure why they are the "worst thing in the history of the world" rather than a dozen other chains

The Awl conversation about this max linked to is great.

Macaroni Grill is by far the best of these Italian chains but, yeah, my last visit was a few years ago for a coworker's birthday lunch.

Applebee's is a much better candidate for "worst thing in the history of the world."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2PkGMq7cb8

But it's got a bar!

I was going to say.

holy shit that awl article (or "conversation" or whatever) goes on forever

some good stuff in there but the way they keep digging at j gold and his so-called snobby appreciation of "chinese restaurants with no menus that are in BASEMENTS" is pretty lame

Kind of want to see what jala-maple-peno sauce tastes like.

the 20 worst restaurants foods in america

Olive Garden has wine.

http://eatthis.menshealth.com/files/book_pasta%20bowl.jpg

god, the idea of pasta in a bread bowl is just...

it doesnt like even make sense as a delightfully sinful indulgence... who would want that??

MarKuS J.
is Hungry

San Dimas, CA

4 star rating
12/17/2008

Nothin' says better than getting drunk at 5pm til 8p at Applebee's with your boss!!

nothin' says WHAT better

lovin'

"my life is a fucking catastrophe"

i havent eaten at one in probably 4 years but there are worse things in the world than olive garden provided you order something normal and not something insane.

Tour of Italy
Homemade lasagna, lightly breaded chicken parmigiana and creamy fettuccine alfredo.**
$23.50

lol

ha, i like that awl thing. funny.

David: That way you can get some pre-cheese in before you move on to your after-cheese.

Maria: They try to grate it all over everything. Flailing the grater over everything. The soup, the salad, your head.

David: That app opt-out happened to me at a TGI Friday's recently and I was sort of taken aback. Just like, "No, that's not the way it goes at all. I was consciously not sending you any messages suggesting that I wanted the Malibu Rum Slathered Shrimp Jammers you just described."

Maria: Yelling with the grater, at every table. "Everybody up for cheese?" I wrote it down exactly because I was just, "NO you did not just say that." I sense they must get home and just collapse in despair at all they've been saying. All the mounds of endless cheese they've been grating. It's a hell of endless cheese-misery. Cheese Miz.

David: There's some Bluetooth-y manager paying attention, noticing if they do not flog the Fonduta and issuing demerits, because Fonduta was mentioned on some conference call as that sector’s AOE (Appeteaser Of Emphasis) for the week.

the priciness is kinda crazy. i thought the whole idea of going to a place like olive garden was to get cheap food. they really sell 20+ tortellini? that's nuts.

i certainly don't recall a dish that expensive (although now that I think of it, "Tour of Italy" is probably the most expensive thing there, and is best shared between two people)

Tour of Thrombosis.

Hilarious comments on that Awl post:

beatrixkiddo1 (#2,988)

@vespavirgin I also think the food at the Cheesecake Factory is kind of strangely delicious, I just can't handle the giganticness of every single part of the Cheesecake Factory experience - the portions (three full chicken breasts in the Chicken Marsala at last count. Three!), the size of the restaurant, the size of the menu. My mom once forgot her glasses and asked for the large print menu and i'm not even kidding, it was like 100 pages long

also the slice of cheesecake they give you is bigger than a typical entree

@vespavirgin I was going to say The Cheesecake Factory! I went once in Florida when I was traveling alone on business. The only prob. with it was that one appetizer was enough to serve ten people. A quesadilla the size of your head, no lie. It came with really creditable guacamole.

i mentioned this on the Friendly's thread, but the cheap cheese thing has become epidemic in this country! its almost like a governement dairy conspiracy. i mean i LOVE cheese, most people do, but the awl people are on the money, these places make cheese distasteful and even dangerous and for that they cannot be forgiven.

But the vibe of those ads all feels crazy to me. Everyone laughing and laughing over things that aren't even jokes, like they were piping nitrous in through the vents or in a David Lynch dream sequence. "We always get together for lunch in the middle of the day!" And then wild, terrified laughter. Everyone smiling like they're in the "Black Hole Sun" video. It's all so welcoming that it makes the whole experience look like joining a manicotti cult or something.

lol this is great

Yeah, the misplaced hatred for bland basically innocuous chain stuff is sorta weird and maybe pretentious. It is just inflated slightly-better-than-institutional cafeteria pretty fatty but palatable stuff. I do not believe that OG is "terrible" or w/e unless you have never had truly crappy food.

chain commercials have always been like that. nobody dances inside a burger king or whatever. just sad shuffling feet and people taking their trays of death to their tables.

i'm kinda with the awl people though. i don't think those places ARE innocuous anymore. i think they're dangerous! and addictive.

but, remy, the point to me is that those Olive Garden and Cheesecake Factory dishes are far from bland and innocuous: they're overspiced and hazardous.

I like the idea of Hagerty as David Byrne:

Maria: Also this former editor at the Grand Forks Herald told the Duluth News that Hagerty's regular readers "would know that this is a fairly negative review since she spent a lot more time on the ambience than the food."

David: Right! She never says it's the best. Which goes back to what's best/most avant-garde about the review: ZERO in-text judgment at all. These are factual statements. It is large. It is well lit. Everyone has shirts. The judgment is implied by what’s left out, which are actual words used to describe the food.

I do enjoy the Buffalo Wild Wings ones though, if only because they imply that BW3's is like an omniprescent cabal with total control of national events

honestly, i sympathize with snobby foodies. i know their attitude can be grating and annoying, but i also see their attitudes in some cases as a form of panic. things have gotten really bad in this country. a lot of people - the majority of people probably - have gotten used to bad, cheap, and even harmful food. i never went to chains when i lived in philly, and i lived there for over a decade. and on marthas vineyard there were no chains - when we went off-island mcdonalds was kind of another world to us and we would indulge in a low-rent disneyland kinda way with the kids - but since we moved to where we are now i've had wendies and kfc and mcdonalds and i do have distinct memories of liking that stuff when i was a kid but now it honestly HURTS me! i pay for eating there. my body isn't acclimated to that food. and it tastes terrible! kfc chicken is really really bad chicken. it has this very foul - no pun intended - aftertaste to me that tastes like cheap unhealthy meat. these places need LOTS of chicken and cheese because they are everywhere and they end up using horrible stuff. even cheap pizza places that would never win any prizes use this cheese now that just reeks of chemicals. i look at the meat "valu-paks" they sell now at the supermarket and i think they should be banned from the market. so, i sympathize. it's almost like a lost cause to rail against big business food/chains cuz that stuff is so normal. it is the national diet.

sorry didn't mean to go all fast food nation...this is all obvious. i love road food and snacks and sweets and all that. but i just think the actual ingredients have gotten deadlier.

thats just another longwinded way of saying i don't think this stuff is "innocuous".

have you ever gone into a chain place and everyone in the place looks very unhealthy and also dangerously overweight? people struggling to get up from the table after their meal? this is no longer "fun" food!

yeah, i know exactly what you are talking about, scott.

i also think maybe people are overselling the extent to which hagerty's review was this poker-faced bad review in diguise. it clearly was much less than a good review, but i don't think the descriptions of e.g. the seats for those waiting were of the "damn them with faint praise" order. that's information that a lot of people want to know (even if most of us wouldn't care).

at the same time, kevin hoffman is obviously an asshole and it says everything about citypages that he's not just a freelancer but the editor. i live in a city of about 250,000 and our "alternative weekly" is 5x better than the twin cities one.

i concur with scott and i must repeat my annoyance at the idea stated in that awl piece that going to a small, family-run chinese restaurant is somehow 'snobby'

love this exchange

HOFFMAN: I just wanted to call to tell you how much I enjoyed your Olive Garden review.

HAGGERTY: Oh, I'm sure you did.

City Pages is a shell of what it once was.

Like, I imagine, most VV-run satellites.

or most alt-weeklies :(

have you ever gone into a chain place and everyone in the place looks very unhealthy and also dangerously overweight? people struggling to get up from the table after their meal? this is no longer "fun" food!

tbh most people in those places look to be about 17. I'm from Wisconsin and all but never had the experience of "wow, everybody here is fat"

yeah, i think her review was just a local paper review/story of interest. most local papers will write a story about a new business like that. the isolated quotes do give it that hemingway/beckett/eliot minimalism vibe though. that windswept mid-west deadpan thing. which is cool.

this happened to me when i would go to the local Friendly's chain here that closed recently. seeing the unhealthiness. it was pretty glaring. whole families. i felt bad for them!

It's probably even more depressing to contemplate the sheer cost of eating healthy, or cooking for yourself. I try not to feel smug when I see fat people eating, but it's an uphill battle.

David: Like, "why is this person all on my ass about the breadsticks? I am fine with the very large amount of breadsticks I already have."

Maria: "What are you doing here again with that basket of ancient-garlic-scented sofa cushions?"

David: Because I am still working my way through the last batch o' cushions, thanks. They taste like they were flavored by Glaxo SmithKline, but I’m working on them.

Who are these two? They are fantastic.

eating healthy and cooking for yourself would be way cheaper than eating at olive garden. i'm sure i could make a good healthy meal that costs less than four people eating at mcdonalds too!

I could probably benefit from a course in grocery economics.

The gay thread and the Olive Garden threads finally intersect

It still feels like I'm spending way more to prepare a meal for myself than if I were to just buy a frozen pot pie.

now we need Lex to write a piece about his first visit to an Olive Garden in Poughkeepsie.

The gay thread and the Olive Garden threads finally intersect

"Here, you're family."

xpost -- He wouldn't like it, it would be situational comedy.

Just remembered an Italian restaurant that's worse than anything else ever -- Fazoli's. I'd rather eat Sbarro every day for the rest of my life.

I just started reading this, seems like it is relevant to this thread's interests.

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/517rHnCIMIL._BO2,204,203,200_PIsitb-sticker-arrow-click,TopRight,35,-76_AA300_SH20_OU01_.jpg

the physical deterioration scott describes is brought home to me every time I stop at a Florida Turnpike rest stop before midnight and peek into the Sbarro.

i could make a yummy spaghetti and meatball dinner for four with fresh garlic bread - and even grate fresh parmesan on the garlic bread before i put in the oven for you cheese lovers - and do it for, like, 20 bucks. in 30 minutes. average cost of mcdonalds meal per person is probably what? 6 bucks or more? plus gas money to get there and back? and a salad. i'd make a salad. still cheaper probably.

i concur with scott and i must repeat my annoyance at the idea stated in that awl piece that going to a small, family-run chinese restaurant is somehow 'snobby'

― A Little Princess btw (s1ocki), Wednesday, March 14, 2012 10:06 AM (21 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

capn save a gold here

Here's the real problem with places like OG. This item is a freakin' appetizer:

Item 	      Calories 	Total Fat (g) 	Sat. Fat (g) 	Sodium 	Carb. (g) 	Fiber (g) 	Protein (g)
Bruschetta 	950 	   13 	            2.5 	 2860 	  173 	          6 	           35 

950 calories!!!

holy shit @ at that sodium count

for BRUSCHETTA.

I assume they're referring to chowhound-style authenticity trawling and not just the mere act of visiting your local chinese restaurant.

well that probably is for a table of people tbf

I mean who orders a big plate of bruschetta and then chows down on the whole thing alone

I assume they're referring to chowhound-style authenticity trawling and not just the mere act of visiting your local chinese restaurant.

― the prurient pinterest (Hurting 2), Wednesday, March 14, 2012 10:32 AM (5 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

they're talking about j gold

Whadathey brusch it with?

well, who orders a "calzone" at Sbarro and eats it?

xxp Yeah, these people:

http://buffman.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/WALL-E-humans_320.jpg

Item 	                      Calories 	Total Fat (g) 	Sat. Fat (g) 	Sodium 	Carb. (g) 	Fiber (g) 	Protein (g)
Fettuccine Alfredo (dinner) 	1220 	   75 	            47 	          1350 	  99 	           5 	           36 

1220 calories, 75 fat grams, 1350mg of sodium. It's what's for dinner!

I assume they're referring to chowhound-style authenticity trawling and not just the mere act of visiting your local chinese restaurant.

― the prurient pinterest (Hurting 2), Wednesday, March 14, 2012 10:32 AM (5 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

they're talking about j gold

― A Little Princess btw (s1ocki), Wednesday, March 14, 2012 10:32 AM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Right, who I don't know very well but I assume he's this kind of food critic. Like Robert Sietsema but more irritating, is the impression I get.

i could make a yummy spaghetti and meatball dinner for four with fresh garlic bread - and even grate fresh parmesan on the garlic bread before i put in the oven for you cheese lovers - and do it for, like, 20 bucks. in 30 minutes.

good for you, i couldn't

Right, who I don't know very well but I assume he's this kind of food critic. Like Robert Sietsema but more irritating, is the impression I get.

― the prurient pinterest (Hurting 2), Wednesday, March 14, 2012 10:35 AM (14 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

you get the wrong impression, he is awesome

- capn save a gold

no you probably could unless you don't have hands or something xp

i heard an interview with her son on local npr. he writes for the wsj! nothing too revelatory but he did have to explain to his mom what 'going viral' meant.

i do wonder why anyone would go to a chain restaurant if they live in a big city like london that has a wealth of superior, cheaper restaurants, but y'know everyone ends up in a pizza express a couple of times per year. i find most proper fast food like mcdonald's really gross though. i HATE it when i see people trot out the "everyone should cook their own food" line, fuck off!

lex over 50% of people in the uk and i guess in the us too don't live in a big city like london.

j gold is awesome, they are just using him as a counterpoint because he wrote a "real restaurant reviewers review" of olive garden

iatee, kitchen and computer uselessness is a big part of lex's schtick -- it's a readymade something to throw a tantrum about when he just feels like throwing a tantrum -- so he'll never ever learn how to cook, or allow anyone to teach him

I think I've mentioned this before, but when my nephew graduated from HS I took him on a trip to NYC (he lives in NE Ohio, about 45 miles from Cleveland). He wanted to eat at: The Hard Rock Cafe (there's one of those in Cleveland, ffs), ESPNZone and Taco Bell. In New York. I got him to eat breakfast at Junior's one morning and that was a struggle. Drove me nuts.

i also just remembered that when i went to miami to do a travel feature, the PRs actually took us to this weird out-of-town mall and started giving us these spiels about how many brands had opened outlets there. and then i THINK for lunch they actually took us to...an olive garden. i can't remember exactly whether it was but it was a chain italian restaurant with totally faux-rustic decor which fits the descriptions i'm reading. the food was edible in a bog standard kind of way and the portions were gigantic. i have no idea why miami tourist board wasted a morning on taking us to that mall, all the journalists in the group were very bemused and also bored.

lex over 50% of people in the uk and i guess in the us too don't live in a big city like london.

yes i know, i'm saying IF they do i don't get why they'd go to a chain restaurant. if they don't that doesn't apply!

people who think my inability to cook is a schtick have obviously never seen me in the kitchen. and why would i allow computers to repeatedly ruin my life if i really knew how to control them.

I just said why.

47 g of saturated fat?! I think it only takes about 40 grams in the span of your entire life to ensure a heart attack.

eating healthy and cooking for yourself would be way cheaper than eating at olive garden. i'm sure i could make a good healthy meal that costs less than four people eating at mcdonalds too!

Okay, I take exception to this. Your average meal for 2 at OG is what, 30 bucks? 35? Maybe you're just a better shopper than I am, but it's hard to make a good homecooked meal for less than that. My wife often gets frustrated about how hard it is to make real Mexican food on a budget, because there are so many vegetables involved and all that's expensive. Getting an avacado, 3 bell peppers, and two tomatoes alone is like $10. I like the "save money by eating in" line too but once you add up grocery bills - just doesn't happen

The math might check out if you're incredibly good at using everything you have. But, yeah, I'm not the type to have a pantry full of options, so any time I get the urge to make even just homemade mac & cheese, I end up dropping at least $15 at the grocery store to get all the ingredients.

where in the world do you guys shop?

And what the fuck is wrong with you?

(them, I mean, not CAD)

Getting an avacado, 3 bell peppers, and two tomatoes alone is like $10.

whaaaaaaat

are the bell peppers made of gold or something

yeah i don't habitually cook so i don't have the ingredients, and buying ingredients is a waste of money because i don't cook so they won't get used up and will rot or go off

"using everything you have" is really the key point here. that's hard to do if there's any level of complexity to what you're cooking. like if I'm making chicken and rice w/ a salad, that's pretty easy and fairly cheap. but still it runs around $15-20. you're not saving that much money!

Not only is that in itself ridiculous, but if you actually make a quantity of that food requiring three peppers and two tomatoes, you should have leftovers for two for at least two more meals.

people who think my inability to cook is a schtick have obviously never seen me in the kitchen. and why would i allow computers to repeatedly ruin my life if i really knew how to control them.

I don't believe this, there is a lower limit to how 'bad a cook' you can be, and that lower limit does not go below 'making pasta'. if you have two hands and can follow simple instructions you can make pasta. if you cannot that does not mean you are 'bad at cooking', it means you can't follow simple instructions.

fwiw I mostly eat cheap takeout too and avoid cooking when I can because I am a lazy mofo and enjoy taking advantage of a place with lots of cheap and delicious food that other people can make for me.

my grocery costs for 2 ppl are $90-$110 a week and i shop at whole foods!

you can't make a meal for two at home for under 30 bucks!!?? honey, we need to talk...

Asda online:

1 large Avocado = £1
3 red peppers = 80p each (I looked for Bell Peppers, I got bicycle locks!)
Pack of 6 toms = £1

Not a lot like $10, really.

good avacados run about $2.50. otherwise, you can get the small ones, but you'd need two. tomatoes - 79 cents apiece. bell peppers are cheap if they're green but good mexican food requires the red and yellow ones, which are $1.79 (or more)

Seriously we spend about $600/mo on groceries for two including a lot of nice organic stuff, in NYC mind you, and eat almost all our meals at home. Just because you are unable to manage adult life does not make the Olive Garden a good deal.

this happened to me when i would go to the local Friendly's chain here that closed recently. seeing the unhealthiness. it was pretty glaring. whole families. i felt bad for them!

― scott seward, Wednesday, March 14, 2012 9:14 AM (35 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah. my girlfriend and i have an occasional craving for crappy late-night food of the denny's/waffle house variety. one night for some reason we went to shoney's (i guess because it has a salad bar) and there were a handful of families there, and nearly all were morbidly obese -- like 350+ pounds for normal-height, not-been-to-golds-gym people.

i'm not judging those people (i'm really not, i know all too well the way brain chemistry shifts and you just can't be satisfied with anything but super-greasy giant meals), but it was a striking scene.

also the food was crazy gross.

Okay, I take exception to this. Your average meal for 2 at OG is what, 30 bucks? 35? Maybe you're just a better shopper than I am, but it's hard to make a good homecooked meal for less than that. My wife often gets frustrated about how hard it is to make real Mexican food on a budget, because there are so many vegetables involved and all that's expensive. Getting an avacado, 3 bell peppers, and two tomatoes alone is like $10. I like the "save money by eating in" line too but once you add up grocery bills - just doesn't happen

it's all about cooking enough for a few days and making it last. then you don't throw out half of that expensive bell pepper, etc.

bell peppers to be fair are crazy expensive in the midwest. tomatoes not so much.

are your avocados imported from the moon or something? xp

Not only is that in itself ridiculous, but if you actually make a quantity of that food requiring three peppers and two tomatoes, you should have leftovers for two for at least two more meals.

no, that's not true. you can easily use them all in one meal. the stuff we cook is very heavy on that.

well i can make pasta, though often it's either burned or overcooked. that's when i want to make an effort!

i can make anything that involves no more steps than "removing from packet, putting in oven/in boiling water". like a boiled egg, or fishcakes. very often they still go wrong. anything that involves mixing ingredients =>> calamities and disasters and nervous breakdowns. so i don't do it.

I have never seen a $2.50 avocado in my entire life

i actually don't believe that you people have tried. unless you have some kind of severe lack of coordinating that makes you a daily risk to yourselves and those around you, YOU CAN COOK. you just don't want to put the time/energy into it. which is fine. but this whole schtick of saying you are somehow INCAPABLE of cooking is ridiculous.

coordination

see also: I JUST CAN'T SWIM

are your avocados imported from the moon or something? xp

no, but you really have two options, one is to get them from a grocery store where they're cheaper, but often not ripe, or overripe, or too small, and the second is to go to a good mexican store which has really, really good ones, but yes they tend to be expensive. tbf I may be mis-remembering the price but I know they're at least $2

bell peppers to be fair are crazy expensive in the midwest.

bingo

I buy avocados at Whole Foods and I don't even pay $2 each for them. Organic, no less!

srsly, cooking pasta is about the level of difficulty of, idk, taking a shower

I'm just not good at taking showers, what can I say

yall should move to the city

we have literally just done this conversation in the gay thread

i am incapable of cooking, i also loathe the entire process, and i resent people telling me i "should" cook or "it's so easy, anyone can do it". fuck off!

100% of the time i try to go above pasta or boiling an egg, THINGS GO WRONG

well if you don't resent paying way more to have other people do it for you, fine, but don't make excuses that it all shakes out to the same cost in the end

One of the few advantages of living in Miami: avocados on street corners go for pennies.

the last time i did a big shop i got food for all of our breakfasts, lunches, and dinners for a week and it cost me 200 dollars. that's two adults and two children.

i don't eat out all the time, this is not a defence of shitty chain restaurants

i'm not telling you that you MUST or SHOULD cook, i'm just saying there is no fucking way you are not physically or mentally capable of cooking unless you have a fairly severe disability of some kind.

i mean, can you turn stuff on and off? can you count to numbers like 10 or 20? can you stir?

and LEX just so you know before i had kids i hardly ever cooked. mostly ate out and got take-out. plus, in philly for years i lived in apartments with kitchens that were less than ideal or fun to cook in. kinda made you not want to cook.

frogbs, what recipes are you making that require three green peppers that will be consumed by two people in one meal? Any time I make pasta sauce or chili I use one green pepper, and it makes a vat; I always have leftovers.

i'm just saying that every time i've tried to cook, things have gone badly wrong, and i have NEVER emerged from the horrible process with anything resembling a nice meal. i mostly scavenge apples and crackers and bread and nuts and seeds and yoghurt and stuff. it suits me fine.

well if you don't resent paying way more to have other people do it for you, fine, but don't make excuses that it all shakes out to the same cost in the end

maybe not at Olive Garden but I'd say a lot of local delis/Chinese places/Mexican places will sell you prepared food for roughly the same cost as it would be to make it yourself.

I just imagined lex sweeping the floor for breads, nuts, seeds, and yoghurt :(

That's true in some cases, although you can probably make a fresher, healthier version for about the same price as the carryout.

yeah i would say it's prob possible to eat a selection of takeout that approximates the cost of buying groceries. but you are prob also signing up to die young.

healthy takeout exists

in california

I make basic pasta sauce for 4 with 2 peppers 2 onions 2 tins of tomatoes.

it's perfectly possible to eat healthily and well without a) cooking b) eating out c) ordering take-out.

a) i never do EVER
b) at most once a week, sometimes not even that
c) once in a blue moon when i'm particularly hungover

Grocery bill dickery. Congrats, thread.

Marilyn's review of this thread so far:

"I read the thread. I found some interesting screen names. I also learned that bell peppers, if too expensive, are probably made of gold."

?

frogbs, what recipes are you making that require three green peppers that will be consumed by two people in one meal? Any time I make pasta sauce or chili I use one green pepper, and it makes a vat; I always have leftovers.

stuff like fajitas or stir fry; you use one in the salad, two in the actual meal. I realize that's pretty heavy and probably not what anyone else eats. also there are soups that we make (that are really whole meals) that have like 12 ingredients, that all gets expensive

i swear some of you people are nuts

I can cook. Cooking is the easy part. Navigating the labyrinth of keeping on top of what perishable food items you have, when they expire, what combination you should use them in to avoid spoilage, making sure not to let your leftovers go bad... That's the hard part and that's where the savings of cooking at home truly start to kick in.

frogbs, saying you can't cook a good homecooked meal for under $30 is probably the most offensive thing you've ever said on ilx

Lex cooking pasta:

Fig. 1

http://www.agefotostock.com/previewimage/bajaage/ae675d96406e91458f0d00168cc5f172/OJO-pe0058498.jpg

Fig. 2

http://udleditions.cast.org/indira/docs/all_about_coyotes/glossary-images/panicked1.jpg

it's perfectly possible to eat healthily and well without a) cooking b) eating out c) ordering take-out.

Seriously though, it's not.

Really hate the words "viral shitstorm" together. http://www.christianoutdoorsman.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/two-cents.gif

hi thread, what strange twists have you taken while I've been gone

DJP do you have any solid gold bell peppers in your pantry y/n?

I can cook. Cooking is the easy part. Navigating the labyrinth of keeping on top of what perishable food items you have, when they expire, what combination you should use them in to avoid spoilage, making sure not to let your leftovers go bad... That's the hard part and that's where the savings of cooking at home truly start to kick in.

― Eric H., Wednesday, March 14, 2012 11:17 AM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Yeah, fair. I didn't really master this until I became fully domesticated - you have to do a bit of planning and have a repertoire of kinds of meals you make most of the time. E.g. we always keep some kind of fish on hand, with a few fillets in the freezer and maybe one in the fridge -- you have to remember to throw one into the fridge to defrost and then eat it within a couple days. We have a rotation of three or four very fast and simple ways to make them on a weeknight (in a foil pocket with herbs, broiled with mustard, etc.). We always keep a big thing of salad greens and usually eat salads. Weekends are usually for cooking more elaborate stuff, when we can make a list from a recipe and take it with us shopping.

I have NOTHING BUT solid gold bell peppers in my pantry

yeah, you have to remember to freeze things, mostly

at least ime

I freeze bacon.

it's perfectly possible to eat healthily and well without a) cooking b) eating out c) ordering take-out.

are you sure you are "eating" and not "staring at pictures of food while a tear rolls slowly down your left cheek"

the problem is when you have a wife who is used to cooking Mexican food on the cheap who comes to America and suddenly realizes the ingredients she relies on cost like 5x more

i still maintain that people who eat out frequently don't really waste that much money. maybe $35 is high. but under $20 for a good homecooked meal is tough.

I could name like 10 good homecooked meals off the top of my head that cost less than $20 for two people.

i think you can cook a good homecooked meal for 2 for about $10

Again, that is bonkers. My wife and I eat on about $200 worth of groceries every two weeks, and that's shopping mostly at Whole Foods, AND that includes taking lunches to work.

w/ the caveat that i'm not talking about authentic mexican food, that for sure sounds like a bitch

Our food budget per week for two adults in a not-cheap part of the country (but not London, either) is £70. That generally buys us a bottle of wine, too. We only get free range chicken and eggs and British meat when we buy those things. I make a point of planning most meals for the week at the previous weekend so that I can buy stuff and use it sensibly, and generally make enoguh of main meals to supply lunches later in the week. I freeze some leftovers for much later on, too. It is way more expensive for us to eat out than eat at home, generally. Wife is also amazingly good with vouchers and reward cards and stuff.

Lex, one day I want you to come and visit and cook with me.

are you sure you are "eating" and not "staring at pictures of food while a tear rolls slowly down your left cheek"

this one time when i was pulling an all-nighter and there was no food in the house i did go slightly loopy and GIS pictures of food in the hope that i would somehow be able to download them into my mouth

no, i just eat bits and pieces that don't require cooking. an apple and some crackers with cheese is a perfectly good lunch for example.

i think you can cook a good homecooked meal for 2 for about $10

Spaghetti, butter, parmesan. Done.

Meal-planning is definitely a different skill to cooking. It took me a few years before I'd absorbed enough recipes to be able to look on the fridge, see two leftover vegetables about to go off, and know how to pair them with ingredients in the cupboard or freezer to make a meal. It's a lifestyle thing too. I have kids so I'm used to planning when I'm in and out and who needs to be fed when and it just falls into place. I guess if you're still spontaneously going out for drinks a few nights a week (wistful gaze) then it's harder.

For me a home-cooked meal ranges from about £2 a head (pasta, stir-fry) to maybe £10 a head (expensive cut of fish). I can't eat out for less than £15 at best. You need a new grocer, frogbs.

i can barely plan the bits of my life that matter there are no organisational skills left over for food

so this is going to be a response likely to generate lols and eyerolls but most of the restaurants I go to are $20/person for the entrees alone; add in drinks and appetizers and you are paying considerably more

you're only "saving money" in the frogbs scenario if your idea of eating out is a fast food dollar menu; his $20 meal should be able to feed 4 ppl at least

my staple food = new covent garden soups. healthy and filling and nice-tasting and requiring no more effort than putting in a microwave.

you can get two frozen tilapia filets for like $6, cook a 1/4 of a $5 frozen bag of veggies, and also a cup of rice... that's basically $10 right there

lex, I'd double-check the sodium content on those soups; pre-packaged soups in general are NOTORIOUSLY sodium-heavy, which isn't very good for your blood pressure

his $20 meal should be able to feed 4 ppl at least

well the economies of scale change pile up fairly quickly. which is why a single person eating takeout is the most justifiable. home-cooking can feed an enormous amount of people for not much more than it can feed two people.

I live alone and buy chicken thighs often: six to a pack usually run you about $5 max. Include tomato paste, tomato sauce, sweet onions, green peppers, cooking wine and rice on the side and the whole meal runs you $15 tops.

i don't know how much E15 is, that's like $25 american? you can eat out here for like, $18 (not garbage, either)

'change pile up' = 'can pile up' xp

I loathe cooking so much, and would eat takeout all time time if it weren't for my girlfriend's good sense, but the people arguing that home cooking is not cost effective are actually insane. I never have a meal as cheap as when we just pick up whatever vegetables look reasonably decent and cheap that day and cook something out of them. Saute some peppers, make some couscous, steam some kale, whatever, it's so cheap it's almost free. And then it lasts for a couple days or so.

wisconsin apparently has the highest COL in the united states

if you have a big thing of rice at home and spices you are basically looking at buying a protein and a veggie or two and you are done. as far as one simple meal goes. if you eat meat, buy some chicken, throw it in a pan with some vegetables cook some rice...voila...food. for what? under ten bucks easy.

pasta + peppers + some veggies on the side, toss some sardines in, have some cheap red wine = cheap and my idea of a good dinner.

iatee you have to factor in the daily 12 of old mil

it's perfectly possible to eat healthily and well without a) cooking b) eating out c) ordering take-out.

lex i'm super confused if you don't cook....or eat out...or get take out....

how do you actually eat? like MREs from the army or spaceman food?

when we do an all-out burrito night then things are more expensive and expire more quickly but this is why life is not an endless series of all-out burrito nights.

Tonight I'm making spaghetti bolognese. I need to get an onion and a carrot on the way home, which will be about 40p for the pair. I have a tin of (Taste the Difference! we usually use value) tomatoes and pasta in the cupboard at all times, and a cupboard literally stuffed with spices and dried herbs, plus vege mince in the freezer. If I'm feeling fruity I may buy some cheese to grate on top, as we're out.

1/4 of a pack of spaghetti = 25p
Onion and carrot = 40p
Tin of tomatoes = 80p
1/4 of a pack of vege mince = 50p
Olive oil, dried herbs, spices, etc = 50p (that's a generous guess)
Bit of grated cheese (optional) = 50p

That's less than £3.

I mostly hate cooked vegetables. Salads and raw carrots and the like are OK, tho.

if you eat meat, buy some chicken, throw it in a pan with some vegetables cook some rice...voila...food.

And if you don't eat meat, a can of black beans or a package of firm tofu does the same trick.

a top-of-the-range ready meal spag bol costs £3 and involves significantly less stress

(i would imagine that the panic and stress i experience in the kitchen is way worse for my blood pressure than any sodium)

I will probably buy a bodega sandwich tonight for $3.50 because I'm lazy, but I def. recognize that it will be more expensive and less healthy than just making some food at home.

basically having some rice or a bag of potatoes at home = you are halfway to dinner. if you are me. it ain't brain surgery.

LEX we get it you are as helpless as a newborn kitten. i would eat out every night too if i was single and lived in london.

lex i'm super confused if you don't cook....or eat out...or get take out....

how do you actually eat? like MREs from the army or spaceman food?

typical day:

breakfast = muesli
lunch = often i'll scavenge throughout the day. crackers w/cheese, apples or other fruit, yoghurts, nuts, seeds
dinner = soup from a nice, healthy pre-packaged range w/a bit of bread. maybe pasta with peas and pesto if i feel like pushing the boat out. maybe fishcakes if i just want a light meal. very occasionally a ready meal.

I find cooking relieves a lot of the stress of the working day. I love to cook when i get home. Put some music or the TV on, chop some stuff, fry it up, lovely.

I wonder if Marilyn Haggerty cooks.

i love the idea of a helicopter dropping MREs into lex's apartment

if i'm popping out i might pick up a salad or a pastry from the supermarket some days.

I think frying onions is, literally, one of the greatest fuicking achievements of human civilisation. It's extraordinary.

I find cooking relieves a lot of the stress of the working day

the EXACT opposite

no working day could ever reduce me to near-breakdowns the way attempting to cook does, every time, without fail

mmm...now i really want some pasta with peas and pesto. i am definitely getting hungry...

xxpost OTM

The smell of onions frying in butter is probably the supreme culinary scent.

i am definitely incapable of frying onions. chopping always goes wrong and then...i just HATE frying stuff. it makes me nervous. and frying pans are particularly grim to wash up.

this thread got amazing

Don't use a frying pan; use a high-sided saucepan. Stops splatter.

i choose using neither

wisconsin apparently has the highest COL in the united states

well typically when I'm doing the cooking, things are much cheaper. and yes I do admit that we do waste a lot of things by letting them go bad or not using the entire ingredient. just saying a lot of stuff cooked in our house really does involve like, over a dozen things

. E.g. we always keep some kind of fish on hand, with a few fillets in the freezer and maybe one in the fridge -- you have to remember to throw one into the fridge to defrost and then eat it within a couple days.

just defrost in the sink or a bowl of water! it'll take half an hour, prob less for a fish filet

this one time when i was pulling an all-nighter and there was no food in the house i did go slightly loopy and GIS pictures of food in the hope that i would somehow be able to download them into my mouth

i loved this

yeah you can defrost fish in the sink in like 10 mins

I do admit that we do waste a lot of things by letting them go bad or not using the entire ingredient.

this is seriously terrible and would make me dislike you in person

On Sunday I slowly roasted a shoulder of pork on top of a pair of fat bramley apples and some water, so the apples collapsed and the water steamed the meat moist. I used the collapsed apple mush to help make an apple and onion gravy. I also roasted parsnips, carrots, and potatoes, and make a sage and onion stuffing from scratch. An awesome afternoon. We had a guest so i was cookign for 3 people. I had enough roasted veg and stuffing leftover to do me a big pot for lunch on Monday.

A decent frying pan with a good surface takes about five (5) seconds to get clean. A cast-iron pan, marginally longer.

Salmon is a little more expensive than cod, right?

sorry to hear about your apples collapsing

Ha!

this is seriously terrible and would make me dislike you in person

good for you! i'm glad your life is so neat and organized that you can efficiently plan ahead and not waste anything. thank god I don't have to worry about meeting you in person!

einsturzende neuapfel

Faded - collapsing new apples
Watch them - collapsing
Jaded - collapsing new apples
Watch them - collapsing

On Sunday I slowly roasted a shoulder of pork on top of a pair of fat bramley apples and some water, so the apples collapsed and the water steamed the meat moist. I used the collapsed apple mush to help make an apple and onion gravy. I also roasted parsnips, carrots, and potatoes, and make a sage and onion stuffing from scratch.

i don't know what any of this means or how to do it, you may as well have written "on sunday i slowly roasted fairy dust on top of a cloud"

hahaha

doesn't it make you curious to learn what it means?? it sounds awesome!!

i feel guilty enough when i buy fruit and don't eat it in time before it rots, this would only happen on a larger scale if i bought other ingredients and therefore i don't

I'm not expecting you to know how to do it from that description, but I'm pretty sure I could write a step-by-step guide that you could follow. I won't though, unless you really want me to.

it sounds awesome for someone to do for me! (i am happy to wash up)

if i did it, it would not be awesome. i can guarantee that

isn't there another thread where you can brag about what you cooked

http://www.ilxor.com/ILX/NewAnswersControllerServlet?boardid=66

Not meant as a punchline. Just thought this thread needed to be annotated like a recipe.

I'm gonna ANNOTATE you like a RECIPE, punk

Don't collapse me.

cooking is a little like learning another language i think. you learn some rudiments and then comes a point where you just need to fling yourself off the edge and wing it, knowing you will make mistakes, not being afraid to make mistakes. knowing it will almost certainly be good enough. the deep skills come in with what DL mentioned about leftover improv. that is the moneysaver. when i buy a chicken i buy a really expensive chicken, but i get 2-3 meals out of it, and 2 pints of stock go in the freezer, every time. add a potato and some leeks to those and that's another 3 meals.

frogbs i have kids, so economizing is important to me, so that's a helpful motivation. i guess i also have a kind of morality about not wasting food. and i feel stupid when i waste money. but "neat and organized".... is not how anyone would really describe my life. it's maybe because of that that the kitchen is like one place where a TINY TINY bit of planning drastically improves my day and makes me feel good about myself.

the way i learned to cook was to just do a ton of simple recipes and follow them terrifiedly and slavishly. eventually you get good at them. eventually you learn why they are structured the way they are and what is actually 'going on' in the pot or whatever. like tracer said, it's like a language, where eventually you just start doing it on your own with some implicit knowledge of what will work or not.

Tracer OTM.

Also after a while it's not really that hard to plan b/c you just get to know your eating habits and how much of something you will or won't finish.

Wait, what the fuck what thread did I just wake up in an hour later? Is it just really nice everywhere and no one feels like working?

xp to s1ocki yup. best thing i ever did was get 3-4 cheap cookbooks of like "easy weeknight dinner" recipes and make all the ones that seemed appealing. it gives you a great base for doing more complex stuff.

the rudiments are beyond me, i am terrified of making mistakes and also how do you learn to ENJOY this lengthy, time-consuming, incredibly stressful, hateful process, at the end of which you produce a mediocre and unappetising mess that's gone in 10 minutes and oh hi it's washing-up time?

compared to "heat soup up in 5 mins, pour into bowl, wash up bowl and spoon, fin"

i used to live wiht a guy who was really 'good at cooking' and used to 'freestyle' in the kitchen and 'throw things together' and would always interrupt and tell me how i should probably just throw some of X in there with Y. fuck off i like to cook like a robot and follow the recipe exactly! how it should be imo.

also something i realized i had to do early on was plan a couple days in advance, just have some general idea of what i'd be having for every meal so i had time to shop and prepare, instead of waiting till the last minute, getting too hungry to do anything, ordering a pizza and falling asleep on the couch

It's some kind of communist connection to the fruits of your labour, I suspect, lex. Seriously, if you're ever near Exeter, let me know, come round, I'll cook.

xp lex one way is to drink a beer or refill your glass of wine between the time when you're done eating and the time when you clean up.

the rudiments are beyond me, i am terrified of making mistakes and also how do you learn to ENJOY this lengthy, time-consuming, incredibly stressful, hateful process, at the end of which you produce a mediocre and unappetising mess that's gone in 10 minutes and oh hi it's washing-up time?

compared to "heat soup up in 5 mins, pour into bowl, wash up bowl and spoon, fin"

― lex pretend, Wednesday, March 14, 2012 11:58 AM (36 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lex the first time you make something a bit more ambitious and it is awesome, it's such a great feeling.

you need something to cook with to show you the ropes! if i lived where you lived i would volunteer!

the way i learned to cook was to just do a ton of simple recipes and follow them terrifiedly and slavishly. eventually you get good at them. eventually you learn why they are structured the way they are and what is actually 'going on' in the pot or whatever. like tracer said, it's like a language, where eventually you just start doing it on your own with some implicit knowledge of what will work or not.

― A Little Princess btw (s1ocki), Wednesday, March 14, 2012 10:56 AM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

this.

the way i learned to cook was to just do a ton of simple recipes and follow them terrifiedly and slavishly

when i tried to do this, there was always one bit of the recipe that went wrong - an ingredient i couldn't find, a step i didn't understand or more usually a step that didn't HAPPEN like the recipe said it would happen. at which point i panicked and things went more and more wrong and this is where the nervous breakdowns come in

the rudiments are beyond me, i am terrified of making mistakes and also how do you learn to ENJOY this lengthy, time-consuming, incredibly stressful, hateful process, at the end of which you produce a mediocre and unappetising mess that's gone in 10 minutes and oh hi it's washing-up time?

compared to "heat soup up in 5 mins, pour into bowl, wash up bowl and spoon, fin"

― lex pretend, Wednesday, March 14, 2012 11:58 AM (27 seconds ago) Bookmark'

bcuz some ppl enjoy eating food

make sure you look at the recipe in advance and visualize what you have to do. if there's a step/ingredient you don't understand, google it or ask a friend.

there are really few things worse than 8pm approaching and you know you don't have anything in the fridge and you haven't been paid yet and you're just like ohhhh GGGGOODDDD

i'm much better about planning now that i cook for 2. (almost) every sunday we pick out meals for the week and go shopping. then i know what i'm making and just have to pick what night to make each thing.

haha tpp my partner is the big improviser and i absolutely adore following recipes to. the. frickin. letter.. we have called a cease-fire and don't fuck with each other now, basically.

i eat like lex most of the time tho. whenever i cook something nice i just end up eating like 4 portions of it because i have no self-control.

yeah I do that too

the rudiments are beyond me, i am terrified of making mistakes and also how do you learn to ENJOY this lengthy, time-consuming, incredibly stressful, hateful process, at the end of which you produce a mediocre and unappetising mess that's gone in 10 minutes and oh hi it's washing-up time?

compared to "heat soup up in 5 mins, pour into bowl, wash up bowl and spoon, fin"

― lex pretend, Wednesday, March 14, 2012 10:58 AM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lex, you are that guy who's like, NO I CAN'T DO IT I JUST CAN'T.

we are like those people who are like NO REALLY YOU CAN. JUST CONCENTRATE. YOU CAN DO IT.

hey, if i gave you a simple recipe, would you like make it and REALLY try to make it not like, OH NOES I CAN'T GET THIS CAN OF TUNA OPEN I GIVE UP?!

because i have some nice simple recipes i can share w/ you.

how does beer bread sound? it is tasty.

frankly if you SWEAR that you can't do ANY of this stuff, then i kind of wonder how you like put your clothes on and open a bank account and stuff.

yeah i can never plan what i want to eat in advance, the only time i ever think about food is when i'm really hungry right now

bcuz some ppl enjoy eating food

so do i! i save my enjoyment of food as a thing for when i eat out. i don't associate enjoyment with my own cooking

this is like when people show up in threads all "i dont like rap" and then people spend hours trying to get them to like it but its such a waste of time

seriously lex would you try to make beer bread? it is tasty and easy and you can eat it for a few days. you can put whatever you want on it. butter, jam, nutella, whatever.and it has BEER in it.

Do you masturbate?

yeah you are barking up the wrong tree amateurist

lex the first time you make something a bit more ambitious and it is awesome, it's such a great feeling.

This is very true. I felt like Will Hunting at a blackboard the first time I made a really well-done carbonara (not a hard recipe, but still represents about the upper limit of my skill set).

why would i try to make bread? you can buy nice bread that isn't exactly expensive

yeah you are barking up the wrong tree amateurist

― TracerHandVEVO (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, March 14, 2012 11:04 AM (28 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

ok, but she or he should shut the fuck up about "NOT BEING ABLE" to cook because it's patently untrue and she or he is being a huge drama queen about it.

xpost oh fuck you lex.

actually i'm with lex on that one

everyone else itt is being as ridiculous as lex ftr

Yeah, some of you are acting like Lex is refusing to breathe.

lol.

actually i'm with lex on that one

― TracerHandVEVO (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, March 14, 2012 11:05 AM (45 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

but it's like crunchy and warm and wet inside and delicious -- it's nothing like store-bought bread. or even bakery-bought bread. tracer, you would like it.

i think some people should just accept that we have all different skill sets and for some of us they don't include cooking

Homemade bread is the best thing in the entire goddamned universe. The smell when you take it out; that first, still-warm piece with a little butter on it . . . it's better than a hundred Super Bowls.

Yeah, but being belligerantly insistant us fun on both sides.

i dont know if baking bread is necc the best first thing to cook

i mean it is amazing but not exactly entry-level

in london there are real bakers who can make better bread than i could ever, ever make in a million years of baking, and i REALLY like bread, so it's worth it to me to spend a crazy amount of money (£3) on a big loaf of REALLY nice bread rather than spend several hours of rising and kneading to produce something maybe a quarter as good

which is not really true of most food - i can make better lunch than a hell of a lot of places i might eat out at

i think some people should just accept that we have all different skill sets and for some of us they don't include cooking

i'm a firm believer in anyone can do anything tbh.

Yeah, some of you are acting like Lex is refusing to breathe.

― Eric H., Wednesday, March 14, 2012 11:06 AM (14 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i'm not actually upset. it's one thing to claim that you don't like to cook and don't really care about eating what you can eat w/o cooking. it's another thing to claim that you are physically or mentally incapable of cooking. i accept that you are not anthony bourdain, i do not accept that you are actually incapable of e.g. making a sandwich.

it's like saying "oh, playing the piano is so amazing, all you have to do is practice!" "writing an essay is so easy, all you have to do is type the words!"

some people just don't have the knack and are never gonna have it. stick to what you can do or enjoy doing, why stress yourself out with the rest?

"oh, playing the piano is so amazing, all you have to do is practice!"

it's true! some people don't want to practice though. it's about interest, not skill or some mysterious knack.

i accept that there are tons of simple things i just don't want to do or spend my time/energy learning. like gardening. but i am not physically or mentally incapable of gardening.

if i HAD to play the piano, i would do some piano practice at home instead of going out to play piano all the time

frogbs i have kids, so economizing is important to me, so that's a helpful motivation. i guess i also have a kind of morality about not wasting food. and i feel stupid when i waste money. but "neat and organized".... is not how anyone would really describe my life. it's maybe because of that that the kitchen is like one place where a TINY TINY bit of planning drastically improves my day and makes me feel good about myself.

yes, I have that morality too, but it obviously depends on your cooking style. if you're buying 12-15 things to make a stir-fry it's not exactly easy to plan out how you're going to use everything else, try as we might

whatever anyway some lady wrote an article about olive garden

also here's a simple recipe for beer bread yum: http://www.farmgirlfare.com/2005/11/beyond-easy-beer-bread.html

look obviously i can make a sandwich or make pasta but i regularly fuck up basic things like TOAST and BOILED EGGS and even my beloved CHEESE ON CRACKERS that i do regularly. stuff above that, you're justr asking for total disaster, plus i am going to hate every minute.

i'm ok at cooking but i don't enjoy it really, only if there are other people involved. cooking alone is a p miserable process.

if i HAD to play the piano, i would do some piano practice at home instead of going out to play piano all the time

well my point is i don't HAVE to cook

if i HAD to play the piano, i would do some piano practice at home instead of going out to play piano all the time

― 3hunn O))) (J0rdan S.), Wednesday, March 14, 2012 12:10 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lol

stick to what you can do or enjoy doing, why stress yourself out with the rest?

Because that's a really bopring approach. How does anyone ever learn anything or the world improve?

Cooking alone is, tbf, pretty rubbish.

cooking along can be kind of sucky, but if you have the right music on and the right drink you can feel like clive owen or some shit

When Em was away for a fortnight recently I cooked about 1/3 as much as usual.

yeah cooking w/ other folks is fun. actually cooking FOR other folks (even if they don't pitch in) is fun. cooking by yourself for yourself can be fun, but it is distinctly less fun than the other options.

cooking along can be kind of sucky, but if you have the right music on and the right drink you can feel like clive owen or some shit

― TracerHandVEVO (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, March 14, 2012 12:13 PM (49 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

me every night yo 8)

well... maybe not every night... but many nights!

cooking alone is a p miserable process.

Cooking alone is, tbf, pretty rubbish.

cooking by yourself for yourself can be fun, but it is distinctly less fun than the other options.

SO IT TURNS OUT YOU ALL AGREE WITH ME AFTER ALL

yes, when the missus isn't home I usually just make a BLT or something, which is not really cooking (total cost = $4. in case you were wondering)

i mean...that is why i don't cook! because it's not remotely fun!

Cooking alone is great, you weirdos

i love cooking by myself! with friends and lovers its even better.

do you people not masturbate??

one dollar for each slice of bread, one dollar for a few leaves of lettuce, 25 cents each for two slices of bacon, 25 cents for a slice of tomato

I cook at least four times a week for and by myself!

frankly baffled by the continuing references to masturbation in this thread.

mayo is extra

- max's slogan

i mean...that is why i don't cook! because it's not remotely fun!

― lex pretend, Wednesday, March 14, 2012 11:15 AM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i thought it was because YOU ARE RECEIVING DISABILITY CHECKS FOR NOT BEING ABLE TO MAKE PASTA SAUCE

It is engaging and empowering to make yourself something uniquely calibrated to your own tastes.

how do you mess up cheese and crackers....?

one dollar for each slice of bread, one dollar for a few leaves of lettuce, 25 cents each for two slices of bacon, 25 cents for a slice of tomato

+ $2.50 for an avocado

can we go back to discussing Marilyn Haggerty

I did make an awesome moussaka the first day Em was away.

I mean, all you have to do is slice some cheese and put it on a cracker, there's no actual cooking involved

how do you mess up cheese and crackers....?

structurally unsound crackers are the bane of my life

you should make your own crackers!

(kidding.)

Yeah I don't get it frogbs are you charging the entire cost of each ingredient to each meal? Cuz that's some fucked up accounting.

trying to cut a piece of cheese can be hard. you end up with slices that are way too thin and some that are very thick. and some that are thick at the top, but are only half size. in the end, not a single piece will be satisfying.

tragic cheese-n-crackers mishap

haha okay that is not "messing up cheese and crackers", that is "an unavoidable side-effect of constantly eating cheese and crackers"

How strong and inept are your hands, geez

*buys loaf of bread, tomato, package of bacon, head of lettuce*
*makes blt*
*forgets remaining 90% of ingredients in fridge for three weeks*

Now all I can picture w/r/t poor lex is

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjvQRerJu0g

*sneaks into hurting 2's house and makes a bunch of blts, confident he will never miss them*

xp yeah I'm pretty sure thats the way most people ITT are picturing me

the ineptness of my hands is the central issue here for me. they are very very very inept

Spray cheese reminds me of doggy diarrhea , but maybe that is yr solution

lex are you Edward Scisshorhands?

with the boiled egg incident, the egg actually boiled fine, but when i was trying to peel it, it wouldn't peel, and i somehow ripped the egg in half and the whole thing fell in the bin

it was my last egg :(

in the end, not a single piece will be satisfying.

And then the neurasthenic took his own life in despair.

I have been playing piano for 25 years now. In my experience, it costs less for me to hear someone else play it, and they'll probably play it better. But it's more satisfying to do it at home where, hopefully, no one is listening.

with the boiled egg incident, the egg actually boiled fine, but when i was trying to peel it, it wouldn't peel, and i somehow ripped the egg in half and the whole thing fell in the bin

it was my last egg :(

― lex pretend, Wednesday, March 14, 2012 12:26 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

this is genuinely heartbreaking

what happened to the other 11 eggs??

Re: spray cheese and other home cooking concerns, everyone eventually changes their tune when their metabolism starts to change

dr. strongo's neuvo cuisine

lex did you let the egg cool first, run it under cold water, etc?

It's some kind of communist connection to the fruits of your labour, I suspect, lex. Seriously, if you're ever near Exeter, let me know, come round, I'll cook.

― Sick Mouthy (Scik Mouthy), Wednesday, 14 March 2012 15:59 (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I do wonder about this. The first part, not SM hitting on Lex.

Eric, is that a pro canned cheese or an anti canned cheese stance?

i'm glad i learned the basics of cooking at Big Bob's Our Place, Double Play Sports Bar & Grill, and Stub and Herb's working part time in high school and college

will someone please let the lex off of the hook and tell him everything's okay. i can't take another botched meal anecdote.

nb, do not stand on canned cheese because you might slip, hilariously

I'm pretty sure that objectively my not-great tofu and whatever meals aren't any better than going to the mediocre Chinese place two minutes away. But I feel a lot better about them. Communism.

Covent Garden soups I always end up eating at work a whole lot and are kind of the epitome of 'I wish I had something better to eat but I'm not, I'm eating this'

It's a pragmatic canned cheese stance.

lex did you let the egg cool first, run it under cold water, etc?

siiiigh no. lots of people have since told me this is what i should have done. i don't know where they learned it from. nonetheless i have not recovered my confidence re: eggs sufficiently to attempt them again

It sounds like Lex really doesn't want to start cooking-maybe he could, if he really wanted to, but he doesn't, so why be so pushy about it? Also it's not like he goes to McDonald's for every meal, or eats nothing but Pop Tarts, it sounds like he has a reasonable diet, not worse than that of many who do cook.

As far as OG etc, I agree they are not really innocuous due to food production methods, their effect on local culture etc, but IME, people who make a display of how much they hate OG rarely make it about that. They don't even mention factory farms, regional culture, local economy etc-it usually seems more an opportunity to display their superior taste, and experience and knowledge of "authentic" food.

Meh, it's OK to hate things that taste bad, are overpriced and horrifically unhealthy.

It sounds like Lex really doesn't want to start cooking-maybe he could, if he really wanted to, but he doesn't, so why be so pushy about it?

we have an interest in making this thread very long

i only just read this. it's funny/sweet because she so politely avoids going into detail about the food and quietly minimizes the damage: "Instead of the raspberry lemonade she suggested, I drank water."

will someone please let the lex off of the hook and tell him everything's okay. i can't take another botched meal anecdote.

i posted this last night in the gay thread:

i tried to steam some broccoli the other week and it just...i have no idea why it didn't work. i thought i knew how to do it. i've done it before. but nothing happened. i ended up having to gnaw sadly on semi-raw florets.

― lex pretend, Tuesday, March 13, 2012 4:10 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

along with the last time i tried to join in on pancake day and toss pancakes, which ended in disaster when i somehow managed to toss the entire frying pan :(

if you're buying 12-15 things to make a stir-fry it's not exactly easy to plan out how you're going to use everything else, try as we might
― frogbs, Wednesday, March 14, 2012 11:10 AM (20 minutes ago)

Yes, it is. You're not trying hard enough.

beginning to think your problem might not be cooking

buy less things to make a stir-fry imo

i think i understand now lex - you've learned your kitchen techniques from saturday morning cartoons

stop cooking on ketamine!

i heard an interview with her son on local npr. he writes for the wsj! nothing too revelatory but he did have to explain to his mom what 'going viral' meant.

― goole, Wednesday, March 14, 2012 9:36 AM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

oh ha i just remembered something pretty funny: the host asked the guy how, since she is very non-negative about anything, you could tell if she was giving a place a bad review? and his answer was if she writes more about the decor, the food probably isn't too hot.

didn't marilyn spend like five paragraphs on the seating?

the famed olive garden review might have been a vicious pan all along

Lex's cookophobia is fun!

goole this has been mentioned

along with the last time i tried to join in on pancake day and toss pancakes, which ended in disaster when i somehow managed to toss the entire frying pan :(

― lex pretend, Wednesday, March 14, 2012 11:40 AM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

haha i hope this was accompanied by one of those "falling on banana peel" slide whistles

sorry, this thread is bonkers

I'm just talking about makin fancy, good restaurant quality stuff, not your evryday meal. I don't think my grocery bills/trash piles are any higher than yours.

I'm just cracking up because I'm imagining Lex putting pancake batter into a pan, and then putting that pan in a larger pan, and then attempting to flip the smaller pan with the larger pan.

is that what 'pancake day' means

No, that's a sex act

You take two intact...

i am a big fan of cooking alone, which is a totally chill relaxing yet mentally stimulating activity. i do like to have someone to share the results with if i'm making anything remotely ambitious.

if i still lived alone i'd be having brown rice salmon and kale every night.

Lex should compile all the stories into some Švejk-like compendium of mishaps.

http://www.collegecomplements.com/img/products/Norpro-Pancake-Turner.jpg

alien technology — recovered from Area 51, starting to be seen in test labs in Dubuque and East Lansing.

Omelette probe

xxpost

yeah if i'm cooking something simple but tasty i have no prob cooking/eating alone.

but if it's something fancy or ambitious i want an audience or collaborator.

i just made ramen noodles using my electric tea kettle at work. dollar lunch.

the kind with the corn kernel and green pea packet. love the corn and pea packet.

i was gonna say, my friends in the Midwest (OK, Indiana) were telling me that they think that the entire article is really just a almost-Swiftian-oh-so-subtle pisstake on Olive Garden (since they claim inside knowledge on Midwest/Heartland humor and such). it does kind of work that way once you try to look at it that way (all the talk about the parking lot and the decor and not so much talk about the food as such).

if you don't have something nice to say...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-wx11l3nr4

the awl people are right about the accidental poetry (or maybe not accidental? i shouldn't sell her short...) of this:

"There is seating for those who are waiting."

hahahhahahahahaha Hurting OTM

"You can find the latest Hagerty coverage on MarilynHagerty.com. It includes links to two new Herald items now available for sale: a new e-book collection of Eatbeat articles and a new Marilyn Hagerty T-shirt."

http://www.grandforksherald.com/event/article/id/232085/publisher_ID/40/

quick work, marilyn.

I thought the review was fine if the OG is the kind of place her paper's readership wants reviewed. And the outright snottiness of the original Internet reaction was unnecessary. But acting like it's an especially well-crafted piece of writing also seems kind of condescending imo.

the awl people are right about the accidental poetry (or maybe not accidental? i shouldn't sell her short...) of this:

"There is seating for those who are waiting."

― scott seward, Wednesday, March 14, 2012 2:27 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

eat yer heart out, t i m @ k f c. e d u

her drunken noodle review is pretty similar. no real food critique:

http://www.grandforksherald.com/event/article/id/231996/publisher_ID/40/

omg, from the taco bell review:

"CS had a taco and a small drink. A creative 13-year-old, she mixed Baja Blast, Mountain Dew and Sierra Mist, something I really don't encourage. Something, I am sure, she has seen older kids do."

kinda love this

Then, there are Japanese-inspired Teppanyaki platters of rib-eye steak, mixed seafood, tiger prawns and scallops. They range in price from $12 to $15, and I told myself this would be nice another time.

"But acting like it's an especially well-crafted piece of writing also seems kind of condescending imo."

i don't think so! i think her review can be instructional. i like the simplicity of it. there is a zen-like quality to it that comes from writing like that for decades. lots of people who can write could never write something like that. there is absolutely nothing forced about it at all.

i find it kind of crazy as a food writer myself that she writes these fairly lengthy reviews and never brings even one person along with her!! she only ever eats one thing!

tbf i have no idea what the intent of "eatbeat" is (reviewing restaurants or providing news about new restaurants), but the idea of an article where someone goes and eats a meal and does not discuss the quality of the food is v. foreign to me.

i mean, if i lived in grand forks, i would not be relying on eatbeat when figuring out where to go on friday night.

you're assuming there are places to go on friday night

well clearly there are at least two such places, the olive garden and drunken noodle!

I think it's literally just like Grand Forks is a small, not especially foodie place and she's like "here are the options of places to eat so you will know what they are." I really wouldn't read too much into it. I mean we're talking about a city of 50K in a very sparsely populated state.

I mean I think you guys are not understanding what it is like to live in a place like that and especially to not be an internet-savvy 20- or 30-something that uses zagat.com and yelp for recommendations.

but i assume people there still have opinions about whether food is good or not!

i kinda loved my recent local front page coverage. they never once got the name of my store right.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/419887_10150570348707137_686202136_9026360_1907195104_n.jpg

dude i grew up reading restaurant reviews in the newspaper before the internet existed and i think even then ppl would question the utility of this column.