cleave
― dyao, Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:09 (thirteen years ago) link
ambivalent
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:12 (thirteen years ago) link
before
weather
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:13 (thirteen years ago) link
secreted (bit fo a cheat?)
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:16 (thirteen years ago) link
Don't get "weather"?
― Tuomas, Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:20 (thirteen years ago) link
inflammable
― tom d: he did what he had to do now he is dead (Tom D.), Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:23 (thirteen years ago) link
"Inflammable" has just one meaning.
― Tuomas, Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:25 (thirteen years ago) link
"ridden" confuses me
like, you might think that a flea-ridden dog would be a dog who'd been ridden of fleas, but it is in fact a dog which is still being ridden by fleas
perhaps this is only confusing in my worry-ridden head
― rah rah rah wd smash the oiks (a passing spacecadet), Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:25 (thirteen years ago) link
I thought "ridden" in that sense came from "ride", i.e. worries are riding your head.
― Tuomas, Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:27 (thirteen years ago) link
to weather something is to get by without significant damage, but if something is 'weathered' it's usually quite badly dmaaged
just imo
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:28 (thirteen years ago) link
Ok, that clears it up.
― Tuomas, Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:29 (thirteen years ago) link
I think you're right, Tuomas, but the two verbs have the same past participle - admittedly there isn't really an overlap in usage, but
― rah rah rah wd smash the oiks (a passing spacecadet), Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:32 (thirteen years ago) link
Bedridden - being ridden by beds
― Chaim Poutine (NickB), Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:33 (thirteen years ago) link
I think it's supposed to be metaphorical: you're "ridden" by something, i.e. it takes over you - like a loa riding a Voodoo priest.
― Tuomas, Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:36 (thirteen years ago) link
ridden mid-14c., pp. of ride (q.v.). Sense evolution, via horses, from "that which has been ridden upon, broken in" (1520s) to, in compounds, "oppressed, taken advantage of" (1650s).
― thomp, Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:44 (thirteen years ago) link
guilt-ridden, bed-ridden, etc
sanction
― Hide the prickforks (GamalielRatsey), Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:46 (thirteen years ago) link
Properly yes, but it's often misused to mean "not flammable"
― tom d: he did what he had to do now he is dead (Tom D.), Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:46 (thirteen years ago) link
damnit there was an xword clue where the answer was a word which meant cut or join, and wasn't cleave. but i can't remember what it was.
― ledge, Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:47 (thirteen years ago) link
dock!
― ledge, Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:48 (thirteen years ago) link
Figurative
― Stevie T, Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:49 (thirteen years ago) link
fast
― لوووووووووووووووووووول (lex pretend), Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:50 (thirteen years ago) link
What meanings of "fast" are contradictory?
― Tuomas, Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:52 (thirteen years ago) link
c'mon now you can't do this every time
stuck fast
― ledge, Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:53 (thirteen years ago) link
clip?
― لوووووووووووووووووووول (lex pretend), Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:53 (thirteen years ago) link
But the it's the "stuck" part here that's contradictory, not "fast".
― Tuomas, Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:54 (thirteen years ago) link
xp nah i answered myself up there, it was dock. how does clip = join?
― ledge, Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:54 (thirteen years ago) link
(8) firmly fixed in place; not easily moved; securely attached.
― ledge, Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:55 (thirteen years ago) link
(xp)
AWESOME example
― progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:55 (thirteen years ago) link
ledge - "paper clip"
"Fast" in that sense just means "tightly", which is not in direct contradiction with "fast", meaning "speedy".
― Tuomas, Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:55 (thirteen years ago) link
when you clip things together, eg with a paperclip
― لوووووووووووووووووووول (lex pretend), Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:55 (thirteen years ago) link
i used to know loads of these. "cleave" is the classic imo.
dyke
― لوووووووووووووووووووول (lex pretend), Thursday, 29 July 2010 12:56 (thirteen years ago) link
wear
... similar to weather
― tom d: he did what he had to do now he is dead (Tom D.), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:00 (thirteen years ago) link
funny how "old" can mean "young" in some contexts.
If I talk about "the old me", I'm referring to the way I was in the olden days, when I was young.
― if you see her, say ayo (unregistered), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:04 (thirteen years ago) link
^ kinda how 'before' works in my head
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:07 (thirteen years ago) link
hmm, I don't q
― if you see her, say ayo (unregistered), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:12 (thirteen years ago) link
*hmm, I don't quite follow you, darraghmac
well your future is before you, but you can also look back on something that happened 'before' now
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:13 (thirteen years ago) link
literal
― thomp, Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:14 (thirteen years ago) link
^ nah, there's actually a thread on how this is just misused
ha as there is for 'actually', actually
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:16 (thirteen years ago) link
PRESCRIPTIVIST!
― thomp, Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:17 (thirteen years ago) link
xxxp ah, clever
― if you see her, say ayo (unregistered), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:17 (thirteen years ago) link
boned
― peligro, Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:20 (thirteen years ago) link
skim
― Chaim Poutine (NickB), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:28 (thirteen years ago) link
suck
― the depressed-saggy-japanese-salaryman of ilx posters (Will M.), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:30 (thirteen years ago) link
haha i didn't see boned. i suppose this works in the same way.
― Chaim Poutine (NickB),
losing you here tbh- as in 'to read quickly'?
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:40 (thirteen years ago) link
maybe because skimming the ingredients vs. reading them makes you fat and skimming yr milk makes you thin
― the depressed-saggy-japanese-salaryman of ilx posters (Will M.), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:41 (thirteen years ago) link
^ needed on crossword puzzle thread
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:41 (thirteen years ago) link
cross? hurt irt friendship vs. help irt football
really scraping teh bottom of my headbarrel here
― the depressed-saggy-japanese-salaryman of ilx posters (Will M.), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:43 (thirteen years ago) link
I suppose "doing the laundry" can result in either clean laundry or dirrty laundry, depending on how you interpret the verb.
― if you see her, say ayo (unregistered), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:44 (thirteen years ago) link
skim - to take away some of the surface layer OR to add to the surface layer ('skimmed with ice' or a skim of plaster)
― Chaim Poutine (NickB), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:44 (thirteen years ago) link
piece/peace (as in, carrying a piece vs. world peace)
again, streeeeetch armstronging this
― the depressed-saggy-japanese-salaryman of ilx posters (Will M.), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:46 (thirteen years ago) link
apology
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:46 (thirteen years ago) link
barely - "just enough to get by" versus "not quite enough to get by"
― if you see her, say ayo (unregistered), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:46 (thirteen years ago) link
hah, I feel like there are a lot of these in English because it feels like I come across them all the time but when it came time to double down and start the topic I could only think of one
:(
― dyao, Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:47 (thirteen years ago) link
custom?
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:48 (thirteen years ago) link
hmm 'barely' just means for it to be close either way.
thread could get vicious if we all start to nitpick though
draw?
To draw on something (e.g. a cigarette) is to take something from it while to draw on something (e.g. a piece of paper) is to put something on it.
― shakiraghmac (onimo), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:51 (thirteen years ago) link
re: the fast discussion above, if "the door is fast" it can have opposite meanings -- if you are talking about a traditional door, eg it probably means it's stuck and something not moving can't BE any slower, whereas if you are talking about a grocery store automatic door it probably means it opens with the rapidity of an automatic door on the uss enterprise.
xxxxxp i don't think barely works because the words after it make it opposite, ie. i barely made the bus vs. i barely missed it. you could explain pretty much any adverb as contradictory by that logic. unless i am missing something?
xxp i should type faster
― the depressed-saggy-japanese-salaryman of ilx posters (Will M.), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:54 (thirteen years ago) link
blow
― conrad, Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:55 (thirteen years ago) link
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:46 (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
I like this, 'sorry I did something wrong' vs 'fuck you I did nothing wrong'.
how about rent? Seems that both positions in the state of affairs are described as renting.
― Merdeyeux, Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:56 (thirteen years ago) link
invaluable is probably with inflammable as one of the 'yes we know but everyone knows what you mean by it'
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:58 (thirteen years ago) link
rent, lease, lend all the same there, yeah
does resign count? you have to pronounce it differently to get the other meaning. like "alex tanguay resigned with the calgary flames" vs. "the ceo resigned amid controversy."
actually the more i think about it, there's also "resigning to your fate" which is accepting the way things are vs. "resigning from your job" which is NOT accepting the way things are and making a big change.
― the depressed-saggy-japanese-salaryman of ilx posters (Will M.), Thursday, 29 July 2010 13:59 (thirteen years ago) link
i guess it just means like quit yr job vs. quit yr bitching, so maybe not opposite
― the depressed-saggy-japanese-salaryman of ilx posters (Will M.), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:00 (thirteen years ago) link
hyphen makes the difference?
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:06 (thirteen years ago) link
Don't get "ambivalent" unless you're just counting the mistaken use of "ambivalent" to mean "indifferent".
― Sundar, Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:15 (thirteen years ago) link
ambivalent can be to feel v strong but conflicting feelings, or it can mean not to care one way or the other.
iirc
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:19 (thirteen years ago) link
"take care of" -- see nurse vs. hitman
― the depressed-saggy-japanese-salaryman of ilx posters (Will M.), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:20 (thirteen years ago) link
think the hitman would take that one
― ledge, Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:20 (thirteen years ago) link
catholic
― Theodore "Thee Diddy" Roosevelt (Hurting 2), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:21 (thirteen years ago) link
nice
― progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:23 (thirteen years ago) link
(that was a response to Hurting 2)
but y'see, it's totally ambiguous, even in the examples you gave. If someone said to me, "I barely made the bus," I'd have a hard time telling if they meant "I made the bus, but I almost didn't" or "I didn't make the bus, but I almost did" without further context. the words after it don't clarify things much at all.
the problem with "barely" is that the formal, historical definition of it is "just enough", but another informal definition is "not nearly enough" (thefreedictionary.com's entry says just this). unless you know which definition someone is using, it could go either way regardless of which verb (made vs. missed) is being modified.
― if you see her, say ayo (unregistered), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:26 (thirteen years ago) link
I 'barely made the bus' = i made the bus, but it was close. there's no other reading i could give it.
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:32 (thirteen years ago) link
'couldn't care less'
^ always annoys me
"couldn't care less" makes perfect sense to me, "could care less" = wtf - but ilx has done that one to death somewhere.
― shakiraghmac (onimo), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:36 (thirteen years ago) link
well yeah i was on about the opposite/same meaning on 'could care less' rly
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:37 (thirteen years ago) link
careometer.jpg solves the dilemma
― shakiraghmac (onimo), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:40 (thirteen years ago) link
I 'barely made the bus' = i made the bus, but it was close. there's no other reading i could give it.― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, July 29, 2010 10:32 AM (6 minutes ago)
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, July 29, 2010 10:32 AM (6 minutes ago)
eh, I respectfully disagree.
I mean, "I almost made the bus" means "I missed the bus, but it was close" — no question about it. but unless you already know whether or not they got on the bus, "I barely missed the bus" could describe one of two totally opposite scenarios. the technical, old-school definition of "barely" may be the only one you or I would ever use, but I know a lot of people who use it as a synonym for "not quite".
― if you see her, say ayo (unregistered), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:49 (thirteen years ago) link
("they" being the speaker)
― if you see her, say ayo (unregistered), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:50 (thirteen years ago) link
PIE
― ledge, Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:51 (thirteen years ago) link
the only way i can justify could care less in my head is by assuming the person saying it is applying dry and acerbic sarcasm. the only way i can justify couldn't care less is by remembering that it's technically correct. effing hate both because one's nonsense and one sounds rubbish.
xxxp i don't think you're going to find anyone to support your definition of barely, that sounds completely bewildering to me.
― the depressed-saggy-japanese-salaryman of ilx posters (Will M.), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:51 (thirteen years ago) link
have never heard the 'barely' where you 'didn't' whatever it was, but it's a big world
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:58 (thirteen years ago) link
fuck, on second thought "I barely missed the bus" pretty much always means, "I missed the bus, but it was close." it's "I barely made the bus" that gives me pause. I guess the verb occasionally makes the meaning of "barely" clear, but it's a tough call more often than not.
maybe I should stop hanging around with dumb people who don't know what words mean.
― if you see her, say ayo (unregistered), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:59 (thirteen years ago) link
well let this be a lesson to you imo
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 14:59 (thirteen years ago) link
Someone told me that if our American friends table an item at a meeting, they mean that the item will be parked and not discussed, while if the Brits table something at a meeting they mean that it goes on the agenda and will be discussed. Crazy.
― The New Dirty Vicar, Thursday, 29 July 2010 15:10 (thirteen years ago) link
^ yes
something about 'continuance' in legal terms is there or thereabouts too iirc?
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 15:11 (thirteen years ago) link
Greek
in one context, it means something you don't understand (It's all Greek to me!). In another, it means something you do understand (Pass it to me, I speak Greek!)
― the depressed-saggy-japanese-salaryman of ilx posters (Will M.), Thursday, 29 July 2010 15:18 (thirteen years ago) link
^ never heard of the latter. Must be Merkinism.
― tom d: he did what he had to do now he is dead (Tom D.), Thursday, 29 July 2010 15:22 (thirteen years ago) link
i've never heard that either
i never knew that about the british version of "table" which explains a lot of my confusion about parliament
― progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Thursday, 29 July 2010 15:22 (thirteen years ago) link
xp I think that might be a quite specific context where someone has something which is written in Greek...
― peligro, Thursday, 29 July 2010 15:26 (thirteen years ago) link
or perhaps...
― peligro, Thursday, 29 July 2010 15:28 (thirteen years ago) link
mean - a mean portion could either be a small one or average sized
― Chaim Poutine (NickB), Thursday, 29 July 2010 15:30 (thirteen years ago) link
Strike (in the baseball sense)
― Myonga Vön Bontee, Thursday, 29 July 2010 15:36 (thirteen years ago) link
Never understood that. I think they should change it to SWIPE!
― shakiraghmac (onimo), Thursday, 29 July 2010 15:37 (thirteen years ago) link
See, I don't think that second definition is actually, you know, a definition of "ambivalent". I've heard people use it that way but I always just thought it was a mistake.
The only definition in Oxford American Dictionary: having mixed feelings or contradictory ideas about something or someone
I've also never heard these alternative definitions of "barely" and "Greek". "Cleave" was a good one.
xposts OK, Myonga OTM.
― Sundar, Thursday, 29 July 2010 15:39 (thirteen years ago) link
"protestant" too, arguably (sort of xpost)
― Theodore "Thee Diddy" Roosevelt (Hurting 2), Thursday, 29 July 2010 15:39 (thirteen years ago) link
well it's probably a mistake in terms of deviation form original, but in my experience it's usually what's meant by the word.
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 15:40 (thirteen years ago) link
re: people who have never heard the latter: it was kind of a (apparently hard ot understand and lame) joke. Greek wither means nonsense, or it means the Greek language which is the opposite of nonsense to Greek-literate people. Never mind.
― the depressed-saggy-japanese-salaryman of ilx posters (Will M.), Thursday, 29 July 2010 16:13 (thirteen years ago) link
just because I didn't laugh doesn't mean I didn't get it
― Theodore "Thee Diddy" Roosevelt (Hurting 2), Thursday, 29 July 2010 16:55 (thirteen years ago) link
how about the word cricket bat, cause in one content it's something you use in a sporting competition, but in another context it's a murder weapon
― progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Thursday, 29 July 2010 16:58 (thirteen years ago) link
Nothing sporting about murder
― Myonga Vön Bontee, Thursday, 29 July 2010 17:08 (thirteen years ago) link
It's just not cricket
― ailsa, Thursday, 29 July 2010 17:16 (thirteen years ago) link
ebb!
― progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Thursday, 29 July 2010 19:18 (thirteen years ago) link
― progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Thursday, July 29, 2010 12:55 PM (6 hours ago) Bookmark
completely OTM kinda dont need to read anymore after this one
― 69, Thursday, 29 July 2010 19:27 (thirteen years ago) link
overlook
― lene lovage (elmo argonaut), Thursday, 29 July 2010 20:06 (thirteen years ago) link
dust
― lene lovage (elmo argonaut), Thursday, 29 July 2010 20:09 (thirteen years ago) link
oversight
― lene lovage (elmo argonaut), Thursday, 29 July 2010 20:10 (thirteen years ago) link
underwear
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 20:14 (thirteen years ago) link
'peruse' as people use it / 'peruse' as it actually signifies
― Eggs, Peaches, Hot Dogs, Lamb (remy bean), Thursday, 29 July 2010 20:15 (thirteen years ago) link
assume
― lene lovage (elmo argonaut), Thursday, 29 July 2010 20:30 (thirteen years ago) link
garnish
― lene lovage (elmo argonaut), Thursday, 29 July 2010 20:36 (thirteen years ago) link
^ good one
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 22:26 (thirteen years ago) link
Maybe
(Means essentially the same as "maybe not", amiright? Kind of a half-full/half-empty sort of thing)
― Myonga Vön Bontee, Thursday, 29 July 2010 22:30 (thirteen years ago) link
gets in on a technicality
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Thursday, 29 July 2010 22:37 (thirteen years ago) link
Bitch - could either be a very dominant and aggressive woman, or a very submissive one.
― 8 (88), Monday, 2 August 2010 22:18 (thirteen years ago) link
wiki has a long list of these here. they're called auto-antonyms.
― if you see her, say ayo (unregistered), Monday, 2 August 2010 23:43 (thirteen years ago) link
ha it backs me on ambivalent anyway IN YOUR FACE HI DERE
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Monday, 2 August 2010 23:51 (thirteen years ago) link
xp oh my god, that is exactly what I'm looking for. wikipedia is my wife
― dyao, Monday, 2 August 2010 23:52 (thirteen years ago) link
anabasis (1) a military advance (2) a difficult and dangerous military retreat[4]
this is just due to xenophon being all contradictory with his title, right.
dollop "Dollop" can mean "a large amount" or "a small amount" depending on its usage.
... depending on whether it's prefixed with "large " or "small" iow
― ledge, Tuesday, 3 August 2010 08:38 (thirteen years ago) link
fish fry Fish fry can refer either to a meal of fried fish (or a social event primarily serving fried fish), or recently hatched fish. Thus, "fish fry" can refer to either the beginning or ending of life for a fish.
ain't wikipedia cuet
decimate The literal meaning is to reduce by one-tenth (e.g., a decimated legion). However, in modern English it is popularly used to describe a dramatic reduction in number (a population decimated by disease).
These two meanings are not antonymic. Bad wikipedia.
― emil.y, Tuesday, 3 August 2010 09:47 (thirteen years ago) link
that page needs decimated.
― ledge, Tuesday, 3 August 2010 09:48 (thirteen years ago) link
"Quite" can mean partly or completely. "This book is quite good" vs "This dinner is quite perfect".
― bham, Tuesday, 3 August 2010 11:10 (thirteen years ago) link
would argue that's more on the words it's paired with again though.
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 11:16 (thirteen years ago) link
quite
― shakiraghmac (onimo), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 11:47 (thirteen years ago) link
would think of it more as 'exactly', 'precisely' kind of thing.
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 11:54 (thirteen years ago) link
I don't know, I'm happy to accept "quite" as ambiguous, at least. In modern British (and Irish? hi darraghmac) usage the meaning of "less than completely" is so dominant that it's almost always the one intended except when paired with a superlative or something more or less superlative in meaning ("quite the best", "quite perfect" etc), but since that is the newer meaning and has only become dominant over the past century or a bit longer, there's definitely still scope for ambiguity, to me
plus I am failing to think of the exact grammatical circumstances in which it means one or the other, so I don't think it's quite settled yet
am I right in thinking that to Americans it always means "completely", or is it regional? I remember it confusing a friend from Florida.
― rah rah rah wd smash the oiks (a passing spacecadet), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 12:08 (thirteen years ago) link
carbuncle
― koogs, Tuesday, 3 August 2010 12:37 (thirteen years ago) link
In modern British (and Irish? hi darraghmac) usage
blowin minds here but we didn't pick up the language from reading the OED over 300 year or anything :p
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 12:52 (thirteen years ago) link
Ha, sorry, just wrote "British", and then thought that perhaps I should revise that in the light of you being the poster I was replying to. Then I was xposted by your second post on the subject and I confused myself about whether you were or weren't using it the same way. But mainly it was too close to lunchtime for me to make any sense.
Now I've had lunch and I'm still not making any sense so I'm just counting the minutes to hometime.
― rah rah rah wd smash the oiks (a passing spacecadet), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 13:09 (thirteen years ago) link
as a crawling apology for colonial expansion and the subsequent ills thereof, 'i was ungry guv' hardly impresses.
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 13:33 (thirteen years ago) link
Cheek complaining to an Irishman about being hungry too
― tom d: he did what he had to do now he is dead (Tom D.), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 13:34 (thirteen years ago) link
well i wasn't gonna go there tbh, i had quite a good lunch myself
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 13:36 (thirteen years ago) link
'quite'
OK, pairing it with the same word:
"Were you happy with your meal?""Quite happy ... the chips were good, but the fish was cold""Quite happy, thank you, it was all very good"
I'd say these meanings were quite contradictory.
― bham, Tuesday, 3 August 2010 14:56 (thirteen years ago) link
i wouldn't, tbh. not completely happy.
in fact the contradiction for me is saying quite happy to cold fish!
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:02 (thirteen years ago) link
quite just means very.
― progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:11 (thirteen years ago) link
oooh- 'very' is a bit of a strong reading imo
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:11 (thirteen years ago) link
i'm with bham here - could be 'very', could be 'somewhat'
― ledge, Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:17 (thirteen years ago) link
it's all in the inflection
"it was quite warm yesterday" never means somewhat warm. "she's quite intelligent" never means she's somewhat intelligent. "it was quite a fuck-up" never means it was somewhat of a fuck-up.
― progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:19 (thirteen years ago) link
"she's quite intelligent" never means she's somewhat intelligent.
?!?
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:20 (thirteen years ago) link
eh i suppose we've let worse through i'm being harsh on bham my bad etc
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:22 (thirteen years ago) link
you'll have to excuse me the last famine we had was quite a severe one and recovery has been quite slow
it means she's very intelligent relative to a shared baseline assumption
i.e. "it was quite warm yesterday" can refer to weather that's barely above a chill, but you weren't expecting it to be that warm so in fact, relative to what you imagined it was QUITE warm
― progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:22 (thirteen years ago) link
"she's _quite_ intelligent, but not really mensa material"
― ledge, Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:23 (thirteen years ago) link
i.e. she's very intelligent, but not really mensa material ...
― progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:24 (thirteen years ago) link
relative to a shared baseline assumption
eh that's not bad that, i like that.
but xp there's usually shades of qualification to using 'quite' too- it's middle ground stuff, you're not enthusing with 'quite'
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:25 (thirteen years ago) link
xp i.e. she's somewhat intelligent but not really mensa material imo
― ledge, Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:26 (thirteen years ago) link
she's surprisingly intelligent, not shockingly so, but i'm more interested in her friend tbh
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:28 (thirteen years ago) link
^ all in the emhpasis
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:29 (thirteen years ago) link
OK, I'd read the first 2 of Tracer's "never means somewhat" examples as "somewhat". "Quite a (noun)" doesn't seem to mean "somewhat", it's true. But with suitable emphasis "it was quite warm yesterday, but I was expecting it to get hotter than it did" is just as reasonable as "it was quite warm yesterday, I was surprised how warm it got" to my ears.
(tl;dr time)
OED says "As an intensifier: completely, fully, entirely; to the utmost extent or degree" and attests this usage before an adjective from c1480; usage modifying verb to signify thorough completion of action is even older. Then "as an emphasizer: actually, really, truly, positively; definitely; very much, considerably" is attested from 1624.
"As a moderating adverb: to a certain or significant extent or degree; moderately, somewhat, rather; relatively, reasonably" is attested in form "quite a(n) (adjective)" from 1808, and directly before an adjective or adverb from 1886. So, much more recent.
It notes "This sense is often difficult to distinguish from sense A. II., out of which it developed", so it's not just me and bham thinking it's ambiguous, A.II being the "as an emphasizer" section. Further, it says "rare in N. Amer. usage", which sort of answers my question upthread, and may suggest why Tracer may think it's less common?
― rah rah rah wd smash the oiks (a passing spacecadet), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:47 (thirteen years ago) link
Bham OTM
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:52 (thirteen years ago) link
basically what you're saying is that Americans speak more clearly and correctly - I quite agree
― progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:57 (thirteen years ago) link
you somewhat agree
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 15:59 (thirteen years ago) link
quite = rather
― Eggs, Peaches, Hot Dogs, Lamb (remy bean), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 16:01 (thirteen years ago) link
= pretty
― ledge, Tuesday, 3 August 2010 16:02 (thirteen years ago) link
unpack
― seandalai, Tuesday, 3 August 2010 16:05 (thirteen years ago) link
Basically what I'm saying is that Americans can make their point without several paragraphs of quotations from a dictionary strewn among bad punctuation and clumsy summarising, that's quite true
(PS I missed the bit "With many adjectives and adverbs (esp. gradable ones), quite is ambiguous between this sense and sense A. I.; in the latter sense it now tends to collocate with particular kinds of adjective and adverb (esp. non-gradable ones)", and now I think about it this "gradability" is key - "perfect" is not gradable; "true" or "agree" are arguable cases so need a more specific flag of only partial agreement; "good" is gradable, so UK-side "quite good" generally means "eh, it was OK")
― rah rah rah wd smash the oiks (a passing spacecadet), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 16:05 (thirteen years ago) link
UK-side "quite good" generally means "eh, it was OK"
this is madness
― progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 16:15 (thirteen years ago) link
Think Tracer's point about prior expectations is a doozy, tho I'm not sure it doesn't actually strengthen the case for the 'nays' tbh
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 16:15 (thirteen years ago) link
xp yeah 'quite good' all but begs to be finished with a sulky 'i suppose'
― "It's far from 'lol' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Tuesday, 3 August 2010 16:16 (thirteen years ago) link
quite good vs rather good
― seandalai, Wednesday, 4 August 2010 00:22 (thirteen years ago) link
You're all quite right.
― moley, Wednesday, 4 August 2010 03:35 (thirteen years ago) link
(the) shit
― Mosquepanik at Ground Zero (abanana), Thursday, 5 August 2010 16:37 (thirteen years ago) link
man-flu
― koogs, Thursday, 5 August 2010 16:40 (thirteen years ago) link
what does that even mean
― the depressed-saggy-japanese-salaryman of ilx posters (Will M.), Thursday, 5 August 2010 16:42 (thirteen years ago) link
man-flu is the flu that only men get.
if you're male then it's an extra bad case of the flu, worse than normal flu.if you're female then it means a cold with exaggerated symptoms.
― koogs, Thursday, 5 August 2010 16:47 (thirteen years ago) link
???
― Tuomas, Thursday, 5 August 2010 20:47 (thirteen years ago) link
man-flu not a universal concept then. http://www.manflu.info/ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man_flu
anyway, look, up there, 'carbuncle'.
― koogs, Thursday, 5 August 2010 21:33 (thirteen years ago) link
go on...
― ledge, Thursday, 5 August 2010 22:36 (thirteen years ago) link
ah i guess you mean an abscess larger than a boil, usually with one or more openings draining pus onto the skin, vs. a deep-red cabochon cut gemstone usually garnet, specifically almandine.
― ledge, Thursday, 5 August 2010 22:37 (thirteen years ago) link
Thought it might be the shorthand name for an intercontinental derby between Manchester United and Fluminense.
― flintstones in my passway (James Redd and the Blecchs), Thursday, 5 August 2010 22:54 (thirteen years ago) link
prince charles famously called some extension or other a carbuncle on the face of an old friend. meaning an ugly thing. cf gemstone, a thing generally prized for its beauty.
― koogs, Friday, 6 August 2010 07:15 (thirteen years ago) link
some extension or other
http://www.ribapix.com/image.php?i=17036&r=2&t=4&x=1
― ledge, Friday, 6 August 2010 08:32 (thirteen years ago) link
(national gallery) (london) (uk)
That'd be an Art Carbuncle then.
― Chaim Poutine (NickB), Friday, 6 August 2010 08:43 (thirteen years ago) link
you're here all week i trust
― ledge, Friday, 6 August 2010 08:46 (thirteen years ago) link
I'm sorry! Speaking of which, what about 'gag'?
― Chaim Poutine (NickB), Friday, 6 August 2010 09:05 (thirteen years ago) link
moot
― a CRASBO is a "criminally related" ASBO (contenderizer), Friday, 6 August 2010 09:33 (thirteen years ago) link
yeah moot works i think
― "It's far from 'loi' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Friday, 6 August 2010 09:33 (thirteen years ago) link
kick
― a CRASBO is a "criminally related" ASBO (contenderizer), Friday, 6 August 2010 09:36 (thirteen years ago) link
secure
― a CRASBO is a "criminally related" ASBO (contenderizer), Friday, 6 August 2010 09:46 (thirteen years ago) link
terminator
― "It's far from 'loi' you were reared, boy" (darraghmac), Friday, 6 August 2010 09:56 (thirteen years ago) link
pious
― a CRASBO is a "criminally related" ASBO (contenderizer), Friday, 6 August 2010 09:57 (thirteen years ago) link
"moot" is perfect
― progressive cuts (Tracer Hand), Friday, 6 August 2010 10:15 (thirteen years ago) link
suspicious?
maybe not self-contradictory but consider:
those men look suspicious.
vs.
i'm suspicious of those men.
― tangelo amour (elmo argonaut), Wednesday, 1 September 2010 15:21 (thirteen years ago) link
i was coming here to suggest that one!
along with perennial favourite 'curious'
― acoleuthic, Wednesday, 1 September 2010 15:22 (thirteen years ago) link
Update!
― Mark G, Wednesday, 1 September 2010 15:23 (thirteen years ago) link
SUBMIT
― acoleuthic, Wednesday, 1 September 2010 15:23 (thirteen years ago) link
"Drift" as targeted deliberate movement, being formerly part of the verb "drive", vs "drift" i.e. meander aimlessly
(having crossed over via magic quantum superposition e.g. snowdrifts and drifting at sea where you're meandering because something else is driving you)
admittedly I'm struggling to think of a particularly convincing surviving example of the former - OED says "(do you get my) drift" = "what I am driving at", but for me that also works as a sarcastic suggestion that you are leaving it as a gentle undercurrent for the more astute listener, rather than actively shoving in that direction
I have been incoherent here and will be zung if anyone can be bothered, must be hometime
― vampire headphase (a passing spacecadet), Wednesday, 1 September 2010 15:53 (thirteen years ago) link
"Trailer" = something that comes before (eg a film) or after (eg a car)
― bham, Thursday, 2 September 2010 14:42 (thirteen years ago) link
suspicious?maybe not self-contradictory but consider:those men look suspicious.vs.i'm suspicious of those men.― tangelo amour (elmo argonaut), Wednesday, 1 September 2010 15:21 (Yesterday)
― tangelo amour (elmo argonaut), Wednesday, 1 September 2010 15:21 (Yesterday)
― I.C.P. Freely (bernard snowy), Thursday, 2 September 2010 14:58 (thirteen years ago) link
I suspect 'those men look suspicious' is actually a misuse of the word that has become so common as to be accepted.
― rhythm fixated member (chap), Thursday, 2 September 2010 15:04 (thirteen years ago) link
Like 'suspicious behaviour' should probably be 'behaviour arousing suspicion'.
― rhythm fixated member (chap), Thursday, 2 September 2010 15:09 (thirteen years ago) link
cf. sceptical/dubious - "I am sceptical, that is dubious", not "I am dubious".
― ledge, Thursday, 2 September 2010 15:09 (thirteen years ago) link
sus·pi·cious
1 : tending to arouse suspicion : questionable <suspicious characters>2 : disposed to suspect : distrustful <suspicious of strangers>3 : expressing or indicative of suspicion <a suspicious glance>
― tangelo amour (elmo argonaut), Thursday, 2 September 2010 15:26 (thirteen years ago) link
suspicious "deserving of or exciting suspicion," mid-14c., from O.Fr. suspecious, from L. suspiciosus "exciting suspicion". Meaning "full of or inclined to feel suspicion" is attested from c.1400. Edgar Allan Poe (c.1845) proposed suspectful to take one of the two conflicting senses.
― tangelo amour (elmo argonaut), Thursday, 2 September 2010 15:32 (thirteen years ago) link
overlook!
― Arvo Pärty (Paul in Santa Cruz), Thursday, 2 September 2010 17:17 (thirteen years ago) link
Specifically:1.a. To look over or at from a higher place.b. To rise above, especially so as to afford a view over: The tower overlooks the sea.
2.a. To fail to notice or consider; miss.b. To ignore deliberately or indulgently; disregard.
3. To look over; examine.
4. To watch over; oversee. See Synonyms at supervise.
― Arvo Pärty (Paul in Santa Cruz), Thursday, 2 September 2010 17:20 (thirteen years ago) link
ay, that's a good one
― shorn_blond.avi (dayo), Thursday, 2 September 2010 23:46 (thirteen years ago) link
behaviour.
― Mark G, Friday, 3 September 2010 08:07 (thirteen years ago) link
graft
― TracerHandVEVO (Tracer Hand), Monday, 13 August 2012 09:21 (eleven years ago) link
dense
"he could not understand the dense text because he was too dense"
― EDB, Monday, 13 August 2012 09:49 (eleven years ago) link
mmmm not buying that one - both mean something like "impenetrable"
― TracerHandVEVO (Tracer Hand), Monday, 13 August 2012 09:52 (eleven years ago) link
the buffalo buffalo etc
― Mark G, Monday, 13 August 2012 09:55 (eleven years ago) link
screen. to show (e.g. a film) & to hide.
― ledge, Wednesday, 22 August 2012 08:22 (eleven years ago) link
good one!
― contenderizer, Wednesday, 22 August 2012 08:24 (eleven years ago) link
patronise. makes me chuckle whenever it's used in the "get cash from" sense.
― give me back my 200 dollars (NotEnough), Wednesday, 22 August 2012 11:12 (eleven years ago) link
literally
― 乒乓, Tuesday, 13 August 2013 02:46 (ten years ago) link
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Auto-antonym
You're talking about the common misuse of "literally" as "not literally", right? I don't think it officially has contradictory meanings?
― Tuomas, Tuesday, 13 August 2013 08:50 (ten years ago) link
let's ask the dictionary tsar
http://img1.etsystatic.com/008/0/8111024/il_570xN.472319187_3qwm.jpg
― click here to start exploding (ledge), Tuesday, 13 August 2013 08:55 (ten years ago) link
No-one's said my favourite one – fuse
― my father will guide me up the stairs to bed (anagram), Tuesday, 13 August 2013 09:54 (ten years ago) link
siren
― conrad, Wednesday, 21 August 2013 06:54 (ten years ago) link
repress
― koogs, Tuesday, 8 April 2014 08:41 (ten years ago) link
was there a brief period in the 60s when "uptight" meant "cool"?
cf the stevie wonder song. why does he say "uptight" there??
― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 14 June 2017 19:23 (six years ago) link
adumbrate
― pomenitul, Wednesday, 14 June 2017 19:30 (six years ago) link
Re: 'uptight,' a quick search unearthed this, from Tom Dalzell's Flappers 2 Rappers: American Youth Slang:
Uptight was another term meaning "very good," a very different connotation than that attached to the word in the hippie slang (inhibited) which survived at the expense of the mainstream meaning. The mainstream meaning was exemplified in the lyrics of a hit song by Little Stevie Wonder …
― pomenitul, Wednesday, 14 June 2017 19:37 (six years ago) link
From context I always thought that uptight represented the life with the girl from the right side of the tracks with the butlers and maids. He has loose shabby clothes because he's poor. But he loves her and is happy about her and her uptight square world. That's just been what I've been going on.
― how's life, Wednesday, 14 June 2017 19:43 (six years ago) link
Warhol & the Velvet Underground used "Up-Tight" in the cool sense in '66 as well (same year as the Stevie Wonder song). It is unusual how quickly and totally that word switched. Bet you don't find many positive "uptight"s after '67 even.
― Josefa, Wednesday, 14 June 2017 20:41 (six years ago) link
fuck the word "sanction". it always throws me when I read it in an article. contradictory as both a noun and a verb!
― Vinnie, Thursday, 15 June 2017 01:41 (six years ago) link
Refute:
1 : to prove wrong by argument or evidence : show to be false or erroneous2 : to deny the truth or accuracy of - "refuted the allegations"― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, February 27, 2018 8:04 AM
― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, February 27, 2018 8:04 AM
#2 is new and insane to me.
― mick signals, Tuesday, 27 February 2018 15:12 (six years ago) link
contemporary!
― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 28 November 2018 13:51 (five years ago) link
anxious
― Fantasy Eyelid (Old Lunch), Wednesday, 28 November 2018 13:57 (five years ago) link
how so
― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 28 November 2018 14:39 (five years ago) link
contemporary means at the same time as, so probably gives the info from context whether its contemporary to the subject or contemporary to the present time doesn't it?
― Stevolende, Wednesday, 28 November 2018 14:42 (five years ago) link
Yes - in fact that is the case with every word listed here!
However, "Contemporary art" does not change its meaning depending on context as far as I'm aware
― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 28 November 2018 15:33 (five years ago) link
incense as a noun vs. incense as a verb
― Choose Your Own Disaster (Old Lunch), Saturday, 23 February 2019 20:25 (five years ago) link
sensibility
― Goody Rickels on the Dime (Old Lunch), Monday, 18 March 2019 13:57 (five years ago) link
OL i will confess that i can't puzzle out your last three contributions itt
― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Monday, 18 March 2019 15:51 (five years ago) link
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/anxious
makes the anxious one quite clear - worried / eager
― koogs, Monday, 18 March 2019 16:12 (five years ago) link
id have to disagree with ascribing intent to the word like that tbh
to whom does one write
― fremme nette his simplicitte (darraghmac), Monday, 18 March 2019 16:31 (five years ago) link
The two usages of 'incense' aren't directly contradictory but the noun has a pleasant connotation (generally speaking, as I know not everyone is a nag champa stan) as opposed to the negative connotation of the verb form.
OTOH I probably should've said 'sensible' (reasonable vs. given over to feeling) rather than 'sensibility'.
― Goody Rickels on the Dime (Old Lunch), Monday, 18 March 2019 16:32 (five years ago) link
Brexit
― Zelda Zonk, Monday, 18 March 2019 16:35 (five years ago) link
ha
― fremme nette his simplicitte (darraghmac), Monday, 18 March 2019 16:36 (five years ago) link
anxious meaning "eager" - yes but there's still anxiety in that negative sense - the eagerness is manifesting as a kind of nervous stressincense - at root it's the same: fieriness
― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, 19 March 2019 09:48 (five years ago) link
"bottle" in the British sense has two directly contradictory meanings. the noun means "courage" and the verb means to lose your nerve!
― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, 19 March 2019 09:49 (five years ago) link
checks out
― fremme nette his simplicitte (darraghmac), Tuesday, 19 March 2019 10:04 (five years ago) link
"but what about the Irish sense" i hear you seething
― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, 19 March 2019 10:55 (five years ago) link
Does the verb form suggesting violence done with a bottle entail more courage or cowardice, I wonder
― Goody Rickels on the Dime (Old Lunch), Tuesday, 19 March 2019 11:55 (five years ago) link
More contents of bottles usually
― Helel Cool J (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 19 March 2019 12:16 (five years ago) link
"dutch courage" originally referred to that nationality's predilection to glassing in an otherwise honourable brawl
― fremme nette his simplicitte (darraghmac), Tuesday, 19 March 2019 12:21 (five years ago) link
(trivia 100% false obv)
Dutch = gin in that context i reckon
― Helel Cool J (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 19 March 2019 12:22 (five years ago) link
Patron - the owner or a customer of a restaurant.
― fetter, Friday, 28 February 2020 10:41 (four years ago) link
It's rhyming slang: "bottle & glass" = class (I think), as in to have class (as a fighter); so to lose one's bottle, to bottle it.
― fetter, Friday, 28 February 2020 10:45 (four years ago) link
fix
― Paperbag raita (ledge), Friday, 28 February 2020 10:56 (four years ago) link
labour
― BSC Joan Baez (darraghmac), Friday, 28 February 2020 16:17 (four years ago) link
"Terribly" can mean very well or very badly.
She's terribly educated vs She was terribly educated
― fetter, Friday, 28 February 2020 16:49 (four years ago) link
gonna need a stewards enquiry on labour.
― Paperbag raita (ledge), Friday, 28 February 2020 17:30 (four years ago) link
As in "in a fix" = having problems?
― fetter, Friday, 28 February 2020 17:33 (four years ago) link
yep. brought to my attention by a line in a children's book, "I'll sort your monster fix".
― Paperbag raita (ledge), Friday, 28 February 2020 18:10 (four years ago) link
I thought it was "bottle and glass" = arse (it works in a Cockney accent), so losing your bottle means to shit yourself?
― Load up your rubber wallets (Tom D.), Friday, 28 February 2020 18:17 (four years ago) link
funky
― romanesque architect (pomenitul), Friday, 28 February 2020 18:19 (four years ago) link
contranym
― reggie (qualmsley), Friday, 28 February 2020 18:19 (four years ago) link
― Fizzles, Friday, 28 February 2020 19:59 (four years ago) link
OP otm
― Something Super Stupid Cupid (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 29 February 2020 05:30 (four years ago) link
Missing from this list afaict: ravel
― Something Super Stupid Cupid (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 29 February 2020 05:33 (four years ago) link
sick
― Lee626, Saturday, 29 February 2020 13:02 (four years ago) link
"drop" (to release to the public) vs. "drop" (to remove/discontinue)
Sony Drops ‘Uncharted’ Movie 😃..............From 2017 Release Schedule 😢New Mutants And Mulan Dropped 😃..............From Release Schedule Due To Coronavirus 😢
― unregistered, Sunday, 22 March 2020 19:19 (four years ago) link
sound
― budo jeru, Sunday, 22 March 2020 19:34 (four years ago) link
string
― budo jeru, Saturday, 28 March 2020 19:19 (four years ago) link
― budo jeru, Thursday, 12 November 2020 21:21 (three years ago) link
nice one!
― the unappreciated charisma of cows (Aimless), Thursday, 12 November 2020 21:25 (three years ago) link
then again, if you’d change the lyrics of the Kansas hit to “all we do is dust in the wind”, it wouldn’t change the meaning of the song at all
― kiss some penis reference (breastcrawl), Saturday, 14 November 2020 09:59 (three years ago) link
gallant
― Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Saturday, 14 November 2020 11:47 (three years ago) link
previously meant “sexually forward” i.e. a man motivated by trying to get into ladies’ knickers and was basically negativethen became a bit of a catch-all for “courageous”, not just in carnal mattersthen the honorable side of courage rubbed off on it, but the previous association with behaviour towards women remained, so magically “gallant” now means “chivalrous” - previously its exact antonym!
― Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Saturday, 14 November 2020 11:55 (three years ago) link
Same etymon as 'well' (e.g. 'well-being') and the Gallo-Roman 'walare', which meant 'to chill' (figuratively, that is). The ancestors had their priorities straight.
― pomenitul, Saturday, 14 November 2020 13:20 (three years ago) link
Along the same lines: 'to host' could also mean 'to lodge at an inn' back in the day. Its ambiguity subsists in the French 'hôte', which denotes both guest and host depending on the context. Nor is a host in the military sense a welcome guest in most cases, but it's not an exact antonym either.
― pomenitul, Saturday, 14 November 2020 13:24 (three years ago) link
Speaking of French, it also features a number of spectacular diachronic reversals: 'rem' (Latin accusative of 'res', i.e. 'thing') eventually became 'rien' (nothing).
From most to least obsolete, the nouns 'mie' (the soft part of bread), 'goutte' (drop (of liquid)), 'point' (self-explanatory) and 'pas' (step) double as adverbs that mean 'not' (e.g. 'je (ne) peux pas'). Presumably 'ne' or 'n'' on their own (as in 'on n'y voit goutte') are too puny to bear the mighty weight of negation.
― pomenitul, Saturday, 14 November 2020 13:40 (three years ago) link
fain
― Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Friday, 2 April 2021 20:28 (three years ago) link
Definition of fain (Entry 1 of 2)1a : WILLINGhe was very fain, for the young widow was "altogether fair and lovely … "— Amy Kellyb : being obliged or constrained : COMPELLEDGreat Britain was fain to devote its whole energy … to the business of slaying and being slain— G. M. Trevelyan
"performative" seems to have developed a couple of almost opposite meanings, not sure which definition came first
― nothing (Left), Friday, 2 April 2021 20:38 (three years ago) link
also: communism (no state vs supreme state)
― nothing (Left), Friday, 2 April 2021 20:43 (three years ago) link
nonplussed
(contradictory usage if not actual meaning but it ain't going away.)
― Noel Emits, Saturday, 3 April 2021 00:32 (three years ago) link
Karen
― longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Sunday, 4 April 2021 03:33 (three years ago) link
I was reminded of this thread by an advert for a furniture store which uses Marvin Gaye & Tammi Terrell's "Ain't Nothing Like the Real Thing" as its soundtrack. Are they able to give those massive discounts they're always telling us about because their stuff is just cheap tat?
― Duncan Disorderly (Tom D.), Sunday, 4 April 2021 13:28 (three years ago) link
"fellow children" because sometimes it means you are a child and sometimes is means you are in fact masquerading as a child
― your own personal qanon (darraghmac), Sunday, 4 April 2021 14:26 (three years ago) link
spare:
being in excess of present need; free for other use: spare time.
frugally restricted or meager, as a manner of living or a diet: a spare regime.
― koogs, Wednesday, 21 April 2021 03:00 (three years ago) link
Yeah that's good!
― Li'l Brexit (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 21 April 2021 08:54 (three years ago) link
Beheaded
― Pfizer the pharma chip (wins), Saturday, 22 May 2021 11:38 (two years ago) link
am i understanding these definitions correctly? 1 and 2 are opposite, no? even the “or” in 1b seems to point the two options in opposite directionsnoesis1 : purely intellectual apprehension:a Platonism : the highest kind of knowledge or knowledge of the eternal forms or ideas —contrasted with dianoiab in Husserl : the subjective aspect of or the act in an intentional experience —distinguished from noema2 : cognition especially when occurring through direct knowledge
― Tracer Hand, Sunday, 5 June 2022 15:29 (one year ago) link
Handicap, as it applies in golf. Perhaps not contradictory but counter-intuitive
"Dust" is my favourite in this thread. Imagine that when it was time to do the sweeping you'd say "can you dirt the floor today please"
― a legible shriek (flamboyant goon tie included), Sunday, 5 June 2022 15:50 (one year ago) link
classic Amelia Bedelia scene depending on that one iirc
― Tracer Hand, Sunday, 5 June 2022 16:15 (one year ago) link
Hahahah
― a legible shriek (flamboyant goon tie included), Sunday, 5 June 2022 16:19 (one year ago) link
“the goat”
― Tracer Hand, Saturday, 26 November 2022 23:05 (one year ago) link
Ha, yes! Took me ages to figure out this new meaning, scratched my head many times on the way
― The Dark End of the Tweet (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 26 November 2022 23:28 (one year ago) link
― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, November 28, 2018 7:51 AM (four years ago) bookmarkflaglink
― budo jeru, Tuesday, 14 November 2023 23:43 (five months ago) link
Off: turn off, set off (e.g. a fire alarm)
― organ doner (ledge), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 08:31 (five months ago) link
“turn” and “set” are different words
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 09:20 (five months ago) link
they're not the word in question.
― organ doner (ledge), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 09:29 (five months ago) link
well then you could say anything is contradictory! the word “turn” - turn up vs turn down etc
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 09:40 (five months ago) link
typcially to put something in an 'off' state - turn off, switch off - is to disable it or stop it. in some cases - set off, kick off - it can mean to enable or start. ok strictly speaking it's the phrase as a whole which has the meaning, nevertheless i find it curious and amusing that 'off' can be used in this way.
― organ doner (ledge), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 09:46 (five months ago) link
i think "off" in that second group is working more as "free" or "release" or "unleash". i agree that it's doing something different to turning off a switch
― Tyler Perry's Cystitis (Noodle Vague), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 09:54 (five months ago) link
let's set off the fire extinguisher! no, turn it off, turn it off!
― organ doner (ledge), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 09:55 (five months ago) link
Fuck off
― Boris Yitsbin (wins), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 09:56 (five months ago) link
Not really just seemed like the thing to say
to ask someone to fuck off is not necessarily the same as wishing them to be fucked off
― close encounters of the third knid (darraghmac), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 09:58 (five months ago) link
fuck away
no, it's not quite the same
― Tyler Perry's Cystitis (Noodle Vague), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 09:59 (five months ago) link
fuck off the pain
The phrase “if not” in constructions like “it was a piece of showmanship worthy of Gaz Coombes, if not Hitler” is used to mean two basically contradictory things (“although not Hitler” vs “and even Hitler”)
― Boris Yitsbin (wins), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 10:07 (five months ago) link
Is that a reference to the Suella Braverman resignation letter?
― The First Time Ever I Saw Gervais (Tom D.), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 10:10 (five months ago) link
i don't think this is a contradiction exactly, it's more like the establishment of a continuum without locating a specific place on the continuum
viz it's contradctory to say "i was in london and also i was in glasgow" but it's not contradictory to say "i was on the london-glasgow train" -- “it was a piece of showmanship worthy of Gaz Coombes, if not Hitler” is a way of saying "i was on the coombes-hitler train": you're indicating an evolution and a direction but not a distance
― mark s, Wednesday, 15 November 2023 10:40 (five months ago) link
in a sense are we not all on the coombes-hitler train ?
― mark s, Wednesday, 15 November 2023 10:41 (five months ago) link
I'll be in the Quiet coach.
― The First Time Ever I Saw Gervais (Tom D.), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 11:07 (five months ago) link
i agree with the wins offering of if not as used
― close encounters of the third knid (darraghmac), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 11:42 (five months ago) link
OK how about this:the alarm's going offvsthe television's going off (till you've done your homework)
― organ doner (ledge), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 13:43 (five months ago) link
the yoghurts going off
― close encounters of the third knid (darraghmac), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 14:09 (five months ago) link
Hmm. I guess that to go off might mean lots of activity (go off on a tangent) or no activity (go off line) or unexpected activity (go off script) or unpleasant activity (go off on someone).
But these are set phrases, not sure that's the same thing as a word that might function as its own antonym.
― don't let days go by, Listerine (Ye Mad Puffin), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 14:16 (five months ago) link
https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=go+off+queen
― mark s, Wednesday, 15 November 2023 14:17 (five months ago) link
Or go off your meds, which means to not take them, or go off message, which means to lose discipline. Go off queen is more like "lose control but in a good way."
― don't let days go by, Listerine (Ye Mad Puffin), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 14:19 (five months ago) link
as far as I'm concerned phrases are words and I think at least some linguists would back me up on this
― Left, Wednesday, 15 November 2023 14:19 (five months ago) link
these days when kids say bad they mean good
― Left, Wednesday, 15 November 2023 14:20 (five months ago) link
Lexemes, speech acts, sure (xp)
― don't let days go by, Listerine (Ye Mad Puffin), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 14:22 (five months ago) link
Egregious
― The narrative of arthur gordon pimp of nantucket (Bananaman Begins), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 15:59 (five months ago) link
Also, lol: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nonce
― The narrative of arthur gordon pimp of nantucket (Bananaman Begins), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 16:00 (five months ago) link
Depends on what kind of phrase you are talking about. Phrasal verbs are pretty wordlike but they still have syntactic qualities most English words do not. Idiomatic phrases are even less wordlike (there is the non-compositional model of idiom processing that you could say treats them like words but it has problems and probably isn't right). The real question is do our explicit categories of "word" and "phrase" map onto how our brain processes language? A heavily analytic language like English is very misleading here... these categories may not exist at all.
In the last few comments, people are mixing phrasal verbs with non-phrasal ones which I would say is non-contradictory. "go off" (explode, rant freely) vs "go off script" are not parsed the same way by your brain. "go off" is a phrasal verb (verb + preposition, meaning cannot be determined by normal processing... you just have to learn what it means), while "go off script" is a verb + adjectival/adverbial phrase, not a phrasal verb. Same with "the alarm is going off" (phrasal verb) vs "the TV's going off" (verb + adjectival/adverbial phrase). Phrasal verbs can have multiple meanings, which I guess you could call homonyms in some sense ("the alarm is going off" and "the yogurt is going off"). Some of these can be contradictory... that gets you closer to what I'd call a contranymal phrase (a phrasal form of a contranym like cleave).
Apparent contradiction against the backdrop of general understanding is a hint you are experiencing the concinnity of human language.
― the absence of bikes (f. hazel), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 17:25 (five months ago) link
It doesn't exactly fit with the thread, but the word "lucubration" does not mean anything like it sounds.
― immodesty blaise (jimbeaux), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 18:45 (five months ago) link
The concinnity of the bells, bells, bells
― don't let days go by, Listerine (Ye Mad Puffin), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 19:16 (five months ago) link
Some excellent work itt! Re Coombes Hitler train: contradictory may not be exactly right but the not specifying the place on the continuum can create an ambiguity in scenarios where the distance between the different potential spots is particularly meaningful — ok this might not apply so much to my own example but in other casesWriters will often throw in a quite to remove this ambiguity: “if not quite Hitler” unlikely to be understood as “maybe even quite Hitler”
― Boris Yitsbin (wins), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 20:14 (five months ago) link
?!
― close encounters of the third knid (darraghmac), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 20:22 (five months ago) link
seeing as you've mentioned "quite"... that means both "completely" and "partially"
― koogs, Wednesday, 15 November 2023 20:30 (five months ago) link
No the interrobang doesn’t have contradictory meanings it has complementary meanings
― Boris Yitsbin (wins), Wednesday, 15 November 2023 20:30 (five months ago) link
(quite is mentioned at length. i did search, but forgot about the fold...)
― koogs, Wednesday, 15 November 2023 20:32 (five months ago) link
pretty baffling revive if you ask me, and normally i like this kind of thing
― budo jeru, Thursday, 16 November 2023 14:25 (five months ago) link
Agree, budo. Nothing will ever top "cleave," and it's weird that anyone thinks we will somehow come up with startling new examples after hundreds of years of talking about this.
"Bad" meaning "good" or "sick" meaning "cool" are a different phenomenon.
Even "ass" as an all-purpose intensifier has already been discussed plenty. Big-ass, piece of ass, half-assed, it's all been unpacked before. Did we really think we were going to come up with a new example?
― don't let days go by, Listerine (Ye Mad Puffin), Thursday, 16 November 2023 14:44 (five months ago) link
sad to see an ilx thread flogging a dead horse
― Tyler Perry's Cystitis (Noodle Vague), Thursday, 16 November 2023 14:47 (five months ago) link
Old ilx: takes aim at side of barn, scores direct hit
Nu ilx: well, are we SURE the horse is really dead/most sincerely dead? Maybe a bit more flogging just to be sure.
Future ilx: lame injoke #35, followed closely by injoke #56
― don't let days go by, Listerine (Ye Mad Puffin), Thursday, 16 November 2023 15:01 (five months ago) link
I guess all the horses had it coming
― Left, Thursday, 16 November 2023 15:16 (five months ago) link
― budo jeru, Thursday, 16 November 2023 14:25 bookmarkflaglink
????
eleven months pass...contemporary!
― budo jeru, Tuesday, 14 November 2023 23:43 bookmarkflaglink
― Colonel Poo, Thursday, 16 November 2023 15:27 (five months ago) link
I appreciate the linguistic knowledge upthread- i was thinking mainly of german compound noun-phrases where what would be considered phrases in english turn up "those crazy germans have a long word for everything" type articles because the parts don't have spaces but that's just one specific type of phrase/word
― Left, Thursday, 16 November 2023 15:29 (five months ago) link
@ CP, i meant the subsequent discussion. obviously my revive proper was immaculate
― budo jeru, Thursday, 16 November 2023 16:40 (five months ago) link
riffing on language, what is this web site coming to
― the absence of bikes (f. hazel), Thursday, 16 November 2023 17:08 (five months ago) link
heaven forbid we should discuss things that were long ago settled by the ancients.
― organ doner (ledge), Thursday, 16 November 2023 17:50 (five months ago) link
“downhill” is a weird one.. when people say “it was all downhill from there” they mean it got worse and worse from that point. so if you wanted to say the opposite you’d say “it was all uphill from there” but that implies effort and discomfort. uphill is hard! downhill is easy!
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Sunday, 19 November 2023 16:03 (five months ago) link
it's just really annoying when the boulder starts rolling back down again
― Left, Sunday, 19 November 2023 16:11 (five months ago) link
well the word downhill hasnt changed meaning and i do think this is a case where the phrase is going to be highly contextualised
i enforce all downhill from here as a positive statement at work and i threaten sanctions if anyone objects
― close encounters of the third knid (darraghmac), Sunday, 19 November 2023 16:38 (five months ago) link
i think about this every time and i think a lot of other people must, too. it's amazing the phrase has lasted so long. whoever started it must have lived somewhere with a very steep, dangerous hill
― i really like that!! (z_tbd), Sunday, 19 November 2023 17:46 (five months ago) link
Meanwhile Midwestern Americans are like, "What's a hill?"
― Oh I believe in Yetis' Day (Ye Mad Puffin), Sunday, 19 November 2023 17:53 (five months ago) link
Same with Floridians.
My friend got an 18 speed bike growing up and all his friends said "the fuck you need that for?"
― a very very unfair (Neanderthal), Sunday, 19 November 2023 17:57 (five months ago) link
I'd parse "it's all downhill from here" when used as a negative statement as meaning "the endeavor/business/artist has achieved their peak ability/quality/performance and aren't going to do better"... it's not a measure of effort, but quality
― the absence of bikes (f. hazel), Sunday, 19 November 2023 19:27 (five months ago) link
Downhill is worse on your knees
But better overall when it comes to rolling shit somewhere
― meaner stinks meat bake it cone (flamboyant goon tie included), Sunday, 19 November 2023 20:39 (five months ago) link
it's like "i'm feeling a bit below par", well that's good right? i mean in golf and all...
― fetter, Sunday, 19 November 2023 21:34 (five months ago) link
in golf yes in many other usages its rather a target to attain tbf
― close encounters of the third knid (darraghmac), Sunday, 19 November 2023 22:43 (five months ago) link
downhill as a positive description has had a renaissance in team sports esp American football when players are described as "downhill runners" like they run with momentum and speed as if they are going downhill
― Lavator Shemmelpennick, Sunday, 19 November 2023 23:01 (five months ago) link
From ILM:Vince Guaraldi - A Charlie Brown Christmas: You cannot fuck with this album
The sentiment would be the same if it were:Vince Guaraldi - A Charlie Brown Christmas: You MUST fuck with this album
― Philip Nunez, Tuesday, 21 November 2023 16:18 (five months ago) link
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Sunday, 17 December 2023 10:15 (four months ago) link
"favours" eg If someone favours a certain pen they own, that would mean they use it a lot. But if an athlete seems to be favouring her left leg it means she's using it as little as she can
I thought favouring a limb meant using it more because the other one is injured?
― Honnest Brish Face (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 17 December 2023 10:58 (four months ago) link
It does... doesn't it?
― Free Ass Ange (Tom D.), Sunday, 17 December 2023 11:03 (four months ago) link
haha maybe i have always used this wrong
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Sunday, 17 December 2023 11:08 (four months ago) link
historically it has meant what tracer says: that e.g. you protect ("favour") the injured leg by using it less -- favour as in you're being kind to it
however the apparent contradiction tracer highlights means that modern usage has become pretty confused = you protect the injured leg by using ("favouring") the other one more -- favour as in you prefer to put weight on it
― mark s, Sunday, 17 December 2023 11:10 (four months ago) link
yeah i don’t have any memory of it being used that way but no doubt today’s simpletons LIKE TOM D AND NV have once again ruined language for everyone
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Sunday, 17 December 2023 11:12 (four months ago) link
every good leg deserves favour
― mark s, Sunday, 17 December 2023 11:13 (four months ago) link
time wounds all heels as the great man once said
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Sunday, 17 December 2023 11:14 (four months ago) link
words mean exactly what I intend them to mean
― Honnest Brish Face (Noodle Vague), Sunday, 17 December 2023 12:05 (four months ago) link
that's just mean
― StanM, Sunday, 17 December 2023 12:15 (four months ago) link
it's the mean but it's not necessarily just
― Left, Sunday, 17 December 2023 15:06 (four months ago) link
resisting the urge to soapbox on "performative" again because social media has made it way too hard to use the word in a meaningful way without having to redefine it first
like I *wish* gender was just shallow surface posturing in the same vein as a brand's newfound wokeness. maybe it is that kind of thing just done really hard for thousands of years
― Left, Sunday, 17 December 2023 15:23 (four months ago) link
I didn't resist that hard
― Left, Sunday, 17 December 2023 15:24 (four months ago) link
drawing the curtains = opening or closing them. Dickens uses "undraw" for open, but I'm guessing that's obsolete everywhere, right?
― fetter, Monday, 18 December 2023 21:47 (four months ago) link
“fast” is a great onethe lex otm, tuomas offtm
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Thursday, 21 December 2023 17:39 (four months ago) link
milk carton otms
― Ghidorah, the three-headed Explorah (Neanderthal), Thursday, 21 December 2023 18:04 (four months ago) link
apparently
― immodesty blaise (jimbeaux), Friday, 22 December 2023 22:11 (four months ago) link
Probably been done upthread but (US) could care less = (UK) couldn't care less
― Zelda Zonk, Friday, 22 December 2023 22:19 (four months ago) link
"Could care less" is in colloquial use, but it's still "wrong."
― immodesty blaise (jimbeaux), Friday, 22 December 2023 22:22 (four months ago) link
i could have sworn i already posted this. maybe i did it in the wrong thread fml. French has a couple of these, sorta“pas terrible” - literally “not terrible” but actually means irredeemably bad“fais gaffe” - literally “make a mistake” but actually means watch out, be careful, mind your step
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 27 December 2023 15:59 (four months ago) link
i think the meaning of "pas terrible" is closer to "Well, it wasn't terrible, but it wasn't exactly great either"
as for "fais gaffe", perhaps it has something to do with the literal definition of "gaffe", since you are generally in an attentive state of mind when docking a boat with a boathook?
― budo jeru, Wednesday, 27 December 2023 17:37 (four months ago) link
well the way my family uses it, it means “VERY terrible” - it’s tremendously counterintuitive which is why i included it here
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 27 December 2023 17:40 (four months ago) link
ah this page explains it. “terrible” in the archaic sense of “terrific”. so “not great”https://www.thoughtco.com/ce-nest-pas-terrible-1371144so it serves for english too! i had to double check the full thread and i’m actually mildly surprised no one’s suggested it yet. “terrible” = 1) quite bad 2) terrific
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 27 December 2023 17:47 (four months ago) link
I've definitely heard 'terrible' used to mean 'fantastic' in French. An uncle of mine (who is admittedly in his 80s) uses it that way.
― Zelda Zonk, Wednesday, 27 December 2023 21:35 (four months ago) link
yeah i feel like i've heard "terriblement" too like eg darling, would you mind terribly if i stayed the night with joan? i'd be ever so grateful for it
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 27 December 2023 22:46 (four months ago) link
Captain Terrible and the Brown Dirt Cowboy
― Ghidorah, the three-headed Explorah (Neanderthal), Thursday, 28 December 2023 00:47 (four months ago) link
good one, Tracer
― budo jeru, Thursday, 28 December 2023 01:25 (four months ago) link
not quite opposites but:https://i.redd.it/e8cjmmi3cwl21.jpg
― Philip Nunez, Friday, 29 December 2023 17:44 (four months ago) link
applause
― brimstead, Friday, 29 December 2023 18:17 (four months ago) link
Garbage man vs. garbage person
― CthulhuLululemon (Ye Mad Puffin), Friday, 29 December 2023 18:53 (four months ago) link
xp amazing!
― budo jeru, Friday, 29 December 2023 20:07 (four months ago) link
the "terribly" thing has echoes in English I think, eg "She's terribly educated" vs "She was terribly educated"..?
― fetter, Friday, 29 December 2023 20:29 (four months ago) link
yes i think thats right
― close encounters of the third knid (darraghmac), Friday, 29 December 2023 20:36 (four months ago) link
teddibly
― immodesty blaise (jimbeaux), Friday, 29 December 2023 20:54 (four months ago) link
“peak”
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Monday, 22 April 2024 20:05 (one week ago) link
i need you to explain that one
― budo jeru, Monday, 22 April 2024 22:41 (one week ago) link
Peak means bad in British slang (I had to look that up)
― Josefa, Monday, 22 April 2024 23:08 (one week ago) link
no wonder coppers knew the Peaky Blinders were bad guys
― ain't nothin but a brie thing, baby (Neanderthal), Tuesday, 23 April 2024 03:50 (one week ago) link
I was wondering the other day if there was any opposite slang (is there a grammatical term for this? bad = good etc) where a positive means a negative instead of the other way round.
"Peak", to become weak, thin, and sickly, first recorded 1500, origin uncertain. Usually used as an adjective these days, "you're looking a bit peaky". Wonder if thats where the slang came from or not.
― ledge, Tuesday, 23 April 2024 07:37 (one week ago) link
the grammatical term is pejoration
― budo jeru, Tuesday, 23 April 2024 14:45 (one week ago) link
at least in the direction of positive > negative
i just learned a good example yesterday: "clambake" used to mean a hip shindig, and Tommy Dorsey even had a jazz combo called the "Clambake Seven" -- but by the '50s "clambake" came to mean a difficult or unproductive jam session, and the word "clam" persists today among musicians as a term for a wrong note or blunder
― budo jeru, Tuesday, 23 April 2024 14:49 (one week ago) link
Never heard of it.
― Not waving but droning (Tom D.), Tuesday, 23 April 2024 15:21 (one week ago) link
In any case, slang words that mean the opposite of their standard meaning, no shortage of those.
― Not waving but droning (Tom D.), Tuesday, 23 April 2024 15:24 (one week ago) link
well with the slang word peak I think it actually evolved from meaning "intensely amazing" - like a peak experience - and then pivoted to meaning "intensely bad" - like in both cases it means "super intense" but just slipped from good to bad
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, 23 April 2024 15:33 (one week ago) link
― Not waving but droning (Tom D.), Tuesday, April 23, 2024 10:24 AM (twelve minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink
obviously. but it would be more fun if you listed your favorite examples
― budo jeru, Tuesday, 23 April 2024 15:37 (one week ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yw1ZhGBDICI
― Pierre Delecto, Tuesday, 23 April 2024 15:41 (one week ago) link
It seems very rare now but "stupid" used to mean amazing in the '90s, I guess it evolved from "stupid fresh"
― Josefa, Tuesday, 23 April 2024 16:01 (one week ago) link
> Tommy Dorsey even had a jazz combo called the "Clambake Seven"
i think you're missing a more obvious clambake, the elvis waterskiing film
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clambake_(film)
― koogs, Tuesday, 23 April 2024 16:57 (one week ago) link
(oh, i put it in url tags to avoid the famous ends-in-a-) bug and it did the exact same thing anyway)
Click-me-do
― koogs, Tuesday, 23 April 2024 16:58 (one week ago) link
"peak" in contemp UK slang is closer to bad luck or tough shit, I think: That's peak (for you). certainly the way my kids use it. makes me think of pique.
― fetter, Tuesday, 23 April 2024 18:32 (one week ago) link
So “peak” is the equivalent of how very old Americans say “Doesn’t that beat all!”
― Josefa, Tuesday, 23 April 2024 18:44 (one week ago) link
xpost yeah mine too. but i think it started out as something more intense like whoa fuck, worst moment ever
― Humanitarian Pause (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, 23 April 2024 18:50 (one week ago) link
Cacaphemism is reverse euphemism m, like referring to your spouse as the ol' ball and chain or your car as a jalopy
― alpaca lips now (Ye Mad Puffin), Wednesday, 24 April 2024 22:56 (one week ago) link