Has ILE become too pally?

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When one wanders into an internet community for the first time, as with a party in real life really, more self-conscious types (eg ME) tend to think that everyone knows each other and aren't interested in talking to new people. In fact, they're all usually sitting there thinking "I wish those people over there would come and talk to me - I'm bored".

I am often wary of referring to people on ILE / talking about ILE too much cause it reinforces that image. Some days it's all just in jokes and not talking about things in the open ended ways that made the community thrive in the first place. It's NOT a clique, but it's important maybe to bear in mind that it would look that way to newcomers.

Do you worry about this kind of thing?

― N., Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

yes, and then i think that no - one would really give a dman if i didn't post for a few months...

it sometimes makes me feel as if I'm back in highschool, trying to fit in again...

but a lot of that is my own headspace, sooooo...

― Queen G, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Well, I am a newcomer (though not to some of you.) And I like gatecrashing cliques :)

― Archel, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I tend to think people take no notice of what I post (and I am not well-liked), I certainly don't feel like a part of any clique. So I'm not really very concious of that when I am posting things to ILE.

― Nicole, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

ideally it's a mix of both. It's obvious (even usually from the title) which threads are kind of serious mided forums where people are exchanging opinions and which ones are cliquey gets talking in code.

Both are fun in their own way and surely one leads to the other, for the uninitiated.

But somedays it is a bit bobbins. Just like real life

― misterjones, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I guess it's some kind of evolutionary thing where only people who aren't too shy or whatever will ever get noticed, which allows for the possibility of lots of nice people never being found. but fuck it I don't know what I'm missing do I, so I can't really worry about it. even the in-jokes are picked up quite quickly.

But I mean even answering this now I'm thinking should I add some sort of disclaimer so people don't read it and go "what's HE talking about our ILE for".

― Ronan, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Oh, totally. * winks *

― Tracer hand, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Yes, now fcuk off, "pal".

― Sarah, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

sniffle

― Ronan, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I'm doing my best to be rude to Nick as much as possible Does that count.

― Pete, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

No, it just shows you secretly want to kiss me. Now go away.

― N., Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I didn't think that was a secret.

― Dan Perry, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I didn't know. Pucker up then Dastoor. No tongues though.

― Pete, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I tend to think people take no notice of what I post (and I am not well-liked)

*insert protestion to the contrary and annoyance that anyone would think such a thing about you here*

― Ned Raggett, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I am still nice to her, but all I get back is abuse.

― N., Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

[ie. she is my ideal woman]

― N., Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Ptee is your ideal woman? Oh Nick... *pats N. sympathetically on the back, then gives him a cookie*

― Dan Perry, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Should be 'protestation' rather than 'protestion,' shouldn't it? Although I like the economy of the latter.

― Ned Raggett, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I don't like this message board because I am not popular. I don't like anywhere if I am not going to be popular.

― Mandee, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

But you are popular! Um, whoever you are.

― Ned Raggett, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Ned, I'm just the geeky girl you are trying to make feel WELCOME.. it's obvious you really hate me!

― Mandee, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Well that wasn't very nice, Mr. Nicest Poster on ILE. It doesn't take a Playboy spread to get your crown revoked, you know.

― Tracer Hand, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

But hey, don't let that stop you.

― Tracer Hand, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Sorry Mandee, I just realized I'm guilty of exactly the "pally" behavior being decried in the question. If it makes you feel any better, yes, I totally hate you, but it's only because you're popular :P

― Tracer Hand, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I do *not* hate Mandee at all, and Tracer Hand is a poopie-head. Hmph. To Mandee = based on yer various posts so far, you are cool. :-) Talk more, I say!

― Ned Raggett, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I like Mandee, but then I'm not popular either. I would be in the ile a/v club.

― Nicole, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

*insert protestion to the contrary and annoyance that anyone would think such a thing about you here*

I wasn't talking about you, but I did get schooled about some other people...

― Nicole, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I would be in the ile a/v club.

I was sorta in that by default in high school. Never formally so, but I was the one bringing the Monty Python tapes to watch.

― Ned Raggett, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

I was in the AV club in high school, but at least for a while that's where the handful of punk rockers hung out, so for me it was the coolest.

― Sean, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Ned - should be protest, not protestation. Protestation in this sense according to Webster is rare. But protestion is not a word. ;-)

― Ron, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Do you not know the power of neologisms? Hmf!

― Ned Raggett, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

you go head wit you word-inventin' self! I only commented because when I first read your initial post I thought 'hmm, is that even a word?' and looked it up. then saw your second comment so thought I'd throw my two cents in since I'd been to the dict.

On the topic, I'm afraid everyone will hate me forever because I tried to defend Sting on ILM.

― Ron, Friday, 22 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

Don't be melodramatic, Ron. Most of us do plan to forgive you before hell freezes over.

― Tim, Saturday, 23 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

phew!

― Ron, Saturday, 23 March 2002 01:00 (twenty-two years ago) link

ten months pass...

I think ILE has definitely got too meta and injokey of late.

― N. (nickdastoor), Saturday, 25 January 2003 17:48 (twenty-one years ago) link

Maybe adding stuff to the FAQ might help? If newcomers don't look at the FAQ then they can't really complain....

― MarkH (MarkH), Saturday, 25 January 2003 17:51 (twenty-one years ago) link

Yeah, I'm inclined to agree. It's the multiple joke versions of threads that I dislike really.

― Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Saturday, 25 January 2003 17:52 (twenty-one years ago) link

I liked your general injoke laden joke, sorry I realise that's an injoke now. I'm unsure if ILE has been meta or injokey, to be honest the old threads keep coming up and I read the sort of comic ping pong of funny posts and think that ILE has become less cliquey in the sense that now threads derail a bit less often. Is this my imagination?

― Ronan (Ronan), Saturday, 25 January 2003 17:52 (twenty-one years ago) link

Yeah Martin, sorry about the Charmin one. Though I think one every so often is good and it was funny once and once only to have a million off one thread.

― N. (nickdastoor), Saturday, 25 January 2003 17:54 (twenty-one years ago) link

but N you're the one who is mainly responsible for the injokes and stuff?

― gareth (gareth), Saturday, 25 January 2003 18:23 (twenty-one years ago) link

It's the multiple joke versions of threads that I dislike really.

It's probably hypocritical for me to talk about annoying things, but the multiple joke versions of threads are intensely annoying.

― Nicole (Nicole), Saturday, 25 January 2003 18:30 (twenty-one years ago) link

thirded, but whatever floats yr boat. let people have their fun - although i didn't read any of them, it looked like this latest round had many threads with quite a few answers.

― ron (ron), Saturday, 25 January 2003 18:51 (twenty-one years ago) link

this injokiness is inevitable. live with it.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Saturday, 25 January 2003 18:53 (twenty-one years ago) link

that's your answer to everything.

― Ronan (Ronan), Saturday, 25 January 2003 18:58 (twenty-one years ago) link

yes.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Saturday, 25 January 2003 18:59 (twenty-one years ago) link

Gareth that's just not true.

― N. (nickdastoor), Saturday, 25 January 2003 20:13 (twenty-one years ago) link

five months pass...

Tonight, I feel totally out of it, for example. Maybe because I've been playing Age of Sodding Empires II all night but still, I look at at, and it's like a chatroom.

― N. (nickdastoor), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 00:15 (twenty years ago) link

It has gotten like that on certain threads.

― Lars (Nicole), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 00:23 (twenty years ago) link

They're just back and forth joshing one-line posts between a few people for the entire thread. On questions that looked interesting. Ah well - I know hw easy it is to get into that mindset. It'll pass, I guess.

― N. (nickdastoor), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 00:30 (twenty years ago) link

ILX goes through good spells and meh spells, I suspect another meh spell is in effect right now.

― Lars (Nicole), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 00:34 (twenty years ago) link

Mostly it goes through people-bitching-about-X and people-bitching-about-Y spells, but it's always something.

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 00:43 (twenty years ago) link

But Nick, aren't you totally like the innest-of-the-in crowd in your ILX locale? I've always thought so, w/ the way some of the international ILX superstahs always flirt w/ you. U have nothing to complain about!

― Vic (Vic), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 00:45 (twenty years ago) link

It's post big FAP. I actually know some of these people now.

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 00:49 (twenty years ago) link

Yeah, like half the posts I read I now have voices and faces to associate with, it's very strange

― Millar (Millar), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 01:16 (twenty years ago) link

Millar made fun of my haircut when he met me for the first time.

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 01:22 (twenty years ago) link

And he said my voice was deeper than he thought it would be. I mean, what the hell?

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 01:26 (twenty years ago) link

that means he's attracted to you that much more, as you remind him of areal military mang

― Vic (Vic), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 01:32 (twenty years ago) link

Shh don't tell!

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 01:36 (twenty years ago) link

Millar: how would you rate Tracer's handshake?

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 01:37 (twenty years ago) link

That's cos you're so imposing in real life, Tracer. I mean, the glowing shirt.

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 01:38 (twenty years ago) link

I made fun of your haircut? That's absurd! I never make fun of anybody's appearance when I first meet them. Andrew can tell you.

― Millar (Millar), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 01:42 (twenty years ago) link

palliness taking over the 'too pally' thread! classic

― ron (ron), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 01:46 (twenty years ago) link

Let me testify for a minute: I met two people over the last fortnight that I feel I've known my whole fucking life. This doesn't happen to me too often, so I'll continue to be a bit giddy for a while. Allright?

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 01:54 (twenty years ago) link

YOU TELL 'EM PREACHERMAN!

(unless you're talking about someone besides me, then I hate you)

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 02:00 (twenty years ago) link

He must have meant me!

― luna (luna.c), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 02:03 (twenty years ago) link

i honestly meant 'classic' :)

― ron (ron), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 02:03 (twenty years ago) link

I think the inside jokes and pally-ness are not a big deal. I think if anybody really wanted to really join the group, I don't think it would be a very rough hazing process.

― Scaredy Cat, Wednesday, 16 July 2003 02:19 (twenty years ago) link

jfgkjfyyyyytygjl,m

― RJG (RJG), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 02:21 (twenty years ago) link

this isn't just a matter of what happens on threads but what kinds of threads there are. it seems like for days at a time every single active thread is jokey and hermetic.

― Josh (Josh), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 02:29 (twenty years ago) link

I offer the same advice as usual: start a thread on what you want to talk about and see what happens. I don't think people generally barge in on serious political threads or advice threads or what have you--generally!--and start posting cock jokes or whatever. I could be wrong, I pay no attention to anything anymore.

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 02:41 (twenty years ago) link

this place is so high school

― James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 02:43 (twenty years ago) link

'why don't you post the threads you want' only works when the place isn't so totally overwhelmed.

― Josh (Josh), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 02:46 (twenty years ago) link

Josh has a point

― James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 02:47 (twenty years ago) link

it seems like for days at a time every single active thread is jokey and hermetic.

and sometimes i saty away from the board for days at a time. coincidence?

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 02:47 (twenty years ago) link

stay

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 02:48 (twenty years ago) link

There are so many threads it is easy for the good ones to get overwhelmed.

― Lars (Nicole), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 02:48 (twenty years ago) link

low-traffic threads take what, maybe two days tops to slip off the new answers page?

― Josh (Josh), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 02:52 (twenty years ago) link

And you imagine bitching about it will do... what again?

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:03 (twenty years ago) link

But that's more # of threads than what is contained within any given thread...

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:05 (twenty years ago) link

If you guys think it's bad here, try some Usenet groups for a while. You'll cry at the stupidity and be glad to come back here. My boyfriend uses webforums too, but they're 3d design ones, and overrun with young kids making stupid poo jokes and the like. He marvels all the time at the level of intelligence on this beeyotch - cock jokes and all.

Just a perspective from a (relative) newbie here... :)

― Trayce (trayce), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:11 (twenty years ago) link

If you guys think it's bad here, try some Usenet groups for a while.

alt.music.alternative veterans from the 1990s to thread!

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:13 (twenty years ago) link

Except for the absence of a basement dwelling crank it's not all that different.

― Larcole (Nicole), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:15 (twenty years ago) link

i imagine bitching about it will do nothing but fill up the internet with more worthless crap. i am trying to fit in man don't hassle me.

― Josh (Josh), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:17 (twenty years ago) link

Somehow I sense a demon has been invoked.

― Not Anything To Do With G*****a B*b (Ned), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:18 (twenty years ago) link

I think Josh has a valid point, I don't see what sniping at him accomplishes either.

― Larcole (Nicole), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:19 (twenty years ago) link

Hahaha this thread is totally populated by old Usenet jerkoffs right now, I just realized that! OUR COMPLAINTS ARE IMMOBILE.

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:22 (twenty years ago) link

old Usenet jerkoffs right now

Ha, my name on several other boards is "jerkoff". I'm quite honest.

― Scaredy Cat, Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:24 (twenty years ago) link

old usenet jerkoffs who fled usenet

― Josh (Josh), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:25 (twenty years ago) link

did we have graham build in escape pods to ilx or something cuz

― Josh (Josh), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:26 (twenty years ago) link

Josh you fool I'm one of the "old usenet jerkoffs", I wasn't excluding myself. I just find this hysterical! We all had this conversation 5 years ago!

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:28 (twenty years ago) link

And if we searched groups.google.com, oh the things that would be found...from all of us.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:31 (twenty years ago) link

from a post entitled "who's cuter, me or ned raggett?"

>I vote for Ned!
>
> yur high, dood. ml and ned are the ugliest fukkers ever. you have
> no taste.. now mention swag and andrew hyme and your in my klub....
>
> all you communyst drug fukers can suk my dik!
>
> kzk... in yo mama's hyney

Darling, sweetie, darling, this behavior of yours is SO gauche.

I have to vote for myself, since I'm such a rampant egomaniac, if you
recall that amusing post back in May. But we need Gregory Parks in
on this too.

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:33 (twenty years ago) link

I'm undetectable on Usenet and you fuckers are gonna keep it that way, got that straight?

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:33 (twenty years ago) link

*whistles oh so idly*

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:35 (twenty years ago) link

ally you fool i am well aware of which of us are old usenet jerkoffs!

― Josh (Josh), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:41 (twenty years ago) link

Josh you fool I just wanted to say fool! I wish more of the Usenet crew would show, like Ron Traino.

Has this thread become too old skool pally? Heavens!

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:43 (twenty years ago) link

I'm not undetectable on usenet. But the one group I still frequent relatively regularly has mercifully avoided most trolls, probably due to it being in the aus.* heirarchy rather than the alt.* one.

Mind you that argument doesn't work for aus.tv which has to be THE MOST inane, useless, irrelevant-to-its-charter NG I've ever read.

Damn, now I'm showing myself as an old usenet jerkoff ;) I just never went on a.m.a back in the day.

― Trayce (trayce), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:48 (twenty years ago) link

I don't know what the fuck anyone is talking about. anyone else?

― django (django), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:51 (twenty years ago) link

can you cuss on this thing?

― django (django), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:51 (twenty years ago) link

No. we now shun you.

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:51 (twenty years ago) link

damn! I was so close. I was even quoted once. Let me just get my hankerchief tied to stick and be on my was...Goodbye luna. Goodby Tracer. Good by Ned. And i'll miss you most of all Ally.

― django (django), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:54 (twenty years ago) link

..on my way, that should say on my way. can't i even have a dignified exit?

― django (django), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:55 (twenty years ago) link

Well that's a bit of a drama queen innit.

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:57 (twenty years ago) link

You're so English!

― Scaredy cat (Natola), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 03:59 (twenty years ago) link

Such wussbaggery. Beat him.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 04:00 (twenty years ago) link

*sneaks a banana peel under django's foot as they exit stage left*

― Trayce (trayce), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 04:01 (twenty years ago) link

this is just like High School!

― django (django), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 04:04 (twenty years ago) link

but django, I need you...

― luna (luna.c), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 04:06 (twenty years ago) link

luna, let's wait for the children to go to sleep, then we'll have our time.

― django (django), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 04:15 (twenty years ago) link

I'll be patient, but only because I have to.

― luna (luna.c), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 04:17 (twenty years ago) link

It is just like watching an episode of Friends but I don't give a shit. I just post my contribution and if it gets a response I feel honoured to be acknowledged by popular, beautiful people.

― kayT (kaytee), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 05:57 (twenty years ago) link

and unpopular ugly ones too!!

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 05:58 (twenty years ago) link

it is just like friends!

― James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 06:00 (twenty years ago) link

OK well anyway I have to say that reading threads from before my time, I really like it when they flow from interesting deep discussions to back-and-forth banter and back. I mean this is how actual conversations happen. This isn't how chat works, for the most part -- at least not group chat, which is hopelessly silly almost all the time.

But threads that are nothing but interesting deep discussions are just as dull as those that are just banter. (Neither are as dull as the ILM list threads, though.) Give me some ebb and flow and I am happy.

― Chris P (Chris P), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 06:23 (twenty years ago) link

Well said Chris :)

― Trayce (trayce), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 06:49 (twenty years ago) link

Yes, that's exactly how I feel about it too, Chris. It is pally here, but what's wrong with that? It's not as though it's some kind of exclusive club which is hostile to new people wanting to join - I found you all very, very welcoming when I arrived here, and in fact the friendly vibe of the place was one of the things which attracted me to it in the first place (along with the intelligence, the humour, the chickenbears etc)

I found the in-jokes and special ILX lingo slightly daunting to begin with, but I just lurked for a week or so to get the gist of it all before diving in. And I'm very glad I did :)

― C J (C J), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 06:57 (twenty years ago) link

ILX can be very pally definitely & is almost certainly daunting for new people. However, I kind of like it that way. Aslong as people keep meeting each other at FAPs it will remain so. You have to remember alot of people are actually real friends that post on the same board. I must admit, I never post any jokes on so called sensible threads. If I don't like a particular thread then I steer clear of it. There are certain threads where people have really got to me & upset me quite a bit, which, of course, shouldn't happen, but that's more to do with me. I find ILE a great source of amusement during the dull work hours that I have to endure, nothing more. I do not live my life by it & I can leave it anytime (I think) that I choose. I appreciate the advice that I am given should I request it & I try to offer any thoughts I may have that could possibly help someone else. I think the only way forward is that if you don't like it, then don't respond to a thread or indeed don't post here at all. This is not meant in a bitchy way, more of a stop moaning about it & change things (if you can) to make it what you want. If this is not possible & it is getting to you too much, take a break, simple as that.

― Pinkpanther (Pinkpanther), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:08 (twenty years ago) link

When ILE gets too in-jokey (or rather, off-boardy) I go and hide on ILM.

I don't think it's the palliness that people object to, but rather the endless allusions to things that happen offboard at meetups, FAPs, etc. - this makes you feel very left out and out of the loop and unpopular if you weren't at said events.

Or maybe that's just me.

― kate (kate), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:15 (twenty years ago) link

No I agree with you Kate, to a certain extent. I always intend to go to FAPs, but the reality of it makes me think twice. (I cannot hide on ILM as it scares me too much!)

― Pinkpanther (Pinkpanther), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:16 (twenty years ago) link

that's why ILM is a million times better than ILE. Once i see the pallyness I go to another thread straight away. don't have time for this shit bcz there are some ok discussions here.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:18 (twenty years ago) link

ignore julio he has an undeclared beard

― mark s (mark s), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:19 (twenty years ago) link

you know, its always funny when ppl say 'ILM scares me'.

x-post: this is getting too pally now. I will go away for a while ;)

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:20 (twenty years ago) link

ilm is specific that's the difference. It exists for the soul purpose of discussing all things music. If you're not into it then you don't post there. I love music, but i am not enough of a music snob or indeed know enough of a diversity of music to post there. (& that is why I steer clear of ILM)

― Pinkpanther (Pinkpanther), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:21 (twenty years ago) link

I feel much the same as Pinkpanther about things.

― Archel (Archel), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:22 (twenty years ago) link

ilm's a bit too much of a sausage party also

― James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:23 (twenty years ago) link

the few times ive been to a fap ive usually talked about music!

― chaki (chaki), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:23 (twenty years ago) link

http://www.memoriespictures.co.uk/socialhistory/fairgrounds/Alexandra%20palace.jpg

― Tim (Tim), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:26 (twenty years ago) link

'i am not enough of a music snob' ?!

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:27 (twenty years ago) link

I have a very limited scope of music that I love and listen to on a regular basis. Yet that that I love, I love completely and passionately. There are plenty of threads on ILM that I completely ignore, or else read and go "oh, that's interesting". I would understand how it *could* be perceived as threatening, because everyone is puffing themselves up with grand posing. But remember, ultimately, most of it is posing and sexual display. They won't actually beat you with sticks for liking/not liking Fennesz/Destiny's Child/MBV. (Except maybe Alex in NYC.)

ILM is easier for me when I don't feel like revealing too much of myself or getting into things too deep because there is a focus, and a topic to remind me not to get too personal. (Not that this works, but relatively, it seems to work.)

― kate (kate), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:28 (twenty years ago) link

Tim - why?? Are you the new Dada?
I have opinions about music that I would like to post on ILM, but for fear of being ridiculed, I stay away. I know what I enjoy (music wise) & I enjoy being exposed to new music or music that I wasn't aware of. I feel if i agree with people that it just appears that I am just being a yes person. ILM is great, but not for me personally.

― Pinkpanther (Pinkpanther), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:30 (twenty years ago) link

Fear of being ridiculed by whom? There is far more ridicule on ILE than there is on ILM, and on a much more personal level. What I fear on ILM isn't ridicule, it's being ignored. I can take ridicule; what I hate is when my threads disappear without a trace. (But shouting loudly or talking to yourself generally cures that until someone else comes along who shares your taste.)

― kate (kate), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:34 (twenty years ago) link

(Thanks, I now have Adam Ant stuck in my head.)

― kate (kate), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:35 (twenty years ago) link

that looks like a big glass house

― chris (chris), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:35 (twenty years ago) link

Nobody specific, i just don't feel i have enough of a wealth of music knowledge to contribute. That's it really. If I post a thread & it's not responded to, so be it.

― Pinkpanther (Pinkpanther), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:38 (twenty years ago) link

YOU TELL 'EM PREACHERMAN!

(unless you're talking about someone besides me, then I hate you)

Aw, you know it's you ... No, wait, alt.fan.geri-halliwell? I don't even know you.

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 08:58 (twenty years ago) link

I'm a relative newbie here, and I didn't feel that much intimidated when I started to post here. But maybe that's just me, since I've never been scared of joining a new group; that it takes some time to get the injokes and feel comfortable is probably inevitable in any group, and that shouldn't scare people too much. However, you most certainly aren't the worst possible bunch. Initially, when I didn't get some of the things people were talking about, I asked about them, and you know what? The answer was never like "You Fule! You are a not part of the Inner Circle, so you don't need to know!" Someone was always kind enough to explain things to me.

As for the FAP's and such, I'm obviously unable to attend them since I don't live in the UK or the US (or New Zealand or Australia). But that's okay; I don't come here to chat with friends I'd meet anyhow outside the InterWeb. I come here because you folks are genuinely fun to talk with, and even though your threads sometime are dull and injokey and cliquesque, more often they are funny and intelligent and a pleasure to participate in. If that wouldn't be the case, you wouldn't see me here.

[SOPPY MUSIC]

[CURTAIN]

― Tuomas (Tuomas), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 09:03 (twenty years ago) link

*applause for tuomas*

― Pinkpanther (Pinkpanther), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 10:35 (twenty years ago) link

Chris, I agree with what you said about threads going from serious to jokey and back again. Unfortunately this doesn't always happen, and sometimes after reading a 50-post conversation which, you know, is often dull for anyone other than the people concerned, I just find myself giving up.

I wonder if the thread's author should have a moral right to be able to say "um, can we get back on topic please" when things start to disintegrate? Just a thought out loud, not a suggestion.

― Mark C (Mark C), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 10:49 (twenty years ago) link

I usually do. Unless the thread derailment involves DDB's or Ass.

― kate (kate), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 10:50 (twenty years ago) link

I wonder if the thread's author should have a moral right to be able to say "um, can we get back on topic please" when things start to disintegrate?

Of course they should. And people do, I'm pretty sure.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 10:54 (twenty years ago) link

I am pretty sure this is already in place. If someone has something serious to discuss & the thread goes off topic, it is usually brought back round to the original topic quite quickly.

― Pinkpanther (Pinkpanther), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 11:01 (twenty years ago) link

ILE's eternal question: how does Ally maintain her
nice figure (judging from the occasional picture she
posts) when she spends most of her time sitting on her
ass typing messages?

― mast ace (Squirrel_Police), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 11:05 (twenty years ago) link

maybe she posts from a stairmaster w.an interweb connection?

― mark s (mark s), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 11:07 (twenty years ago) link

Also how come in the month I wasn't posting I got EVEN FATTER :(

― Tico Tico (Tico Tico), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 11:10 (twenty years ago) link

"enrage yrself thinner w.ilxor"

― mark s (mark s), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 11:27 (twenty years ago) link

Squirrel Police, at least log out to make your bitchy comments.

― Larcole (Nicole), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 11:30 (twenty years ago) link

I've never met another Ilxor, haven't been on AIM in months, and that never bothers me.

Like I said upthread: someone, somewhere, is always bitching about ILX. Either it's too pally/in-jokey/chat-roomy/twee/nice/cliquish, or it's too hostile/unsafe/argumentative/overrun-by-new-people. You can't have it both ways. You can't fix both problems. All you can do, apparently, is keep swinging back and forth between the two. The complaining is probably part of the cycle, which means we're about to be overrun with personal attacks, stalkerish behavior, and a few people leaving the boards or threatening to -- or maybe we have, cause I'm not caught up yet.

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 11:44 (twenty years ago) link

I post jokes mostly, but that's because I'm intimidated by the level of intelligent conversation on the "serious" threads. I usually feel like anything serious I post pales in comparison and my arguments are poorly developed. I read some of the serious threads but almost never post on them anymore. When I do post on them, I regret it later. Joking is easier. Whether this is a good or bad thing, I'm not sure.

― NA. (Nick A.), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 11:50 (twenty years ago) link

I don't know that there's any point in mentioning this, but I tend to avoid the super-serious threads (well, not just serious but the serious and "intellectual" threads), because they're often so earnest it reminds me of my freshman/sophomore years. I can't take them seriously.

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 11:53 (twenty years ago) link

Tep is completely OTM in both of his posts.

Josh, if the reason you left Usenet was because it became too pally, I have to wonder at how you're defining the word "pally".

― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 11:54 (twenty years ago) link

You can't have it both ways. You can't fix both problems.

Yeah you can, in theory. It doesn't have to be either of things. In practice, maybe you're right that those are the two traps it can fall into.

― N. (nickdastoor), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 11:57 (twenty years ago) link

haha he put intellectual in quote marks

i read and post on the "earnest" threads bcz the chances of finding somewhere else in the world where i get my ideas this stretched or challenged = v.slim indeed

― mark s (mark s), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 11:59 (twenty years ago) link

ILE would be much better if it wasn't for those pesky charismatic posters the others try and impress.

― Tico Tico (Tico Tico), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:01 (twenty years ago) link

WHY I LIKE "JOKEY" THREADS MORE THAN "SERIOUS" THREADS:

My take on it is that the serious threads are often less about exchanging ideas and much more about scoring points off of each other in a genteel, academic manner and if I'm going to be involved in a point-scoring contest, it's much more entertaining to me to involve dick jokes.

Conversely, I really like the way people are treated when they post personal problems to the board. The outpouring of well wishes and sympathy usually staggers me, even given that many of us have met each other.

― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:03 (twenty years ago) link

Like I said up thread, people are not made to contribute to all threads. If they are too 'intellectual' then you don't post to them. I don't if people are talking way above my head. There is nothing wrong with posting jokes at all. Everyone has to get out of ILE what they want. As I said, I find it helps to pass the time during my boring work.

― Pinkpanther (Pinkpanther), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:05 (twenty years ago) link

I have also found that if someone has posted about a personal problem, it is accepted & advice is offered. It is never made fun of or laughed at. This is the thing I most like about ILE.

― Pinkpanther (Pinkpanther), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:06 (twenty years ago) link

big ditto to Dan

― James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:12 (twenty years ago) link

And you say that ILM is not warm and loving... I give you:

In Praise of Kate St. Clair

I mean look! Jason and Pete fighting over my affections! You wouldn't get that on ILE!

― kate (kate), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:13 (twenty years ago) link

Yes you would!

― Pinkpanther (Pinkpanther), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:14 (twenty years ago) link

i am working on a masterplan (= ensure dick jokes are accepted into mainstream academic discourse BY VIRTUE OF THEIR INTELLECTUAL CONTENT) but my minions have all run in the opposite direction, the bungling fools

*accidentally releases tons of guano onto own head and suffocates*

― mark s (mark s), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:19 (twenty years ago) link

I like the Kuhn thread even though i haven't contributed. I like having new things to think abt and i don't think of it as 'point scoring'. those threads stay with me more than the ''joke'' threads.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:20 (twenty years ago) link

A pally ILE is infinitely preferable to the ILE we had a few months ago and at other points in the past where people were tearing lumps out of each other left right and centre.

I have no problem whatsoever with chatcentric threads as long as they don't overtake other threads much, and I don't really think they do.

Incidentally, Dan in serious mode, which happens more than he gives himself credit for, is one of my favourite posters...

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:27 (twenty years ago) link

*boggle*

Wow, Matt. Thanks!

― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:28 (twenty years ago) link

Andrew, are you stalking me online now? You know my sordid Usenet troll past! *SIGH*

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:29 (twenty years ago) link

I love both mode Dans, but the serious one puts the jokey one into brilliant relief

― Andrew Thames (Andrew Thames), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:29 (twenty years ago) link

I'm still recovering from that fucking Matthew Barney thread. I haven't been able to talk about nuttin' smart for days. And that one about Bush is just damn depressing. Dick, pussy and ass jokes recharge the ol' batteries! I thank god for you, you vulgar motherfuckers.

― django (django), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:32 (twenty years ago) link

(I'm still reeling, guys. Thanks.)

― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:38 (twenty years ago) link

Andrew, are you stalking me online now?

If you're going to say things like "I'm undetectable on Usenet" without typing your name into Google Groups, you get what's coming to you.

You know my sordid Usenet troll past!

You wish - I know your stolid a.f.g-h FAQKeeper past.

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:53 (twenty years ago) link

Did you actually read that thing? I think I claimed to BE Geri Halliwell in it. Do a search for Ron Traino and you'll see the light.

I'm obviously not undetectable on Usenet and also any one of these fuckers could actually tell the name that I posted 99.9% of my Usenet shit under! I just trust my compadres not to sell me out to the mang.

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 12:56 (twenty years ago) link

THIS IS NOT ABOUT SERIOUS, DRY THREADS vs JOKEY THREADS.

I love jokey threads. But my favourites are the ones that make you think and laugh.

― N. (nickdastoor), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 13:18 (twenty years ago) link

Dan in serious mode is a Wonderful Man. In jokey mode, he takes it all to the stage. :-)

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 13:28 (twenty years ago) link

Ditto.

I just trust my compadres not to sell me out to the mang.

So I'm the mang now? Fabulous.

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 13:32 (twenty years ago) link

You're the mang now dog!

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 13:43 (twenty years ago) link

OH MY GOD ALLY!

― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 13:48 (twenty years ago) link

Ally isn't YOUR god, she's everyone's.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 13:49 (twenty years ago) link

ally akbar!

― gygax! (gygax!), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 13:56 (twenty years ago) link

I think ILE has become too Ally. ;-)

― Larcole (Nicole), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 13:58 (twenty years ago) link

Never such a thing!

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 14:08 (twenty years ago) link

Maybe someone should start a “this is a thread for posts that DID NOT make you laugh out loud /I don’t get this joke-please explain it my sorry self -sob sob bang bang ouch that was my head...”

― kephm, Wednesday, 16 July 2003 14:18 (twenty years ago) link

B-but Kate! I started an ILE thread for you once! :-)

When I first visited (uh, lurked on) ILE, I felt like I was at this party and didn't know everyone. But lots of the folks looked really cool and I wanted to chat them up and become bestest buddies with them. So then I got up the courage to start posting and now I can post messages to people by name and know a bit about them and their personality. It's fun stuff. I should hope it's like that for most new people.

― Sarah McLUsky (coco), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 14:20 (twenty years ago) link

I think ILE has become too Ally. ;-)

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 14:22 (twenty years ago) link

The Ragget wink should give away that this statement was joke!

― Larcole (Nicole), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 14:28 (twenty years ago) link

The RaggetT wink is even more accurate!

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 14:30 (twenty years ago) link

Why is it that whenever people talk about comical things, they invoke the Raggett winkie?

― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 14:31 (twenty years ago) link

*insert comment here, or just let it dangle*

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 14:32 (twenty years ago) link

Stop being so serious, Dan. ;-)

― Sarah McLUsky (coco), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 14:32 (twenty years ago) link

This will probably sound more offensive than I indended (IE at all), but I think people like Ally, Ned, Dan who have a big cartoon personality alongside their normal "personal" personality are a big help in getting new people to feel at home. They're easy interaction.

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 14:45 (twenty years ago) link

HOORAY I'M EASY

― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 14:48 (twenty years ago) link

Sheesh, Raggeett, people misspell my surname all the time: In Praise of Kate St. Clair but you don't see me getting all uppity about it!

― kate (kate), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 14:50 (twenty years ago) link

That thread again: In Praise of Kate St. Clair

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 14:52 (twenty years ago) link

(only joking, I heart Kate and should have added her to the list above)

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 14:54 (twenty years ago) link

NNeedd RRaaggggeetttt.

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 14:57 (twenty years ago) link

I love that thread so much I don't even care that they misspelled my name on it. But I get the feeling that if I started a thread called "Neg Ragget I Love You, I Would Like To Paint Your Toenails I Love You So Much" that all he would do would be get on the thread and say "Fi, you scoundrels, you have misspelled my name, away with ye" and flounce off.

― kate (kate), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:00 (twenty years ago) link

my posts are always the same, I am the universal constant.

― jel -- (jel), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:02 (twenty years ago) link

That was a typo. Of course I can spell Ned's name! Feel free to call me Marcole or Garcole in retaliation.

― Larcole (Nicole), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:02 (twenty years ago) link

this thread has become too pally.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:06 (twenty years ago) link

Oh but Ms. Kate, it is a sore point with me, as I've gotten so many mispronounciations and misspellings since I was small. :-( The secret with Larcole is to add the 'h'.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:07 (twenty years ago) link

Kate is painting Ned's toenails: Yes, ILE is too pally.

― Chris P (Chris P), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:09 (twenty years ago) link

Dude, they spelled my name wrong in the NME. (When it was good.) Everyone misspells my name. It doesn't matter that it's not really mine. It's got to the point where I am amused by the endless permutations and HOW MANY DIFFERENT WAYS there are to misspell my name.

― kate (kate), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:10 (twenty years ago) link

Yay cartoon personality! Dan and I should sing "Easy Lover."

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:10 (twenty years ago) link

To me, you are now Cate Sinclair.

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:14 (twenty years ago) link

as seen in that one Encyclopedia Brown

― James Blount (James Blount), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:16 (twenty years ago) link

We should rope in JF and start a new band - The Cartoon Personalities.

― kate (kate), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:17 (twenty years ago) link

Yeah, these pally threads make me feel left out. Well, not really.

― Mandee, Wednesday, 16 July 2003 15:21 (twenty years ago) link

I hate easy interaction.

― N. (nickdastoor), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:01 (twenty years ago) link

you like stilted conversations and awkward silences??

― jel -- (jel), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:03 (twenty years ago) link

ilx:

http://www.german-cinema.de/archive/images/dr_mabuse_the_gambler_the_great_gambler_a_picture_of_our_time.jpg

― amateurist (amateurist), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:06 (twenty years ago) link

I am the fat dude at the end of the table who looks like he wants to cry.

― Mandee, Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:07 (twenty years ago) link

I like how the Hand from the Addams Family was invited to that party.

― jel -- (jel), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:08 (twenty years ago) link

I honestly haven't posted to an intellectual thread ever. Perhaps its because I consider myself outclassed. Or perhaps I think that if I did post something rather than typical Chris V. banter would I be taken seriously? Im not sure. Actually, i lied I probably posted to an intellectual thread once or twice, but it probably involved a shit joke. Unfortunately, in real life I am nothing like my alter ego.

― Chris V. (Chris V), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:13 (twenty years ago) link

my name isn't really Chris either.

― Chris V. (Chris V), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:16 (twenty years ago) link

Right, it's Poops McGee!

― Sarah MCLUsky (coco), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:34 (twenty years ago) link

Many messages while I was out, geez.

Nick said:

Yeah you can, in theory. It doesn't have to be either of things. In practice, maybe you're right that those are the two traps it can fall into.

In theory, yeah, I just meant that in the time I've been on ILX, and especially ILE (there were a couple months when I was only on ILM ... which I hardly ever read now, for lack of time), it doesn't seem like more than a couple weeks ever goes by without there being a lengthy thread about one or the other of those problems.

Whether they're actually problems or not -- whether the perceived traits of ILX-at-the-time are there or are just transient things which might go away if ignored -- and whether they're traps or just things that happen, the way all social groups shift and mingle -- is a whole nother question. I don't have a strong opinion one way or the other, which is probably why I'm not bothered either by group-hug-chat-room ILX or I-hate-sparrows ILX.

haha he put intellectual in quote marks

Don't take that wrong, I was rushed for time and trying to clarify that serious threads don't always have to be about "intellectual" things (for lack of a word coming more quickly to mind), nor do intellectual threads need to be serious. We could probably have a rollicking thread about Saussure and dick jokes, really.

i read and post on the "earnest" threads bcz the chances of finding somewhere else in the world where i get my ideas this stretched or challenged = v.slim indeed

I wasn't dismissing or criticizing that or anything, it's just not an opportunity I lack elsewhere.

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 17:43 (twenty years ago) link

It's kind of true I guess, I feel I know the people being pally too to some extent but I don't have much to say sometimes cos it's a joke I don't get. It doesn't really bother me though I was a bit disappointed when starting threads recently. I think one thing about being on ILX less is you think more about starting threads because it is a way to maximise the time you are on it for. I've been feeling quite serious lately but I feel there's a big amount of work needed to make a serious thread takeoff, ie keep posting sincerely to stop it descending into a pisstake, for example the thread on music I started a while ago.

I'm not bitter or anything but it is a bit sad if this is happening others aswell.

In no way do I really consider this a big thing and I'm not on here enough to complain what with work and all but it is how I feel nonetheless. I haven't really talked properly to people here in ages despite posting daily, albeit a little less, it's very easy to fall out of the loop actually. But I'm sure I'll be back. Positive.

― Ronan (Ronan), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 19:29 (twenty years ago) link

it bugs me that some people seem to be on ilx exclusively to make flirtatious three-word posts and flatter themselves, but that's their prerogative.

― amateurist (amateurist), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 19:41 (twenty years ago) link

oh you!

― Ronan (Ronan), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 19:42 (twenty years ago) link

(sorry, cheapshot)

― Ronan (Ronan), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 19:43 (twenty years ago) link

I never have any idea if amateurist is being sarcastic.

― bnw (bnw), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 19:49 (twenty years ago) link

I don't hink he does either.

― oops (Oops), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 19:54 (twenty years ago) link

Why does it bother you, Amateurist?

― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 19:55 (twenty years ago) link

(assuming you're not being sarcastic, of course, which I think is probably right based on past conversations)

― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 19:56 (twenty years ago) link

it's entirely plausible that i was being sarcastic.

― amateurist (amateurist), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:01 (twenty years ago) link

Suggestion for a new board: I Love Being All Up In Everyone's Grill (ILBAUIEG)

― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:02 (twenty years ago) link

I think my problem is that I like reading the jokey stuff all right, but I don't find myself compelled to "join in" as much as I do with more substantive threads -- so I don't feel as pally with everybody (cuz that's mostly where it develops). And sometimes I do think, "Everyone's being so goddamn pally today; I feel left out" -- but then I realize that I haven't really initiated any pally-ness of my own.

― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:11 (twenty years ago) link

Would it make you feel better, amateurist, if we balanced the flirtation and self-flattery with a lot of mean-spirited-ness and self-loathing? Cause I think I might could fill those shoes.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:18 (twenty years ago) link

will you or won't you 'fill those shoes'?

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:25 (twenty years ago) link

I think he'd feel better if we all shot ourselves in the face, but that's just the voibe.

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:25 (twenty years ago) link

Heavens! That's quite the vibe. I don't get that vibe at all.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:27 (twenty years ago) link

I might be being sarcastic! Who can tell?

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:28 (twenty years ago) link

can you feel the void tonight?

― amateurist (amateurist), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:28 (twenty years ago) link

This is getting very non-pally.

― s1utsky (slutsky), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:28 (twenty years ago) link

Hypocrite!

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:28 (twenty years ago) link

Me?

― s1utsky (slutsky), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:29 (twenty years ago) link

I have a poor memory for it but it strikes me that if ILE were ILM three years ago, we would now be talking about starting a new board for people to screw around on so that they don't sink ILE by drowning out everything else.

― Josh (Josh), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:30 (twenty years ago) link

People need hope, people need loving
People need trust from a fellow man
People need love to make a good living
People need faith in a helping hand

Man has always wanted a woman by his side to keep him company
Women always knew that it takes a man to get matrimonial harmony
Everybody knows that a man who's feeling down wants some female sympathy
Gotta have love to carry on living
Gotta have love 'till eternity

People need hope, people need loving
People need trust from a fellow man
People need love to make a good living
People need faith in a helping hand

La la la la, la la la la-la, la la la la la la la-la la la
La la la la, la la la la-la, la la la la la la la-la la laa...

Flowers in the desert need a drop of rain like a woman needs her man
If a man's in love and his woman wants the moon
Then he'll take it down if he can
Somebody who loves you and somebody who cares
Isn't that what you'd call a friend?
Gotta have love to carry on living
Isn't it easy to understand?

People need hope, people need loving
People need trust from a fellow man
People need love to make a good living
People need faith in a helping hand

La la la la, la la la la-la, la la la la la la la-la la la
La la la la, la la la la-la, la la la la la la la-la la laa...

People need hope, people need loving
People need trust from a fellow man
People need love to make a good living
People need faith in a helping hand

La la la la, la la la la-la, la la la la la la la-la la la
La la la la, la la la la-la, la la la la la la la-la la laa...
La la la la, la la la la-la, la la la la la la la-la la la
La la la la, la la la la-la, la la la la la la la-la la laa...

― amateurist (amateurist), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:34 (twenty years ago) link

People need to get the hell over themselves and enjoy it for what it is, and also for what it isn't. If it bugs you, don't read it.

― luna (luna.c), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:35 (twenty years ago) link

Or do, if you get off on that kind of thing.

― luna (luna.c), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:36 (twenty years ago) link

How is everything else getting drowned out? What is this 'everything else' you speak of?

― oops (Oops), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:36 (twenty years ago) link

how would you know it bugs you if you didn't read it?

― amateurist (amateurist), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:36 (twenty years ago) link

(x-post)

― amateurist (amateurist), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:37 (twenty years ago) link

meta discussions are good. if ILX bugs you, do read it.

― Ronan (Ronan), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:38 (twenty years ago) link

Well there are certain threads you can avoid by reading the titles... I dunno, I just hate the bitching that crops up every so often... but I suppose I don't have to read it, do I?

― luna (luna.c), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:38 (twenty years ago) link

Ams, are you trying to say you stick around in the hopes that it won't bug you in the future?

― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:39 (twenty years ago) link

well i don't read much of the pally stuff bcz i don't have time. it can be OK if you're in the mood (as everything else) I suppose.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:40 (twenty years ago) link

http://vincentbridges.com/millennium/images/mobilus.jpg

― amateurist (amateurist), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:41 (twenty years ago) link

You are all completely emo.

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:42 (twenty years ago) link

Except me. I'm completely Elmo.

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:42 (twenty years ago) link

Has anyone even come out against palliness yet?

― s1utsky (slutsky), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:42 (twenty years ago) link

fuck you s1utsky. i need my personal space.

― amateurist (amateurist), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:43 (twenty years ago) link

Hahaha! I'm sorry I'm adding to the supposed static-to-signal or whatever but goddamn, that's a good post, amateurist.

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:44 (twenty years ago) link

i cry

― s1utsky (slutsky), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:49 (twenty years ago) link

all of my posts will henceforth be followed by numerous line spaces. i think it will increase my aura of impenetrability.

― amateurist (amateurist), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:53 (twenty years ago) link

but we just want to be close to you!

― luna (luna.c), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:53 (twenty years ago) link

(blank stare)

― amateurist (amateurist), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:54 (twenty years ago) link

Give us all kisses, you silly silly thing!

― Ally (mlescaut), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:55 (twenty years ago) link

I WILL MAKE YOU LOVE ME, BITCH

― oops (Oops), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:57 (twenty years ago) link

the new single from cher, extra vocoder.

― Ronan (Ronan), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 20:59 (twenty years ago) link

You have to admit, an aura of impenetrability beats an aura of easy penetrability every time.

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 21:01 (twenty years ago) link

So, who else is contending with Amateurist for "resident crank"?

― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 21:02 (twenty years ago) link

My jokes aren't very funny. Does that count?

― Kenan Hebert (kenan), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 21:03 (twenty years ago) link

the new single from cher, extra vocoder.

I'm hearing it to the tune of Whitney's biggest single. With sample from Eminem.

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 21:04 (twenty years ago) link

do you imagine the extended "biiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiitch" like the "youuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuueeeeeeeoooooooooo" in the original?

― Ronan (Ronan), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 21:11 (twenty years ago) link

I go to lunch and I come back to this.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 21:19 (twenty years ago) link

I'm in tears and a couple of guys are talking about Cher

― s1utsky (slutsky), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 21:20 (twenty years ago) link

That reminds me of this one time at summer camp --

― Tep (ktepi), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 21:21 (twenty years ago) link

Fine - no love for you. Whateverrrr.

― luna (luna.c), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 21:22 (twenty years ago) link

Kenan: quit being so hard on yourself, palzo.
Fules: it's clearly the Barbara Streisand/Trick Daddy collabo

― oops (Oops), Wednesday, 16 July 2003 21:30 (twenty years ago) link

More people = more posts.

More people meeting each other = more pally posts.

Also: when ILX started the core posters were a few Brits who mostly knew one another anyway and had a separate mailing list for banter and nonsense. Now the locus is a bigger group of New Yorkers who mostly met through ILX so it's natural ILX is the scene for a lot more social stuff.

― Tico Tico (Tico Tico), Thursday, 17 July 2003 08:01 (twenty years ago) link

yea, totally! i can even remember when there were british people on ilx!

― gareth (gareth), Thursday, 17 July 2003 08:04 (twenty years ago) link

I can too. They were bad times.

― Tim (Tim), Thursday, 17 July 2003 08:10 (twenty years ago) link

Also, there aren't just more New Yorkers on, there are less Londoners too. More than there were a month or two ago, but less than a year ago.

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Thursday, 17 July 2003 08:41 (twenty years ago) link

I don't think there are any fewer Londoners than there ever were, it's just they are posting less and the NYC ilx0rs are posting more regularly. I have no doubt the pendulum will swing back the other way eventually. Or in a different direction - Toronto ILX could suddenly become huge.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 17 July 2003 09:04 (twenty years ago) link

That would be nice, except for banter about Kraft Dinner.

― Larcole (Nicole), Thursday, 17 July 2003 11:25 (twenty years ago) link

I'm posting quite a bit. South London in the house!

it bugs me that some people seem to be on ilx exclusively to make flirtatious three-word posts and flatter themselves

Yeah, this bugs me quite a lot. There are people who can be absolutely *guaranteed* to follow posts by certain other people with nudge-nudge flirtation and private jokes, and sometimes it's fine, sometimes it's irritating. Mostly I just think it would be better kept off-board, as it's a bit showy-off, kinda territorial and just a bit icky.

Anyway, I'm a touchy fuckx0r, so this may just be me (and amateurist, if I can speak for him, as I suspect he wasn't being sarcastic), but... there you go.

― Mark C (Mark C), Thursday, 17 July 2003 11:35 (twenty years ago) link

mark you forgot 'played'

― Josh (Josh), Thursday, 17 July 2003 20:31 (twenty years ago) link

I have no doubt the pendulum will swing back the other way eventually. Or in a different direction

Ormskirk ILX - And You Will Know Us By The Trail Of The Bickering

― Matt (Matt), Friday, 18 July 2003 00:02 (twenty years ago) link

Eventually DC/NoVA/MD ILX will take over all yr asses

― Millar (Millar), Friday, 18 July 2003 00:10 (twenty years ago) link

Josh, why do I never understand you?

― Mark C (Mark C), Friday, 18 July 2003 14:35 (twenty years ago) link

i remember when gareth was british!

― Mary (Mary), Friday, 18 July 2003 21:33 (twenty years ago) link

i love ile. i especially like it when the palliness overcomes geographical barriers. if there are threads i don't read - and there are lots of em, it doesn't bother me because (this may shock and stun you all) i don't own the board. dan perry is ace. so is ally.

― di smith (lucylurex), Saturday, 19 July 2003 01:28 (twenty years ago) link

I'm sure people will take this the wrong way, but I tend to balk at effusions of emotion and sympathy and love from posters to people they've never even met (so obviously this does not apply to the lot of you who *have* met). It seems to me to trivialize those sentiments.

So if I sometimes seem crotchety, it's largely for this reason.

― amateurist (amateurist), Saturday, 19 July 2003 04:10 (twenty years ago) link

I think I may have just put my foot in my mouth.

― amateurist (amateurist), Saturday, 19 July 2003 04:12 (twenty years ago) link

"foot"

"mouth"

― amateurist (amateurist), Saturday, 19 July 2003 04:13 (twenty years ago) link

amateurist, i simply adore you.

― di smith (lucylurex), Saturday, 19 July 2003 04:16 (twenty years ago) link

why do you have to have physically met someone in order to show genuine sympathy towards them?

― oops (Oops), Saturday, 19 July 2003 04:18 (twenty years ago) link

The key word is "effusions."

― amateurist (amateurist), Saturday, 19 July 2003 04:20 (twenty years ago) link

So you're saying emotions can only be genuine if they're shown sparingly?

― oops (Oops), Saturday, 19 July 2003 04:25 (twenty years ago) link

amateurist, i love you more than life itself.

― di smith (lucylurex), Saturday, 19 July 2003 04:27 (twenty years ago) link

did i mention that you're really great and you should move to new zealand right now?

― di smith (lucylurex), Saturday, 19 July 2003 04:27 (twenty years ago) link

amateurist why do you even hang around ile then?

― jess (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 19 July 2003 04:48 (twenty years ago) link

Because that sort of thing represents only a tiny fraction of what gets posted!

Incidentally Jess I didn't have you in mind as one of the people who seems unnaturally effusive and enthusiastic.

― amateurist (amateurist), Saturday, 19 July 2003 05:06 (twenty years ago) link

Don't I have the right to be bothered by certain qualities evidenced in some ILE posts, without abandoning the board altogether? Certainly you have voiced your problems with certain threads/posts/posters before, Jess.

― amateurist (amateurist), Saturday, 19 July 2003 05:06 (twenty years ago) link

I'm not trying to censure anyone. I just thought I would be honest in responding to this thread's central question.

― amateurist (amateurist), Saturday, 19 July 2003 05:07 (twenty years ago) link

So you'd like it better if everyone remained detached and interacted w/one another solely on an intellectual level? You're such a stereotypical man!

― oops (Oops), Saturday, 19 July 2003 05:16 (twenty years ago) link

(gathers flintstones)

― amateurist (amateurist), Saturday, 19 July 2003 05:16 (twenty years ago) link

Amateurist, I know exactly what you mean and I'm sure lots of other people feel the same way. Look how many don't post those kind of huggles posts.

― N. (nickdastoor), Saturday, 19 July 2003 11:40 (twenty years ago) link

amt speaks for 'us' N.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Saturday, 19 July 2003 11:57 (twenty years ago) link

We are the silent majority and our voice will not be heard.

― N. (nickdastoor), Saturday, 19 July 2003 11:58 (twenty years ago) link

Sociopaths are the new meme.

― Larcole (Nicole), Saturday, 19 July 2003 11:59 (twenty years ago) link

i don't think it's any secret, when there's at least 10 of them almost guaranteed per certain type of thread they do lose their meaning. it's like a signal response sometimes, motion censor almost.

― Ronan (Ronan), Saturday, 19 July 2003 12:00 (twenty years ago) link

haha on font 'Cochin' in italics the 'h' in heard looks like a 'b'.

― Cozen (Cozen), Saturday, 19 July 2003 12:06 (twenty years ago) link

the 'posts that made you laugh out loud' threads may be the apex of annoying pallyness for many people here then. personally (and seeing it was I who started that whole thing) I enjoy them a lot, even tho much of the time the comments posted are not that funny out of their correct context - but still interesting to read for me. I also notice certain posters have embraced those threads and dominate them both as quoters and quotees. I can see this annoying other people for reasons ranging from jealousy to genuine belief it is un-necessary (especially as those threads are huge and slow down some people) but their volume and regularity would seem to indicate they are appreciated by the majority of people on this board, despite the fact certain individuals (like, the funniest people on ILE) do dominate the threads.

― stevem (blueski), Saturday, 19 July 2003 12:08 (twenty years ago) link

additionally, I was attracted to ILE for two reasons - 1) to engage in discussion and argument about all kinds of subjects large or small with a broad range of people, just as you would ideally do face to face with people in life and 2) to actually make some more friends, or pals if you will, who are like-minded in certain ways....therefore the nature of my posts is fairly well balanced between these two motives.

― stevem (blueski), Saturday, 19 July 2003 12:10 (twenty years ago) link

It doesn't indicate that they're enjoyed by the majority of people on the board at all! You said yourself that they are dominated by certain posters as quoters as well as quotees.

I have an ambivalent attitude to those threads. I rarely laugh at what's posted there, partly because it's about context (threads are always funnier if one sees them as they build anyway - there's a strange element of timing, despite the message board format) and partly just cause people have crappy senses of humour. Yet, I can't stop myself pasting stuff there from time to time. It's a weird compulsion. And I always read it in the hope of an ego boost.

I do find it hard to believe that people are sticking to the 'laugh out loud' criterion most of the time.

― N. (nickdastoor), Saturday, 19 July 2003 12:17 (twenty years ago) link

I don't know if it's just me but I seldom laugh out loud at anything, and not because I'm miserable either, I just think "that's funny". The thread is a kind of ego boost thing I guess, I've never pasted anything on it I don't think, I just would be too lazy I suppose. I don't know why people do either, I guess there is something personal being said by what you paste yourself.

― Ronan (Ronan), Saturday, 19 July 2003 12:24 (twenty years ago) link

The thread is a kind of ego boost thing I guess, I've never pasted anything on it I don't think, I just would be too lazy I suppose. I don't know why people do either, I guess there is something personal being said by what you paste yourself.

For me, it's just because I have read something I think is pretty funny. There is no connection to me and I'm not trying to boost anyone's ego. No evil Machia-pally-ian scheme behind it at all.

― Larcole (Nicole), Saturday, 19 July 2003 12:27 (twenty years ago) link

i find myself laughing out loud quite often when i read full threads. that is something i'm grateful to ilx for. it might take some time to get the injokes and know each poster's sense of humour, but i definitely love the conversational side of this board, and hence the jokes (even the bad ones!).

― joan vich (joan vich), Saturday, 19 July 2003 13:10 (twenty years ago) link

the existence of the Jokes You've Already Seen Anyway If You've Been Reading The Board threads isn't making all the other threads any funnier. on the other hand it surely isn't making them any less funny.

― thom west (thom w), Saturday, 19 July 2003 13:49 (twenty years ago) link

but you can't read ALL the threads, can you?
sometimes you find funny bits on the 'posts that made you laugh...' threads.

― joan vich (joan vich), Saturday, 19 July 2003 14:01 (twenty years ago) link

I think I may be one of the ones who can seem effusive in affection and sympathy to others, to some people. Some of the time I am sympathising with someone I know to varying degrees (I posted something sympathetic an hour or so back to someone I've regarded as among my dearest friends for over twenty years!), and sometimes it's to someone I've never met. But I choose my words pretty carefully, and don't say things I don't mean. I was posting some very fond words to someone I've never met earlier, but they are entirely meant and sincerely felt - it's someone who, through ILX, emails and IM I feel is a friend, and I feel very fond of her and she is going through a rotten time. I realise some people will think it odd to form attachments to people you've not met, but I see nothing wrong with it - and it has happened to me, however I theorise about it.

― Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Saturday, 19 July 2003 14:06 (twenty years ago) link

It doesn't indicate that they're enjoyed by the majority of people on the board at all!

maybe not but then they are HUGE threads, and while some do dominate there is still a wide range of people both quoting and being quoted on there - and nobody has really complained about it (because they'll just get accused of hating fun).

the 'laugh out loud' threads i dunno - you either like that sort of thing or you dont- i guess i love it. i didnt want it to be just about backslapping, ego-stroking cliqueyness, but i dont really see the harm in that anyway if thats what people want to do. i suppose some people approach a thread like that and they wont laugh at anything on there because often people will not laugh at something when they've been forewarned that its absolutely hilarious.

― stevem (blueski), Saturday, 19 July 2003 14:28 (twenty years ago) link

I only get on the funny thread when I'm not trying to be funny, stop laughing at me!

― jel -- (jel), Saturday, 19 July 2003 14:42 (twenty years ago) link

HA-ha

― JuliaA (j_bdules), Saturday, 19 July 2003 14:46 (twenty years ago) link

It seems to me to trivialize those sentiments.

it seems that way to me, too, but then I have to sit back and realize that these other people ARE NOT ME, and have v. different emotional lives and may mean exactly what they say when they do that effusive ILXor love thing.

I have serious issues with strong emotions and other people probably don't. That's my problem, not theirs. I know exactly where Amateurist is coming from but at the same time I like to think I know where the other side is coming from as well

(obv I do not, to be honest)

― Millar (Millar), Saturday, 19 July 2003 14:51 (twenty years ago) link

Somehow my Nelson closing tag didn't show.

In terms of people being supportive and that seeming trivial...there may be some insincerity on these boards, but it seems that very many of these sentiments are real. Especially with the more prolific posters, you get to know people a bit from their posts, and become fond of some of them. And it sucks to see anyone hurt.

― JuliaA (j_bdules), Saturday, 19 July 2003 14:57 (twenty years ago) link

the honesty and sincerity surprises me a lot at times. an example being someone feeling the need to post about how they're feeling relating to something quite deep and personal...and receiving all the right comments in return, from people they know and from people they don't know so well at all. you could be cynical about all that but i think there's a genuine sense of love and concern around which is re-assuring. revealing so much about yourself on a public msg board as cathartic exercise is obviously not for everybody tho.

― stevem (blueski), Saturday, 19 July 2003 15:08 (twenty years ago) link

Has ILE become too pally? Well sometimes it seems like the board should really be called We Love Ourselves, but given that there's no set topic on ILE you have to go with the conversational ebbs and flows... so, whatever. The palliness on ILM bugs me more, because I see ILE as being for "fucking around" and ILM being for braney music talk. They both have their place, but I don't always want my chocolate to get into my peanut butter. That's just a preference; I'm not lobbying for ILM to become a solemn, humorless think tank. But I wish some of the more frequent posters could get their notch on the statscock by actually talking about MUSIC, for a change.

― Jody Beth Rosen (Jody Beth Rosen), Saturday, 19 July 2003 15:48 (twenty years ago) link

haha JBR in between brainy music talk and palling around you've basically nailed why I only ever read ILM like once a month

― Millar (Millar), Saturday, 19 July 2003 15:52 (twenty years ago) link

(also whenever I go there I end up spending wads of money shortly afterwards and that's not always a good thing)

― Millar (Millar), Saturday, 19 July 2003 15:53 (twenty years ago) link

That's surely the best compliment ILM could receive, Tom!

― amateurist (amateurist), Saturday, 19 July 2003 18:14 (twenty years ago) link

Not necessarily, because I want him to give his money to me.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 19 July 2003 18:23 (twenty years ago) link

Millar OTM in his last paragraph-long post.

It seems to me that the issue at hand stems simply from the fact that people are different from one another. Some people are not tolerant of this and would prefer if everyone posted as they themselves would post. Some people are not sociable, jokey types and reading sociable, jokey posts may grate on them. They don't feel genuine concern or empathy for other people, besides a select few loved ones, and assume that those who show concern and empathy freely must be faking it.

― oops (Oops), Saturday, 19 July 2003 18:44 (twenty years ago) link

That's a total misrepresentation of my point of view, but oh well.

― amateurist (amateurist), Saturday, 19 July 2003 18:59 (twenty years ago) link

Well then explain your point of view

― oops (Oops), Saturday, 19 July 2003 19:03 (twenty years ago) link

I don't appreciate your calling me intolerant.

Concern and empathy aren't really my pet peeves, as these can be and are in many different ways--it's excessive flattery and effusive sentiment that doesn't seem to have much basis. The sort of thing Jody alludes to when she calls ILE "We Love Us."

I know a woman, she's a friend of my mother's, and at get-togethers she inevitably gives a toast in which she rambles on and on about how much she loves everyone, how special everyone is, how beautiful and smart and etc.. Most people are rather embarrassed for her, for her toasts seems to be less about actually loving anyone (although I'm sure it is not *dishonest* per se) as her needing to feel a part of something, soak in emotion. (Said person all attends funerals of people she hardly knows and cries profusely, and calls up dying friends 10 times a day to see if she can "help," over the objections of said friend's husband.)

Does it not belittle certain feelings and thoughts if you go around expressing them in the most enthusiastic terms willy-nilly? Also does every thought and emotion have to be expressed in the most enthusiastic, hyperbolic terms?

You're right though that I probably prefer less expression of "feelings" (in the overt, explicit sense) than many. It's a cornerstone of my personality, and yet I don't think it makes me "unemotional"--quite the contrary.

From my first post here I said only that I myself "balk" at these effusions, not that anyone was being insincere or dishonest ("faking it"), nor that anyone should have to stop them on my behalf.

― amateurist (amateurist), Saturday, 19 July 2003 19:17 (twenty years ago) link

Whoops. Correction:

Concern and empathy aren't really my pet peeves, as these can be and are EXPRESSED in many different ways

― amateurist (amateurist), Saturday, 19 July 2003 19:18 (twenty years ago) link

This sounds like me at 5am Sunday morning at Glastonbury.

― N. (nickdastoor), Saturday, 19 July 2003 19:19 (twenty years ago) link

--it's excessive flattery and effusive sentiment that doesn't seem to have much basis.

And how are you determining what is excessive?
I call bullshit on your economy of emotions, but, to each his own.

― oops (Oops), Saturday, 19 July 2003 19:20 (twenty years ago) link

"Bullshit"?

― amateurist (amateurist), Saturday, 19 July 2003 19:21 (twenty years ago) link

TS: Love Is a Many-Splendored Thing vs. An Affair to Remember

― amateurist (amateurist), Saturday, 19 July 2003 19:22 (twenty years ago) link

Oops do you actually read my posts or do you simply object to them a priori?

― amateurist (amateurist), Saturday, 19 July 2003 19:23 (twenty years ago) link

I am enjoying seeing someone with don'temailmebitch@hotmail.com as their email address stick up for internet community spirit.

― N. (nickdastoor), Saturday, 19 July 2003 19:23 (twenty years ago) link

yes, i read your posts. what makes you think i didn't? I mean, I sort of agree w/what you said, I just don't think your RL example was reflective of what happens on ILE.

― oops (Oops), Saturday, 19 July 2003 19:25 (twenty years ago) link

Ha! I used to know someone like this. Opinions were split among mutual acquaintances -- her friends obv thought she was the ginchiest loveliest most generous person evah because she flattered them so and was always "there" and was very vocal about her there-ness, making sure everyone was 100% aware how full of 24/7/365 concern and sympathy and YOU ROCK and today's-your-birthday-isn't-it she was, while other people just found her really flaky and shallow and disingenuous. People like her have made me wary of all manner of compliments and excessive good will, because I always have to wonder about the person's motives and/or sincerity. I do sometimes see behavior on ILX that reminds me of hers... I'm not sure how to react to it, really. The people I care about know that I care about them, and if they need me I'm here and willing to help, but I refuse to launch a million-dollar campaign to elect myself Humanitarian of the Year. So if I'm noticeably quiet about these things, that's why.

― Jody Beth Rosen (Jody Beth Rosen), Saturday, 19 July 2003 19:47 (twenty years ago) link

Amateurist, you ARE suggesting the statements of strong feelings are false, by your view that expressing such things willy nilly diminishes them. I am certainly not doing anything of the kind, and I don't see many people expressing strong positive feelings towards people here much more than I do. I'm not asking you to like it, but you have zero basis for implying it is in any way not real and carefully pitched to be honest and true. I can't speak for everyone else, and there may be people saying things they don't mean, but from private conversations and the kind of reactions I have received when bad things have happened, I'd say most people are expressing things truthfully and proportionately.

― Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Saturday, 19 July 2003 19:50 (twenty years ago) link

Amateurist, you ARE suggesting the statements of strong feelings are false, by your view that expressing such things willy nilly diminishes them

I don't think this logically valid, Martin. They could be true to the person who makes them, no matter how often they do it, but still diminish the force of sympathy by their ubiquity. A kind of converse of compassion fatigue.

― N. (nickdastoor), Saturday, 19 July 2003 19:53 (twenty years ago) link

Ah, you don't even believe that, Nick. Amateurist said "if you go around expressing them in the most enthusiastic terms willy-nilly" - this implies that they are being expressed more strongly (probably a lot more, or the game is not worth the candle) than they are felt. Amateurist clearly thinks that many people are expressing far more than they genuinely feel. Obviously I can't tell him he's always wrong, and I don't even suppose he is, always, but I still object to his implication that when I tell someone I care a lot about how they feel, that I probably don't really mean it. I know he isn't naming me at all, but as I said I think I express these things as often and effusively as just about anyone, so I think I'm a decent example.

― Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Saturday, 19 July 2003 21:41 (twenty years ago) link

I just wish people would provide specific example of whatever annoys them so. grow some balls. ante up.

― James Blount (James Blount), Saturday, 19 July 2003 21:45 (twenty years ago) link

It's not really a case of what I believe, Martin - I was just saying that the one doesn't necessarily follow from the other, even if it is suggestive of it. As for Amateurist's real position, can't you just accept it when he unambiguously states (in the same post as the one you quote from):

From my first post here I said only that I myself "balk" at these effusions, not that anyone was being insincere or dishonest ("faking it"), nor that anyone should have to stop them on my behalf.

― N. (nickdastoor), Saturday, 19 July 2003 21:48 (twenty years ago) link

I could if it fit with anything else he said - and anyway even in that statement the word 'effusions' still implies that the feelings are being overstated.

― Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Saturday, 19 July 2003 21:59 (twenty years ago) link

Effusions just means they are given liberally. Some people are just very emo!

― N. (nickdastoor), Saturday, 19 July 2003 22:45 (twenty years ago) link

amateurist, I love you, man.

― Al Andalous, Saturday, 19 July 2003 22:56 (twenty years ago) link

i'm with martin skidmore on this issue.

― di smith (lucylurex), Saturday, 19 July 2003 23:45 (twenty years ago) link

To clarify a bit -- I'm not actually attacking anyone here, even though I said I observed certain qualities among the ILX posting body that reminded me of the woman I described upthread. This is my issue, I guess, that a few seemingly insincere people in my life have made me distrustful of EVERYONE'S intentions. But it's important to have some kind of bullshit radar with these things; if you're naive, you risk getting fucked over or hurt. Where is the line drawn?

― Jody Beth Rosen (Jody Beth Rosen), Sunday, 20 July 2003 02:31 (twenty years ago) link

wak-wak-wak-wak-wow-wow-yik-yakakakaka-kow!

― James Blount (James Blount), Sunday, 20 July 2003 02:43 (twenty years ago) link

*snort*

― Jody Beth Rosen (Jody Beth Rosen), Sunday, 20 July 2003 03:34 (twenty years ago) link

What I have noticed:
People post about their lives on ILE.
Am I allowed to post about MY life on ILE?
If the answer is no, then ILE has become too pally.

― Orbit (Orbit), Sunday, 20 July 2003 05:36 (twenty years ago) link

this muhfuh's become too pale-y I'll tell you that - you seem them fap photos: get some sun people!

― James Blount (James Blount), Sunday, 20 July 2003 05:40 (twenty years ago) link

You can say pretty much whatever the fuck you want to say, Orbit. Just don't threaten violence against anyone, ok? We don't have to pay any attention, or we may choose to, it's up to us. I have no right to do so, but could I make one suggestion? Could you try not to shout so much? Thank you.

― Bryan (Bryan), Sunday, 20 July 2003 05:40 (twenty years ago) link

I don't shout that much. What are you talking about? I don't shout any more or less than anyone else!

― Orbit (Orbit), Sunday, 20 July 2003 05:43 (twenty years ago) link

YES YOU DO!!!

― James Blount (James Blount), Sunday, 20 July 2003 05:46 (twenty years ago) link

actually I have no idea whether you do or not, that was just too easy

― James Blount (James Blount), Sunday, 20 July 2003 05:46 (twenty years ago) link

Well I don't shout any more than anyone else
. But I'm not offended by the joke. ;-)

― Orbit (Orbit), Sunday, 20 July 2003 05:48 (twenty years ago) link

You shout a fair bit on your own threads, but I guess that's your right, sort of. Actually, go ahead and shout! I like it, come to think of it.

― Bryan (Bryan), Sunday, 20 July 2003 05:52 (twenty years ago) link

Just some points of fact:
I haven't made very many threads. Only one thread: ATTACK was a shout and the whole thread was a shout by everyone because that was the point of the thread. Other than ATTACK I have never made an all-caps thread nor have I posted all-caps to someone else's thread.

If you look at the thread list, I'm not shouting any more than anyone else.

Perhaps because at the start of two threads I said: GO! GO! ?
That's pretty trvial. But I'm not worried about it. I will in the future say Go. Go.
You will then be happy.

― Orbit (Orbit), Sunday, 20 July 2003 05:59 (twenty years ago) link

I'm sorry if I wasn't clear. I honestly do enjoy the shouting. I wasn't being sarcastic! Please, Orbit, accept my apologies.

― Bryan (Bryan), Sunday, 20 July 2003 06:01 (twenty years ago) link

No offense taken. My reply was also sincere, no offense intended. ;)

― Orbit (Orbit), Sunday, 20 July 2003 06:02 (twenty years ago) link

OH NO! NOT THE WINKY!!! I CAN'T BEAR THE WINKY!!! Um... ;-)

― Bryan (Bryan), Sunday, 20 July 2003 06:03 (twenty years ago) link

Embrace emoticon love.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 20 July 2003 06:05 (twenty years ago) link

Hi Ned! (or was that too pally?)

― Bryan (Bryan), Sunday, 20 July 2003 06:06 (twenty years ago) link

Yes, I believe I will. :-)

― Orbit (Orbit), Sunday, 20 July 2003 06:07 (twenty years ago) link

Hello everyone! Yay everything! :-)

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 20 July 2003 06:08 (twenty years ago) link

YAY!!! It's a good ol' late night ILE circle jerk! PASS THE LOTION!

― Bryan (Bryan), Sunday, 20 July 2003 06:11 (twenty years ago) link

Hooray for the Western Hemisphere! The rockin'-est continent around!

― oops (Oops), Sunday, 20 July 2003 06:11 (twenty years ago) link

YAY!!! It's a good ol' late night ILE circle jerk! PASS THE LOTION!
-- Bryan (bryan...), July 20th, 2003. (Bryan)

erm. that might be a little difficult on this end....

― Orbit (Orbit), Sunday, 20 July 2003 06:14 (twenty years ago) link

I'm sure we could work something out! Or maybe I could just shut my fucking pie hole!

― Bryan (Bryan), Sunday, 20 July 2003 06:18 (twenty years ago) link

Lol. I'm just not sure how a female circle-jerking would work--lotion is *definitely* out. I think you might have to mail me a strap-on.

― Orbit (Orbit), Sunday, 20 July 2003 06:19 (twenty years ago) link

How drunk do you have to be to call the Western Hemisphere a continent?

― oops (Oops), Sunday, 20 July 2003 06:25 (twenty years ago) link

Canadian drunk! Millar drunk! Pretty fucking drunk!
I told you we could work something out, Orbit!

― Bryan (Bryan), Sunday, 20 July 2003 06:26 (twenty years ago) link

Shit! Is that what circle jerk means? I always thought it was badass guys who ride motorbikes.

Stop corrupting me ILE!

― jel -- (jel), Sunday, 20 July 2003 08:42 (twenty years ago) link

Was the band Circle Jerks or Cycle Jerks? I'm convinced it was Cycle Jerks.

― jel -- (jel), Sunday, 20 July 2003 08:48 (twenty years ago) link

http://image.allmusic.com/00/amg/cov200/dre600/e625/e62520eusx4.jpg

― Chris Barrus (Chris Barrus), Sunday, 20 July 2003 09:06 (twenty years ago) link

Orbit we don't know you from shit. Give us time before you call us "pally". Most of us have been posting here for 2+ years. You've been here like what, 2 weeks? It takes time, honey.

― Texas Sam (thatgirl), Sunday, 20 July 2003 09:13 (twenty years ago) link

Cor you lot are so paranoid! This is grebt. I must get gAIM working so I can get all the backstories to this. I for example, find all the NYC-ers talk impenetrable, so either I ignore it or make something entertaining up...

Perhaps the NYC-ers could explain some of their injokes to us? I shall try to explain a London injoke in turn except that all I ever joke about these days is linux and Dr Who eg GOT A LIGHT? NO MATCH ahahhahahahahaha.

― Sarah (starry), Sunday, 20 July 2003 09:25 (twenty years ago) link

i get the majority of the ILXNYC0R injokes and I live in TX, WTF?

― Texas Sam (thatgirl), Sunday, 20 July 2003 09:31 (twenty years ago) link

I guess you talk to them on AIM? Or you met up or something? Also Americans have a common language of syrup on pork products and stuff that mean there is already a bond which us over the pond with our pork products and tomato ketchup will never understand.

― Sarah (starry), Sunday, 20 July 2003 09:45 (twenty years ago) link

Sarah, if there's something you don't understand and would like to know please ask -- I'm sure the result will be as disappointing as Tottenham Geezers Swan Kiosk but the NYC crew would be happy to explain nevertheless.

― Mary (Mary), Sunday, 20 July 2003 11:37 (twenty years ago) link

Mary I must admit that I have only got the interweb at home a couple of days ago so I not down with all the young peoples groovy jokes! But I shall make sure to revise this thread when curious!

BTW I now have great hatred for the Tottenham Swan bcz of many nights spent waiting for the sodding N73 to start running but all there are are bloody 73's going to Tottenham. Grrrr. And all you want to do is go home cos you are tired and drunk and grumpy and all your friends have gone home and buses only go to TOTTENHAM. Unless you go to Angel and change. I can recommend this method.

― Sarah (starry), Sunday, 20 July 2003 11:47 (twenty years ago) link

Get the N38 and go via BAKERS ARMS instead!

― RickyT (RickyT), Sunday, 20 July 2003 11:54 (twenty years ago) link

I want to go to Tottenham Swan.

― Mary (Mary), Sunday, 20 July 2003 11:59 (twenty years ago) link

Toda is going to dye his hair blue next season.

― jel -- (jel), Sunday, 20 July 2003 12:36 (twenty years ago) link

Like Starry says, I think there is a tendency for ILx becoming just a spin-off from AIM chat. And I think this leaves those of us with no desire to go on group AIM chats a little out of the loop (cf the Polyamory thread).

― Jerry the Nipper (Jerrynipper), Sunday, 20 July 2003 12:56 (twenty years ago) link

i think this only applies to ILE jerry.

― Julio Desouza (jdesouza), Sunday, 20 July 2003 13:22 (twenty years ago) link

syrup on pork products is canadian dammit

― s1utsky (slutsky), Sunday, 20 July 2003 14:56 (twenty years ago) link

http://www.norfolkwindmills.com/images/tottenhamswan.jpg

― gareth (gareth), Sunday, 20 July 2003 16:20 (twenty years ago) link

"Salsa is what I put on my scrambled egg."--Tito (It's-still-Mambo-to-me) Puente

― Al Andalous, Sunday, 20 July 2003 16:22 (twenty years ago) link

the Swan like the Viaduct pub near Ealing Hospital.

― jel -- (jel), Sunday, 20 July 2003 16:23 (twenty years ago) link

I know many of the people on this board for 5-10 years, that girl, in real life and not on the internet. I was simply de-lurking myself on this board, and responding to the question asked in the thread.

― Orbit (Orbit), Sunday, 20 July 2003 17:48 (twenty years ago) link

http://www.manchester2002-uk.com/buildings/strangewys1.jpg

― Mary (Mary), Sunday, 20 July 2003 17:49 (twenty years ago) link

Orbit we don't know you from shit. Give us time before you call us "pally". Most of us have been posting here for 2+ years. You've been here like what, 2 weeks? It takes time, honey

What is this? This whole thread was started because I was concerned how the board looks to newcomers. Newcomers are more qualified than anyone to give their thoughts on how pally and inward-looking it comes across as. I'm surprised you should be like this Sam.

― N. (nickdastoor), Sunday, 20 July 2003 17:58 (twenty years ago) link

The vast majority of people here were newcomers at some point or other tho right? So to draw from my own experience - I checked out a few threads now and then based on the odd Google search or recommendation by other people but seldom posted or lurked. this went on for about 6 months before i became a full on ILE devotee. the only reason i avoided this board for that long was because I knew it would engulf me, but I eventually gave in when I saw how much pally fun was being had and i thought 'hey gimme a slice' - well thats not entirely true as i became a regular on ILM a good 2 or 3 months before ILE

― stevem (blueski), Sunday, 20 July 2003 18:14 (twenty years ago) link

N, my point was people can't get upset that they aren't automatically in on everything right away. (if anyone is/was, I dunno). But it's not hard to get all the BS if you stick around. The group will draw you in if you let it.

Sarah, you are right it's the syrup/pork that binds us all.

― Texas Sam (thatgirl), Sunday, 20 July 2003 18:21 (twenty years ago) link

ILE/ILM's problem from the perspective of every non-regular I've ever talked to is that it's this MASSIVE, INSANELY FAST conversation and it requires far too much time for most people to keep up. The weekends move a bit slower but every day coming home from work (where I can't read, much less post) I have to play catch-up on all the poop that happened between 4am - 5pm EST while London and NYC are up and chattering away.

Palliness is what makes people want to stay and keep up with everything. We're FRIENDS, here, of a sort, some moreso than others, and that's what friends do - make injokes and call each other silly things.

― Millar (Millar), Sunday, 20 July 2003 18:25 (twenty years ago) link

Tom, don't lie. It's all about the pork.

― Texas Sam (thatgirl), Sunday, 20 July 2003 18:27 (twenty years ago) link

good point about how much your view of ILE depends on your circumstances and location. i have a fair bit of free time on my hands and i am in London area which explains why i have been such a frequent poster the last 6 months and enjoy the vibe of this place generally. i'd be a lot more frustrated if i was on 56k dialup, worked 9 to 5 everyday without permission to access this site and i lived somewhere where i couldnt go to a local FAP regularly - but those who come here in that situation and put up with all the cliquey bollocks are real troopers and i salute them (no pun intended Millar, bwahahaha)

― stevem (blueski), Sunday, 20 July 2003 18:31 (twenty years ago) link

I don't know, after reading some of the comments on this thread I wonder if anything I write is welcome here.

― Larcole (Nicole), Sunday, 20 July 2003 20:57 (twenty years ago) link

I am probably being paranoid, but when people speak in such generalities it does make you wonder who they are referring to. Maybe next time you find a post you take exception to you should comment on it on that thread.

― Larcole (Nicole), Sunday, 20 July 2003 21:03 (twenty years ago) link

Aw.

*hugs Nicole*

― Sommermute (Wintermute), Sunday, 20 July 2003 21:09 (twenty years ago) link

(You better get a streptococci vaccination soon, stranger.)

― Sommermute (Wintermute), Sunday, 20 July 2003 21:11 (twenty years ago) link

i think its interesting that someone pointed out upthread that a lot of the palliness follows from AIM chatrooms. and i hate to say it, but a lot of ilx AIM chatrooms, though individuals go out of their way to be welcoming and thats a good thing, hardly ever talk about anything with any relevance to me. sometimes ilx is like that too, but frankly you have to take the good with the bad, lifes like that. nicole, trust me, you have nothing to worry about.

When one wanders into an internet community for the first time, as with a party in real life really, more self-conscious types (eg ME)

i find this initial statement interesting, because N you don't come across as particularly self-conscious on the internet at all.

― The Lady Ms Lurex (lucylurex), Sunday, 20 July 2003 21:49 (twenty years ago) link

a lot of ilx AIM chatrooms, though individuals go out of their way to be welcoming and thats a good thing, hardly ever talk about anything with any relevance to me.

that's everybody, I think. Unless you're me in which case the content of the AIM chat convo is whatever I have to say abt what is on my TV at the moment and not much else.

― Millar (Millar), Sunday, 20 July 2003 21:51 (twenty years ago) link

I am very self-conscious, lucylurex. I carefully examine all the things I am about to say and decide they are great. Ha ha. Actually I meant more in real life, I guess.

― N. (nickdastoor), Sunday, 20 July 2003 22:27 (twenty years ago) link

See, this is a good example of a thread which went into deep psychosis for a while there but managed to crawl back out of the abyss!

Oh it gives me hope.

― Chris P (Chris P), Monday, 21 July 2003 01:36 (twenty years ago) link

http://www.internalmemos.com/memos/memodetails.php?memo_id=1701

― Jody Beth Rosen (Jody Beth Rosen), Monday, 21 July 2003 03:50 (twenty years ago) link

Good Lord.

― Matt (Matt), Monday, 21 July 2003 03:57 (twenty years ago) link

Sounds fake to me. It decreases company morale? They're going to escort you to a meeting room?

― nickn (nickn), Monday, 21 July 2003 04:48 (twenty years ago) link

"All things in moderation" works pretty well in all works of life, including ILE.

― Mark C (Mark C), Monday, 21 July 2003 12:38 (twenty years ago) link

Mark is a moderate smoker.

― N. (nickdastoor), Monday, 21 July 2003 12:52 (twenty years ago) link

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