The Great Gatsby

not thee great but a verry good.

I'm reading Norwegian Wood at the mo, just so I can say it's not his best work.

i thought the style was way more flaubert than conrad. < /asshole >

Oh man, this book used to be a major point of debate between myself and a friend...she was always complaining that she had to read it for English class. "What the fuck? It's a great book! You try reading fuckin' Os Lusiadas instead, now there's a dull book!" I'd say. "But this book is just about rich people whining!" she'd reply. "Rich people have feelings, too!" I'd say, and on it went...

This probably wasn't helped by the fact that I'm relatively well off and her family struggles to make a living. Insert Ironic Manic Street Preachers Quote Here.

I'm both surprised and impressed that you got assigned Pynchon in high school ahead of either of those two though.

I had one heck of a creative English teacher for 11th grade...

The best ending ever, of course. no recommended for anyone pondering to become a writer him/herself, as John Irving hinted in "The New Hampshire Hotel": it is a heavy weight on your shoulders, because you finish the book with the impression you will never be able to scribble anything like that, to crystallise a feeling so perfectly with so little wording behind.

This Side of Paradise on the other hand is a very tedious read, completely lacking in the romance and depravity, just focussing on the rich-boy crap.

- the narrator not being the main character

- the fractured time sequence

- having the main action of the story take place at sea during a storm

the first 100 or so pages of 'tender is the night' were excellent, after that it went straight to shit and i couldn't even be bothered to finish it.

Which version did you read? Fitzgerald's intended version where the story begins at the beach, or the version where the parts are swapped to force the story into chronological order?

His intended version reads better - the other version gives too much away too soon.

Am I losing my mind? I don't remember anything like this happening in Gatsby.

I read it a couple of years ago on my own. For some reason I never got assigned it in school. I enjoyed it quite a bit, especially the chapter early in the book where Nick goes into the city with Tom and Myrtle and they get plastered and fight. I would recommend it on the strength of that chapter alone.

I think it's among the most perfect, polished novels ever written, and he wrote like an angel. There are very few better American novels - one of those few, Ned, is Huck Finn. And quite a bit of it really is set on the water.

This may take some convincing. ;-) Keep in mind I love Twain and all (but I'm probably more of an Ambrose Bierce lover at heart).

I'm actually with Ned on Huck Finn. I read it in high school the same year as Gatsby and thought it was okay, but haven't been able to get through it again.

The original or the seventies version?

Fear and Loathing and Great Gatsby - both have large amounts of mint juleps.

Yes, one of the best books ever. I don't really have anything to add to that.

keep meaning to rerereread "tender is the night"

I liked the first third a LOT but not the second third. maybe the last third would have been different, again

What a great formulation, from N.!

yeah, like three times. what i meant was unfilmable in the sense that it wouldn't make a very good film.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/holiday/thanksgiving/photoessay/images/c18535-18-398h.jpg

Is that you in the middle, Ned?

the later jack does, but i think JN c. chinatown could've pulled it off - gatsby needs to have that spark of obsessiveness, which robert redford couldn't really do.

plus now that i've mentioned it i can't imagine anyone but JN not sounding silly saying "old sport."

Nicholson could never pull this off. His penchant for injecting irony into the most commonplace of utterances would give the game away.

has anyone seen the 1949 version with alan ladd?

imdb on the 1926 silent version: "No prints of this film are known to survive. Check your attic."

With respect, Alfred, 'thusly' is a 'ly' too far. I am reminded of the Amises' dentist: 'Open widely'!

For a moment I thought that J.D. was saying not that only JN could pull off Gatsby, but that ... only JtN could!

They'd have to have harassed him Kubrick-style, making him say the lines so many times he dropped the Nicholson affectations. Even then, I'm not sure he'd have been the best pick. Redford was reasonable, but the main problem was he looked like he belonged with the prestige and money. Gatsby was supposed to be more suspicious.

http://www.3-x.nl/images/front/25873.jpg

With Tim Hopkins as Gatsby?

I went looking for my copy of tender is the night to run through that another (a sixth? a seventh?) time but I must have given it away again (the sixth time? the seventh time?)

must pick it up again today

I read 'the last tycoon' a while back and it read as you'd expect: a touch bitty and piecemeal, not entire

a dizzylingly great writer

But Gatsby: a classic, a masterwork, etc. I had to read it in high school then again for a college course, but haven’t revisited it since. Will have to correct that.

Something interesting that a college prof pointed out when we were studying Gatsby was the fact that Fitz endlessly employed the word “careless” and its variations to describe Daisy.

New movie version by...Baz Luhrmann. Hm.

i've really been meaning to reread this. can't imagine it making a good film, though.

oh goody it'll be a campy genre-bending epic

I reread it every couple of years and it's different each time, if you know what I mean.

obv Hugh Jackman will be Gatz, right? Musical or not?

I couldn't help but picture Robert Downey Jr. in the role when I read it.

which role?

Daisy Buchanan.

Gatsby = RDJ

Tom Buchanan = Puddy from Seinfeld

Read Gatsby in 11th grade, but don't remember if I liked it or not. I actually liked the Robert Redford adaptation of the book.

One of the worst movies ever made --- top ten bad.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=rARN6agiW7o

or Apple Trailers: http://trailers.apple.com/trailers/wb/thegreatgatsby/

ugh ugh make it go away

Tom Buchanan = Puddy from Seinfeld

that said this would have been genius casting

i had never read this book, but then i read it the other day, p good, glad i got in in time to be outraged @ new vers

haha

way too much COLOR imo

kill it with fire

Would rather see a high-school Gatsby by the guy who directed Brick.

There's been a 7-hour stage version that had a couple diff runs in NYC in the last year, in which the actors read every word on an office set.

this is a gatbsy that speaks to the way we live today though, morbs

leo actually might not be terrible

i imagine it'll be hard to tell

zebra in the pool you know it's gonna be a party

If anything, I give Baz credit for persuading Leo to shave that scraggly fuzz off his face. That's as far as I'm going, though.

this is a baz lurhmann movie

and it'll be that

more over the top than ever before, etc etc

ugh.

i really cannot stand carey mulligan

don't know why

Baz Lurhmann films have a built-in audience (of people who've seen previous Baz Lurhmann films) and little more. This won't flop, but it won't be a blockbuster either and will probably max out at some costume and cinematography nominations come awards season.

she was good in that episode of Doctor Who. It's all been downhill since though

more over the top than ever before, etc etc

― obliquity of the ecliptic (rrrobyn), Tuesday, May 22, 2012 8:31 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

tomorrow we'll run faster, stretch out our budgets farther. . .

Carey Mulligan is a good actor BUT she's doing contemporary Hollywood films, so suckage.

Baz Lurhmann films have a built-in audience (of people who've seen previous Baz Lurhmann films) and little more. This won't flop, but it won't be a blockbuster either and will probably max out at some costume and cinematography nominations come awards season.

― Johnny Fever, Wednesday, May 23, 2012 12:33 AM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark

Have we forgotten Australia so quickly?

I don't know if it was just me but it seemed like there was a lot of cgi going on for no good reason.

Scrunchy Face might work if cast as Daisy.

and 3D!!!!

'gatsby' just doesn't make for good film material, IMO.

ugh I hope that's not really what the soundtrack is like
not sure if I have a crush on Tobey Maguire anymore either

well yeah -- it's like filming "The Eve of Saint Agnes" or "The Bridge." I don't know who'd want to watch this beside masochists thinking "I want to see the train wreck."

there's much more action in that 1.5 minute trailer than there is in the book.

i kinda want to see this train wreck.

'gatsby' just doesn't make for good film material, IMO.

― (The Other) J.D. (J.D.), Tuesday, May 22, 2012 8:48 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

particularly not these days - it could probably be a pretty good low-key, black and white movie, but that'd be box office suicide

just watched kubrick's lolita the other night and hated it, not looking good for film adaptations of my favorite books. maybe that paradise lost thing won't suck, assuming that ever gets made

Just needs to be Gatsby! the musical instead.

yeah for real it already looks like Chicago (musical)

besides its lyricism the novel's innovation lies in its structure. Film could reproduce the structure but not without attenuating the momentum -- and there's now way to render even in filmic terms what Fitzgerald accomplishes.

And we've already got a film version of the Gatsby story: Citizen Kane.

Ten minutes of a camera shot of a big pair of eyes on a billboard.

"Art!"

Movies are never as good as books, unless the book is bad to begin with.

Writers: F. Scott Fitzgerald (novel), Baz Luhrmann (screenplay),

And we've already got a film version of the Gatsby story: Citizen Kane.

― Exile in lolville (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, May 22, 2012 8:57 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

also the other versions of the great gatsby

just watched kubrick's lolita the other night and hated it, not looking good for film adaptations of my favorite books. maybe that paradise lost thing won't suck, assuming that ever gets made

i'm actually a big fan of kubrick's 'lo' (tho the book is better) but it's sort of one of those extremely unlikely things that somehow worked out (for me anyway) -- 'lolita' the book seems even less suitable for filming than 'gatsby.'

Movies are never as good as books

Tangelos are never as good as nectarines

Films are made FROM, not OF, books

plus gatsby would p. much have to be a completely unknown but staggeringly charismatic actor, which could never happen.

we're still recovering from the effects of our Gatsby president Ronnie Reagan.

gatsby is sort of like the little red-haired girl in 'peanuts' -- if you actually see him/her, it ruins the mystery, and the mystery is the point.

cant they just make a modernized one where everyone works at facebook

anyway, here ya go Londoners:

http://elevator.org/shows/show.php?show=gatz

i had to go back and re-read some of my favorite passages, lest the film version be the one to remain in my memory. i thought he totally messed up the scene at the schiller house, and thought most of the humor was (inevitably) lost in translation. and that it was generally rushed. and that Q was a cartoon character.

objectively it wasn't awful i guess, but i just recently finished the novel and am kind of still emotionally attached to certain parts of it

xp JD

why would you expect a film made in 1962, financed by Hollywood, to replicate the particulars of Nabokov? Not meant to be seen in conjunction with the novel.

Sellers is pretty bad though

no i know, i tried to make it clear that most of my objections were pretty subjective. i adored the book and i probably watched the film too soon after finishing it

Number Rong

I like him in other things. His appearance in Lolita is grating and self-indulgent (although i'm sure it amused Kubrick too)

I'm fine with the Kubrick film succeeding as a collection of lurid tableaux based on the Nabokov novel.

So back to this trailer

ugh I hope that's not really what the soundtrack is like

Yeah, was wondering that now that I had a proper chance to look at it. Who was doing the overwrought U2 cover there?

It was so bad it inspired E.L James's next book.

xp Jack White

i wish baz lurhmann nothing but ill

like his-children's-children-will-also-be-cursed ill

there are no third acts in baz lurhmann films

great going, gatsby

so we beat them, Baz Lurhmann's children, borne back ceaselessly into nothingness

the drake gatsby

can't believe Kubrick's Lolita failed to replicate the novel, blame the screenwriter imo

haha

as this was filmed in Sydney, it really should be titled "The Great Gazza"

can't believe Kubrick's Lolita failed to replicate the novel, blame the screenwriter imo

― melodic yew (Noodle Vague), Wednesday, 23 May 2012 09:49 (2 hours ago) Bookmark

funny and all, but Kubrick made some pretty radical changes to Nabokov's original script

yeah, Nabokov's script basically wasn't used, that's my understanding.

can't wait for the sequel 2 Gats 2 Curious amirite guys

I lolled

Waiting for "The Great Gatsby: West Egg Drift" here.

Gatsby 2: Electric Jitterbug

Gatsby 2: Greater, Bigger, Dandier

hahahaha this trailer

not that you can probably tell over the luhrmann, but tobey maguire looks like he's stinking the joint up as nick.

There's been a 7-hour stage version that had a couple diff runs in NYC in the last year, in which the actors read every word on an office set.

― World Congress of Itch (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, May 22, 2012 8:21 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

this is a great show, partially because the language of the novel is so lyrically beautiful (i believe the same company tried a similar thing with a faulkner novel and it wasn't the same kind of sensation) but also partially because the guy who plays nick is amazing.

http://elevator.org/shows/show.php?show=sound_and_fury

yeah, kicking myself that I missed it. xp

yeah thats playing in london soon, kinda tempted

lol i hope the whole movie is scored by frank ocean

you should absolutely see it.

xp

who was singing that version of "love is blindness" in the trailer? whoever it was was terrible.

jack white, apparently

lol okay

"Mahalo, Gatsby"

In case the original link to the trailer gets taken down, I found this mirror site:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAHj3IsSuT0

so help me i just bought a ticket for the 8 hour GATZ in london. in real real 3d! in your face luhrmann.

lol i hope the whole movie is scored by frank ocean

Surely there's no way in hell Baz has been able to resist Lana Del Rey?

My girlfriend really wants to that play but I've vetoed going with her on the basis that it's EIGHT HOURS LONG. Also, kinda expensive. I'm kinda curious but at the same time, no.

Surely there's no way in hell Baz has been able to resist Lana Del Rey?

thank you for this, now I can convince my wife not to go see this

http://www.shokwaves.co.uk/images/anilaser.gif

EIGHT HOURS LONG

better than what i normally do for eight hours a day tbh. (taking a 1/2 day off work for it.)

Look, counting the dinner break I think it's less than 6 hours. I'm amazed they can get every word in that quickly, in fact, I remember the book being longer.

that is, removing the intervals and meal break

its a p short book

The book isn't that long but it's still a lot of words. There was something in London recently when they read out the whole of Moby Dick out in a church and that took literally days.

it ends up being like 8 hours with the intermissions and the dinner break. IT'S A JOURNEY.

ledge, you are in for a treat

the woman who played jordan played some moments a little broad for my taste, but that's my only real criticism, and it's hard to blame the company; presumably they felt like they had to punctuate all the subtly-inflected reading with some broad moments.

the way they stage the party at tom's mistress's house in the early part of the book is amazing.

maybe i will go to london and watch it again

I really wanted to go see Gatz, I should keep an eye out once I have some money again.

i befriended my seatmate who i guess had worked as a producer in new york theater before he got priced out or something? it was fun; he gossiped with me about rando philistine producers who left before the show was over.

dicaprio's voiceover is hilariously awful and i will see the hell out of this movie

it ends up being like 8 hours with the intermissions and the dinner break. IT'S A JOURNEY.

― horseshoe, Wednesday, May 23, 2012 11:10 AM (3 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

it's not a book it's a RIDE

Strap yourself in and feel the Gatsbys...

tbh I'm just imagining this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IL3Dp6Oh3Fw

I would ride the hell out of a Great Gatsby roller coaster

haha wait a minute that's tobey maguire doing the VO right? i can't tell who's been dooly appointed and who hasn't

at any rate mumblecore seems somewhat the wrong tone to take with gatsby and the temple of doom

gatsby and the temple of doom

Tobey as Short Round...

Meryl Streep as Molo Ram

And so we whip on

no time for love dr. t.j. eckleburg

"Hold on to your potatoes, old sport."

"Tom...prepare to meet KALI. In MANHATTAN."

"Fortune and glory, Mr. Carraway. Fortune and glory."

There was a faint, barely perceptible movement of the water as the fresh flow from one end urgedits way towards the drain at the other. With little ripples that were hardly the shadows of waves, the laden mattress moved irregularly down the pool. A small gust of wind that scarcely corrugated the surface was enough to disturb its accidental course with its accidental burden. The touch of a luster of leaves revolved it slowly, tracing, like the leg of a compass, a thin red circle in the water, followed by his ripped-out heart on fire.

Kate Beaton's Gatsby adaptation is still the best: http://www.harkavagrant.com/index.php?id=259

all three leads look terrible in this, but at least this thread reminded me to go play the NES video game version of gatsby again

i don't know, i think dicaprio seems kind of okay in that trailer. i think i might be some kind of dicaprio stan. :/ (nothing else about that trailer is okay.)

i wonder if he and maguire drew on their experience as leaders of the "pussy posse" in the 90s to help dramatize the jazz age.

Amitabh bachchan is in this, that's kind of cool

i wonder if he and maguire drew on their experience as leaders of the "pussy posse" in the 90s to help dramatize the jazz age.

― horseshoe, Wednesday, May 23, 2012 7:21 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark

hah, i didnt even think of that

i didn't know that about bachchan! i am probably going to watch this thing and then i will be so boringly, predictably angry afterward.

bachchan plays meyer wolfsheim!

i didn't even recognize him!

I have still never seen the '49 Alan Ladd version, which apparently is a gangster noir.

http://articles.latimes.com/2012/apr/16/entertainment/la-et-classic-hollywood-20120416

But this 1949 version starring noir icon Alan Ladd as Gatsby leaves the Jazz Age behind for the rat-a-tat-tat of tommy guns, thugs, fisticuffs and dark shadows. ("Gatsby" was reportedly Ladd's second favorite film after his 1953 western classic "Shane.")

I want to see this now!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kJnt9_8ZM0&feature=player_embedded

Better than the original.

This is the most bizarre reading of Gatsby I've ever seen. It is so conservative it could have run in the National Review.

Is "The Great Gatsby" a rousing homage to the American dream or a disillusioned takedown of that same dream? If Fitzgerald, who died in 1940, were alive today, would he be clinking champagne glasses with CEOs and hedge fund managers or pitching a tent at an Occupy Wall Street outpost?

This kind of breathless desperate contemporaneity is what makes journalism loathsome. Too bad it didn't fade with the slow death and retirement of print reporters.

otoh Reagan has always parsed best as a Gatsby figure: born in Nowheresville, recreates himself, still a nullity even as prez but animated by weird green lights at the end of the dock.

The tragedy that befalls him — we're treading delicately here, to avoid the dreaded spoiler — is based on a misunderstanding, and could've befallen anyone. His fate is almost beside the point.

I hope this is a joke.

the reagan comparison is actually pretty inspired!

I'm rereading The Great Gatsby now. I started it on June 7, i.e. exactly 90 years after Nick's initial visit to Tom and Daisy. (It usually doesn't take me that long to read such a short novel, but I set it aside for a while.) Anyway, it's fantastic -- and incredible how modern it feels.

(The only other time I read it was in high school.)

Just reread it myself this week on vacation. (Odd, never mentioned finally reading it the first time a couple of years back.) I was vaguely disappointed on the first read then, so I'm glad the reread worked more for me, probably because since there was nothing to spoil per se I could luxuriate a bit in the telling. For all that it's a short novel, I found it something best for lingering rather than racing through.

Interesting catching the bits of descriptive detail that did end up in the trailer (like the group in the car racing across the bridge near the start) but so much of that trailer, admittedly due to the edit and soundtrack, is so skew-whiff to how the novel simply feels.

I should reread this. only ever read it in high school under the tutelage of my worst English teacher of all time.

Maybe second-worst. Didn't really stop me from enjoying it at the time though, at least.

yeah I probably should re-read it too. I was a bit underwhelmed the first time.

Maybe it's time I gave Fitzgerald a full-blown shot...

the blue honey of the Mediterranean

Saw GATZ last night, just amazing. The reading made the text absolutely sing, and the performance brought the characters to life, it's really more than the sum of its parts and I thought it was a solid 10 even though I had problems with some of the cast choices, Gatsby in particular. He was too old, too balding, too monotone. Sounds like a major criticism but because so much of the play is carried by the reading it wasn't such a big deal.

They really brought out the humour of the book, played some of the scenes almost farcically. Maybe pushed it too far once or twice but nbd. Like when girls rubbing champagne into Gatsby's hair was mentioned, Nick looked up sharply at the balding Gatsby, and he turned to frown at the audience. lulz.

the way they stage the party at tom's mistress's house in the early part of the book is amazing.

yeah this was probably the highlight.

ledge! yay! i can see the criticism of the dude who played gatsby but omg the dude who played nick!!! amirite? he was amazing.

i hope it was the same dude in london. scott shepherd?

yep, a tour de force indeed. loved the way he started off just reading, somewhat hesitantly and woodenly, and gradually became nick. well worth a standing ovation but none of the other fuckers in my row (at the front in the top balcony) stood up.

I liked the way that the actor who played Gatsby looked nothing like how I imagined the character to look. It enhanced the shifting between the story and the office environment.

Somehow I don't see Gatsby as being a summer blockbuster.

I'm still waiting for Elevator Repair Service to announce their fall plans for Gatz, I really want to see it. Now that I have money.

They know their audience. It's their only hope. xp

Already jokes on Twitter about how the plan is to make it into three movies.

just a web series will do

Yeah, this seemed perfectly suited to winter. What are the big summer 2013 would-bes it will be up against?

Iron Man, Superman, Iron Man, Hungry Man, Area Man

I'm OK with pushing it to summer if only b/c the novel takes place during summer.

Dead Man, Rain Man II: The Rainier, Rich Man Richer Man

Star Trek 2, Iron Man 3, Fast and Furious, um, 6, Hangover 3, Superman 6, World War Z, Monsters Inc. 2, Robopacalypse, Pacific Rim.

Grown Ups 2, Smurfs 2.

I'm OK with pushing it to summer if only b/c the novel takes place during summer.

Would be funny if all movies were shown exclusively during the season in which they are set.

prob a new Kiarostami too

Would be funny if all movies were shown exclusively during the season in which they are set.

"A long time ago..."

Kiarostami 2.

Tarr 2: The Reckoning.

this time it's personal.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_8vkug9iozgk/SfCbK1L6NXI/AAAAAAAAAI8/3DiLCmziEbY/s400/p-28308-38250P-cat.jpg

live action garfield sequel?

the crated catsby

a couple years old -- Bilge Ebiri on mistaking TGG for a 'star-crossed romance.'

When people talk about the lack of chemistry between Redford and Farrow in Clayton’s film, I have to laugh, bitterly: Any honest depiction of this story pretty much ensures that there will be no chemistry between them.

http://ebiri.blogspot.de/2010/11/its-gonna-be-hard-for-me-to-keep-my.html

We got new trailer:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7AFnJbETLw

this is going to be gatsby with pitchfork music isn't it. ffs.

very little gravitatsby indeed

I'm not sure why film makers think people want to see period clothes, cars, and interior design but somehow can't handle period music.

I know Nick is not an old character but Toby Maguire seems like a babe in arms compared to the considerate & understanding character in the book. Or maybe I'm just lol old, the police are getting younger every day. I think Leo could actually pull off a decent Gatsby in a less flamboyant production.

it actually looks good visually but i really don't think there's any need for some pop version of gatsby at a time when people are so obsessed with drama from that era.

People are really into the 20s right now?

somehow can't handle period music.

1) Last film version had period music, bombed

2) it's Luhrmann (in the vapor trail of Tarantino)

saw the trailer to this before django oh the lols and oh my eyes

is this thing getting dumped?

Man, never realised Ben Affleck was in the running to play Tom Buchanan.

I re-read this last year. It's great, the words are wonderful and poetic, it's a well put-together piece of literature. But it is basically all about rich people that have nothing to do but lay around all day drinking and smoking and getting into drama. It's basically a literary forerunner of celebrity-based reality TV.

I kept reading, thinking "Oh, wow, that's a great phrase" every so often but mostly wondering WHEN IS SOMETHING GOING TO HAPPEN. And by the time it does i don't really care about any of these people.

So is there a movie coming out

Quit reminding me.

Filter will always remind you

And as noted:

Surely there's no way in hell Baz has been able to resist Lana Del Rey?

― Homosexual Satan Wasp (Matt DC), Wednesday, May 23, 2012 7:56 AM (11 months ago)

thank you for this, now I can convince my wife not to go see this

― that is a weird thing to bring up over lean cuisine (DJP), Wednesday, May 23, 2012 7:57 AM

And yes, she's on the soundtrack

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5snA5TEse9w

ILM vivisection beginning:

The Great Gatsby soundtrack from hell

A tale of two covers.

Will this version at least let Nick be gay?

letnickbegay.tumblr.com

ugh, I normally shrug at movie tie-in book covers but the original Gatsby one is so classic

apparently hemingway thought the original gatsby cover made it look like a 'bad science fiction' novel!

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2013/04/26/business/media/Gatsby/Gatsby-popup.jpg

The new cover looks like the blonde woman is waiting for Giant Leo to take her from behind...

...but all of a sudden all these normal-sized people appeared between them, and she's like "What the fuck, who are you?!"

Just waiting for the "green light."

Clearly the soundtrack should have had Leo covering "Permanent Green Light."

Oh no: http://www.thedailybeast.com/videos/2013/04/09/jake-gyllenhaal-reads-great-gatsby.html

i'm totally in favor of this movie, btw, even though i'll probably never see it. kill yr idols

he died in 1940

well technically he died as soon as he sent the final manuscript to the printers

lol pp

I re-read this last year. It's great, the words are wonderful and poetic, it's a well put-together piece of literature. But it is basically all about rich people that have nothing to do but lay around all day drinking and smoking and getting into drama. It's basically a literary forerunner of celebrity-based reality TV.

terrific insight, thank you

did Jake say that

The Hills is the Great American Novel

the design theme for this movie kind of makes it look like an art deco Tron

http://basketball.themarsreel.com/nba/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/enhanced-buzz-696-1353704553-2.jpg

OMFG: http://www.cleveland.com/books/index.ssf/2013/05/gatsby_in_3-d_is_a_manic_three.html

Nick is the readers' surrogate, our guide as we observe the almost unimaginable swirl of wealth and privilege and carelessness surrounding Jay Gatsby and Daisy and Tom Buchanan.

Nick is the outsider looking in, and he is telling his story to us. Directly.

So imagine my surprise to find, when I saw Baz Luhrmann's adaptation of "The Great Gatsby" (opening Friday), that in addition to bringing his trademark over-the-top, three-ring circus atmosphere to the movie -- not to mention the 3-D effects, which I fervently wish I had not seen -- Luhrmann has made a critical change in the narration.

In this version, Nick is writing "The Great Gatsby" as therapy. Under orders from a psychiatrist.

Nick is back in the Midwest, but here he is in a sanitarium, drying out and recovering from the experiences he had with Gatsby and the Buchanans back East. He begins telling the doctor about it, starting with the famous opening, "In my younger and more vulnerable years, my father gave me some advice . . ."

But not too long into it, he stops: "I don't want to talk about this, doctor."

"Then write about it," the doctor says.

"Why would I write about it?" Nick asks.

"You said yourself writing brings you solace," the doctor says. Then he hands Nick paper and a pen that -- thanks to the 3-D -- seems to float, defying gravity and glowing like a magic sword being handed to a comic-book superhero.

ARRGH

I think I might actually have a stroke if I watch this movie.

yessssssss #nodads

Buh.

Xpost Lol. Universal Studios presents the great gatsby

i am not seeing this

lmao

I mean, I dislike the 1974 Great Gatsby but it sounds like a masterwork compared to this.

this sounds incredible

Guys, guys, we're missing the key point about what's going to happen here, surely -- the big pair of eyes will COME TO LIFE. And at the end of the movie, they will stare...at YOU.

I keep telling friends that it's probably going to be an amazing clusterfuck of horribleness that is entertaining

Yeah im seeing this opening night. I like how its not just sort of in bad taste, but just all out, over the top insane

Okay, I'll see it if someone keeps the spirits of elderflower coming.

Comment from a friend in the office: "Coming soon, Baz Luhrmann's The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn. It's a mockumentary."

The roundup thus far

http://www.fandor.com/blog/daily-baz-luhrmanns-the-great-gatsby

Wise words from Robert Towne on turning down writing the '70s version: "I felt it was a very chancy thing to attempt. A lot of what was in the novel was by suggestion. So much of it was in prose and so much of it was utterly untranslatable, and even if you could translate it, I thought it would be a thankless task and you’d just be some Hollywood hack who fucked up a classic. I felt that I had a lot to lose and very little to gain. That whole book is a mirage."

I can't wait for Luhrmann's adaptation of Swann's Way:

He begins telling the doctor about it, starting with the famous opening, "For a long time I used to go to bed early. . . ."

But not too long into it, he stops: "I don't want to talk about this, doctor."

"Then write about it," the doctor says.

"Why would I write about it?" Marcel asks.

"You said yourself writing brings you solace," the doctor says. Then he hands Marcel paper and a pen that -- thanks to the 3-D -- seems to float, defying gravity and glowing like a magic sword being handed to a comic-book superhero.

Wise words from Robert Towne on turning down writing the '70s version: "I felt it was a very chancy thing to attempt. A lot of what was in the novel was by suggestion. So much of it was in prose and so much of it was utterly untranslatable, and even if you could translate it, I thought it would be a thankless task and you’d just be some Hollywood hack who fucked up a classic. I felt that I had a lot to lose and very little to gain. That whole book is a mirage."

Yes, that's completely otm.

Very.

makes me curious to see the '26 silent version actually

I couldn't remember yesterday how many times it's been adapted.

not as many as Jane Eyre, which is about 20-25

just can't get enough of that uplifting Jane Eyre story

best really to take what you can from the plot and discard the rest (i.e. good Henry James adaptations).

I can't wait for Luhrmann's adaptation of Swann's Way:

He begins telling the doctor about it, starting with the famous opening, "For a long time I used to go to bed early. . . ."

But not too long into it, he stops: "I don't want to talk about this, doctor."

"Then write about it," the doctor says.

"Why would I write about it?" Marcel asks.

"You said yourself writing brings you solace," the doctor says. Then he hands Marcel paper and a pen that -- thanks to the 3-D -- seems to float, defying gravity and glowing like a magic sword being handed to a comic-book superhero.

― A deeper shade of lol (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, May 6, 2013 10:43 AM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

"When I awoke this morning from uneasy dreams, I found myself transformed into a gigantic...I don't want to talk about this doctor."

"Then write about it."

"Why would I write about it," Gregor asked, laying on his hard, as it were, armor-plated back.

"Mother died today"

"Tell me more about that"

"Or maybe it was yesterday, I don't remember"

"Do you not remember, or do you not want to remember?"

"If you really want to hear about it, the first thing you'll probably want to know is where I was born, and what my lousy childhood was like, and how my parents were occupied and all before they had me . . . I don't want to talk about this, doctor."

"Then write about it," the doctor says.

"Why would I write about it? It makes me feel crummy, like a great big phoney."

Kathryn Schulz explains why the novel is "aesthetically overrated, psychologically vacant, and morally complacent; I think we kid ourselves about the lessons it contains."

This gem: "The Great Gatsby might be the least funny book about rich people ever written." A friend and I quote Tom and Nick's Nordic race exchange all the time. "It's about you and you and -- you."

I believe NYU once staged South Pacific in a mental institution.

(I mean conceptually, not did the show in one)

He begins telling the doctor about it, starting with the famous opening, "In my younger and more vulnerable years, my father gave me some advice . . ."

Believable dialogue.

"...never say anything to a doctor."

"What?"

"In fact, fuck you, I'm not crazy, you're the one who's crazy."

I believe NYU once staged South Pacific in a mental institution.

― Pope Rusty I (Dr Morbius), Monday, May 6, 2013 11:28 AM (20 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Sade/Pacific

Such a weird way of twisting the opening of that book too -- it's all about how NICK is the quiet, unwittingly receptive person who everyone unloads on, iirc, so very awkward to have him being the one talking to a therapist. Also, I really hope this isn't some kind of bookend framing device where in the end it turns out he had a nervous breakdown because of his experiences with Gatsby or some bullshit.

Also, I really hope this isn't some kind of bookend framing device where in the end it turns out he had a nervous breakdown because of his experiences with Gatsby or some bullshit.

It sounds like it is, though.

Which means unreliable narrator, right?

wish it featured a Redford cameo as "old Gatsby"

wait how would there be an old Gatsby

Sade/Pacific

― Huston we got chicken lol (Phil D.), Monday, May 6, 2013 3:49 PM (37 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

wld pay to see this

xp well, not that old

The lacuna in the narrative regarding Gatsby and Daisy’s relations that summer saves Fitzgerald the trouble of writing dialogue for them that would have underlined their shallowness (one of the reasons why Daisy’s line about Gatsby’s beautiful shirts works: it happens just once)

that is kind of the greatness of the book, that it's a tale about Gatsby that has epic qualities but really he's just trying to fit in and seduce the most vapid people

That aspect ... might translate!

:)

that is kind of the greatness of the book, that it's a tale about Gatsby that has epic qualities but really he's just trying to fit in and seduce the most vapid people

― mh, Monday, May 6, 2013 12:35 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

actually just the existence of this remake is sort of making me think about the book a little differently -- it's all about strivers partying with new money people.

For sure, Tom Buchanan is old money but still a midwesterner like the rest of the main cast, but they're attempting to blend into the NY social scene, none of which shows up to Gatsby's funeral.

me speak english

wait how would there be an old Gatsby

I could see Baz Luhrmann changing it so that he lives, this movie seems that goofy.

obi-wan-style ghost gatsby

Has anyone read this?
http://www.amazon.com/Trimalchio-Version-Cambridge-Edition-Fitzgerald/dp/0521890470/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1367859678&sr=8-1&keywords=trimalchio

well, he could be Gatsby's father (Gatz) who shows up to the funeral

the remake should have Gatsby as a multi-millionaire from an herbalife style scheme. He could be a positivity-preaching crossfit junkie. Maybe Carraway is a would be app-designer seeking VC funding or something.

let's not

this framing story enrages me more than any other stupid thing about this movie.

I heard Gatsby's going to be in the next Avengers

Tbh though, i dont care about "faithful" adaptations. The book exists, it's its own thing, and this is something different.

yeesh @ that schulz article. i mean no one's obligated to like anything, but when someone trots out the 'there aren't any likable characters!' line, you know it's time to run for the hills.

Yeah I didn't quite get her bug -- ok, you don't like the book, but what does Edward St. Aubyn have to do with anything? Is caustic satire the only way rich people are supposed to be written about? High moralistic melodrama can make for a great read!

I'm surprised ppl still get away with the "likable characters" criteria.

the characters in Edward St. Aubyn's books are all horrible, including the narrator

agggh I just read about that stupid framing device ...

I liked Strictly Ballroom, I liked Romeo & Juliet, hell I didn't mind Moulin Rouge. Australia was duuuumb and a snooze. But this is a bridge too far. I knew it would be horrendous just from the trailer. But now with this new information...this is like Sandra Lee 'reimagining' Julia Child's Mastering the Art of French Cooking. Baz Luhrman IS the Sandra Lee of movies.

nick carraway is a likable character!

so is gatsby, for that matter

except when Sam Waterston played him

Gatsby is likeable but you end up pitying or loathing him because he's accomplished so much and all he wants to do with it is chase after Daisy

damn, dude, I get your single-mindedness but you have to get over it

Or maybe he just likes green lights?

"Darling, Tom has cornered the market and I need to complete my Christmas lights portfolio."

i find gatsby very likable and sympathetic. one of the saddest things about the david michaelis book about charles schulz was learning how deeply schulz identified with gatsby.

i agree. gatsby's a dreamer more than anything. to call him "materialistic" is to simplify things: his understanding of status, as an outsider, is the fathest thing from "worldly." i always thought the tragedy of gatsby is that he is a determined guy of enormous imaginative capacity who wasted these gifts on such a superficial version of the american dream.

always considered Reagan a Gatsby figure: born in a nothing Midwestern town; a blank, forced to recreate himself.

so all Midwesterners are blanks now huh

the one thing reagan seems to be lacking is the kind of insane, blind, driving passion that motivates gatsby. unless his 'daisy' was the laffer curve.

i don't think that's that far off. reagan's america was a fantasyland where hard work always pays off and the government doesn't need to messily step in and stop the egregious harm that comes from very un-perfect market dynamics, which do not necessarily benefit the public good. like his voters, he might have bought into the dream.

sorry for all those adjectives.

I've made the analogy before. The guy was a nullity -- even to his wife -- who cared only about a blinkered if powerful vision of America.

Charles Foster Kane too.

do you think gatsby was a nullity though? i always assumed a guy like that must have a rich inner life. you don't see it because all of his creative energy is devoted to maintaining the mystique of his self-invented personality.

a good update on the gatsby myth is the movie rushmore. i always assumed that behind gatsby there is a creative little max fischer he has slowly refined out of existence.

It's Nick telling the story, of course, but he doesn't he call him an elegant young roughneck or something?

hm, it's been a while since i've read the book. my impression is that gatsby was -- to nick -- very cool, detached, and elegant. it's only by closely observing him that nick realizes that gatsby has this obsessive, blinding ambition to realize a dream version of his life he made up for himself long ago, and that most people would have long since moved past

but my point is that it takes a certain personality to cling to your dreams that fiercely, and refuse to adapt your expectations in accord with changing circumstances.

http://sallykohn.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/reagan.jpg

Red light! Red light!

wtf Amitabh Bachchan is in this?!? as a Jewish gangster?

oh weird, i thought that was a picture of reagan.

xp Baz Luhrmann don't care.

Walter Chaw of Film Freak Central:

The great irony of Baz Luhrmann's unwatchable farrago The Great Gatsby is that it's not so much an interpretation of its titular hero's self-aggrandizing fandangos as a literalization of one. It's all surface, all façade, and not coincidentally, the most successful thing about it is Luhrmann's shooting of Gatsby's legendary parties as infernal bacchanalia. But that bit of useful critique is clearly a fluke, an accident of Luhrmann's one-trick pony kicking over the single element in Fitzgerald's book that is remotely compatible with Luhrmann's style. The marriage of Baz with Fitzgerald, in fact, is a little like asking Michael Bay to adapt The Brothers Karamazov--it's Timur Bekmambetov's A Farewell to Arms. It's showing off in the loudest, most obnoxious way possible, without any kind of critical, nay, useful, rationale for all the bread and circus--an asshole at play with Welles's "best train set a boy could ever want," with the casualty only what's possibly the best American novel ever written. It's an effrontery to taste, the sole consolation being that as Baz Luhrmann's The Great Gatsby is something of a motherless child, there's no one who will love it. No one could.

deployment of welles chestnut p devastating there imo

I dunno, isn't Baz the kinda brechtian ideal for this sort of shit? Doesn't the massive detachment make the point?

well he says the party scenes are good

Zacharek didn't hate this.

lol novel as "casualty" ... the book is there and always will be. Portnoy's Complaint was made into a lousy movie, you know.

glad we'll be spared the 'catcher in the rye' movie for another three decades at least.

neveldine/taylor already working on that one sry

actually a book probably survives a REALLY shitty movie even better than a meh one, because no one remembers the shitty movie in ten years. Wasn't there a Seize the Day movie with Robin Williams or something?

unsearchable on youtube because of that dead poets society scene

http://www.mediacircus.net/jakobtheliar1.jpg

hey for what it's worth the reviewers on amazon seem to like it

http://www.amazon.com/Seize-the-Day/product-reviews/B000QGVV5G/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1

although one of them apparently wasn't sure which movie s/he watched:

2 of 5 people found the following review helpful
4.0 out of 5 stars MY REVIEW FOR THIS MOVIE, November 12, 2000
By Masayo Hayakawa (Chiba Japan) - See all my reviews
This review is from: Seize the Day [ VHS ] (VHS Tape)
"DEAD POET SOCIETY" I like this movie, because I was moved by it. Perhaps, this movie tells us that you don't have to obey your parents and try to be honest to yourself and live anything you like!! In this film, all children obey their parents. The school the children go to is very strict. One day a teacher named Mr.Keating came to school. Mr Keating is a free-thinker. Because of his appearence,children's thinking is changing day by day. In this film, my favorite charactor is Mr Keating,because he always smiling and I like his way of thinking. The most impressive scene for me is when Mr.Keating leaves the school and students stand up on their desks and say, "Oh, Chaptain my chaptain" I couldn't control myself and moved into tears.
At last, I think this film is worth seeing very much , please rent this film and watch it!!

https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/5336775168/h3B3014D2/

http://jezebel.com/a-great-gatsby-book-report-by-a-kid-who-only-saw-the-mo-499342823

The Robin Williams Seize the Day (made for PBS) is one of his best performances, Hurting.

“It’s just a dream at this point,” Baz Luhrmann tells the Hollywood Reporter‘s Merle Ginsberg and Gary Baum, but what he’s really like to do is re-team with Leonardo DiCaprio, after Romeo + Juliet and The Great Gatsby, on Hamlet.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/baz-luhrmann-i-want-leonardo-518858

i had never known about that seize the day movie but i am curious now. that is one of my favorite books.

btw i am seeing gatsby tonight and i am psyched. i went to iron man two nights ago with one of my friends who is into comics and i was very jealous of the teenagers dressed in 20s costumes who were at the theater, they seemed to be having a richer experience at the cinema than i was.

teenagers dressed in 20s costumes

Actual IRL 3D!!!!

You know what Hamlet is missing? Lots of songs and jumpy editing.

plus he'll probably try and try and it'll still be less ridiculous than the one where marcellus is a 70-year-old jack lemmon (nb i love this movie)

oh my god this movie

I embarrassed my movie companions by flailing around in disgust and futy

fury

tell me in detail how terrible it was pleeeeeease horseshoe

Was there a long slow tracking shot from overhead with Gatsby in the pool, the camera pulling away to show a perfectly circular swirl of red leaves, as the xx's song on the soundtrack played?

(A good friend made an exact bet that this is how the song would be used and in what context.)

i need a hate-filled horseshoe review of this

^^^

I want to know if the totally minor, non-life-threatening drunken car accident is exaggerated into some kind of hit-n-run vehicular manslaughter. That was my big bet on this movie.

i'm seeing this tonight and i've already decided that i like it.

lol viceroy

I want to know if the totally minor, non-life-threatening drunken car accident is exaggerated into some kind of hit-n-run vehicular manslaughter. That was my big bet on this movie.

based on the costumed attired of everyone lining up out the door of the movie theater i drove by last night, this is like 'episode 1' for the mad men set.

come back horseshoe

needs a few random sprays of tommmygun fire to lend authenticity

http://www.vice.com/read/james-francos-impressions-of-gatsby

Would anyone object to a production of Hamlet in outer space?

haha i really want to read this as franco testing the waters for an upcoming project rather than just a rhetorical question

he's just filmed Faulkner's As I Lay Dying, presumably set on Earth.

xp the best part of that is that the presumed answer is "of course not!"

plz tell me he plays the corpse

i would def watch franco as hamlet in space

http://metro.co.uk/2013/05/15/bret-easton-ellis-baz-luhrmanns-great-gatsby-must-be-a-ghastly-prank-3759717/

The 49-year-old previous suggested that his Twitter feed could be read as his new novel.

Franco as Osric would be facile casting.

haha sorry i never returned to vent my spleen!

1. baz luhrmann has some kind of disorder where everything has to be about romantic love--that is not what this book is about! there's a thinness to his interpretation.<---this is a vast understatement of my true feelings. it hardly seems like it's about America at all.

2. if you're going to open your movie with the iconic first words of the novel in voiceover (which you should), don't edit the iconic words. you are not a better writer than f. scott fitzgerald. i wish i could remember exactly how it was reworded, but it basically changed nick's father's advice to him! the nerve!

3. toby maguire sounds like he's going through puberty. and delivers his lines like his reading comprehension is around the level of a young man going through puberty. nick carraway has to be believably smart. wry even. if i had to pick a single worst thing about this movie, it would be toby froggy maguire.

4. why is this movie in 3D?

5. i can't even really talk about the framing device. the doctor at the sanitarium (!!!) uses the words "find solace" at least three times. i kept imagining fitzgerald violently puking and spinning in his grave all at once.

6. there's a throwaway scene of a three black people listening to "Izzo" and riding in a car as the camera pans over cases of Moet. why, Luhrmann?

7. everything that Fitzgerald accomplishes through indirection, luhrmann's script makes explicit. there's a scene where, i think, Nick comments on the eyes of Dr. T.J. Eckleberg. And then intones, "the eyes of God." ow, baz luhrmann.

i really should have posted in the heat of the moment but i was drunk and sleepy. i forget all the details now. diCaprio is not bad, but the direction totally ruins his performance. while Nick is narrating the famous lines about his smile, the camera lingers on diCaprio's face for, like, an hour. even the best actor would seem frozen in place after a while. it's kind of an impossible role, to be fair. one of the people i saw it with said she didn't even sympathize with movie Gatsby, and that it was hard to care about anyone.

things i liked: the hushed version of "Crazy in Love" on the soundtrack. the dude who played Tom is pretty good and god help me, i think his Hitler mustache is kind of a clever visual cue in a totally obvious "do you see? do you see" Luhrmann kind of way.

i sort of thought amitabh bachchan was great. too bad he was in it for 2.5 seconds.

horseshoe otm all around imho

everything that Fitzgerald accomplishes through indirection, luhrmann's script makes explicit.

literature vs film

not that you can probably tell over the luhrmann, but tobey maguire looks like he's stinking the joint up as nick.

― horseshoe, Wednesday, May 23, 2012 9:54 AM (11 months ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

turns out, you can totally tell, even though luhrmann's luhrmanning all over the place.

literature vs film

― A deeper shade of lol (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, May 15, 2013 5:04 PM (53 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yes, and i like that Robert Towne quote you posted upthread, but if you're going to take on this thankless adaptation, don't have tobey fucking maguire actually SAY, "the eyes of God" like you're SparkNotes or some fucking thing. there have to be ways to do this better.

obvs the only way to do it is to read every word of the novel and have it be 8 hours long, like Gatz

It's just as bad as that EXTREME CLOSE UP LOOK OUT THIS IS IMPORTANT closeup of Robert Redford in the '74 film as he says "Her voice is full of MONEY."

Baz would score that line to Pink Floyd's "Money" though.

ugh don't remind me

when they used the VO to give a heavy-handed interpretation of daisy's line about the shirts

ty horeshoe, I feel even better about not seeing this

I'm sure I'll watch it out of curiosity when it's on tv or something but there's no way I'm going to the theater to see it, I'd rather put spoons in my eyes

that was bad

if you're going to do a lit classic, you either do it with pungent typecasting like Lean in Great Ezpectations -- but then Dickens is so different, begging to be PERFORMED -- or shake things up like Campion w/ Portrait of a Lady.

if neither of those will work, do an original or a pulp adap, so no one will be grading you.

i did think that the actor who played tom was a good physical match to how i imagined tom in the novel, at least much more than bruce dern in that respect

yes, i agree, elmo. the 1974 movie is crappy as far as i can remember? i am not sure i've ever seen the whole thing tbh.

it's one of the worst films ever made

i don't have such a bad recollection of the '74 film but it's been since highschool

strange that '74 Gatsby's director, Jack Clayton, did the brilliant film of "The Turn of the Screw," The Innocents.

haha thats an awesome post horseshoe

are there any non-gatsby fitzgerald films? 'bernice bobs her hair' might make a good short film.

the guy who played tom is joel edgerton, he has a great old timey mug on him. he looked like a buff conan o'brien in Warrior

xpost there's a movie version of Keep the Aspidistras Flying and I can't for the life of me remember what it was called, it was Richard e Grant & helena Bonham carter, it was p good!

don't forget the shitty shitty shitty benjy button

can't imagine this gatsby being worse than that

People who've seen Gatsby for work are complaining that the characters all look too sweaty. So that's a fail, because preppies don't sweat - they perspire.

about the only thing the Clayton version got right: even in an expensive Upper East Side hotel you can still sweat like horses.

I liked Button, was merely 'suggested' by FSF.

Kazan's Last Tycoon w/ De Niro is fuzzy in my memory. Jason Robards did a Tender Is the Night film, never saw it.

De Niro's quite good in TLT, one of his least heralded performances. The movie's a waste of a good cast though.

uggggggh what part of fitzy's funny acid little story suggested that 6hr borefest xp

i saw the last tycoon and barely remember anything about it

There's a 70s PBS version of Bernice w/Shelly Duvall.

I checked out of the public library a loooooong time ago. She was fine playing a variant on her 3 Women character.

i just want to see a version of gatsby where everyone is exactly as terrible as they are in the book

The Australian director added: "The other night we had a premiere and completely out of the blue a woman came out of the audience. She was quite old and frail. She held me by the hand and said, 'I've come to see what you did with my grandfather's book.' And of course I went cold, because I didn't know it was Fitzgerald's granddaughter.

"She said, 'All his life he's been maligned because you can't transfer first person narrative into film and in my opinion you have done it, and he would be very proud'."

yeah this doesn't sound made up

Why would Gatsby's granddaughter think her grandfather had been maligned because you can't transfer first person narrative into film? Like wtf has this got to do with F Scott?

Sorry Fitzgerald's granddaughter

When director Baz Luhrmann went on “The Colbert Report” last week to talk about his new adaptation of The Great Gatsby, he mentioned that a “very regal woman” took him by the hands after the movie’s world premiere and told him she’d come all the way from Vermont to see what he’d done with her grandfather’s book.

That woman was Bobbie Lanahan, an artist, animator and filmmaker, and the daughter of F. Scott and Zelda Fitzgerald’s only child, Scottie.

Why would Gatsby's granddaughter think her grandfather had been maligned because you can't transfer first person narrative into film? Like wtf has this got to do with F Scott?

it's bollocks anyway

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/5/58/Doom_movie_poster.jpg/220px-Doom_movie_poster.jpg

Why would Gatsby's granddaughter think her grandfather had been maligned because you can't transfer first person narrative into film? Like wtf has this got to do with F Scott?

ppl not necessarily makin sense shocker

people don't often make sense until they've seen doom the movie

i haven't seen doom the movie, fwiw

always a little weird when people act like somebody's descendants have some kind of unique insight into their work. i mean first-generation maybe, if it's a working relationship like vladimir+dmitri or jrr+christopher. if you're just scottie's daughter wtf would you know about the great gatsby.

(i mean, not weird in this case, cuz baz wants validation.)

i had fun at this movie. at the scene where gatsby was introduced and they showed leo's slick, smug face in slow motion framed by fireworks while nick talked about having "never seen a smile like that" i lost it, and started laughing, causing someone to kick the back of my seat. i think this movie suffers from the fact that the last time we saw leonardo di caprio in theaters he was also a multimillionaire lording over a massive estate, except he was a sadistic slave owner.

no, we didn't see that

did you see gatsby morbs?

I haven't seen DOOM. Is it any good? Does it have The Rock in it?

I just had a brush with death, Tship, I don't have 2-1/2 hrs for that.

feel you

Sorry to hear that Morbs. Hope you're feeling well.

thx i am, p much

I like that Scott Fitzgerald called his son Scottie. If they're smart they'll keep on iterating through the lineage so that his son is Scottington, then he begets Scottolas etc etc until you end up with great great great grandson Scottieottiedopaliscious.

lol

i don't have such a bad recollection of the '74 film but it's been since highschool

we got shown this in class too, but the discussion afterwards turned into an argument btwn me and the teacher about whether or not it was fuckin terrible

I like A.O. Scott comparing Alien/Franco amd Gatsby.

the only reason our Yr 11 English Lit teacher showed us the movie was because she had a crush on Robert Redford. We had JUST finished the novel and we all watched that movie just openly dismayed at how soft-focused and pastel and uggggggh it was, and the main cast were so wooden. We all yelled at her afterwards and she just hung her head and said, 'But Redford was pretty cute, right?"

And whenever I think of that stupid movie, I think of this Australian tv commerical - in my mind they're one and the same

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLXkL46-Ml0

honestly teachers should prob just show 'citizen kane' instead.

teachers should be barred from inflicting their celebrity crushes on students. I had to sit through at least 2 Richard Gere movies in my first year Cinema Studies class because my lecturer just couldn't help herself. Ugh.

Due to the raging Peter O'Toole obsession I had as a teenager, which I put down to 'beautiful man who is really good at enunciating profanity', I edited Becket down to a classroom-friendly 90 minutes for extra credit in a European history class when we were doing a church v. state unit and persuaded the cinema teacher (who didn't need a ton of persuading TBH) to add The Ruling Class to his syllabus.

We had JUST finished the novel and we all watched that movie just openly dismayed at how soft-focused and pastel and uggggggh it was, and the main cast were so wooden. We all yelled at her afterwards and she just hung her head and said, 'But Redford was pretty cute, right?"

ha ha a part of my argument was that Farrow was awful & unnuanced and 90% of her performance consisted of biting the back of her hand, and the teacher was like "she's an Oscar-winning actress, you can't say that she's bad"

if only I had known she was not an Oscar-winning actress

suzy, Becket is one of the great homo-lust movies.

Farrow was actually well cast as Daisy! She was just badly directed.

yeah never seen the coppola gatsby but mia as daisy works for me, makes more sense than dipsy mumford or whatever

but her voice sounds money, it doesn't sound LIKE money

Somehow, my English teacher didn't know that Romeo & Juliet had been turned into a modern-day musical until I mentioned it one day.

So I apologize to the next 15 grades that came through her room and had to watch West Side Story.

west side story is awesome. at first i thought you mean william shakespeare's romeo + juliet which is also pretty awesome. i think i pretty much like any movie of romeo & juliet, i'm just a big romantic i guess. justdudethings.

<3 West Side Story, hate the film of it, could go on forever, won't.

love the West Side Story movie

you're testing my commitment to not ranting about this at great length

i would love to hear your rant! tbh I've never seen the stage version, I just have nostalgia for watching the movie with my Mum

yeah go for it silby i loved it when i saw it too

Well my core objection to the film is that it casts adults to play the teenaged/maybe early 20s characters, which doesn't play on film like it does on stage, where you can suspend disbelief. It wrecks the whole hotheaded lovesick teenage-aimlessness theme of the show.

Other objections include casting mostly Anglos to play the Jets, and dealing with it by painting them all an identical shade of brown, and the repurposing of "Somewhere" from an anonymous soprano solo sung during the nightmare sequence that unites the warring gangs in a hopeful dream for a more humane future into a fucking SEX DUET.

In sum America is a land of contrasts and West Side Story is great when performed by high school students or Schlong.

Same English teacher showed us the 60s version of Romeo & Juliet, and jumped up to stand in front of the screen during the (5-second?) scene with nudity.

Also the prologue to West Side Story is like 20 minutes long.

Our teacher just fast forwarded the nude scene.

sex duet <3

our teacher screwed that up, to our stunned satisfaction

As he sings, the walls of the apartment begin to move off, and the city walls surrounding them begin to close in on them. Then the apartment it self goes, and the two lovers begin to run, battering against the walls of the city, beginning to break through as chaotic figures of the gangs, of violence, fail around them. But they do break through, and suddenly-they are in a world of space and air and sun. They stop, looking at it, pleased, startled, as boys and girls both sides come on. And they, too, stop and stare, happy, pleased. Their clothes are soft and pastel versions of what they have worn before. They begin to dance, to play: no sides, no hostility now; join, making a world that Tony and Maria want to be in, belong to, share their love with. As they go into the steps of a gentle love dance, a voice is heard singing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80-DtChQ39U

there's probably a better thread for this

wow Silby that just made me cry. what a voice!

THEEEERE'S AAAAAA THREAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAD FOR UUUUUUUUUUSSSS

WEST SIDE STORY motherjumping sountrack poll!

skip here for more versions of this song that are mostly better than the one in the film, including possibly the Barbara Streisand one

60s version of r&j is awesome, espec if you're in middle school and your teacher's bad at remembering when to fast-forward

the botched fast forwarding of that scene is like a universal experience among american middle schoolers

otm

No Zefferelli for us, sob. Our R&J experience was delivered by an irritating dumpling who used to shout 'this is MY TIME' when we stopped paying attention to her. We stopped paying attention to her because correcting her mistakes was tiring after the first fifty times it happened.

my sophomore english teacher held a cardboard box in front of the screen during the sex scene(s?) in the fishburne/branagh othello and i made some big deal about how it was absurd and typical that we were censoring the sex but not the violence. didn't make much sense cuz the fishburne/branagh othello isn't exactly peckinpah but it did at least waste a little class time.

I've still never seen the Zeffirelli R&J.

As for WSS, stage musicals belong on the stage, esp when an otherwise talented director has no facility for giving them visual rhythm (hey Robert Wise), and oh the lead actors aren't doing the singing.

also YOU KIDS MAKE THIS WORLD LOUSY

also YOU KIDS MAKE THIS WORLD LOUSY

― ballin' from Maine to Mexico (Dr Morbius), Friday, May 17, 2013 10:13 AM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark

otm

i used to say that line all the time. i need to add that one back to my repertoire... freaking kids

Zeffirelli is boring, but my roommate had me giggling when he MST3K'd the moment the maidens were throwing their flowers in Juliet's grave: "Here you go. Plug it up."

Would love to see WSS get the Rosencrantz & Guildenstern treatment with Morbius as Doc.

if u wanna do the original I look good in friar's robes too.

we didn't watch the zeffirelli but we watched the lolmann. god high school was weird. we did heart of darkness my junior year and spent like four class periods watching apocalypse now. boomers.

when we were doing ancient greece in world history class we watched spartacus cuz our teacher thought it was about sparta.

lol

btw the WSS Doc was a ubiquitous character actor on TV when I was a kid, and I just learned he was in a buncha classic 3 Stooges shorts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ned_Glass

i still love luhrmann's r+j, i blame nostalgia

so when will Gatsby be musicalized? inevitable, no? propose song titles.

i think danes+posthelwaite+especially leguizamo are all really good, and leo's ridiculously pretty. kinda hard to sit through for me tho. particularly remember it making a total hash out of the parents' parts. xp

postlethwaite. dunno why i thought i could get away with not googling that.

luhrmann's r+j is pretty good. insane-o production design and costuming. johnny leguizamo's a great tybalt

luhrmann's last good movie imo

so when will Gatsby be musicalized? inevitable, no? propose song titles.

"I Remember Yesterday," Donna Summer
"Barely Breaking Even," Universal Robot Band
"I'll Play the Fool," Dr. Buzzard's Original Savannah Band
"Weekend," Phreek
"I Love New York," Metropolis
"High Steppin', Hip Dressin' Fella (You Got It Together)," Love Unlimited
"A Little Bit of Jazz," Nick Straker Band
"Love Hangover," Diana Ross
"Standing In The Rain," Don Ray
"Hit 'n' Run Lover," Carol Jiani
"Car Wash," Rose Royce
"Running Away," Roy Ayers
"You Saved My Day," Cheryl Lynn
"Goin' To A Showdown," Don Armando's 2nd Avenue Rhumba Band
"Last Dance," Donna Summer
"Was That All It Was," Jean Carn
"The Red Light," Green Velvet

High frame speed Paul Sorvino. Pretty much all I remember.

xp

it is pretty good. it's about romantic love, which is i guess where he excels. i do not think danes is that good. baby dicaprio a perfect romeo imo. leguizamo kills; i can't read the play without picturing him now.

xp luhrmann's romeo and juliet, i mean

Natalie Portman had been chosen for the role of Juliet, but after production began, it was felt that the footage looked as though DiCaprio was "molesting" her.[4] Eventually, Luhrmann agreed that the age difference between the two actors was too great. Filming was halted to find another actress for the part.

whoa

the botched fast forwarding of that scene is like a universal experience among american middle schoolers

― Treeship, Thursday, May 16, 2013 11:58 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

omg yes, except i think my teacher didn't even bother? olivia hussey was a stone fox

also i have much love for R+J, had the soundtrack on repeat for ages. and yeah, leguizamo totally ruled.

xp whoah indeed

it's about romantic love

the parts he left in, anyway. certainly fits him better than gatsby.

i might not be being clearheaded about claire tho cuz that dress + sudden brief expression of alarmed betrayal on "what satisfaction canst thou have tonight?"

this gatsby is great...

http://cdn.avsforum.com/6/69/80x80px-LS-69cdc448_triumph_insult_comic_dog.jpeg

i still love luhrman's r+j, the look and style of it, and that dude that played Mercutio that ended up in Lost, he was rad
and PAUL RUDD

never forget:
http://media.portable.tv/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/romeo-juliet-claire-danes-paul-rudd-gif.gif

I liked this quite a bit for the most part; the first 40 minutes or so are just giddy with light and movement - Luhrmann really excels with the champagne-popping party scenes, and the car chase is deliriously nuts. The visuals overwhelm absolutely everything - and are wonderful, if wholly artificial seeming (oh, and the 3D is kind of integral, too) - but underneath it was a more faithful adaptation than I was expecting.
DiCaprio is excellent, and Joel Edgerton and the girl who plays Jordan Baker were both really good casting. Carey Mulligan, not so much. Carraway is a cipher anyway, and Tobey Maguire doesn't bump into the furniture or anything, so he didn't ruin it. I could really have done without the sanitorium bookends, and the film loses its fizz towards the end, but otherwise it's okay. It's not the cat's pajamas or anything, but we enjoyed it.

I prefered it to Moulin Rouge, for what it's worth. It's beneath Romeo + Juliet, though.

Carraway is a cipher

strongly disagree; he's kind of an awful snob iirc

he is not a cipher!

...he is a free man!

Nick Carraway as an ancestor of Ezra Koenig

Well, I've seen the Luhrmann rendition, and my favorite screen adaptation of Gatsby remains the one in 2010's The Extra Man. (Am I the only ILXor to have seen this?)

I will say the new version, like the recent version of Anna Karenina, is hyperactive where previous renditions were static, but that's about the only thing to be said on behalf of either production.

Question: Can Tobey Maguire Grow Facial Hair?

btw this movie was completely awesome fuiud

i think that 'fidelity to the work' is... an empty concept. kind of like comic book nerds who show up at iron man 3 press conferences and complain about why iron man's suit was tinted cinnamon in the movie and not maroon, like in the books. who really cares... u dont really need to be thinking about the book at all when watching this, no tombs of idols are being desecrated. the only complaint i had was maybe baz slops on the sentiment too thick at the end, w/ the lingering shot on gatsby as he falls backwards into the pool, but ennhhh, if youre in for a dime youre in for a dollar. loved the soundtrack to this, esp as synths play while there's a jazz band on screen. it's just a movie...

i think this movie had the best photographed martinis ive ever seen, they shimmer in every scene. also the bowl-glasses (hopefully a mixologist will tell me the proper name for this vessel) look so classy~~

hard to overstate how much those last two posts lowered my estimation of you

lol

damn, balls dropped his level of appreciation for me ;-(

iirc that makes your Persona less powerful

balls with the necessary tough love

also the bowl-glasses (hopefully a mixologist will tell me the proper name for this vessel) look so classy~~

champagne coupes, easy find at most Salvation Army-type places, used today mostly for cocktails instead of champagne

Nick Carraway as an ancestor of Ezra Koenig

I love this

damn, balls dropped

nicelydone.gif

who really cares...

well, when you put it that way

i'm sorry that baz sullied the prestigious doormat of f. scott fitzgerald with his dingo boots

comparing books to movies is never a good proposition, no matter how highly you esteem either the book or the movie

champagne coupes, easy find at most Salvation Army-type places, used today mostly for cocktails instead of champagne

― Sadly, 99.99 percent of sheeple will never wake up (I DIED), Sunday, May 19, 2013 11:07 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark

nice, will pick some up for the house parties i'm never gonna have

on one hand, i agree with you, because i don't think complaints about the general anachronistic flair of the production design & music cues are relevant criticism. but this version fundamentally changes the story and makes romantic love the central theme, and changes the characters in order to make it happen. it's not a "wrong" interpretation of the novel, really, but it's pretty facile and simplistic in a way that just empties the story of any relevance, imho. i don't think it's outrageous or fussy to want to see some more complexity from an adaptation.

aybe baz slops on the sentiment too thick at the end, w/ the lingering shot on gatsby as he falls backwards into the pool, but ennhhh,

WHOA! Spoiler alert!

Surprised he didn't shout he was having a Nestea Plunge.

it's not a "wrong" interpretation of the novel, really, but it's pretty facile and simplistic in a way that just empties the story of any relevance, imho. i don't think it's outrageous or fussy to want to see some more complexity from an adaptation.

― a ridiculous clusterfuck of totally uncool jokers (elmo argonaut), Monday, May 20, 2013 10:20 AM (15 minutes ago) Bookmark

yeah... i mean it's not OMG SHOCKING to anyone that a love story is one of the cores of the novel, but if you start saying stuff like 'empties the story of any relevance' again that's gonna be in comparison to the novel... it's best to just try to take this movie in on its own terms, most of us haven't read the great gatsby since high school so should be pretty easy to do

6. there's a throwaway scene of a three black people listening to "Izzo" and riding in a car as the camera pans over cases of Moet. why, Luhrmann?

my take is probably wrong but i felt like maybe this was one way that baz was trying to balance the grosser elements of the source material, i.e. you sorta need tom's diatribe against the 'colored empire' to show how bad of a guy he is + you need to show all his servants are black... so idk, showing that the wall street excess didn't just only include white ppl? cf also the heavyweight boxer

As we crossed Blackwell's Island a limousine passed us, driven by a white chauffeur, in which sat three modish negroes, two bucks and a girl. I laughed aloud as the yolks of their eyeballs rolled toward us in haughty rivalry.

so it's lifted right from the novel but stripped of nick's nonchalant racism

ah

sorry but tbh if you adapt one of the most famous and familiar texts of all time you don't get to cry 'don't compare it to the book, it stands on its own merits!'

one of the most famous and familiar texts of all time you, say, please tell me more abouzZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZzzzzz

sounds like you are target audience for this movie alright

why did u like the movie 乒乓

because it was a spectacle and i love spectacles

the party scenes alone are worth the price of admission

sounds like you are target audience for this movie alright

― (The Other) J.D. (J.D.), Monday, May 20, 2013 12:56 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark

yup, a completely uncultured and uneducated boor, dont even read the new yorker, 乒乓 the jock over here

i thought the movie was really well cast, i actually did enjoy leo's performance a lot... ever since i saw that gif of him doing nicholson eyebrows i have a sneaking suspicion his yoga teacher or w/e taught him how to control every single muscle on his face individually. he sort of has a perfect appropriate mask for every scene, it's great

i though the middle part of this was really good, i liked that i sort of lived on the surface of things, but the end was complete garbage

also every time he says 'old sport' it sounds like 'old spoaht' but sometimes the r's slip back in and u cant tell if thats james gatz's midwestern provincialism sneaking back in or is it just that leo is terrible with accents

a young nicholson might've been a good gatsby

because it was a spectacle and i love spectacles

― 乒乓, Monday, May 20, 2013 12:57 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark

he takes old-time footage from back then and turns it into 3D, theres a lot of planes that fly overhead and then all of a sudden ur zooming in from 10000 feet to ground level in 3 seconds like in that old trailer they'd show in front of IMAX science films at the franklin institute, it's really inexplicable

he literally asks WEGA or w/e studio effects house to recreate NYC for him, and long island, so he can have shots of just zooming along the water through mist

re popular texts, I don't remember John Huston's The Bible being thoroughly terrible; George C Scott was a good Abraham.

nb: i dont think ive seen a baz film from start to finish, also i love spectacles, i love times square, i love neon lights and places that feel like day in the night

is it just that leo is terrible with accents

yup

regardless of whether it's an accident tho i like that

haha i mean i guess we are at odds about spectacle, because i could not really deal with pirhana 3D: myrtle's mutilated breast fly @ u face

why weren't the eyes of t.j. eckleburg wearing 3D glasses, missed opportunity imho

we are dooooly appointed old spoats

"I love spectacles"

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-2C_xkImTZPE/TeMpAkOs7gI/AAAAAAAAACo/Hu5_WIXQrPA/s320/doctor_t__j__eckleburg_by_sukimd2.jpg

The New Statesman's critic actually ended his review with a joke about why Eckleburg should be wearing 3D glasses.

Erm, "I love spectacles"

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-2C_xkImTZPE/TeMpAkOs7gI/AAAAAAAAACo/Hu5_WIXQrPA/s320/doctor_t__j__eckleburg_by_sukimd2.jpg

why weren't the eyes of t.j. eckleburg wearing 3D glasses, missed opportunity imho

Arf. They made the Eckleburg billboard look reminiscent of the novel's most famous cover instead:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/b0/Gatsby_1925_jacket.gif/200px-Gatsby_1925_jacket.gif

the eyes of eckleburg were partly inspired by that cover -- fitz wrote to his publisher telling him not to change the cover because he'd 'written it into the book.'

taking a moment today to be thankful 17-year-old me never went through w that tattoo

hemingway:

A day or two after the trip Scott brought his book over. It had a garish dust jacket and I remember being embarrassed by the violence, bad taste and slippery look of it. It looked the book jacket for a book of bad science fiction. Scott told me not to be put off by it, that it had to do with a billboard along a highway in Long Island that was important in the story. He said he had liked the jacket and now he didn’t like it.

why weren't the eyes of t.j. eckleburg wearing 3D glasses, missed opportunity imho

― a ridiculous clusterfuck of totally uncool jokers (elmo argonaut), Monday, May 20, 2013 2:14 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

looooooooooooooool otm

dayo you are crazy but i love you

i will admit to kind of liking dicaprio's performance, too, but WHATEVER

i take your point about insisting on a faithful adaptation but movies shouldn't be poo

also if you are going to invite comparison to one of the best books ever i am not going to feel bad for you when your movie is dumb

dicaprio sounds like good casting, since hes not running away from his looks for once

dayo you are crazy but i love you

― horseshoe, Monday, May 20, 2013 4:40 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark

:D

i feel like i should probably explain myself a lil' more, i think my view of these things is p heavily influenced by hutcheon's a theory of adaptation, which views adapted works and their source materials not in a top-down hierarchal fashion - adaptations all deriving from a source, w/ usually the source presented as the 'best' and the ones which by all others are judged, are ranked; (though there are obv many examples where an adaptation becomes the defining example, see the shining film v. the shining book); rather, adaptation as always being a lateral move from the source. i'm probably being too glib when i say that u should always view adaptations w/o any reference at all to the source, obviously that's gonna be pretty hard to accomplish if you or your audience are familiar with both. but i'd like to see more than just "hah the [exalted, critically impervious work] is sacrosanct, definitive, anything else is automatically lesser, the most that an adaptation can hope to be is to be on par...."

you're basically otm I reckon & I've said similar things many times before but yeah you were way overstating it before

i think this movie is p good adaptation even its not necessarily 'about' the same things the novel is i think the middle third or so does a pretty excellent job of capturing what its like to be caught up in the novel, to live in its surfaces and succumb to its charms

a slow giving in and turning away

i think it's possible for film adaptations to exist in their own right, side by side without degradation of integrity, ie Kubrick's Shining vs King's Shining.

but it requires strength of an authorial vision, imo. if even the director is treating it as an adaptation, & even somewhat 'nursing' the original text, that shows & weakens the adaptation.

imo. idk. maybe that's bullshit, it sounded ok in my head

i havent seen baz's gatsby but i havent found anything yet that is really compelling me.

saying "comparing novels to books is never a good proposition" is a bit like saying that historical films should never be viewed in relation to the events on which they're based, and I reckon sometimes they should. It's worthwhile, sometimes. A film is a film and a book is a book, though, for sure.

all that said i would've like this a lot more if it had been directed by karl lagerfeld and carolyn murphy had replaced carrie mulligan and she had no dialogue and it had been 40 minutes long

lol "comparing novels to books" ffs

lol

lamp i would watch that

it also gets into sort of the differences b/w mediums, film and text are just so different from each other, opposed in many respects. prob the most untranslatable or immoveable experience of the text is the interiority of the characters, u can try to get at it w/ voiceovers (and i think baz framed the movie the way he did just to be able to get voiceovers in), u can change the plot (used in the sense of the ordering of the diff elements of the underlying story) to make the storytelling experience more effective, more 'adapted' to the experience of film... but really, the ingestion of text and film occurs at such different rates, and in such different ways, and the possibilities w/ each are so different...

(sorry that was an xpost to myself, had to take a phonecall)

love the book. know it every which way. don't feel any kind of way about baz. have never seen a 3-D feature. i'm off today and it's playing a block away. these champion sweats can hide a bottle of sancerre. yes, no?

historical films should never be viewed in relation to the events on which they're based,

yah man but what is meant by the word history, really

*bongrip*

in this particular case something that is often mentioned, including upthread, is that gatsby is a peculiar book cuz it looks like a 200-page soap opera about pretty rich people that you'll just be able to slap right up there, but so much of the work is being done by prose and strange tricks of structure and careful distancing that unless you are really clever in a way more than one filmmaker has rather spectacularly not been you are going to end up with a 2-hour soap opera about pretty rich people nobody likes. nb i have not seen this. but that's one legitimate reason to compare: if one version is way different and way less interesting and you suspect it has something to do with the media themselves.

haha oh xp

xp I call it HERstory

think about it

vaya con dios viacom dios

w/ a book u take it in at ur own pace, u read, reread, double back, u could be 20 pages from the end and realize that u need to reread a passage on pg. 28 that ends up being crucial to the understanding of a plot point

films are kinda like... that contraption in slaughterhouse five, bound immobile to a fixed dolly, viewing the world through a single opening in a particleboard, the gears neither slow nor speed up but move at their own fixed pace

random access gatsbies

the surrender of watching a film is totally different than the surrender of reading a book, the latter of which isn't maybe even a surrender at all but a complicit creation of a shared interior world

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-jGnPJiy_LxE/TexQwEfd0mI/AAAAAAAABGA/ahYNqdDmfWo/s1600/Poems+and+Problems+-+Vladimir+Nabokov.jpg

like, idk, i know its a stupid book, but when i first read house of leaves and the narrator mentions that the interior wall-to-wall measurement was 5 inches more than what the exterior wall-to-wall measurement was, man, such a chilling moment! and how would u even transpose that into film

I only watch choose your own adventure movies

in 3d

i sometimes wonder what nabokov would make of the total demystification of chess via supercomputers =(

oh man i haven't read house of leaves but the only reason i keep almost reading it is i think that revelation is SO CREEPY

in this particular case something that is often mentioned, including upthread, is that gatsby is a peculiar book cuz it looks like a 200-page soap opera about pretty rich people that you'll just be able to slap right up there, but so much of the work is being done by prose and strange tricks of structure and careful distancing that unless you are really clever in a way more than one filmmaker has rather spectacularly not been you are going to end up with a 2-hour soap opera about pretty rich people nobody likes. nb i have not seen this. but that's one legitimate reason to compare: if one version is way different and way less interesting and you suspect it has something to do with the media themselves.

haha oh xp

― the white queen and her caustic judgments (difficult listening hour), Monday, May 20, 2013 6:41 PM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark

yeah i think the other reason i like this is that, the ~greatest american novel ever written~ can be reduced to a p facile love story, and that interpretation isn't even wrong! it's def one of the armatures of the novel, and obv FSG only builds it up maybe to chop off bits of scaffolding here and there, make it unstable, but it's undeniably there, and its a totally valid frame for baz to hang his own tapestries from

ok i just sort of beat that metaphor up... maybe even collapsed it

good shit

books also allow for the reader's own interaction, allowing their mind's-eye to carry the story along. the difficulty, and delicacy of adapting a text is replacing the many individual visualizations of a story that in part now becames the reader's *own creation*, with a singular visualization that now tells you another way to see. that's a hard call with a text like Gatsby that has existed in people's minds for decades. Especially since Fitzgerald does do so much with the inner voices of his character.

oh man i haven't read house of leaves but the only reason i keep almost reading it is i think that revelation is SO CREEPY

― the white queen and her caustic judgments (difficult listening hour), Monday, May 20, 2013 6:50 PM (47 seconds ago) Bookmark

there are some really good parts! could have been a much better book via stronger editing, it's sort of classic first-novel-itis, overstuffed, danielewski could/should have spun off at least half the content of the book into separate works. but the first couple of chapters or so are really well done i think

would watch a Baz adaptation of "Bernice Bobs Her Hair."

historical films should never be viewed in relation to the events on which they're based,

sorry to return to this example but i've been meaning to watch marie antoinette and i can't help but think that knowing the intricacies of the french revolution probably wouldn't be too useful in appreeshing the film

oh man i haven't read house of leaves but the only reason i keep almost reading it is i think that revelation is SO CREEPY

i read 'the 50 year sword' on a plane last week and can recommend it p highly, it also takes the 20 mins to finish. its a better use of time than 'house of leaves' i think but has some of the same pleasures

hungry4ass did you like baz lurhman's 'the great gatsby'?