The Vagaries of Dating The Vagaries of Dating

What I'm saying, Louis, is there is NO SUCH THING as a person with mixed priorities. If having a relationship with a person is a priority, an interested person will make the time.

A person who is constantly chasing is never going to be a priority, because you can take them for granted.

1. Drop the phrase 'my boyfriend' or 'your girlfriend' offhand into the most casual of conversation with him.
2. Check reaction.
3. PROFIT???

I would actually say this, but instead of a conversation with him, make it a phone conversation with someone else when you're with him.

"Oh I'm just out shopping with my/the BOYFRIEND SQUEEEEEEEEEEEEEE."

Bear in mind, that I have never operated in that old skool way. I have always operated the "honesty is the best policy" kind of "let's talk about it and constantly establish where we are coz I am so insecure" policy. I am now a single woman in my late 30s. Your mileage may vary.

I am seriously going to shut up now.

So have I, with the same result at the same age. This is my maiden attempt at game-playing.

Well, I'm suggesting there ought to be a Moment rather than a Conversation, but it's still fine if there's a Conversation and it is brazened out. Some people prefer to have it laid out like that.

NickB's suggestion is vague and meaningful enough to work on the right level implied by its tone of voice/eye contact, good one

looool Nick11 yeah do everything suggested by a person called Nick basically

I do think it's possible to have mixed time priorities, but once the dude's turmoil has dulled, that is when this Moment/Conversation should happen, and these priorities can be rectified

Really there's not much need for actual game-playing. As far as I can see.

Oh NickB, that's actually pretty great. I might use it.

Well, obviously I take pride in my articulacy in these situations.

I've found that the only actual long term things I've had were the ones where there never *had* to be The Conversation.

maybe this was true for you but it was def not for me and for a lot of ppl i know.

'thing thing thing a thing'

I guess it was more "I didn't have to force a conversation". There was definitely some talking between the first shag and the "OK, I want you to move in with me" but it wasn't me going ARGH ARHG ARE WE DATING ARE WE INVOLVED WHAT ARE WE DOING as a constant panic.

Also, perhaps I am being harsh - things change as you get older. But I don't think there are any *absolutely* immovable priorities except for perhaps already existent children.

I don't know how long you've been seeing this guy, but the idea that someone would put the thing on hold for a month would make me go do something else for a month (not even necessarily dating someone else, just DO something else, take up macrame classes or get a DJ residency or something) and if he's still around at the end is up to him.

Yep Kate, this 'we just know' is my ideal but CAD, yes, this is why I haven't thrown in the towel yet - hope that complicated thangs can still be good thangs, especially once everyone's in their late 30s and sometimes their lives are not straightforward.

You know, this has actually been really helpful and given me a bit of perspective and even something to say (that can be said with raised eyebrows and a smile rather than a look of blind panic). Hell LJ, I am even looking forward to the Moment, however it turns out. (sorry Nick11, I am politely disregarding your suggestion though enjoying the mental picture).

Yeah this month I am mostly working and looking out for a friend who is having a really hard time, but also trying to get out and meet people a bit more.

oh re how long: since early June, but only seen him 5 or 6 times in that whole period - I was away in the UK, he thinks he's gonna get sacked if he doesn't meet this FY's deadlines, etc.

I trust there was enough chemistry to suggest that a union would Work? Conversation spilling on and on without you noticing? Genuine tenderness?

Seriously, there are still people in this world so stunted as to be actively scared if the person they were seeing referred to them as their "boyfriend"?!

I dated one last year! He told me he wasn't my boyfriend in front of his friends at the bar. I yelled at him in the street outside on the way home. Should have left right then, but I'm a sucker.

I think using words like "commitmentphobe" and "game-playing" when this guy is coming through a divorce is really unfair, btw. You can hardly blame him for being cautious.

I'd say "see where it goes but try not to put too much emotional pressure on it early on" is the way forward. If it's going to work out, it will.

Rose by any other name would not taste so sweet
You only want me with no expectations to meet

Das is nicht mein boyfriend
Das is nicht mein boyfriend
Das is nicht mein boyfriend
Das is meine NOYFRIEND

What's in a label, what's in a name
Why can't you say it, are you ashamed
Categorise the microgenres of life
Somewhere between a stranger and a wife

Das is nicht mein boyfriend
Das is nicht mein boyfriend
Das is nicht mein boyfriend
Das is meine NOYFRIEND

Friends with benefits, fuckbuddy, bitch
Booty call or scratch that itch
Boyfriend, lover, partner, date
Commonlaw wife (in certain states)

Das is nicht mein boyfriend
Das is nicht mein boyfriend
Das is nicht mein boyfriend
Das is meine NOYFRIEND

Constructive *and* helpful!

But hey, if the internet has already decreed that this dude is an emotionally stunted commitmentphobe, so be it.

I've found that the only actual long term things I've had were the ones where there never *had* to be The Conversation. Where it was understood by both that it was a Thing. The need to have The Conversation is kind of a sign of insecurity - either lack of confidence in the relationship or lack of confidence in ones own self.

But this probably isn't very good advice, I've no idea.

― Evren Kader (Masonic Boom), Friday, 11 September 2009

no - this is good advice imo. I don't really see the point in The Conversation

What I'm saying, Louis, is there is NO SUCH THING as a person with mixed priorities. If having a relationship with a person is a priority, an interested person will make the time.

Disagree here though. Sometimes I really can't decide if I want tea or beer - I know once I've had one that i'll stick with that for the evening because the other won't taste right. But beforehand I'm not sure

eh i could just as easily go the other way and say not having "the conversation" is a sign that u are not really prepared to communicate honestly and openly.

you could! differing perceptions of the same thing

I guess for me stuff is always implicit - for others not so much

it's just pers experience really, a lot if times i thought something was implicit in a relationship it turned out to be something we needed to talk about--now i feel like i know better.

But hey, if the internet has already decreed that this dude is an emotionally stunted commitmentphobe, so be it.

Not entirely sure if that has been decreed. My point was really that if "boyfriend" is what he feels like to ljubljana, then chances are that's how he sees himself as well. "Boyfriend" hardly denotes ring-on-finger-level-commitment, does it? Why would he be afraid of it?

LJ - yes, definitely chemistry. Conversation spilling on and on - check. Genuine tenderness? Check, though tender not lovey-dovey, and tempered with a LOT of caution - a lid is being kept on it. Also forgot to mention pillow talk a couple of times along the lines of 'I'm getting into this a bit quickly'.

Matt DC - he's definitely not a commitmentphobe. I do believe in such a thing as bad times. I also believe that if the thang is really, really good, it'll transcend them. But I think you have to have a lot of patience, understanding and self-belief to make that happen, and I am not full of these qualities so am trying very hard. I also believe that all this patient understanding can easily mask 'he's just not that into you'. So of course I'm veering between believing he's JNTIM and believing it's worth at least a shot at just being understanding and patient.

Did I mention we met on OKC? I don't think either of us expected to meet anyone we liked so much so quickly on there. We were both anticipating more a strung-out series of 'social' dates, make new friends, hope something works out eventually.

I think it goes...

Patient waiting phase till mid-October (to allow for post-deadline recovery phase, sleeping, catching up with friends etc.)
Catching up phase till mid-November, hoping that things get clearer
Moment!
Moment didn't get you anywhere? Conversation! (on a different occasion)
Key part: *accept whatever happens from there and don't whinge* (except on here)

Jesus, I'm bad at living with uncertainty.

wait, so this guy is just getting out of a serious relationship? I doubt he's a commitment-phobe since he was married. He probably wants some time and space to figure things out before jumping into another serious relationship ...

He was married, she left over two years ago, but it was a drawn-out split in a number of ways. Actual decree nisi came through a week or so before I met him.

I am going away for the w/end now but please carry on without me and feel free to amend my timeline above :-)

I do have to say that my "commitmentophobe" comments were prefaced with an "IF"

Mainly in defense against those people who were trying to say that there don't exist guys who will try and say all "you're not my GIRLFRIEND" to the person they are shagging. Because it's certainly happened to me.

Or perhaps a healthy dose of projection as I totally am a commitmentophobe through and through and I'll say all "bad time..." and all that, but the truth is, there is never going to be a "good" time again.

i hooked up with this girl and we added each other on facebook. i check out her photos and i find out a few years back she used to be rather chubby. (which for me is cool, you know max r is like sir-mixalot in that respect) no big deal. then i log on the next day and 2 pages of her late-teens chubster pics have vanished... i think this is a good sign, you know how paranoid girls are about weight. i feel like feedin her up, she looked good!

classy

ok question answered, and I didn't even have to ask it :-( At least he manned up and told me

Told you what? What happened?

Just Not That Into Me. Fin.

Oh, I'm so sorry. This is rubbish, but at least you know, and you can stop WONDERING which is the killing part.

Yeah, that's true. At the moment though I just want to stay in bed and cry for three days. Falling hard for people is my speciality. I don't do it often but when I do it, I'm thorough.

Oh god, I know that feeling. Give yourself a couple of days, allow yourself to grieve - make yourself sad mixtapes and eat ice cream and watch movies that make you OK to bawl like a child. Get it out of your system. (So long as you make sure you know when to come out of it.)

yep I think you're right. Got a friend who is *actually* grieving right now though and trying to support her so dunno how that's going to go this weekend, I'll have to leave her to her parents I think.

off to drag myself to work now I think

Oh no, the wrong sort of thing :(

Sorry to hear that ljub, hope you get through the next few days okay.

Thanks, and I was still gonna use your line if this hadn't happened.

1. Drop the phrase 'my boyfriend' or 'your girlfriend' offhand into the most casual of conversation with him.

Not passive aggressive imo. Wouldn't have worked on my guy but might have worked on some

aww :( well trite as it is, better luck next time! i mean, obviously something will happen in the heretofore, but i hope it's with someone you share an intimate connection with

i had a date tonight! it was fun. we got on, and will probably do dinner and drinks again at some stage...life and its options

thanks lj!

drunk and in 'f**k you' stage, hoorah, will not last but enjoying it for now.

*I used Nick's line retrospectively!!* To explain what I was thinking over the last month.

ok ilx, i said yes to a date with someone i'm probably not interested in (but figured give him a chance and maybe my mind will change, the reason i'm always single is that i always say no unless i'm really into the person already)...is this a terrible thing to do? if at the end of said date i figure out that i'm not, what do i say?

Well, it depends how you view the experience. If you think of it as a practice date, where you just get used to the idea of dating and learning how to do it, then I think it's fine. It's just trouble lies ahead when you get to the point where all you ever go on is practice dates with guys you're not that into and start to lose faith in the whole process.

I'm not so much worried about it from my side, I just don't want to be a bitch if it turns out he's interested and I'm not, especially as he's a friend of some of my friends. Advice?

oh this is not a bad thing! come saturday i'm going on a second date with a girl i'm not at all head over heels with, although she is very friendly and talkative. that said atm dating is about all i have time for, so i'm able to go on these chilled dates without feeling any pressure to force an issue. treat your own one like this and it'll be fine :) maybe better than fine!