Rolling Music Writers' Thread

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i think my twitter is worthwhile

max, Saturday, 15 August 2009 02:00 (fourteen years ago) link

i dont care for whiney's twitter personally

butthurt (deej), Saturday, 15 August 2009 07:47 (fourteen years ago) link

devastated to hear that a guy who posts Gucci Mane lyrics to twitter 20 times a day doesn't like my writing

Whiney G. Weingarten, Saturday, 15 August 2009 14:14 (fourteen years ago) link

some people think their bands are worthwhile, deej thinks gucci manes lyrics are worthwhile

max, Saturday, 15 August 2009 14:15 (fourteen years ago) link

devastated to hear that a guy who posts Gucci Mane lyrics to twitter 20 times a day doesn't like my writing

clearly, since you "deigned" to reply

Matos W.K., Saturday, 15 August 2009 14:56 (fourteen years ago) link

matos, your steady stream of "WELL ACTUALLY" zings on ILX are like an eighth grader who just discovered sarcasm.

Whiney G. Weingarten, Saturday, 15 August 2009 15:13 (fourteen years ago) link

LOL

Matos W.K., Saturday, 15 August 2009 15:24 (fourteen years ago) link

What are the responses of everyone else who clowns you around these parts like, then?

Matos W.K., Saturday, 15 August 2009 15:28 (fourteen years ago) link

Usually about sandwiches

Whiney G. Weingarten, Saturday, 15 August 2009 15:31 (fourteen years ago) link

Actual Question Time: What is the longest you have sat there staring into the abyss of a piece you knew would be fun to write when you pitched it and then found out it was exactly the opposite? I'm going on four days on one right now, and it's interrupted almost everything else in my life. Ugh.

Matos W.K., Saturday, 15 August 2009 15:52 (fourteen years ago) link

Well, I've been working on my 33 1/3 book for about two years...

Whiney G. Weingarten, Saturday, 15 August 2009 16:16 (fourteen years ago) link

I'd imagine that's every book, yeah.

Matos W.K., Saturday, 15 August 2009 16:17 (fourteen years ago) link

Usually when there's an article/review that I realize I DON'T want to do, I clear my schedule, chug a coffee, sign off AIM and try to burn through it and put it behind me... Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't

Whiney G. Weingarten, Saturday, 15 August 2009 16:17 (fourteen years ago) link

I can't drink coffee most of the time--it really screws my nervous system up--but yesterday and the day before I'd gotten so little sleep I had to resort to it or else pass out mid-afternoon. (Up late trying to finish w/no luck, get up early a.m. to try again.) It helped with bursts of plow-through-it, which is usually enough; once I get a bead on something it can be pretty easy to follow through to the end. Not this time.

A lot of times I'll work on other, smaller stuff as a break from whatever's giving me trouble, and I got a few things done I needed to, so that's been nice. But this is pretty ill-timed: I have more assignments right now that I have in a while, which is a relief, or would be if this roadblock weren't in the way.

Matos W.K., Saturday, 15 August 2009 16:23 (fourteen years ago) link

i don't think i've ever met a writer who doesn't leave the writing until the last possible minute. i know i need the deadline to focus my thoughts, whether its a 150 word album review, or a 160,000 word book.

She's big on the mental illness scene (stevie), Saturday, 15 August 2009 17:26 (fourteen years ago) link

Ever since I went fulltime freelance that shit ended fast. Now I just bang out shit as fast as possible in hopes of having time to pitch more stuff..

the goon and antarctica (Whiney G. Weingarten), Saturday, 15 August 2009 18:29 (fourteen years ago) link

Yeah, fuck that hanging around waiting on the muse bullshit. This is work. Get it done, and start the next thing.

unperson, Saturday, 15 August 2009 19:17 (fourteen years ago) link

http://www.gao.gov/about/history/articles/images/wecan.jpg

scott seward, Saturday, 15 August 2009 20:01 (fourteen years ago) link

i need the deadline to focus my thoughts, whether its a 150 word album review, or a 160,000 word book.

a 160,000 word book? jesus that's 600 pages! i couldn't even review a 600 page book at the last minute.

m coleman, Saturday, 15 August 2009 20:53 (fourteen years ago) link

xp Yeah, I've never comprehended the wait until the last minute thing. That'd drive me into the crazy house to work that way (and as an editor, writers working that way drove me even more nuts, usually because they tended to go way past the last minute.)

xhuxk, Saturday, 15 August 2009 21:06 (fourteen years ago) link

Actually, that's the reason editors work up fake deadlines, without telling writers they're fake.

xhuxk, Saturday, 15 August 2009 21:07 (fourteen years ago) link

have recently returned to freelancing after a few yrs off, and have recently clued in that my longest-term editor has been feeding me fake deadlines for a few months. But I have been actually meeting them, so I'm not going to tell him I'm hip.
what xhuxk said "I came up covering zoning boards and sewage commissions, where objective detachment is strived for", likewise (sorta). Objective detachment is practically a survival technique in that environment.
Also, writing mostly in a newsy-style, record reviews used to be great no-one's-looking chances to play around with different writing ideas/styles/whatevers. Y'know, 150-300 wds once a week with which to play.

there's a better way to browse (Dr. Superman), Saturday, 15 August 2009 22:01 (fourteen years ago) link

Actually, that's the reason editors work up fake deadlines, without telling writers they're fake.

i've been on both sides of this equation. found that fake deadline usually don't work from either direction. writers can sense where the real deadline is. but it does help focus the mind.

flying squid attack (tipsy mothra), Saturday, 15 August 2009 22:05 (fourteen years ago) link

(i think of it as sort like keeping my clock 10 or 15 minutes fast. i know it's not the real time, but it still reminds me that the real time is coming up soon.)

flying squid attack (tipsy mothra), Saturday, 15 August 2009 22:06 (fourteen years ago) link

probably biggest part of my hitting deadlines is less editor faking me out, more maturity/concerted effort

there's a better way to browse (Dr. Superman), Saturday, 15 August 2009 22:10 (fourteen years ago) link

a 160,000 word book? jesus that's 600 pages! i couldn't even review a 600 page book at the last minute.

by the last minute, i mean of course the last month or two of an 18 month project! though last time i had loads of interview sources holding out on me and meaning i *couldn't get started any earlier...

'dude, hydroponic uterus' (stevie), Sunday, 16 August 2009 09:42 (fourteen years ago) link

Yeah, fuck that hanging around waiting on the muse bullshit. This is work. Get it done, and start the next thing.

this is so much easier said than done. i wish i could be one of those writers who could just sit down and bang words out, but...no :(

lex pretend, Sunday, 16 August 2009 09:46 (fourteen years ago) link

yeah... i'm not revelling in my slothfulness, i wish i could be more 'professional' too - but have been full time freelance for eleven or so years now, and this is just the way i work, so.

'dude, hydroponic uterus' (stevie), Sunday, 16 August 2009 10:02 (fourteen years ago) link

BTW, who said anything about waiting for the muse until Phil brought it up?

Matos W.K., Sunday, 16 August 2009 14:15 (fourteen years ago) link

I'm just not the type to wait until the last minute. Depending the length of the piece, I'll usually have started three days to a week before, in large part because I allow myself time for revision. The number of assignments I'm working at once is another factor.

Anatomy of a Morbius (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 16 August 2009 14:22 (fourteen years ago) link

Music writing shouldn't be about crimping the stuff out but it is for a lot of people and you can always tell. That said ^^ it is a job; so if I get stuck on one thing I move immediately to something else. So if I've always got a list of ten or more things to be writing there's no need to stop.

It was hard to train myself to stop downing tools the second I couldn't think of anything to say about Marillion. Just move on to something else; it's not an open invitation to have half an E and play guitar hero for the rest of the afternoon.

Doran, Sunday, 16 August 2009 15:30 (fourteen years ago) link

What Alfred said actually made me curious about how other people handle revising their own work, before sending it in. Give or take certain haiku-length reviews for Rhapsody or wherever, or if I have very very very tight deadline (which I usually find ways to avoid) I almost never file copy the day I finish it. I generally prefer to sleep on it overnight -- or, for longer pieces, maybe over a weekend -- before making final tweaks/overhauls/ massages to it and sending it in (which tends to be the first thing I concentrate on the next morning, before moving on to other work). How common is that? I honestly have no idea how others handle this. (As an editor, though, I got the impression that certain writers even more neurotic than myself had a tendency to worry and overthink pieces into oblivion and missed deadlines. I really hated that.)

xhuxk, Sunday, 16 August 2009 16:29 (fourteen years ago) link

yeah, i always, always, always finish at least one day before; sleep on it; look at it with new eyes; revise and turn in.

The Velvet Undergrowl And Beako (Whiney G. Weingarten), Sunday, 16 August 2009 16:32 (fourteen years ago) link

writing a bi-weekly record review column in the early 90s I established a pattern of waking up around 5:00 AM on deadline day and pulling together all my rough drafts and notes into finished copy and sending it off by early afternoon. otherwise I tried to follow xhuxk's method of sleeping on a finished piece and doing some revisions/tweaking on deadline day. of course this often didn't happen and I rushed to finish at the last minute.

the last few years I've been reviewing books (non-fiction/not on music) and for me it's a completely different process, more time-consuming and labor intensive, perhaps because I'm less experienced in this arena. i need to finish a 1000 word book piece days before deadline and do several rounds of revision/tweaking before sending it off.

m coleman, Sunday, 16 August 2009 16:47 (fourteen years ago) link

by the last minute, i mean of course the last month or two of an 18 month project! though last time i had loads of interview sources holding out on me and meaning i *couldn't get started any earlier...

i think this must varies w/the type of book you're writing and I certainly didn't mean to cast aspersions on yr work habits. clearly it worked for you!
and yeah, for a reported book you are at the mercy of your subjects to some extent and as we all know, looming deadlines are merciless.

m coleman, Sunday, 16 August 2009 16:53 (fourteen years ago) link

sometimes i work way ahead of schedule, sometimes right on it, occasionally a little behind. usually my secret blessing is if i know i'm going to be busy or not home much in the coming days, and get a lot of stuff done early and then have time to actually go over and revise and nitpick a few times, which is a luxury i don't give myself a lot anymore.

some dude, Sunday, 16 August 2009 16:57 (fourteen years ago) link

of course, my schedule is also a product of what and where i write -- sometimes i do concert reviews and movie reviews where i have a window of a couple days to write after seeing the subject, so it's not like i can do those early eithert way. and sometimes if i have a big piece on my plate but don't feel ready to give it the concentration it needs, i'll knock out a couple short blog posts instead.

some dude, Sunday, 16 August 2009 17:03 (fourteen years ago) link

Almost all of my gig reviews have a deadline of 6:00 am the following morning, so I have to write them as soon as I get home. As a natural procrastinator, I find this concentrates the mind wonderfully. (It also means that none of them are written stone cold sober, but I found my optimum level of consumption quite early on.)

mike t-diva, Sunday, 16 August 2009 17:39 (fourteen years ago) link

yeah, i used to do gig reviews for a daily paper, with a 3am the next morning deadline, which i actually really loved - it focused my mind, and meant i didn't have any 'homework' hanging over me.

otherwise, though, i think i spend the time between 'finishing' a piece of work and the deadline just honing and fiddling with every detail. i had a relatively quiet week last week, and spent five straight days polishing every line of a 1000 word blog piece for MOJO - but i was aiming for being 'funny', which i don't do terribly often, and whcih, for me, is always a matter of swapping a dozen possible jokes in and out of every line.

'dude, hydroponic uterus' (stevie), Sunday, 16 August 2009 17:47 (fourteen years ago) link

xp Actually, that raises another question. Somebody just mentioned to me last month that they write for a publication where the policy is that critics are not allowed to consume alcohol at the concerts they're covering. There's some logic to that rule, I guess, but I'd honestly never heard of it before. (And it's hard to think of a show I've been to, including ones I've reviewed, where beer was available that I haven't had some. Also, since it's likely that most people don't watch shows entirely sober, I'm wondering whether not drinking might unfairly skew opinions about the music.) Anyway, I wonder how rare this policy is.

xhuxk, Sunday, 16 August 2009 17:51 (fourteen years ago) link

can someone email maura@idolator dot com and tell her what publication that is?

The Velvet Undergrowl And Beako (Whiney G. Weingarten), Sunday, 16 August 2009 17:52 (fourteen years ago) link

Wow, that's unimaginably harsh! For me, the right amount of booze helps rather than hinders the review - easing me over the initial hump, so that the words start flowing more freely. My regular intake: two pints of ordinary lager. Not a drop more, not a drop less. I've become quite superstitious about it.

There's been one recent change, which for me has worked out very well: about a year ago, my newspaper lifted the word count restriction for the web versions of gig reviews, retaining it just for the print versions. So we're now asked to "write freely" for the web version, and to submit an edited print version at the same time. This has improved my whole attitude to the editing process.

mike t-diva, Sunday, 16 August 2009 18:00 (fourteen years ago) link

the number of offices i've worked in where intoxicants much stronger than alcohol seemed to fuel the entire production team...

'dude, hydroponic uterus' (stevie), Sunday, 16 August 2009 18:06 (fourteen years ago) link

Somebody just mentioned to me last month that they write for a publication where the policy is that critics are not allowed to consume alcohol at the concerts they're covering.

I would think sports writers would find the idea of such a 'restriction' hysterical.

And how does one enforce it, other than having a snitch who know what you look like and is near you at the show?

Now I'm curious. The name of the pub needs publishing so that we can be supercilious with those willing to work for a fifteen dollar or less review and be teetotal.

Gorge, Sunday, 16 August 2009 18:14 (fourteen years ago) link

Let's just say it's a daily in Texas. Don't want to get any more specific than that without actually verifying the rule first-hand -- sounds really far-fetched to me, and I'm still kind of incredulous.

xhuxk, Sunday, 16 August 2009 19:04 (fourteen years ago) link

And yeah, apparently the theory is, if you drink at a show, a friend of your boss's might see you there.

xhuxk, Sunday, 16 August 2009 19:06 (fourteen years ago) link

Let's just say it's a daily in Texas.

Now you know -- in Texas (!?), of all places -- that is just wrong and anti-'Mercan. How would anyone survive during college football season?

Gorge, Sunday, 16 August 2009 19:15 (fourteen years ago) link

concert reviewing: the last bastion of socially accepted drinking on the job (bartending excluded)?

there's a better way to browse (Dr. Superman), Sunday, 16 August 2009 19:47 (fourteen years ago) link

I don't drink, so I get a few editors assigning me for festival coverage because they like how I have the energy to stay on my feet and watch bands for 10 hrs at a time

Whiney G. Weingarten, Sunday, 16 August 2009 19:50 (fourteen years ago) link


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