The Great Moving Right Show II: The Kirsty and Phil Years

"the natural (feudal-socialist) order" = wtf!

how is judging the good by outcomes more or less right-wing than the opposite?

ept in that book argues that marx *was* a moralist -- as does lucio colletti, a thoroughly kantian marxist... till he stopped being a marxist -- how else to explain what he was doing? i don't think he was notoriously anti-moralist at all.

xpost hell

Who is Nick Land?

Who was dude that was going to be Prime Minister (or at least leader of the Tories in the 70s) before he did this big speech arguing for eugenics? The one who Thatcher took most of her schtick for? Was this guy looked at as a Cameron-esque "moderniser" at the time, or was he just seen as a new Heath?

the anti-moralist thing was tied up in naturalist theories of historical development that got appended to marxism, no? and then got regurgitated as scientific marxism -- natch there was no place for moralism in a scientific marxism.

keith joseph

xpost. very much a moderniser but not a la cameron. more a la... pinochet.

Are you kidding, Keith Joseph would never have been PM, he was a scary weirdo!

And slightly to the right of Pinochet!

That "Tory Tory Tory" documentary seemed to suggest that Joseph as Conservative leader was pretty much a foregone conclusion before he overstepped the mark by basically arguing for the killing of poor people.

i don't think i said judging by outcomes was more OR less rightwing, it depdns on the outcomes you favour presumably -- i think yr bein rightwing if yr arguin that "social good: we are humans and we know it when we're in it" is a coddled delusion

doesn't ept argue marx is like secretly a moralist despite often and loudly denouncing "moralism" -- he doesn't however state what the moral basis is; i *think* ept is making a kind of morris-ist argt abt what that basis must be, if it isn't to be "idealist" (another thing marx wasn't)

he is somewhat rescuing marx from aft-times "scientific marxsism" yes, but also i think rescuing him from the consequences of his own rhetoric in particular tactical debates at the time (it's an age since i read it, and i am reaching for the morrisism based on a book by ept I HAVE NEVER READ)

What did Macmillan say about Keith Joseph? Something like "the only boring Jew I ever met in my life".

This is all very interesting (really), but how are you going to transmit it to all the apolitical, complacent suits-in-the-making, who, after all, will have some degree of control over this country's social future?

I thought the moralism point was RE crit theory as philosophy. the analytics, deludedly probably, want to make philosophy SCIENCE and give TRUTH VALUE. whereas the crit theory dudes do there thing which purports to abandon the author or the metaphysics of presence, basically whip SCIENCE's knicker down, or summat but is often defined by their won moral postion.

xp

http://www.artofbarter.com/gif-bin/FlipchartMan.gif

How about a NEW PUNK ROCK.

it is one long-ass book, and i haven't read it either. i don't think it's a coddled delusion exactly, just that it has to leave so much unsaid -- and already assumes a load of "freedoms from", i think, which must have some moral basis all we humans agree on ('cept we don't... ;_;).

i think marx's moral basis is not a million miles from other socialists/anarchists of the mid-19th c tbh. he was anti-moralist insofar as moralism is a poor basis, or no basis at all, for understanding the historical process.

xpost

Maybe 65daysofstatic can do something about it

author = authority = rightwing
metaphysics of presence = you had to be there dude = culture of celebrity = rightwing

i am a hobbesian lettrist: i foment war between the VERY MEMEBERS OF THE ALPHABET har har

http://www.hobbyistsoftware.com/Initiate-backgrounds/hobbes3.jpg

and now i am off to the pubbe

mark: i agree w/ you re: land, but i'm really curious why you think so

The Facebook groups of someone in my extended network:

Black Plastic ▪ Boris for Mayor ▪ Facebookers in Support of SIR Salman Rushdie ▪ Petition to make Top Gear of The Pops...A weekly program ▪ I know NOTHING about cars, but I still LOVE Top Gear ▪ I HATE people who get offended at Top Gear. ▪ Modelling yourself on Bernard Black is a perfectly valid lifestyle choice ▪ BBC's Ghostwatch was the scariest fucking thing I have ever seen. ▪ FBS girls ▪ Mr. Jones- More than a History Teacher ▪ You know you went to Frances Bardsley when.... ▪ A Cup of Tea Solves Everything ▪ The New London 2012 Logo Is Really Horrid ▪ Get that fucking tomato out of my sandwich! ▪ Rockabaret ▪ May I Light Your Cigarette, Madam? ▪ Ban teaching of Abstinence as part of Sex Education ▪ Luxembourg - Pop Noir ▪ dim sum, sushi, tapas and all small pieces of foods appreciation club ▪ The Dylan Moran is a Drunken Genius Society ▪ Fuck This...I'm Going To Hogwarts ▪ Stay Beautiful Club ▪ Seeing Scarlet ▪ RCPCH EXAMS TYPES ▪ I Love Kittens. ▪ Feeling Gloomy ▪ Ron's Marathon Sweepstakes

lol middle class people

woah wtf RCPCH EXAMS has a facebook group? that's who i used to work for, practically (i was in TRAINING, not EXAMS).

i don't know any of your guys though.

this thread revive seems timely Robert Christgau - Ima'murrican, Gawdammit!

anyway, getting back to listing things: THE FEELING

http://static.sky.com/images/pictures/1575527.jpg

http://static.sky.com/images/pictures/1575439.jpg

http://static.sky.com/images/pictures/1575437.jpg

Can't find an img of the Mirror's front page but they go with:

Too scared to leave our homes
EXCLUSIVE MIRROR POLL SHOCKER 42% frightened of yobs at night 62% think parents are to blame

Should we do a "British ILXors are you scared of yob gang menace?" thread? Could be good.
One of The Feeling is married to Sophie Ellis Bextor, right? Hmmm. Links in with Carmody's Popism is back door right-wing-ism but y know. Stuck that xgau thread in for similar reasons, i am trying to make an analogy between the old ilx / nu ilx shit and the film hot fuzz but i can't make it work. american influx = supermarket, simon pegg = nick southall. maybe. but old ilx wasn't evil so it doesn't really work. at all.

the feeling started out playing covers at ski resorts.

heehee i wz accosted by a drunk polish-american tourist just outside my house in hackney on sat: "hey man, is this like london's answer to the GHETTO?"

i guess my unpersuaded amusement towards carmody's "i'm so bored with the usa" stance is that I KNOW WHERE IT ENDS UP

(am right now trying to write semi-nice stuff abt the temple strummer doc)

quitney didn't you review that in sight and sound?

PS where does I KNOW WHERE IT ENDS UP end up?

cranky old man s on park bench complainin abt YOUNG PPL TODAY

aka everyone shd be checkin INTELLECHNO

haha re henry's -- k-korrekt -- sally against clunker-edits, the VERY FIRST HOME-MOVIE SHOT, where small joe s throws a stone and j.temple dubs in a really crappy SFX of glass breaking!!

if " s " refers to who i think " s " refers to then i would say " s " does like a few young ppls things and has always had an, often hidden, anti young ppl streak. this is about grime isn't it?

if by young ppl you mean simon reynolds then YES i am always fightin w.him the mere whippersnap -- i quite like grime tho i am not like whistleheadedly simple for it

not really sure what yr gettin at (maybe yr not talkin abt me at all)

http://tachyontv.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/ep53_1.jpg

" m s "

http://www.internationalhero.co.uk/1master1.jpg

" s r "

OR IS IT THE OTHER WAY ROUND?

"m s"

http://www.bigrat.co.uk/images/characters/shane.jpg

"s r"

http://www.bigrat.co.uk/images/characters/joe.jpg

http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2007/05_01/FACupFergieJose_468x302.jpg

MS, SR

Ha ha

http://www2.prestel.co.uk/grayling/beano/prodm2.gif

http://www.smh.com.au/ffximage/2005/10/10/next_cover3_oct11,0.jpg

http://www.transdiffusion.org/emc/smallscreen/images/gsr.jpg

only just realised what this thread was

i am all those ppl and things obv

"do not wipe the taste of the day away with the false and foreign taste of mint"

i don't know. i think yes -- though with most of the anger directed at the US. people used to say about watergate that far from making people more engaged or concerned, it made them more cynical, and i think that's happened here a bit.

i suppose i am a bit mean about the academic left -- at the moment they seem concerned with the lack of a utopia in modern politics. there isn't even the very, very limited idealism* of the new labour project that you had in the mid-'90s.

and i guess that's what the other thread is about -- how far this cynicism** carries over into/is fostered by cultural ephemera.

*realize this sounds ridiculous to people who were adults at the time, i suppose it *was* a mostly "please just end this tory government", but still...

**http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychological_projection

xposts to acrobat

-- That one guy that hit it and quit it, Wednesday, 22 August 2007 12:32 (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

to sorta seriously answer what i take to be yr question, above, acrobat:
one of the reasons i get snarkily agitated by hyper-sectarianism and passive-aggressive outflanking manoevres and general haha splittism on the left is clearly self-hatred: viz *i* am the most consistently perversely topsyturvyist contrarian i know -- my instant kneejerk to ANY agreement reached prior to me enterin the room is to think "well obv THEY'RE wrong, let's start from there" -- and i am disliking ppl behaving the way i suspect i do (or would like to or would tend to)

i *try* and be playful and useful abt this for others -- and i think as an editor i achieved (potential) constructiveness for abt 10 months maybe at w!re -- but i am hyper-aware of my own tendency-ability to filbuster pointlessly yet impatiently on something only i care about (rightly obv, except usually no one gets it but me cz i explain it so compactedly, and anyway it's more intution than understand probbly), so i step away from most political arguments, and only toss stuff into them which (maybe, possibly) someone else will pick up on and turn into an opening-up

this isn't quietism as cynicism, it's slow-and-steady-wins-the-er-oops-race-ism, but what it actually leads to in me -- i've increasingly noticed recently -- is occasional break-outs of extreme spiteful frustration at not any longer knowin how to re-renter the race, esp.when it's full up of ppl (but isn't this always the way) who seem to be misperceiving the world the same way i did when i wz their age