what are barack obama's flaws?

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maybe but i was really (maybe willfully?) blind to the bill clinton is untrustworthy thing in the 90s. i can see how it was the flipside of his charm in retrospect, i guess.

xpost

horseshoe, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 21:57 (6 years ago) Permalink

edwards was better at talking about class that obama, as i remember, but i also think its "easier" to talk about class as a white guy than it is as a black guy

max, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 21:57 (6 years ago) Permalink

and the flip side of that was that edwards was no good at talking about race.

max, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 21:58 (6 years ago) Permalink

uh, whatever that would mean, i guess

max, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 21:58 (6 years ago) Permalink

I wish he was an atheist -- with his oratorical skills he could do lots for the millions of us who want to hear a convincing defense of godlessness put to theists. And yet, and yet, I suspect he IS less of a god-fearing man than he pretends. Something about his preternatural coolness bespeaks a kind of deism.

I kind of like to think that Barack Obama's reasonable optimism is engendering a sort of secular spirituality in the country.

Curt1s Stephens, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 21:59 (6 years ago) Permalink

it pretty funny fighting bill clinton and being all ooooh yah ok now i see why he got under yr skin so bad

jhøshea, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 21:59 (6 years ago) Permalink

i really want obama to give a truth bomb class speech like he did with race. lol campaign fan fiction.

xposts

horseshoe, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 21:59 (6 years ago) Permalink

also easier to 'talk about class' when you're never gonna be Prez and just want to influence the debate

gabbneb, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:00 (6 years ago) Permalink

at the time (i was like 10) i didnt believe that shit, just thought it was partisan & desperate

Nobody's gonna call bullshit on a 10 year-old and what studying up on the Clintons?

jon /via/ chi 2.0, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:00 (6 years ago) Permalink

hes never going to be able to give a speech about class with that kind of credibility after the "bitter" thing

max, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:01 (6 years ago) Permalink

i think edwards wanted to be prez xxp

deej, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:01 (6 years ago) Permalink

I didn't say he didn't want to be prez

gabbneb, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:02 (6 years ago) Permalink

No results found for "obama edwards slash fiction".

max, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:02 (6 years ago) Permalink

also easier to 'talk about class' when you're never gonna be Prez and just want to influence the debate

-- gabbneb, Wednesday, April 30, 2008 5:00 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Link

yeah, i think that's basically right.

horseshoe, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:02 (6 years ago) Permalink

hes never going to be able to give a speech about class with that kind of credibility after the "bitter" thing

-- max, Wednesday, April 30, 2008 5:01 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Link

okay, in my imaginary fan fic scenario, an in-depth justification of the "bitter" thing would be the pretext for the entire speech! OMG AMAZING, RIGHT? but yeah, whatevs. i love him.

horseshoe, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:04 (6 years ago) Permalink

He worked his way up the ankles to Jim's knees, and then his thighs. As Edwards's hands continued up Obama's body to his torso, they traveled lightly over Obama's full rear end. Edwards's blood quickened at his first touch of such an interesting area of flesh.

He lathered up Obama's stomach and carefully rubbed the soap over the other man's front. "I am pleased that your chest is once again free of hair," Edwards remarked. Then he ran his foamy hands over Obama's pecs, grazing both nipples at once.

"Mm," Obama grunted in answer. More of his penis went turgid. Edwards continued to clean him as if he hadn't noticed, moving soap all around Obama's back without missing an inch of skin.

Edwards returned to the floor and gathered more soap into his hand. Now he ran his curious, searching fingers against Obama's inner thighs, exploring the contours and lines there which were uniquely Obama's.

max, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:04 (6 years ago) Permalink

this ad kicks the gas tax freebie's ass

http://thepage.time.com/2008/04/30/obama-responds-to-clinton-in-new-north-carolina-indiana-ad/

gabbneb, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:07 (6 years ago) Permalink

turgid

BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:09 (6 years ago) Permalink

at the time (i was like 10) i didnt believe that shit, just thought it was partisan & desperate

Nobody's gonna call bullshit on a 10 year-old and what studying up on the Clintons?

-- jon /via/ chi 2.0, Wednesday, April 30, 2008 6:00 PM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

my thesis on bill clinton in 96 was that i was happy there was a cool democrat in the white house instead of a creepy old republican and he liked jazz and made jokes and seemed smart and my mom liked him

and what, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:11 (6 years ago) Permalink

i didnt know the word 'partisan' then but i do remember thinking all the armchair psychology was jealous haterz not serious analysis

and what, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:11 (6 years ago) Permalink

haha lil guy otm

jhøshea, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:13 (6 years ago) Permalink

thats the thing is, i dunno if it was just stopped clock/twice a day shit or if idiots like jonah goldberg actually managed to see the truth about bill clinton and liberals were blinded by triumphalism

and what, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:15 (6 years ago) Permalink

Nobody's gonna call bullshit on a 10 year-old and what studying up on the Clintons?

ethan gets a pass because he has well-formed opinions about records and a job in a muppet museum. it's when folks like suzy talk about being smarter and ballsier than average that makes people upset

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:15 (6 years ago) Permalink

oh man xposted to death again

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:15 (6 years ago) Permalink

wtf about my post made ppl think i was making serious policy & character judgments at age 10???? ive been pretty clear on ilx that ive only soured on the clintons in the last 7-8 years

and what, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:16 (6 years ago) Permalink

lol tom what made today defend-suzy day?

max, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:17 (6 years ago) Permalink

and before you answer read these two sentences:

Edwards returned to the floor and gathered more soap into his hand. Now he ran his curious, searching fingers against Obama's inner thighs, exploring the contours and lines there which were uniquely Obama's.

max, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:17 (6 years ago) Permalink

anyway if I had to pick something that's a virtue of the guy that we're going to regret two terms from now it's that he has too much faith in people which is what this whole thread has been about the end

max: people being really boring about hating suzy and gabbneb. it'll be like one tiresome post that breaks the camel's back with stuff like that on ILX and then I just go off. you know this

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:18 (6 years ago) Permalink

it reached the TIPPING POINT

max, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:19 (6 years ago) Permalink

ive defended gabbneb a lot, and suzy is surprisingly inclusive with her class-hatreds, but generally suzy/gabbneb zings still make me lmao

and what, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:19 (6 years ago) Permalink

peak zing

dan m, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:19 (6 years ago) Permalink

my thesis on bill clinton in 96

You were 13 in '96.

jaymc, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:20 (6 years ago) Permalink

i'm surprised that everyone's saying clinton's flaw was "untrustworthiness" - he was a dlc democrat for years and that's exactly what we got; i think he actually tried to follow through on pretty much everything he said he would

to me his tragic flaw was his charm - he could charm the pants off anyone, and it brought his world down around his ears

Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:20 (6 years ago) Permalink

I followed the '84 race when I was 8 </gabbneb>

gabbneb, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:21 (6 years ago) Permalink

those things are the same thing!

xpost to tracer hand

horseshoe, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:21 (6 years ago) Permalink

liberals were blinded by triumphalism

Did liberals believe Clinton then? Most of'em were warily happy there was a Democrat in the WH.

Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:21 (6 years ago) Permalink

untrustworthiness and charm are the same thing??

Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:22 (6 years ago) Permalink

gabbneb is a gr8 poster

deej, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:23 (6 years ago) Permalink

xpost

i can see how they'd be part of the same package for sure

btw the classic politician's answer to this question, which most of you have already made, is "sometimes i'm just too honest"

Tracer Hand, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:23 (6 years ago) Permalink

suzy is surprisingly inclusive with her class-hatreds

lol

Curt1s Stephens, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:23 (6 years ago) Permalink

charm at its logical endpoint is about misleading, i think!

xposts

horseshoe, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:23 (6 years ago) Permalink

I followed the '84 race when I was 8 </gabbneb>

I have a hazy memory of announcing to my first-grade teacher I was a Mondale fan, but I have no idea why: probably just picked up bits of conversation from my parents.

jaymc, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:23 (6 years ago) Permalink

I was the only Mondale fan in my elementary school, and I did it just to be contrarian (and Reagan creeped me out even then).

Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:26 (6 years ago) Permalink

back in '92 before the election some friends and i walked around the playground chanting "clin-ton."

deej, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:27 (6 years ago) Permalink

Friends With Money is good

Surmounter, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:27 (6 years ago) Permalink

haha i remember seein pictures on the news of the available candidates (= nixon, humphrey, wallace) and thinkin THEY ALL LOOK THE SAME ie UGLY, i shall vote for NONE OF THEM

i was 8 and my policy analysis stands

mark s, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:27 (6 years ago) Permalink

I was one of three kids (out of 25 or 30) in my 5th-grade class who voted for Dukakis in a mock election. I was also the only white kid who did so.

jaymc, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:28 (6 years ago) Permalink

the Hitchens book ethan mentioned has a fairly detailed indictment of Clinton's war on welfare, if you get past the author's breathless rhetoric.

Alfred, Lord Sotosyn, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:32 (6 years ago) Permalink

yeah if he would chill with how clinton is the worst man in history who violently rapes every woman in sight its actually a substantive policy critique from the left

and what, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:34 (6 years ago) Permalink

i was pro-clinton in 2nd grade because my parents told me to be so

max, Wednesday, 30 April 2008 22:35 (6 years ago) Permalink


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