New York Restaurants

I kind of feel that most major cities have their particular food niche, based on immigrants and whatnot. I know people that swear by the food - quality and diversity - in Houston, for example. From Pittsburgh to Portland, this country is packed with great food.

All cities have good food somewhere, that's a given.

It's interesting to revisit the same places/cities/regions over the course of many, many years. You can really see when they start fast forward through many years of food stagnation to catch up.

i will say i have been surprised at how... peremptory the espresso drinks i have had in pk Slope have been? gorilla, clever blend, swedish espresso bar etc - they are all several notches below what I'm used to at the equivalent sorts of places in London. is it cuz London has more Australians??

Maybe it's the water?

xpost That's a good question. If I had to hazard a guess, it's that starting a hipster coffee shop is kind of a generic "I've got a great idea for a business!" sort of idea, but I'm not sure how well trained the baristas are. Factor in a pretty harried environment and probably Americans being accustomed to average (or goofy) espresso drinks, and perhaps the standards are low? I think (speaking of Australians) it's telling that the flat white has become a thing here, even at Starbucks. It was always one of my favorite things about going to Australia, its simplicity and drinkability, so perhaps the novelty of something so simple and accessible and not soaked in syrup and covered with sprinkles held some appeal here? Americans settled for shitty coffee for decades and decades, and it's only been in the last 20 years or so that they've finally started to catch up.

Or it could be the water! I remember there used to be a NY pizza place in Santa Monica whose proprietor had a cocktail of minerals and whatnot added to the water to mimic NYC drinking water and therefore better replicate his pizza dough of choice.

i mean they literally just don't make them well, to the extent that it seems pretty clear they don't even realize there is a higher standard. they look and taste like they've come out of a machine. it's not terrible by any means but these are places with like, framed vintage posters of coffee machines on the wall and little stickers saying things like "only good coffee" like the technical wizardry of coffee-making is their USP but the coffee you get could be from the unit in the breakfast room of a fair-to-middling la quinta suites

There's a question for you, now that I've brought it up: is the notion of a "hipster coffee shop" a distinctly American thing? It seems that for a long time "hipster" was conflated with "snob," and you were a snob because you actually wanted to go to a coffee shop of quality, rather than McDonald's or some chain. But in other countries they've had great coffee shops for decades, so there would be nothing "hip" about wanting a good espresso.

i think very, very few countries outside italy have had good coffee shops for decades

might be just those places? i would try grumpy, hungry ghost, or blue bottle in park slope.
but i would also believe that nyc is behind lots of cities in the us and abroad when it comes to third wave coffee.
xxp

thanks for the recs! i forgot about hungry ghost - i have had good coffee there

i have to say I'm particularly disappointed in gorilla, which i thought of as a very credible place a dozen years ago

yeah, I do agree that americans making espresso for american palates is its own thing, even if it happens subconsciously. Coffee has it's own terroir.

I always have these issues when I go from place to place and bring food or wine somewhere else. So much affects how it presents itself when you are not acclimated to the local food and water.

We totally have hipster coffee shops in chile.

Only semi-related, I remember reading about Starbucks opening its first shop in Vienna, and everyone there predicted it would fail because there was nothing someone in Vienna liked more than taking their time, sipping their coffee and smoking a cigarette. And Starbucks turned out to be a big success, because there was a big contingent of people in Vienna who, go figure, *wanted* a smoke-free coffee shop that did not require an hour-long commitment.

Park Slope is not really considered a great neighborhood for restaurants.

Yes- i went to Fausto last night though, which is terrific

I've been to a random sprinkling of diners around NY/NJ/PA/NYC, and outside of NYC the quality goes down so fast. If it's a Greek ("Greek") diner, it might be fine (shoutout to the Pompton Queen, you were phenomenal!), but places in PA are based on Germanic heritage cuisines and local preferences, and...yikes. The most flavorless starch mounds known to humankind. They will not have spinach--like literally in the whole kitchen they do not offer or use any spinach or asparagus or broccoli or any vegetable that's not frozen. They will not have feta or blue cheese. They will not use any spices at all. There will be no hot sauce available. It's bad, people.

Tbh we're finding the same thing in small Hudson Valley towns. It's almost universally terrible unless you go to a larger city known for having a "scene," like Beacon. Even then, lots of places are bad (Brothers Trattoria--red sauce and white tablecloths and nothing else; the wine was bad, the sauce was bad, I'm pretty sure they lied about the gluten-free pasta option because I got sick afterward). The good ones are ramen, Palestinian, Sri Lankan.

and mexican food in nyc is roundly terrible in my experience

― jolene club remix (BradNelson), Thursday, March 14, 2019 12:36 PM (two hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

This is ridiculous and/or a narcissism of small differences. Some is mediocre, some is good, some is really good, but nothing is as bad as Velveeta and food service watery salsa so I don't want to hear it.

Yeah, NYC is just on an entirely different level than almost anything I've experienced. Being able to get any type of cuisine and being able to get the authentic version and then the americanized version and both being good. And being able to source those directly imported ingredients yourself. There is such a high concentration of people really knowledgeable and interested in food that nothing average can really survive. Unless it's a laundering front or they own the building.

it is absolutely ridiculous and a narcissism of small differences to the point, i can't account for why a burrito in san francisco is perfect while every burrito i've had in new york over the past nine years is overloaded to the point of being unwieldy, and tasteless on top of it

to the point where*

Aren't all the burritos in NY really done in the California burrito style?

I've had some really amazing tacos (cecinas, lenguas, carnitas) and huaraches in ny.

Tacos, posole, chilaquiles, elote, tamales, arepas....burritos are for chumps.

I almost said burritos are for NYU students but then I remembered the noize board's love affair with them.

The problem is the produce. Also regionally the Mexicans in New York are more about tacos. The Mexican restaurants that make mission style burritos in New York aren’t using the kind of ingredients you take for granted in California.

this is what i've always suspected thanks dan

But go to Cosme or any number of trucks on Roosevelt ave. There’s great Mexican in NY of many stripes.

It’s Vietnamese food we’re lacking.

it's true that i'm overstating my case and i've had a good taco from a truck in new york

Dan, did you ever go to Bunker? We used to drive by their weirdly located place in the middle of an industrial area on...Metropolitan? but never went in, and then I think it closed? Idk what happened there.

Anyone have any recs for a newish place to go out for dinner with friends in Jackson Heights/Woodside area? I've done Ayada, Sripraphai and Mustang a lot and would like a change.

The Mexican restaurants that make mission style burritos in New York aren’t using the kind of ingredients you take for granted in California.

cld you elaborate? avos, cilantro, beans, green or red sauce, what are these mystery ingredients?

xp I have been to the Bunker in Bushwick a couple times -- one time it was really good and another time (the more recent time) it was kind of bad.

It’s Vietnamese food we’re lacking.

Bingo. Philly has better Vietnamese than NYC.

I miss Holy Basil. I went on some early and memorable dates with my wife there. Hadn’t been in years though.

I told my mom there was a surge of hipstery Taiwanese places all of a sudden in NY and she wanted to work at one.

I assume it's much easier to maintain yearlong avocado, pepper, greens quality in CA.

I agree that burritos are not as good in NYC. I think the quality of the flour tortillas is part of the problem. You can get good tacos though. There’s a Spanish hole in the wall place near my office that makes carnitas tacos with the Cuban-style roast pork and they are great. As good as the more hyped tacos at Los Tacos #1 but with shorter lines and better prices.

Went to Bunker a couple times at the old location on Metropolitan but heard it was not as goood when it moved to Bushwick.

Bunker is/was great. Used to go all the time when it was on Metropolitan because we have a CAR! But they moved over to a more hospitable area of Bushwick near "jefftown" or whatever. We went once to that location, it was packed and not quite as good.

So yeah, they're good, there's a few places like that, also Falansai in bushwick if that's still open, but the classic vietnamese places, there's a few in the various chinatowns but none are as good as what you find from Cherry Hill/Philly down to DC or apparently New Orleans...or what I had that one time in Seattle.

RE: Woodside, Woodside Cafe on the corner of Broadway and 65th, I really like, they have these things called Chatamari which are awesome pancake meals. Khao Kang is my favorite restaurant, maybe in the world, but it's not a nice sit-down place. It's a block up from Ayada. There's an indonesian place called Awang that's interesting. We've only ordered once and it was good.

My favorite tibeten in JH was Phayul and they've been working on opening a larger location across the street from their orginal upstairs (and totally charming) location. Not sure if it's open yet, but Phayul is great. That and Mustang were our go-to nepali places.

Have you been to Dawas in Sunnyside? That's FANTASTIC and usually pretty chill at night. The owner does a new american hipster chef kind of thing and her father does a nepali thing and they don't do fusion and both sides of the menu are great. I've had friends take issue with the nepali because it's sorta "elevated" but it's still totally authentic and in some cases, like the shabeley meat patty things, their version is better than anything I've had elsewhere.

cld you elaborate? avos, cilantro, beans, green or red sauce, what are these mystery ingredients?

it is a bit of a mystery but all of the above? I think the issue is the mission burrito joints in NY all suck. When I go to my local taco cart, their salsas are fresh and handmade and taste good. But if you got "California Burrito" or whatever, it's not so good.

I think there are good burritos. My local De Mole, which isn't as good as it used to be, but I'd get their Chicken Mole burrito and swear by it.

vietnamese food is bad here. there's a good banh mi place in sunset park and another in elmhurst. not even remotely close to new orleans or houston in quality.

bunker was good in its former digs on metropolitan ave but new big bunker is trying to be too many different things and it's kind of a bummer. they are incredibly nice and baby friendly which is all i care about at this point tbh.

burrito-eatin' chump here

Bonita used to have an amazing spicy pork burrito that was better than anything I have had in san francisco.

Yeah I don't feel like I've ever had really good vietnamese in NYC.

I still need to try Casa Enrique.

ft Greene used to have a fantastic Cambodian place.

Casa Enrique is very good...but I totally don't get like, michelin star good?

my favorite mexican place though is in the bronx, and it's name shall not be revealed.

Cosme and Oxomoco both worth the high-end mexican hype.

there is a decent pho spot in the east village, the name escapes me though.

ramen is a much better bet, in general.

http://estrellitapoblana.nyc/