Faith No More: Angel Dust v. The Real Thing

King for a Day is great but the benefits of having Spruance are also a hindrance in that he brings more of the genre-splicing of Bungle into the mix. Which isn't bad, but "Star AD" and "Evidence", while I love both, are kinda kitschy in a way that Angel Dust isn't.

There aren't really even any songs I dislike from it, but I enjoy the highs of Angel Dust more.

(though there is "Midnight Cowboy" and "RV", so.....)

King for a Day secretly has it over both of these records imo

― Whiney G. Weingarten

The issue with KotD is that it crosses over into simple genre parody too often, which is less interesting no matter how well done those parodies might be. On Angel Dust it's more like each individual song combines several genres to create something original. The more enduring songs on King for me are the ones that attempt that, such as the title track, Ricochet and Last to Know. Something like Evidence is fun and very listenable, but not as exciting as their more experimental hybrid tracks.

*KfaD, I think I'm getting it mixed up with Match of the Day.

yah I don't get the criticism of KFAD here it's a perfect record

Album of the Year is also a really satisfying listen.

Much of KFAD is very good but too often it's like Patton and Spruance weren't quite finished purging their Bungle-fied juvenilia. While Album of the Year isn't as good an album overall as KFAD, it's more consistently good (and I might go so far as to say that FNM, as much as I love them, never put out an album as consistently good as California).

(I was writing that before I saw the previous post, so I guess discussing Album of the Year was just the logical next step in this convo.)

California and Angel Dust are my only two serious contenders for best Patton album.

Everyting on AotY is at least decent, but it only has three of four really great tracks.

Mit Gas is the next runner up imo

I'm impressed by all these different viewpoints.

Many People Have Different Perspectives on Mike Patton's Recorded Output: Should You Be Afraid?

Let's gossip: I think it's fucked up how Mike treated Trey at the end of Mr. Bungle.

I think I'd be more afraid if everyone was in agreement re: FNM, Tomahawk, Peeping Tow, Fantomas, Mr. Bungle, Lovage, solo, Zorn stuff, et al. They're sort of designed to defy consensus.

+ all the Secret Chiefs stuff + live shows post California is much better than anything Patton has done.

Hey Kurt - how did Mike treat Trey? curious...

Favourite Patton:

Mr. Bungle - California - Would kill to see a documentary on this illuminating the weird tape methods they used.
Mondo Cane - S/T
Fantomas - Suspended Animation
Faith No More - Angel Dust

King For a Day... is my favourite FNM album at this stage.

The story goes: Mike wouldn't talk to Trey directly and wanted all communication go through Greg W, former Jello Biafra/AT biz dude and the guy Patton founded Ipecac with. Trey didn't want to do business through Greg and wanted to do things like they always have (they are all childhood friends). This caused a huge fight and Mike, when asked about the future of Mr. B in Rolling Stone, said some pretty mean shit about Trey.. he is a self centered egomaniac or something. Trey handled it in the press with much more class.

Trey: As time wears on you find out who your friends are, and who they aren't. Mike and I always had the best working relationship imaginable. Really, very very good and fruitful. There are other things in life we see differently. I don't think those things are irreconcilable at all. But when you get used to having things your own way, and certain people around you resist the "natural order" of becoming subordinate to you, you may start nursing resentments. Even lashing out at them and calling them egomaniacs etc. for not assuming the position. I think in my case it was too painful for Patton to realize that where there are no subordinates there is no insubordination. Like most of us, Mike tends to begin the process of deciding whether or not he can afford to discard a person's point of view altogether, rather than facing certain difficult facts of life. So to answer your question, there was never any big mess between he and I specifically. The general dysfunction coming from being expected to silently endure more and more of this emerging top-down/top-dog order-barking thing he'd taken to just ended up getting really tiresome for everyone involved. In a band, strong personalities need to know where to draw the line on this kind of stuff. Anyway, since it wasn't going to happen, I was the idiot who started to draw that line. I admit I had more emotional involvement in the process than would be neccesary for a non-robot, having poured comparatively ridiculously copious doses of my blood into the project. Patton's subsequent resentment towards me is a fairly predictable outcome. You don't stand up to him and stay off the shit-list. A bummer, yeah, but its essentially a self-protecting reflex action - something I don't really feel a need to hold against him too much. He has his way. It won't change. And after all why should it? This method works well for him overall -- who am I to question it? I dare say it's even part of his charm. (we are a nation of pathological narcissists after all!). Whatever. Really, I feel fondly about the time we spent making music together, and feel we did some great things. And, while I am diametrically opposed to it on a human level, over time I do appreciate the clarity of his cut and dry approach: how black and white it makes things. You're either in the club, or out of the club. Unfortunately, I have to say I do prefer life as an excommunicate from that kind of 'friendship'. I know he prefers it that way too. I'm sure both of us would agree it was a good run, though.

Patton: “We could have probably squeezed out a couple more records but the collective personality of this group became so dysfunctional, this band was poisoned by one person's petty jealousy and insecurity, and it led us to a slow, unnatural death. And I'm at peace with that, because I know I tried all I could.”

To be honest I would not know whose side to take on that without more inside knowledge - they both say more or less the same thing about the other in different ways (Trey somewhat more magnaminously, granted).

it's definitely one of those "i wasn't there, i don't know" things for me, and they've worked together since then anyway.

Thanks for sharing that Kurt. Secret Chiefs rule hard live...it's a shame the only time I've seen Patton was Peeping Tom which was like the diluted version of everything that makes Patton good.

Only time I've seen Patton was in 96 with FNM, should probably keep it that way.

Fantomas videos rule hard live though, especially with Terry Bozzio

Ha, it's like their first criteria was a bigger kit than Lombardo's.

It's been over a decade since I've followed Mike Patton religiously, but didn't he do a song with Secret Chiefs at some point in the last few years? That seemed to bode wel for a possible Bungle reunion, but of course it didn't happen.

I liked the Fantomas lineup with Crover a lot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PwERjFal7Rs

Jackie, the jacque brel one?

with Secret Chiefs

Pretty awesome, though hard not to hear Walker's version in the back of my head

holy crap i didn't know about that track. it's great!!!

Seemed to put to rest any hard feelings between the two at the time.

I don't think Mike's been too prolific lately anyway. I heard one track from the album with the guy from TV on the Radio. It was really, really, really bad. That came out in the last year or two, right?

Yeah, doesn't seem like he's been up to much. Nevermen album was bad, but the Boards of Canada remix of Mr Mistake is great.

Was going to make a smartass comment about wasn't there talk about a FNM reunion album at some point OH WAIT but then I just realized that that was two years ago and now I feel old and sad, wondering where it is that time goes when it slips through my fingers unnoticed.

There was also that new FNM album..never really heard it

I liked it at first. Haven't really thought about it since.

Cone of Shame, Matador and Separation Anxiety are pretty rocking.

Was going to make a smartass comment about wasn't there talk about a FNM reunion album at some point OH WAIT but then I just realized that that was two years ago and now I feel old and sad, wondering where it is that time goes when it slips through my fingers unnoticed.

― The twin snake of violence and sex is more like a sick wolf. (Old Lunch), Thursday, March 9, 2017 9:09 AM (fifty-one minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

the original reformation was in 2009

which makes me feel old and sad lol

FNM reunion album =a good album, nothing spectacular

I just checked out the Ipecac site for the first time in years and it's just a huge list of Omar Rodriguez-Lopez releases. Damn.

The only album I've listened to on Ipecac recently is A Raw Youth by Le Butcherettes.

Which was produced by Omar Rodriguez-Lopez.

King For A Day is fkn genius

Angel Dust makes me feel like I'm in high school (in a good way)

The Real Thing still surprises me, even now it sounds exciiting

My personal accounting of albums to listen to on a Walkman while mowing the lawn: Physical Graffiti, Superunknown, The Real Thing

(Oh, and I listened to the first Comus album when I mowed my mom's yard a few years ago, that was pretty ace but it was not on a Walkman.)

just imagining the neighbor's kids running home crying cos the man next door is screaming "SURPRISE! YOU'RE DEAD!" while mowing the lawn

FTR I was like thirteen when I was screaming "SURPRISE! YOU'RE DEAD!" and making kids run home crying.

My very obnoxious friend put "The Bends" from Disco Volante on full blast on his car and we drove around suburban Dallas with his windows rolled all the way down. So many nasty looks. I think that's the one with all the horrible noise. It's been a while.

if i had had a cell phone in 1993, be aggressive would have been my ringtone

I love it how the vocal approach that Patton utilised on The Real Thing only lasted for that album!

Looks like Kaada and Patton did another album in 2016 in re: to what Patton's been up to

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PohCD7Umz98

Difference between "trashing a hotel room" and "giving someone an e coli infection".

Dave Matthews hasn't recovered from dumping shit and piss on innocent bystanders

And then there was the Chicago River Incident

Replacements used to put a dead fish in hotel ice dispensers, iirc. And God knows where they peed.

Speaking words of wisdom....