Vinyl records make a return

Once again... M.I.A.'s Kala is 47 minutes and it's a 2-disc set. I'm not into that idea.

the idea of bass?

yeah more than 20 minutes a side is really asking for trouble. unless you don't care about the last track on each side

The thing is, sometimes doubles happen w/albums where the sides couldn't possibly be more than 20 minutes

Case In Point:

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41mNN3mIp-L._SS400_.jpg

Total time: 34:33 for 11 songs, resulting in a double w/two and three short songs per side.

i never even made it through the last couple of wu tang albums. we are talkin' like 8 sides there. i can't be expected to get out of my chair THAT much.

Whatever label pressed my copy of 36 chambers did it the right way.. 58 minute album, 1 LP. The order of tracks is not consistant with the CD, but somehow I totally do not mind at all.

― billstevejim, Thursday, April 30, 2009 4:37 AM (11 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

those old loud pressings don't really sound very good though

i just don't think i have the energy to take every album on a case-by-case basis, doing internet consumer report testing on whether cd or vinyl sounds better

Esp. since indie-rock bloggers are mad gung ho about it right now, and somehow got the idea that records like Merriweather Post Pavillion and Veckatimest were "Made for vinyl"

And they're welcome to it.

back in the day (mid-90s) i bought vinyl -- new and old -- because it was cheaper for my teenage budget. I could get, say, the new pavement album for $8.99 on LP, rather than $15.99 on CD. Now i go to record stores and they're trying to sell stuff like that REM album posted above for $27 ...

yeah i mean i dunno we've had zillions of arguments about it, but honestly it also depends a lot on your turntable, needle, cartridge too...it's not like if you're playing it on some hashed old table with a worn out needle it's going to sound good...the difference in hardware is a lot more apparent with vinyl IMO than with CD

back in the day (mid-90s) i bought vinyl -- new and old -- because it was cheaper for my teenage budget. I could get, say, the new pavement album for $8.99 on LP, rather than $15.99 on CD.

so true - for a long time I was buying vinyl both cuz it was a better product, sounded nicer, and was cheaper.

you can still buy plenty of new LPs for $10-15, which doesn't seem like too much money imho.

a lot of it depends on who the label is aiming the product at (aging REM fams developing a hip audiophilia vs. punx) and how they manage their costs.

yeah, i suppose you can still find cheap indie vinyl, as opposed to like REM/Radiohead collector gouging.

re: Radiohead, like I said earlier (xpost) they create digital music, so listening to it on an analog medium does not make sense to me.

yeah it depends...sometimes i don't mind. like the capital reissues of roxy music and the band have been really nice sounding....or anything pressed at RTI like the astral weeks reissue..if it's a total classic record i don't really mind cuz i know i will always want to have it...but yeah a lot of newer punk stuff is still around the 12-13 price range...or like deerhunter cryptograms was about 16 i think? and that had the flourescent gray EP on it too

re: Radiohead, like I said earlier (xpost) they create digital music, so listening to it on an analog medium does not make sense to me.

― billstevejim, Thursday, April 30, 2009 4:47 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

it's a lot more than digital vs analog. like i've said before you can get a pretty sensitive great record player for not too much, the equivalent CD player would be way more expensive.

plus a lot of the ways in which vinyl sands off the harsh edges of stuff can really help to make newer records more listenable, they aren't compressed as much in mastering, etc

like i've said before you can get a pretty sensitive great record player for not too much, the equivalent CD player would be way more expensive.

Well, I dunno about that. Rather depends on what you mean by "equivalent". I mean, if you accept that there is no real equivalence because the two formats have different strengths, then I don't know at what point you can say that any given turntable is as good as any given CD player.

You can get close to state-of-the-art 16/44.1k playback from a $300 Sony - the same can't really be said wrt vinyl replay of a $300 Thorens or MusicHall (that's what they called ProJect in the US, right?). It'll sound good - indeed, if that's the sound you prefer, it'll sound better than maybe any CD player. But I'm not sure you can really say "this old belt-drive Dual beats any sub-£1000 CD player" cos I don't think it works like that.

I'll sell my Copland before I sell my Michell, though...

Whatever label pressed my copy of 36 chambers did it the right way.. 58 minute album, 1 LP. The order of tracks is not consistant with the CD, but somehow I totally do not mind at all.

― billstevejim

that wu tang lp sounded so horrible audio-wise i sold it back after a week, it was mixed so low : /

interesting that m@tt's said that the newer vinyl's mastered different from the cd, i'd been wondering abt that

that wu tang lp sounded so horrible audio-wise i sold it back after a week, it was mixed so low : /

I don't mind it at all.. My stereo has a volume knob. As far as I can tell, all the music is there.

I bet if they made less expensive special editions of these records that were 1-LP instead of 2, the 1-LP editions would sell better.. which is exactly what they should do if they want to increase sales.

Yeah, 36 Chambers doesn't sound great but it's not horrible and somehow this album just wouldn't WORK as a double - I mean, too few songs per side, too many flips, but also the whole out-of-the-underground speed and raggedness of the whole presentation is hard to sustain with a double-LP 180 gram prestige package, you know? (Hence the impact and swagger of Wu-Tang Forever being a double CD, this time around they'd conquered all - I mean the lead single was "Triumph" for pete's sake.)

I buy vinyl exclusively; I won't rehash the reasons because there's tons of threads like that - but as far as supply and demand goes, I will say that I would buy a LOT more new vinyl if major reissues could get priced at the point of, I dunno, new releases on Kill Rock Stars. I hear what people are saying about economies of scale and shit, and I'm no economist, but I'm pretty sure if KRS can put out a $12 record Sony should be able to. The REM cited above is a case in point, actually all their vinyl post-New Adventures has been one continuous gouge. WTF, guys?

plus a lot of the ways in which vinyl sands off the harsh edges of stuff can really help to make newer records more listenable, they aren't compressed as much in mastering, etc

But the problem here is the way current CDs are being compressed, not that CD sounds that way in the first place. Today's music isn't being mastered for CD, it is being mastered for iPods and mobile phones. And that is the main problem about it.

yesterday i got my first new vinyl album in many many years.

http://www.recordstore.co.uk/images/covers09/02.2009/madness_200.jpg

its a object of desire, as i doubt i'll ever play it (the package also includes the cd .. ), but it does look good.

Top Selling Jazz Vinyl-April 2009


Charles Mingus - Mingus Ah Um [1 LP] 180 Gram Vinyl
Yusef Lateef - Eastern Sounds
Diana Krall - Quiet Nights [LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
Jorge Ben - Forca Bruta [LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
Roy Hargrove & The Rh Factor - Strength [Ep]
Bobby Hutcherson - Solo / Quartet
Bill Evans Trio - How My Heart Sings
Norah Jones - Live From Austin Texas [2 LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
John Coltrane - Blue Train [LP] (120 Gram Vinyl plus CD)
Cassandra Wilson - Loverly [LP]
Bill Evans - Waltz For Debby [LP]
Norah Jones - Come Away With Me [LP] (200 Gram Vinyl)
Cannonball Adderley - Somethin Else [LP] (120 Gram Vinyl plus CD)
Art Blakey & Jazz Messengers - Moanin' [LP] (120 Gram Vinyl plus CD)
Lee Morgan - Sidewinder [LP] (120 Gram Vinyl plus CD)
Herbie Hancock - Maiden Voyage [LP] (120 Gram Vinyl plus CD)
Miles Davis - Bitches Brew [2 LP] (180 Gram)
Miles Davis - Bags' Groove (w/ Modern Jazz Giants) [LP]
Miles Davis - Sketches Of Spain [LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
Bill Evans - Time Remembered
Miles Davis - The New Miles Davis Quintet [LP]
Miles Davis Quintet - Relaxin' With The Miles Davis Quintet [LP]
Miles Davis - Nefertiti [LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
Milt Jackson / Ray Brown / Mickey Roker / Joe Pass - The Ellington Album - 'All Too Soon'
Sonny Rollins - Saxophone Colossus
Various Artists - Droppin Science: Greatest Samples from the Blue Note Lab [2 LP]
Pyramids, The - King of Kings [LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
Gil Scott-Heron - Pieces Of A Man (180 Gram Vinyl)
Miles Davis Quintet - Workin' With The Miles Davis Quintet [LP]
Thelonious Monk - With John Coltrane [LP]
Gal Costa - Gal Costa [LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
John Coltrane - Soultrane [LP]
Pyramids, The - Lalibela [LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
Pyramids, The - Birth/Speed/Merging 1976 [LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
Norah Jones - Come Away With Me
Art Blakey - Kyoto [LP]
Norah Jones - Feels Like Home
Miles Davis - Kind Of Blue 50th Anniversary Collector's Edition [LP] (180 Gram BLUE Vinyl plus 2 CD's / 1 DVD / Book / Poster i
Herbie Hancock - Blow-Up (Soundtrack) (180 Gram Vinyl) (feats. the Yardbirds with Jeff Beck and Jimmy Page)
Kenny Burrell - Midnight Blue [LP] (120 Gram Vinyl plus CD)
Diana Krall - Live In Paris [2 LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
Hank Jones - Just For Fun
Medeski Martin & Wood - End Of The World Party [2 LP]
Diana Krall - The Look Of Love [2 LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
Hank Mobley - Soul Station [LP] (120 Gram Vinyl plus CD)
Joe Henderson - Page One [LP] (120 Gram Vinyl plus CD)
Kenny Dorham - Quiet Kenny
Milt Jackson - Milt Jackson And Strings - Feelings
Sonny Rollins - Way Out West [LP]
Dexter Gordon - Go! [LP] (120 Gram Vinyl plus CD)
John Coltrane - Ballads [LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
Bill Evans - Everybody Digs Bill Evans [LP]
Sonny Rollins - Sonny Rollins & The Contemporary Leaders
Miles Davis - In A Silent Way [LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
McCoy Tyner - Real McCoy [LP] (120 Gram Vinyl plus CD)
Eddie 'Lockjaw' Davis - Straight Ahead
Cal Tjader Sextet - A Night At The Blackhawk [LP]
Bill Evans - Sunday At The Village Vanguard [LP]
Miles Davis - Kind Of Blue [LP] (200 Gram Classic Quiex SV - Super Vinyl)
Norah Jones - Feels Like Home [LP] (200 Gram)
Weather Report - Heavy Weather [LP] [180 Gram Vinyl]
Billie Holiday - God Bless The Child [LP]
Duke Ellington & His Orchestra - Up In Duke's Workshop
Norah Jones - Not Too Late (200 Gram)
John Coltrane - A Love Supreme [LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
Horace Silver Quintet - Song For My Father [LP] (120 Gram Vinyl plus CD)
Gene Ammons - Boss Tenor
John Coltrane - The Last Trane [LP]
Joe Bataan - Riot!
Eric Dolphy - Out There [LP]
Bob Scobey - The Scobey Story Vol. 1 [LP]
Wayne Shorter - Speak No Evil [LP] (120 Gram Vinyl plus CD)
John Coltrane - Giant Steps [LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
Red Garland Trio with Paul Chambers & Art Taylor - Groovy [LP]
Ray Barretto - Acid
Eric Dolphy - Outward Bound [LP]
Charles Mingus - Mingus At The Bohemia (with special guest Max Roach) [LP]
Wes Montgomery - Incredible Jazz Guitar [LP]
John Coltrane - Inch Worm
Nina Simone - The Amazing Nina Simone [LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
Duke Ellington & John Coltrane - Duke Ellington & John Coltrane [LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
John Coltrane - Live At The Village Vanguard Again [LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
John Coltrane - Crescent
Don Ellis Quintet - New Ideas
Lucky Thompson Quartet - Lucky Strikes [LP]
Herbie Hancock - Thrust [LP] (180 Gram Vinyl)
Herb Alpert & The Tijuana Brass - Whipped Cream & Other Delights [LP] (PICTURE DISC) (includes Poster)
Cedar Walton - Plays Cedar Walton
Eddie 'Lockjaw' Davis - Montreux '77
Milt Jackson Quartet - Milt Jackson Quartet [LP]
Ray Barretto - Barretto - Power
Miles Davis - Birth Of The Cool [LP] (180 Gram - Mono)
Ray Barretto - Hard Hands

those pyramids records are pretty dope imho.

re: Radiohead, like I said earlier (xpost) they create digital music, so listening to it on an analog medium does not make sense to me.

― billstevejim, Thursday, April 30, 2009 4:47 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

instinctively I would agree with this and it probably holds generally. I have In Rainbows on vinyl and it seems to sound just a lot lovelier in that format than on CD. I think of it as their most analogue-y record at least since The Bends, and most of the time it sounds more warm and natural even than that. The exception is 15 Step. Surprisingly I felt like it made more sense with the vinyl sound, with the digital noise at the beginning being a bit too jumbly and distorted in digital versions

so are any of you finding that new cds are really cheap? i've been to about 4 or 5 record stores in the past week and have found tons of new cds that are like $8 or $10. major label stuff, even, anything from byrds/stones/dylan to newer hip-hop stuff that came out in the past 5 years.

like 6 years ago all these wouldve been like $15. anyone know the reason for this? are record companies actually bringing down the prices of cds? thought it'd be the opposite but i don't know

I haven't bought a new CD in a long time but a price drop makes sense according to economics 101 - drop in demand > drop in price.

Then again, drop in demand for NYT has led to an increase in price, so what do I know. I guess it all depends on profit margins per unit sold.

Forca Bruta is a jazz album?

target end caps have been doing the 8$ new CDS for like "hot new artists" for a while...i remember buying the strokes for that reason cuz it was so cheap

^^^you still got ripped off

nah bro i like that record

The Bends is 48:37 on 1 LP.
Kid A is 49:57 on 2 LPs.

I just don't get it. Does a minute & 20 seconds really make that much difference? Also additionally frustrating because I always thought "Treefingers" would be a great Side A closer.

kid A is on a 10" lp iirc

you can def get more on a record (prefab sprout's jordan the comeback, for example, is 64 minutes long and was issued as a single lp). there are quality concerns, i guess, the more you fit on one side. i guess the people who buy records now are willing to spend more, so you have all these 180 gram high quality pressings, and a lot of double albums. personally i like albums to be on one lp whenever possible.

i think the "over 20 minutes" crowd are being a little hypersensitive. it's only at 25+ minutes that sound quality starts to be an issue for me. that said, the double 12" 45 format, with like 10-15 minutes of music per side, sounds fantastic. southern lord and relapse do this a lot, and as long as they keep costs semi-reasonable, i approve.

crowd is/crowds are

Yeah, I'm on the fence b/c I really hate slogging through double albums. But I just bought a new pressing of The Boy With The Arab Strap and the sound is bad on the last song and a half on either side. I dunno if that's just a badly-done record or just a fundamental problem cramming too much on one disc.

wait, nm, i just checked and it's only 45:18, so fuck those guys

The less on a disc the loud you can make the pressing as the grooves are wider, and also cut things like bass louder/have more complex waveforms without the needle jumping out of the groove etc. Something probably not much an issue with The Bends.

the *louder*

A buddy told me about a four disc single sided 45 RPM edition of Big Star's Radio City, but I haven't seen anything about that anywhere.
There's also something similar for Led Zeppelin, I guess. I dunno.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/dec/25/antidote-to-capitalism-33-revolutions-minute

Anecdotal evidence suggests the consumers responsible are not just hard-bitten types – men, usually – of a certain age, but much younger people.

I reach for a record, and take 40 minutes or so to give it my undivided attention. So as to be kept in its original condition, it must be carefully played as its creators intended, and also divided by the lovely pause for reflection in between sides one and two

The sound quality is way better than anything digital

when the iPod era ended with the arrival of the streaming service Spotify, the infinite jukebox of millions of dreams was made real. Here, though, is the problem: as I distractedly jump from song to song, am I actually listening, or merely hearing?

modern pop has little time for delayed gratification, so intros must be quickened, choruses brought forward, and the most banal buttons pushed.

sorry, would go on but i just shat in my own mouth

Dreadful, dreadful article. I love vinyl, but sound quality better than anything digital? Please.