Mourning in America - Trump Year One: November '16 to

Common ground is important, is all I am saying, in a year that saw all the norms of our political culture evaporate into orange dust.

Oh cool this again

"For every new regulation, two old regulations must be eliminated."

That sounds like a very carefully worked-out strategy.

The class/race divide really is complicated, and Treeship is 100% right that people should look for common ground. But then on the other hand you've got Bernie Sanders up on stage saying 'The working class of this country is being decimated. That's why Donald Trump won.' Not even lip service to race in the explanation of why a white supremacist won the election. How to find common ground in that?

smfh

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissism_of_small_differences

here are some tweets from the past couple of days, you tired fucking troll

https://twitter.com/SenSanders/status/799680323181121536
https://twitter.com/SenSanders/status/799668183351357440
https://twitter.com/SenSanders/status/800101849793642496
https://twitter.com/SenSanders/status/800392536342687744

Trolling according to you is discussing actual quotes from an actual speech without going through the speakers twitter-history?

your implicit point that sanders is supposedly unable to cultivate common ground based on a cherry-picked excerpt from one speech is belied by the rest of his messaging. it's hard enough to get people to agree on anything without useless performative white europeans constantly concern trolling every few hours. stop fucking posting here

So the greatest trepidation for me about working under this administration is the sheer amount of endemic stupidity. Hateful ideas can be fought with, argued against, beaten back, shown for the cowardly retrograde shit that they are. I really believe that. But stupid people drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.

I just keep imagining a briefing where we lay out all the facts on why it's a bad and unreasonable idea to require backdoors in every smartphone sold in America only to be told there's no other way to keep us safe from terror so just make it happen, nerds!

xps - I don't think the part you quoted (or paraphrased) was difficult to find common ground with. Your assertion that he does not even pay lip service to race as an explanation for Trump's victory could definitely be considered trolling.

It's a shitty speech - and I'm using the actual quotes, I know it was misquoted originally. A huge problem with structural white supremacy is that it constantly makes itself invisible. When Bernie Sanders says 'life expectancy for many workers has gone down' he doesn't mention that those statistics are about white workers, because the whiteness is invisible. He is talking about specific white problems, but they're 'beyond identity politics' because white identity is the normal identity.

with the Yam issuing policy videos, I think all my pub drinking in London this week will be Orwell haunts.

And k3v, fuck no you're not gonna make me stop posting. I don't care if you think I'm concern trolling, you also said about hispanics asking Mike Pence to think of them, that the 'sole purpose was to generate attention and controversy'. And fuck no it isn't 'belied' by the rest of his messaging, it fits with his campaign all too well, unfortunately. Which doesn't mean he's a bad person. It's not easy to combine identity and class, but it doesn't get easier when people like you are constantly doing personal attacks and attacks on motivation instead of discussing what's being said. You stop posting.

I feel your despair, El Tomboto.

xp kev and me and 49 others will tho u tiresome lecturey tonedeaf child

i bet when they check the records even trump voters will have gpd u

A huge problem with structural white supremacy is that it constantly makes itself invisible. When Bernie Sanders says 'life expectancy for many workers has gone down' he doesn't mention that those statistics are about white workers, because the whiteness is invisible. He is talking about specific white problems, but they're 'beyond identity politics' because white identity is the normal identity.

― Frederik B, Monday, November 21, 2016 9:53 PM (eleven minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i'm not sure you understand how much economic misery there is in this country.

God, people threatening to fp posters they disagree with must be so childish, insecure and pathetic. I get it for threats or personal attacks, but ffs, grow up darragh.

you dont understand what fp is for

its for irritant posters who fuck evryone off without the outright bannable behaviours you listed.

you are textbook.

Treeship: The statistics that started the whole debate about life expectancy were always about white people. Black people, as a group, are living longer and longer, though still shorter than white people. If he wanted to talk about general economic misery, he could say 'life expectancy is too low for many groups', but he took a statistic that was true for one race, and made race invisible. Which, again, does not make him a bad person, but it's indicative of how easy it is to turn a white identity into the de facto identity when speaking of class.

darragh, you just threatened that you'd help get me 51'd. You are a pathetic coward.

i would never disagree with you that black people in america face tons of obstacles that whites don't. the discrepancies in our criminal justice system alone are unspeakable and that's just the start of it. our neighborhoods and schools are segregated. but i think that it is worth pointing out that black, white, latino and all other workers are subject to the same brutal economic forces, the same heartless privatization and union busting policies. white and black residents of flint michigan are drinking the same poison water. if we keep arguing about how to frame this reality i don't think we'll ever address it. i also think things like criminal justice reform go hand in hand with addressing poverty and empowering labor organizations.

Fred could you remind us again how you know so much about racial politics in America and how to undo the centuries-spanning injustice of the country's foundational sin, over which a devastating civil war was fought, with one weird trick

I've read Ta-nehisi Coates.

Also, you are currently repeating a debate we've had for fifteen years in Denmark, since our populists became the foundation for the right-wing government in 2001. The US is not the only country in the world where the left is dealing with an identity/class conflict of emphasis.

i agree with fred that we shouldn't go for a kind of race blind new dealism that would overwhelmingly benefit whites. i just also don't think sanders was advocating that. he was more criticizing the kind of identity politics rooted in tokenism, like clinton's glass ceiling rhetoric, or the idea that inequality is fine as long as the people on the top include representatives from various genders and races. while the success of anti-discrimination legislation is important, and must continue and go much further, there are other problems to address too -- problems that affect people of all races and prevent them from leading healthy, fulfilling lives

thanks for new hi-concept dn tris

can y'all, like, grab a smoke, a drink, or listen to the Tribe album? Some of you have been writing words that may or may not turn into sentences since early this morning.

did u really hate nocturnal animals, im missing the spurs game tonight to go see it ffs

yeah go watch it (I hated it)

otm, everyone take a thread break, listen to Tribe

I'm just going to stop to try to figure things out because smarter people have already done so and I'm going to follow their trail ie. Rev. Barber.

Fred could you remind us again how you know so much about racial politics in America and how to undo the centuries-spanning injustice of the country's foundational sin, over which a devastating civil war was fought, with one weird trick

― slathered in cream and covered with stickers (silby), Monday, November 21, 2016 10:14 PM (thirty-four minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I've read Ta-nehisi Coates.

― Frederik B, Monday, November 21, 2016 10:19 PM (twenty-nine minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

too good. i had to take it, first time I've ever used a display name

lol

Alexis de Wokeville

haha

A+

pretty good

i don't even remember what i was thinking when i came up with my ugly ilx name (collardio etc)

Frederik Douglas... xpost to Treeship 'if we keep arguing about how to frame this reality i don't think we'll ever address it.' It scares me, with guys like Kobach possibly going to lead DHS that people aren't solely focused on the possible damage to so many lives. forget theory for a second. it'll still be there.

Man, Kobach is such good evidence for the theory that sinister motherfuckers actually look sinister.

like most of middle school was spent kicking the shit of people

yeah, exactly lion in winter. and it's hard for me bc i love a good theoretical argument. but right now i feel like, i know who my enemies are. and they aren't the other people on the left who perhaps have a different understanding of the mechanisms of inequality than i do.

yes, that exactly. He has the face of a locker-stuffer.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/21/business/media/trump-summons-tv-figures-for-private-meeting-and-lets-them-have-it.html

so apparently this actually happened?

yeah, i heard katy tur and some bro from the washington post talk about it on msnbc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVg2EJvvlF8

https://twitter.com/justinamash/status/800914868039655425

Republican Congressman from Michigan, speaking out against Trump

Ok, "speaking out" is a bit strong. "Is critical of Trump" probably makes more sense

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/21/business/media/trump-summons-tv-figures-for-private-meeting-and-lets-them-have-it.html

so apparently this actually happened?

― k3vin k., Tuesday, November 22, 2016 4:29 AM (twenty-three minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

his awful twitter fans seem absolutely cock-a-hoop about this, all those people who leave aggro comments below online articles can't believe they have a president who can actually say this stuff to journalists faces

i thought that everyone in america knew they were at least supposed to pretend to believe that the freedom of the press, as one of the great bulwarks of liberty, should be inviolable.