It doesnt matter if there were some lost sheep in the clown coalition. Racism was a major part of the movement, a major reason it was popular. It's the only thing that makes this phenomenon intelligible.
― Treeship, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:10 (seven years ago) link
No one really thought he was going to bring their jobs back come on. He was a vehicle for white revenge by and large.
― Treeship, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:11 (seven years ago) link
No one really thought he was going to bring their jobs back come on.
they wanted to believe! not saying that race wasn't a factor, but it wasn't the only one, if you're talking about everyone who supported him.
― sarahell, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:12 (seven years ago) link
supporting someone promoting an explicitly racist ideology means one of two things: 1) you agree with that ideology, or 2) you do not find that ideology grounds for rejection. Both = being cool w racism.
― Οὖτις, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:14 (seven years ago) link
racism-friendly
― scott seward, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:14 (seven years ago) link
and the next time I see my Jewish (!) relatives that voted for him I am going to give them a ton of shit. "first they came for" etc.
― Οὖτις, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:15 (seven years ago) link
everyone who voted for trump should be called a racist forever. by everyone who didn't vote for trump.
"have you met my cousin cathy? she's a racist and a dental hygienist. cathy, this is bob."
― scott seward, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:17 (seven years ago) link
of course POC can be racist wtd
against themselves?
― Supercreditor (Dr Morbius), Friday, 11 November 2016 21:18 (seven years ago) link
that wasn't what you asked initially and is a more complicated question
― Οὖτις, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:19 (seven years ago) link
i thought it was inherent, my apologies
― Supercreditor (Dr Morbius), Friday, 11 November 2016 21:20 (seven years ago) link
I grew up in a conservative town with a large Latino population, during the Gulf War, a lot of the guys were as crassly "kill the towelheads" as their white counterparts.
― sarahell, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:20 (seven years ago) link
http://i.imgur.com/XcpPVsj.png
speaking of promoting extremist ideologies
― AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Friday, 11 November 2016 21:20 (seven years ago) link
From a high-school teacher (quoted in http://jezebel.com/what-do-i-say-stories-from-the-classroom-after-electi-1788781296):
My struggle is this: I have been taught and fully embrace that my job is to make a safe space for kids to share their viewpoints. Whether or not I agree is so unimportant that I don’t even take it into consideration. However, a long time ago, this election became no longer a political choice but a moral one. Everyone who voted for Trump is not racist, but everyone who voted for Trump had to decide that racism was not a dealbreaker.
Whether "deciding that racism was not a dealbreaker" is itself equivalent to "racism" is a semantic debate. Either way, though, there is no moral out.
― Wozniak on Kimye's Baby (jaymc), Friday, 11 November 2016 21:21 (seven years ago) link
secondhand story from L.A.: a friend of ours whose housekeeper is here on a work visa and lives in south L.A., who woke up to find that a dump truck-sized amount of trash had been deposited in the middle of the street outside their house and "TRUMP" had been scrawled on many of the bags.
― nomar, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:21 (seven years ago) link
she is here from Mexico and trying to earn money and earn residency and would like to get her college degree, she arrived that morning in tears and terror.
― nomar, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:22 (seven years ago) link
well yeah duh POC are not a monolithic cohort
xps
― Οὖτις, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:22 (seven years ago) link
The one (maybe literally) Muslim woman who wrote a WaPo oped about voting for him said it boiled down to his stance on Islamic extremism, iirc. She didn't think the current gov or Clinton was taking it seriously enough. Don't know if that is racist or self-defeating, necessarily, though of course I'd love to hear her thoughts on the matter if she's forced to register or be rounded up in pursuit of the agenda she supported.
― Josh in Chicago, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:23 (seven years ago) link
I mean, Morbz, how long have you lived in NYC? You have never experienced one PoC expressing racist sentiments?
― sarahell, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:25 (seven years ago) link
yes, and i've seen Spike Lee films. I was asking if a POC voting for Trump is being racist toward blacks, Asians, Latinos, Muslims etc.
btw the "sausage making" of 'ho-hum, just politics' strategies in memos such as the one above always make me want to projectile-vomit
and if this is true, i suggest shooting the B/H/C trio into space as founders of our Mars colony:
https://twitter.com/tinyrevolution/status/797145182642831361
― Supercreditor (Dr Morbius), Friday, 11 November 2016 21:27 (seven years ago) link
I was asking if a POC voting for Trump is being racist toward blacks, Asians, Latinos, Muslims etc.
based on the definition of racist other posters are using, then yes.
― sarahell, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:28 (seven years ago) link
kinda sad that in his litany of racist shit I can't recall if he ever really said anything explicitly racist about Asians (beyond blanket condemnations of China, which is not really the same thing)
― Οὖτις, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:30 (seven years ago) link
@tinyrevolutionSaul Alinsky, the Lucifer-worshipper who turned both Clinton & Obama into demons, predicted our current reality in 1971:
https://twitter.com/tinyrevolution/status/793904566651604993
― Supercreditor (Dr Morbius), Friday, 11 November 2016 21:34 (seven years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6zk31iNtHs
― Karl Malone, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:37 (seven years ago) link
LBI otm and shakey otm. This continent was developed and this country was built on genocide and the free labor of enslaved people. Tuesday was the flowering of a 240-year-old seed. 50 million racists? psssh, don't sell America short
― aaaaaaaauuuuuuuuu (melting robot) (WilliamC), Friday, 11 November 2016 21:38 (seven years ago) link
― Wozniak on Kimye's Baby (jaymc)
thank you jaymc
― xiphoid beetlebum (rushomancy), Friday, 11 November 2016 21:38 (seven years ago) link
I don't think they would agree on your definition of "morality" ... this is really a pointless argument, except for catharsis. I'm all for catharsis, I guess. It isn't really a discussion about what people who voted for Trump believe or wanted to believe, but what we believe about them from our moral/ethical standpoint. That's fine. They aren't posting here.
― sarahell, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:46 (seven years ago) link
Newsnight had a special on earlier about Trump being President/Immediate aftermath of the election etc.& managed to have somebody in on their panel who was denying that Trump had said anything racist. Which does make me wonder about how people are defining things possibly including 'saying' and 'racist'.
Also had locals in Terre Haute talking about how Trump said the same things that they said among themselves at home which is one reason why they liked him. Just brings home how normalising having a president who acts like him may be for questionable thought processes.
― Stevolende, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:49 (seven years ago) link
http://peterlevine.ws/?p=17674
http://peterlevine.ws/images/Screen-Shot-2016-11-11-at-1.19.30-PM.png
― j., Friday, 11 November 2016 21:52 (seven years ago) link
yes
― the notes the loon doesn't play (ulysses), Friday, 11 November 2016 21:55 (seven years ago) link
what a way to go out
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/11/obama-approve-dakota-access-pipeline-231255
― goole, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:56 (seven years ago) link
shit
― Supercreditor (Dr Morbius), Friday, 11 November 2016 21:57 (seven years ago) link
ughhh
― sarahell, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:58 (seven years ago) link
goddammit
― Οὖτις, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:59 (seven years ago) link
the oil and gas industry needed some good news
it's been such a rough week for them
― Karl Malone, Friday, 11 November 2016 21:59 (seven years ago) link
vindictive
― ¶ (DJP), Friday, 11 November 2016 22:00 (seven years ago) link
xp - brb gonna invest my savings in Chevron
― sarahell, Friday, 11 November 2016 22:01 (seven years ago) link
i've only seen that on politico but if it turns out to be true, that's a true shit stain on his legacy
― akm, Friday, 11 November 2016 22:01 (seven years ago) link
If we haven't mentioned this yet, Daniel Hunter's "Building a Movement to End the New Jim Crow: an organizing guide" is free on kindle today.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00UCF3U0A/ref=cm_sw_r_fa_awdo_t2_rNCjybMJVAMGS
― (rocketcat) 🚀🐱 👑🐟 (kingfish), Friday, 11 November 2016 22:05 (seven years ago) link
I need to find that tweetstorm from earlier today about not letting Trump voters and their apologists use liberal tendencies towards dialogue and understanding as a weapon against them.
― and this section is called boner (Phil D.), Friday, 11 November 2016 22:08 (seven years ago) link
i.e. to let the racist/fascist elements off the hook
― and this section is called boner (Phil D.), Friday, 11 November 2016 22:09 (seven years ago) link
For such an extreme radical who looks down his nose at ppl who take electoral politics seriously dr morbius has some depressingly typical "moderate" views
― Listen to my homeboy Fantano (D-40), Friday, 11 November 2016 22:12 (seven years ago) link
"On smarm" from gawker has been a useful framework for me w stupid Facebook arguments
― Listen to my homeboy Fantano (D-40), Friday, 11 November 2016 22:13 (seven years ago) link
i contain multitudes, d40
my nose is a short stubby irish one, i do not look down very far
― Supercreditor (Dr Morbius), Friday, 11 November 2016 22:15 (seven years ago) link
as far as taking electoral politics seriously goes, if i lived in a swing state i would likely vote for Dem prez candidates every time and bitch about it til I FUCKIN' DIED, so count those blessings.
― Supercreditor (Dr Morbius), Friday, 11 November 2016 22:18 (seven years ago) link
I predict DNC institutional power shenanigans here. Sanders performs strong due to an unexpected upswell of support around the country (unexpected since the media doesn't bother to talk to Average Joe Slob except when a dead body shows up in a river), Hillary wins on bullshit institutional politics (or enough of an appearance of), Bernie supporters boycott the election, and we get ourselves a President Trump/Cruz. I'll throw $20 on that.
― larry appleton, Thursday, February 11, 2016 2:29 AM (nine months ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
btw i totally support what sanders is doing and will vote for him as i've said many times but man i cannot wait to collect that $20
― the thirteenth floorior (Doctor Casino), Thursday, February 11, 2016 2:34 AM (nine months ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
it wasn't just bernie supporters boycotting the election, it was everyone else, too. anyway, i should've bet more money. ahem.
― larry appleton, Friday, 11 November 2016 22:51 (seven years ago) link
Politico already backing off of the story. Click the same link now.
― Three Word Username, Friday, 11 November 2016 22:53 (seven years ago) link
story from my mom, who canvassed in rural east tennessee for gloria johnson, a democratic state legislator (a great woman, who ultimately lost by about 200 votes)
most of the houses she went to looked like shit. there were a few mcmansions, but most had porches covered in detritus, rusting things, decaying dog shit, etc. - your typical rural combo of drugs and poverty. single mothers holding it down somehow on their skinny shoulders. about half the people weren't home. the other half had mostly never heard of her candidate. and most said they didn't know how they were voting in the presidential election. one woman she spoke to said she wasn't going to vote for the republican candidate for state legislature because he'd done something or other that wasn't beneficial to veterans, and her husband was a veteran. so they had a good 10 minute convo about gloria. it seemed potentially promising. the woman wasn't sure. but then she said to my mom: "now will YOU do me a favor? will you please vote for donald trump?" and she went on to say that trump was so kind, he was such a kind man, and that he never boasted about himself, he was so humble, and that he was going to make this country strong again and that it was so important that my mom vote for him.
now, whaddya think? racist? maybe. probably. but there's something else at work (many things, i guess). a cult-like need for belief in some authority? someone to project every unfulfilled emotional need onto?
there was some talk upthread about facts, and needing to tell vivid, "sticky" truthful stories with enough verve to crowd out the lies that are told. i'm starting to wonder if, in the context of political persuasion, facts matter at all. are important at all. maybe as reference material for the inside-baseball crowd they are. but for this woman, standing in the busted-out screen door frame of this shitty house in east tennessee? i don't know.
― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Friday, 11 November 2016 22:57 (seven years ago) link
my partner tells me one of her phd classmates just split with her boyfriend because the guy admitted to voting for trump in wisconsin (he lied initially, said he left the president blank on his ballot)
― geometry-stabilized craft (art), Friday, 11 November 2016 22:58 (seven years ago) link
in the context of political persuasion, facts matter at all.
they don't. we're clearly past that point, rational discourse doesn't matter (if it ever really did). It's about personalities, projection, imagery. that's it.
― Οὖτις, Friday, 11 November 2016 23:01 (seven years ago) link
That's what I learned from Ronnie Reagan!
― The burrito of ennui (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 11 November 2016 23:02 (seven years ago) link