the goal should be to make more voters who are not racists/fascists/etc.
― Al Moon Faced Poon (Moodles), Friday, 11 November 2016 19:29 (seven years ago) link
also we should stop generalizing about half the population of the country. that's a lot of people.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2016/11/11/trump-got-more-votes-from-people-of-color-than-romney-did-heres-the-data/
― Thus Sang Freud, Friday, 11 November 2016 19:30 (seven years ago) link
NY, morbs
well they didn't count her vote (not that it mattered, Clinton winning the state by 22 points). There were 32 sanctioned write-in candidates in NY. All other prez ballots w/ unapproved choices were disregarded.
― Supercreditor (Dr Morbius), Friday, 11 November 2016 19:30 (seven years ago) link
Are you really going to do this?
― and this section is called boner (Phil D.), Friday, 11 November 2016 19:30 (seven years ago) link
xp
also we should stop generalizing about half the population of the country.
"Half the people who voted in the 2016 election" is not "half the population of the country." This shouldn't even be necessary to point out, but here we are.
― and this section is called boner (Phil D.), Friday, 11 November 2016 19:32 (seven years ago) link
well there's that. half the people who voted i mean. same diff.
― Thus Sang Freud, Friday, 11 November 2016 19:33 (seven years ago) link
that is not same diff
― ciderpress, Friday, 11 November 2016 19:33 (seven years ago) link
also given that Clinton won the popular vote and roughly half the population stayed home, i struggle with the notion that courting the votes of racist misogynists is necessary or even worth the moral compromise required but again im still boiling and keeping this shit largely to myself outside this space
― geometry-stabilized craft (art), Friday, November 11, 2016 7:27 PM (two seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
i was thinking about this too, but then i remembered brexit. there's a world-wide far right movement going on, not just in the US. so it's hard to say whether or not it was just Clinton being terrible as a candidate, or if there's been a significant change in how things work, making it hard to use older examples to fill in the blanks. nearly all of the candidates of one of our major parties had far-right leanings, and Trump was the most radical of them. and he won the primary. so that right there already shoots the odds way up of having one of these far-right guys as president. then among the Democrats your best choices were Clinton and Sanders, and Sanders didn't even win the primary.
Joe Biden? But it's like, all of this radical far-right shit that helped get Trump elected has been bubbling and foaming for years now. I watched how it went from a little blip to growing to this wide-spread movement that helped win the presidency. i don't think ignoring what's going on here is a good idea, because the US isn't the only place this is happening.
― larry appleton, Friday, 11 November 2016 19:35 (seven years ago) link
haven't there been studies finding that people who don't vote roughly have the same opinions (proportionally) as ppl who do?
Biden could've been hit over his history of being a credit-card-co Muppet?
― Supercreditor (Dr Morbius), Friday, 11 November 2016 19:36 (seven years ago) link
That was so long ago it might not have mattered; all people know is the smiling vice president
This is not an endorsement of the former senator from MBNA
― The burrito of ennui (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 11 November 2016 19:40 (seven years ago) link
probably the only thing that can be said for sure in favor of a different candidate, when evaluating this election in hindsight, is that none of the other potential democratic candidates were the subject of two decades of smear by the right and that perhaps this would have improved their chances
― geometry-stabilized craft (art), Friday, 11 November 2016 19:40 (seven years ago) link
Given that the Democrats' vote turnout went down by a shit-ton this year I'm not taking that as a given.
― and this section is called boner (Phil D.), Friday, 11 November 2016 19:40 (seven years ago) link
here's an alternative version of "Bernie dumbs it down" and low-information voter stuff - he offered up a vision that centered around economic justice but was also completely and utterly supportive of social justice.
― Kiarostami bag (milo z), Friday, 11 November 2016 19:42 (seven years ago) link
If you're still intent on making fun of that, I don't know what to say. Veiled accusations of racism against him or the people who supported him is NAGL.
I don't think anyone is criticizing Bernie for appealing to low-information voters. He had an attractive vision and he/his campaign communicated it well to people.
― sarahell, Friday, 11 November 2016 19:44 (seven years ago) link
hope it was clear i wasn't dissing any bernie voters or bernie himself obviously -- i think he was a great candidate on the merits -- i was just pointing out that in this world we live in where people don't pay attention to politics and vote anyway, being a genuinely nice guy who appeals to those types of voters is a nice bonus
― k3vin k., Friday, 11 November 2016 19:47 (seven years ago) link
The hits continue as Trump a) moves Chris Christie off the transition team to turn it over to Mike Pence, and b) names his three oldest children -- who he earlier said would run his businesses to keep them separate from the government duties -- to the transition team.
http://theslot.jezebel.com/chris-christies-unending-humiliations-continue-as-trump-1788873400
― and this section is called boner (Phil D.), Friday, 11 November 2016 19:47 (seven years ago) link
pence obviously moving fast to consolidate his cabal
― a little too mature to be cute (Aimless), Friday, 11 November 2016 19:48 (seven years ago) link
Eric Levitz, nymag:
No one has ever used the words 'soul of the Democratic Party' and 'Chuck Schumer' in the same sentence....
27 percent of white voters who backed Trump hope he will pursue “more liberal” policies than Barack Obama did, according to exit polls.
So, there doesn’t seem to be much basis for the idea that Democrats can find political salvation by moving right on fiscal policy. But clearly, they’ve isolated themselves from the silent majority on immigration, right?
Wrong, per CBS News:
Exit poll voters were asked whether most illegal immigrants working in the U.S. should be offered a chance to apply for legal status or deported to the country they came from. Fully 7 of 10 voters said they should be allowed to apply for legal status … Among those who favored giving illegal immigrants a chance to apply for legal status, one in three voted for Trump.Trump also won 35 percent of voters who believe “international trade creates jobs.”
In the face of these befuddling facts, the only people in the Democratic Party with a coherent narrative of how to move forward — and a national base of support — are Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren.
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/11/is-bernie-sanders-now-the-leader-of-the-democratic-party.html
― Supercreditor (Dr Morbius), Friday, 11 November 2016 19:55 (seven years ago) link
No success like failure, and failure is no success at all.
― Josh in Chicago, Friday, 11 November 2016 19:57 (seven years ago) link
just want to lol at "low information voters" for a minute. as if a million echoing polls told us anything or gave us any valuable info besides "She'll win!".
― AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Friday, 11 November 2016 19:58 (seven years ago) link
buddy i described my own mother as a "low-information voter". it wasn't meant pejoratively
― k3vin k., Friday, 11 November 2016 20:01 (seven years ago) link
― k3vin k., Friday, November 11, 2016 7:47 PM (one minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
totally. yet he didn't win the primary. Sanders didn't get a fair shake by the establishment because they don't give a fuck what these people want, so did nothing to accommodate them. for a while the NYT was giving better coverage to Trump than Sanders, then hoots and hollers that their hated establishment candidate didn't win. the type of alternative that would appeal to more people was squashed by the powers that be, while shoving Hillary in our faces.
it's easy to forget how pissed off people have been for years with how things are going, and how totally disconnected they feel from power over their own fate and lives, because they're being governed by people who don't give a crap about them and try to tell them how they should vote and live, because they aren't listening anyway. i remember how people were like "yup" when a Princeton study came out showing average voters had a 0% impact on the laws passed in Congress. all that news of pharmaceutical price gouging, and the lack of repercussions for that, people remember that shit, it becomes part of their worldview that they're being taken advantage of and there's nothing they can do about it. i wonder if cuck's an insult to the far-right because lots of people feel humiliated and powerless under this, and since the social contract has been broken, there's no reason to hold back socially taboo things like racism anymore.
― larry appleton, Friday, 11 November 2016 20:11 (seven years ago) link
Howrd Dean throwing his hat in the ring for DNC chair again. I know there are some who dislike him; but he did some good stuff as DNC chair last time.
― akm, Friday, 11 November 2016 20:12 (seven years ago) link
― AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Friday, November 11, 2016 11:58 AM (eleven minutes ago)
this sentence makes no sense.
― sarahell, Friday, 11 November 2016 20:12 (seven years ago) link
christie finally got his letter from the FBI telling him he's a suspect in bridgegate?
― carthago delenda est (mayor jingleberries), Friday, 11 November 2016 20:14 (seven years ago) link
Howard Dean is good people and his 50 state strategy was otm
― Οὖτις, Friday, 11 November 2016 20:15 (seven years ago) link
Yeah, if all the DNC Chair possibilities are people like Dean and Ellison I won't be mad
― Kiarostami bag (milo z), Friday, 11 November 2016 20:16 (seven years ago) link
Howard Dean is now a lobbyist shit; eff him
― Supercreditor (Dr Morbius), Friday, 11 November 2016 20:18 (seven years ago) link
https://thinkprogress.org/giuliani-dean-paid-to-advocate-for-terrorist-group-9c316a06c50#.qdj2ra5dk
https://theintercept.com/2016/01/14/howard-dean-lobbyist/
― Supercreditor (Dr Morbius), Friday, 11 November 2016 20:19 (seven years ago) link
Dean has lobbied for grotesque shit, as most lobbyists do, but I have immense respect for the 50-state strategy and how he forced Dems to think past the enclaves (this sense of entrapment is what I most remember from December 2004-Januarly 2005). He's also much smarter on TV than he let on in 2003.
But I'll take the black congressmen from Milwaukee.
― The burrito of ennui (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 11 November 2016 20:19 (seven years ago) link
ha -- I was gonna hyperlink that Thinkprogress story
― The burrito of ennui (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 11 November 2016 20:20 (seven years ago) link
what is the counter to low information voters - high information voters? people that pay thorough attention to constant polling? the media and the left just did this obsessively for 6 months and got caught w their pants down. Clinton ditched out of the rest belt cos all that great high information told them they didn't need it.
― AdamVania (Adam Bruneau), Friday, 11 November 2016 20:20 (seven years ago) link
rust belt
"America died on Nov. 8, 2016, not with a bang or a whimper, but at its own hand via electoral suicide."
http://billmoyers.com/story/farewell-america/#.WCUbk-3V-Md.facebook
― scott seward, Friday, 11 November 2016 20:20 (seven years ago) link
you guys looked like you needed some cheering up.
― scott seward, Friday, 11 November 2016 20:21 (seven years ago) link
opinion polls are not the type of information we were referring to. At least, I wasn't.
― sarahell, Friday, 11 November 2016 20:22 (seven years ago) link
No, that's generally not what *anyone* is referring to with that phrase
― and this section is called boner (Phil D.), Friday, 11 November 2016 20:25 (seven years ago) link
Pence taking over transition team from Christie
― never have i been a blue calm sea (collardio gelatinous), Friday, 11 November 2016 20:25 (seven years ago) link
All the autopsies seem to reveal to me is that Dems should have run an obnoxious asshole that would get through some very thick skulls.
― Distribution of all possible outcomes (Sanpaku), Friday, 11 November 2016 20:25 (seven years ago) link
I think we all need some smelling salts to wake up from the world we've been living in the past decade or so. Trump is president. That still hasn't sunk in for me yet. Clearly the established way of doing things isn't working out too well. It's over, pack it up, the game has changed.
― larry appleton, Friday, 11 November 2016 20:27 (seven years ago) link
Donald Trump’s victory has been followed by a series of racist attacks and instances of vandalism and racist graffiti.We need your help to track these incidents. If you know of an incident, please #ReportHate here:https://www.splcenter.org/reporthateYour involvement will help support our work tracking hate.If you have been victimized, please first report it to local law enforcement.In solidarity, Your friends at the SPLC
We need your help to track these incidents. If you know of an incident, please #ReportHate here:
https://www.splcenter.org/reporthate
Your involvement will help support our work tracking hate.
If you have been victimized, please first report it to local law enforcement.
In solidarity, Your friends at the SPLC
― the notes the loon doesn't play (ulysses), Friday, 11 November 2016 20:28 (seven years ago) link
I think 'people planning on Trump being more liberal than Obama' is what most people mean by low-information voter.
― Kiarostami bag (milo z), Friday, 11 November 2016 20:29 (seven years ago) link
good example, troo
― Supercreditor (Dr Morbius), Friday, 11 November 2016 20:32 (seven years ago) link
In 2012, after Obama was elected to a second term, Trump tweeted: “We can’t let this happen. We should march on Washington and stop this travesty. Our nation is totally divided!”
― Josh in Chicago, Friday, 11 November 2016 20:34 (seven years ago) link
we *should* march on Washington
― Οὖτις, Friday, 11 November 2016 20:35 (seven years ago) link
in addition to "bigly," i wonder if we could stop throwing around these "racist" and "fascist" bombs as often as we do, particularly as applied to whole swaths of the population we don't know very well, and whose votes we need.
― Thus Sang Freud, Friday, November 11, 2016 7:16 PM (four minutes ago) Bookmark
I'm getting rather tired of this. Not directed at you, but I keep hearing the same argument: "those 50m trump voters can't all be racist right?" Why not? Why can't 50 million people be racist? They voted for a racist! Trump doesn't even hide his racism, he boasts about it. Death penalty for five black men, saying he'll only let a Jew count his money, wanting to ban Muslims only because they are Muslims...
He ís a racist. And all the millions who voted for him are too. There is nothing "impossible" about that. Yes, they can be nice people, they can be your mother or best friend or yr fave sports star. So what? That doesn't make someone nót racist. Voting for a racist makes you a racist, too. An enabler at the very least.
I see a lot of people on the left saying "we should listen to these people's concerns, they can't be all racist", terrified that calling someone who is a racist a racist will backfire. Listen to their concerns we should, but no concerns make it ok to support a racist. If anything the election of notable and proud racist Trump should teach left ánd right that there are a hell of a lot more white racists then they thought there were.
― Le Bateau Ivre, Friday, 11 November 2016 20:37 (seven years ago) link
(Scratch 'white' from 'white racists')
― Le Bateau Ivre, Friday, 11 November 2016 20:38 (seven years ago) link
Trump's rise was fueled by a guy who told people he saw genetically-modified fish people being kept in tubes in a secret government lab, and then cried on air about it. Like what the fuck? It's disturbing how this is being treated as normal, like we should all just go along with it like this is an acceptable course of things. This is still so insane to me.
― larry appleton, Friday, 11 November 2016 20:38 (seven years ago) link