PEOPLE... HOLD ON. It's the ~~~ ILM 1970s SOUL/FUNK/DISCO ALBUMS POLL ~~~ results thread!

Yeah, I cannot get into Donny Hathaway at all. I've listened to his first three albums and they all passed me by.

What are the genre's worst and most isolated instincts?

I love the results so far... several of these seem like classics and I thought they were top 20 for sure. I hope Curtis gets 1st place instead of Gaye or Wonder. What's Going On and Innervisions are good albums but they're not top 10 material for me, not even my favorite by each artist.

I'd love to see Curtis up there. I was assuming that Sly & The Family Stone were the biggest competition. They'll have slightly less split voting than Curtis, Stevie and Marvin.

Sly would be cool too. Anything that's not Whats Going On or Innervisions works for me hahaha

xxxp I think it comes down to a certain embeddedness in old time pop. A particular sort of sappiness and histrionics. Sure, Donny does use more contemporary references but they become dull mannerisms in his hands. All of it is so tame I can't quite understand why someone would prefer him to basically anyone else in the genre.

Put it this way. If I wanted to convince someone that 70's soul is the golden age of music and offers something you can't get anywhere else, Everything Is Everything would make an extremely ineffective argument. It sounds like every cliche received wisdom about r'n'b ever. And the stuff that is sort of removed is such in a bad way (his attempt at Misty for example).

Hate to be negative but I think 70's soul is desperately in need of an updated canon. It's misleading and unrewarding to focus on funk and blaxploitation so much. Giving Donny the "underappreciated genius" spotlight isn't helping this proces.

Figure Riot will take this and I have no problem with that.

huh ppl having strong opinions either one way or the other about Donny Hathaway is something I was completely unaware of until I first heard Everything is Everything a couple years ago. I knew Roberta Flack's solo stuff but not his. and was surprised to read all the gushing praise quoted in his wiki entry. I don't think Everything is Everything is incredible or anything but it's solid. Does seem like one of those cases where the artist's personal story might tend to make his actual work overestimated (I'm sure some people here feel the same way about Betty Davis)

the live album is really good. don't care about his studio albums, not really my kind of thing.

I don't really understand exactly what he does that sets him beyond the pale, compared to other stuff on this thread. Like he doesn't feel like he's in a different genre or working from a totally different template than others listed so far.

That's true sort of. But the point of many (most) albums on this list is how distinctive they are. Everything Is Everything really isn't so it irks me when Donny gets the praise I feel legitemately underappreciated geniuses like Eugene Record, Ashford and Simpson, Thom Bell, Teddy Pendergrass, August Darnell and Swamp Dogg need.

http://cdn-s3.allmusic.com/release-covers/500/0001/882/0001882991.jpg
39. Earth, Wind & Fire - All 'n All (1977)
78 points • 6 votes

When I first came across "Everything Is Everything", I didn't know anything about Donny Hathaway's story (the CD copy I bought in the nineties doesn't even have liner notes), so certainly his tragic life wasn't the reason I got into his music. I just saw the album in the soul section of a record store, loved the cover, listened to it for a bit in the store, and was sold!

Like you, I was a bit tired of "greasy" funk and "gritty" blaxploitation soundtracks being the stereotypical image of '70s R&B (and this was in the '90s, so that stuff was everywhere). I'd tried to get into "What's Going On", but besides the admittedly gorgeous title track, it all sounded a bit too samey to me. So listening to "Everything Is Everything" was a revelation! Here's this guy who was doing all sorts of things on one record, experimenting within the form of R&B, but not in that psychedelic rock-inspired way Funkadelic etc were going (which isn't my thing), it was still within that smooth sound and always with his silky voice. And that was great for me, because I love smooth and silky!

So to me that seemed like an interesting alternate route that many of the more praised soul/funk/R&B artists I was more familiar with hadn't chosen, which drew me in. And he went even further with that on Extension of a Man, which is excessive, yes, but excess can be interesting. It doesn't gel together as nicely as his debut, but I'm still glad he tried, because it's an even more unique album than "Everything Is Everything".

And I get that Donny Hathaway is mannered and puts on personas and may sometimes sound disattached from his material, like on "Misty" or "Magdalena" or "Little Girl". But I don't necessarily see that as a bad thing? When white rockers like David Bowie do that, put on all their various masks that are all not so convincing, they're praised for being chameleons and theatrical perfomers. But to me it feels that black R&B artists, at least those from the pre-Prince era, are still expected to be "real" (which also accounts for why funk and blaxploitation is still the most canonical sound of that era), which seems unfair. So certainly I don't count that as a minus fo Donny! I love "Magdalena" in all it's showtuneness!

I'm not saying Donny Hathaway is this forgotten genius who'se reappropriation can help change the '70s R&B canon, I guess that "quite there but still outside" mannered quality in his music and persona makes it sure that he will never be rated as high as some more straightforward artists within the genre. And I still rate artists like Minnie Riperton, Curtis Mayfield, Nina Simone, Leon Thomas, Roberta Flack, EWF, etc as high or higher than him. But I do feel his small output is an interesting and unfairly slept on chapter in the history soul music, and that getting more recognition would do him justice.

(xpost)

Oh, that's way to low! It's undoubtedly the best album EWF did, and one of the top 10 albums of the decade, IMO. Everything in it is so colourful, so beautiful, so filled with joie de vivre. Philip Bailey has the most gorgeous falsetto in soul music, and their genius for writing catchy songs reached its highest hights here too. A tune like "Fantasy" has like three different hooks, all of which could've been built into a separate hit, but they decided to put them all into one. It's amazing, transcendent pop music.

Very interesting what you say about Hathaway's personas, Tuomas. I hadn't picked up on that aspect. I'll listen to Everything Is Everything again with your post in mind.

http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_500/MI0002/513/MI0002513974.jpg
38. Mandrill - Mandrill Is (1972)
79 points • 4 votes • 1 number one

BTW, I keep seeing the Powerslave cover when I scroll up :)

http://cdn-s3.allmusic.com/release-covers/500/0001/115/0001115731.jpg
37. Gil Scott-Heron - Pieces of a Man (1971)
84 points • 9 votes

My number 1 coming up:

http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_500/MI0000/038/MI0000038951.jpg
36. The Stylistics - Round 2 (1972)
85 points • 6 votes • 1 number one

Album highlights:
'Children of the Night'
'Peek-a-Boo'
'You and Me'
'Pieces'

I love "Magdalena" in all it's showtuneness!

Donny Hathaway's "Magdalena" kills me. Is it a showtune? The verse is all ragtimey and sounds like it ought to be on the Toy Story soundtrack and then the chorus kicks in and the whole thing is just so good. Tuomos right otm though, dude had some pretty big, unconventional ideas for someone that might show up on the ILM 70s Soul Poll

Tuomas that's fair. I'm not big on being "real" but I much prefer the way showtuneness is handled in, say, Thom Bell stuff which is to say via Burt Bacharach. But agree to disagree. I was sort of being a prick earlier.

Fantasy is indeed a landmark. Might be the best pop expression of spirituality ever. It feels like somewhere in the middle the holy ghost really does intervene. But I don't dig the ballads on All 'n All.

Pieces of a Man is flawed but beautiful. Heron is like a fucked up, introverted version of Bill Withers. Both smart and intense but Withers is better on sex and Heron more evocative on desperation.

Round 2 shows some weaknesses imo. Russel Thompkins Jr. is the best there is at what he does when what he does is hyperromanticism. But I don't think he handles lust (Children of the Night) or genuine regret (the Carole King cover) well. It just ends up sort of awkward. Still, at least a half of this record is unfuckwithable.

http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_500/MI0002/280/MI0002280564.jpg
35. Curtis Mayfield - Roots (1971)
85 points • 10 votes

"Roots" is fine, but it's kinda sad how it already begins to show hints of Mayfield's decline. I guess it's really hard, after having released the perfect (solo) debut album, to try to come up with anything that'd equal it... Sadly he never did.

http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_500/MI0001/924/MI0001924745.jpg
34. James Brown - There It Is (1972)
86 points • 5 votes • 1 number one

Yes! Was saying how ranking Brown albums is a thankless job but this is my choice. King Heroin would be a dud if performed by anyone else but somehow I'm on a verge of tears by the time it ends. He truly cuts the beat while saying "cuttin'" on Talking Loud and it's one of those myriad moments that demonstrate that he is on a whole different playing field.

http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_500/MI0002/067/MI0002067330.jpg
33. Millie Jackson - Caught Up (1974)
87 points • 6 votes

Prefer the similar Soul Children album way down on the list.

Millie Jackson was my number five. I'd given up hope of her placing. Caught Up is an incredible record.

http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_500/MI0000/830/MI0000830300.jpg
32. Sister Sledge - We Are Family (1979)
88 points • 9 votes

Should have been a disco masterpiece but for some plodding filler and maybe an overused tittle track. Thinking Of You is sublime.

http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_500/MI0000/667/MI0000667286.jpg
31. Minnie Riperton - Come to My Garden (1970)
92 points • 8 votes

OK simmel, here comes your moment of glory:

http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_500/MI0003/690/MI0003690606.jpg
30. Stairsteps - 2nd Resurrection (1976)
94 points • 5 votes • 1 number one

Album highlights:
* 'From Us to You'
* 'Pasado'

Indeed! Just recently heard this and was amazed. Gave it the number one spot and judged all the other albums against it. A few that are yet to come match it in cohesiveness but this one is still a miracle. It just flows so well! Spectacular cover too.

I listened to it via this YouTube of the full album, that's why I highlighted the first two songs. Do you have any other particular favorites?

I had it at number 8, mostly thanks to your campaigning. I'd never heard of the group before.

Oh, I forgot to highlight 'Les Fleur' from Minnie Riperton's Come to My Garden, for the few people who haven't heard it yet.

Not just the high point of that album, but one of the most beautiful songs in music history.

Described it as a cross between Riot's murkiness and Stevie's silliness/prettiness in the noms thread and stand by that. Tell Me Why is the highlight imo but this album really does work better than it's individual parts.

Yes, even I can respect Les Fleurs.

Wow, the placement of this Stairsteps album is the biggest surprise of the list so far. Delighted to see it so high. I had it in my top 10.

I just listened to Come to my Garden again yesterday. It's such a lovely record.

http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_500/MI0003/486/MI0003486361.jpg
29. Eddie Kendricks - People... Hold On (1972)
97 points • 5 votes

Another classic. Eddie Kendricks is so underrated. His first five albums are all so good.

This is a great run of albums. Eddie Kendricks, Minnie Riperton, Stairsteps and Millie Jackson were all high on my list.

Frustrated by this album. Girl You Need a Change of Mind is a bolt of lightning from Olympus and then the rest is just run-of-the-mill material imo.

http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_500/MI0002/034/MI0002034808.jpg
28. WAR - The World Is a Ghetto (1972)
97 points • 7 votes

no way! xp

My People...Hold On, I'm On The Sideline, Day By Day are all-time classics imo

http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_500/MI0000/614/MI0000614206.jpg
27. James Brown - Sex Machine (1970)
99 points • 7 votes • 1 number one

Remembered this album at the last moment while scrolling the nominations list. It's a patchy sort of compilation, sort of live album with plenty of other random shit thrown in (Spinning Wheel? If I Ruled the World?). But there's too much transcendent music here to leave it off the ballot.