Is the Guardian worse than it used to be?

i guess i'd just say.... and? what does it achieve to say "sooo many voters are racist!" how does that get you to point B?

― illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Sunday, October 2, 2016 11:29 AM (twelve minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I don't know, but it just seems like part of the reason why discourse around this issue is so toxic, why there has been a failure to have an "honest debate" around this immigration like people are always saying there should be, is that everything politicians say about it is contorted by this requirement to dent that racism is a factor? so no one pushes back against the problem because they can't even acknowledge that there is a problem, and instead you get avoidance and double-speak and pandering which just makes the voters more cynical and the whole thing more malignant

to *deny* that racism is a factor, rather

Gosh, what would happen if, say, a US Presidential candidate were to describe a large chunk of the electorate as a 'basket of deplorables', for example? They would have no chance of being elected.

In a two horse race you only have to be better than one horse

i think there are plenty of ways to say that racism is a massive destructive issue in society but make your audience feel that they are, or can be, part of the solution rather than part of the problem. even if they are part of the problem.

the only people this bullshit doublespeak helps are moderates who are looking for excuses to connect with UKIP voters with a justifying caveat that thick fucking racists are a legit voice

Thick fucking racists being in the minority here, and that includes among those ignorant proles, despite what the Guardian thinks.

Most ignorant proles have way more pressing issues that need addressing than hating, but these concerned moderates don't tend to attack austerity with the same vigour.

in fact they mainly tend to support it iirc

I must watch Mr Corbyn's speech!

I bet I will like it.

Freedland has been a big hack for a long time.

it's interesting to see the way the idea of democracy has been used by the right and how its been knawing at the conscience of a lot of centrists in a way it never has before. in the era of online petitions paternalism suddenly seems problematic. the elite is cripplingly self-conscious of its privilege and there's something paradoxical in the feeling that it's only by attempting to reach out and act in the name of the provincial, the deindustrialised, the people who don't care about the limits of their bubble that they are confident in their legitimacy

think I will stick to my guns and blame the ever-growing constitutional rot and democratic deficit for letting power relations get so obviously dysfunctional that it has allowed this self-abnegating force to gestate within the media class

knawing?

ah, gnawing

I kind of gnew, was just making sure

if you don't subscribe to the notion of false consciousness it becomes harder to tell people (you believe that) they're wrong

yeah, requires too much nuance to square false consciousness with everyone's experiences being affirmed, and that sort of populist storytelling

'We'll listen to your racism because what you've got is a legitimate and very concerning concern but we won't help you with your actual problems'

Very solemnly placing big, outsize joke-shop ears on their head, whilst unplugging all the life-support machines

speaking of

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2016/oct/06/diversity-is-a-boon-but-were-losing-our-sense-of-community?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

Giles Fraser ‏@giles_fraser Oct 5
I'm a committed socialist. But I definitely prefer Tories to liberals. That's why I like May's speech. She is the anti-Cameron

um, ok then

oh good, accelerationism

at least it's an ethos

I don't think that Fraser is really an accelerationalist, he's on more of a blue labour/red tory kick, and has been for some years now

it's the utter confidence and authority with which he spews this shit

I always enjoy a good Giles Fraser Thought for the Day, by enjoy I mean marvel at the fatuousness of.

I MEAN THE PROBLEM WITH YOUR ETHNICS IS THEY KEEP TO THEIR OWN KIND, DON'T THEY? THEY DON'T WANT TO LEARN THE BLOODY LANGUAGE.

Trust is good, but not trusting outsiders is bad. Diversity is good but lack of cohesion is bad. Friendship is good but not the kind you get on the interet. Business likes diversity but business is bad - right? The past was ok but we don't want to go back to the past. Crikey, this is confusing, no wonder poor Giles can't work it out.

Brexit and the new mood in politics is misunderstood as a hostility to outsiders, though it is easily purloined by racists. Rather, it is a cry for community, for togetherness, for the local, for mutuality, for social solidarity. Theresa May, the vicar’s daughter, wants to find all this in a return to the past. That’s the wrong answer. But at least she’s answering the right question.

what an unfortunate misunderstanding, thank heavens Giles is here to set us right! is there any case for "Lexit" that isn't based on this "ppl say they hate foreigners, but what they actually mean is that they agree with me" wishful thinking? (aside from accelerationism, I guess?) iirc correctly during the referendum he was pro-brexit but also said that we should have *more* immigration?

ime lexiters broadly believe that 1) the eu has become a fundamentally neoliberal institution & 2) the single currency is a recipe for disaster. which is kinda hard to argue with tbrr, but imo it's a long unconvincing road to 3) therefore the UK should leave it

larry elliot voted leave "in order to shake things up" well be careful what you wish for mate

There are also leftwingers who are against freedom of movement because it's part of globalisation, treating workers as resources who are expected to move around the continent as capitalism requires. Job low paid or non-existent? Get on your bike and move to another place where you're more in demand.

never feel lower than when giles fraser is trolling me with his hobbit morality in 2016

Larry Elliot is really beginning to piss me off...I had been a fan of his columns for some years, but he's now writing crap like this:

Will dearer food and the coming squeeze on living standards will prompt a change of heart about Brexit? Remainers should not bank on it. Life has not been great for many in recent years anyway. What’s more, Britain is a country with a streak of cussedness that delights in having its back to the wall.

Britain is a country with a streak of cussedness that delights in having its back to the wall.

Pretty sure that can't be England he's talking about.

Pixie geldof interview: frowns on paparazzi, links to salacious paparazzi pics.

paper edition doesn't have any papped photos.

Yeah they should offer the bonus content to those who actually pay.

Free glossy pamphlet of pap shots.

page 44 of the magazine "Nearly everything in the house is secondhand" says the owner of Aerende, which will sell you, on page 47, a £185 duvet cover and a £7 bar of soap.

https://www.theguardian.com/membership/2016/nov/09/with-trump-victorious-time-to-support-fearless-independent-journalism

Jesus Fucking Christ. I think I would genuinely prefer one of those 'Cheer yourself up with a gingerbread latte!' offers.

rolling thread of shaming PRs who make omg-eyecatching references to the election results to promote their artist shite fucking paper

Naomi Klein entering her Scott Adams phase

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/nov/09/rise-of-the-davos-class-sealed-americas-fate

I thought the article couldn't be as crass as the subbing made it out to be, but I was wrong

Jesus Fucking Christ. I think I would genuinely prefer one of those 'Cheer yourself up with a gingerbread latte!' offers.

lol you stole my criticism!

Did you actually say that? Not consciously nicked, honest, but it's the sort of thing that sticks around.

https://twitter.com/rmkf/status/796278820546482176

That shit is everywhere right now in fairness.

it is insufferable tho, all day on twitter today and yesterday

xpost, yeah! awful.

From the other thread:

Hillary is definitely going to delete this email

<liveyourc✧✧✧@yplan✧✧✧.c✧✧>

That's the kind of guy we want leading the free world

(BIG GIF OF TRUMP AT WRESTLEMANIA)

Have you ever taken out Vince McMahon live on WWE? Nah, didn't think so. Have you ever set up your own university? Oop, no, you haven't. And I bet if someone gave you a small loan of a million dollars you wouldn't even know what to do with it. Sounds like Donald just clotheslined your libertarian, democratic opinions right out of the window.

But seriously, before you go home and start building your own wall around your property to keep out all the post-apocalyptic raiders you'll be fighting off after the nuclear war, maybe go out, take one last gulp of fresh air and hit up some the hotspots in London we've been stockpiling for just such an eventuality. Believe us – these are the memories you'll cling to after all else has crumbled in the wake of WWIII…have fun!

Just gonna take my mind off the rise of fascism by standing around a gas burner eating a £12 burger while some twat plays a Gorgon City tune.

the thing is, I actually did go out last night - so maybe they're onto something. the place i went wasn't tweeting at me.